Three decades ago when Mike Mussina was toeing the rubber at Camden Yards, his younger Mark struck up a friendship with Nestor that has lasted a lifetime. And in the week after a Baltimore Ravens’ victory over his beloved Dallas Cowboys, it was time to turn to a one-time WNST radio host when the station began 28 years ago to bring the MLB playoffs and our 28th anniversary music memory bank exploration full circle with a side order of Meat Loaf and Van Halen. And maybe some Tommy Conwell…
The conversation examined the Cowboys’ loss to the Ravens, baseball broadcasting and competitive balance, and the role of live music in Nestor’s ongoing anniversary storytelling project.
Football Discussion
- Mark said Dallas regularly plays entertaining but ultimately unsuccessful games and has defensive weaknesses.
- Nestor and Mark discussed Lamar Jackson’s running role, Derrick Henry’s usage, offensive-line limitations, and Dak Prescott’s command of the Cowboys offense.
- Open question: Can either Prescott or Jackson lead a deep playoff run while overcoming the Cowboys’ defense or the Ravens’ health and offensive constraints?
Baseball Topics
- Mark viewed Pete Alonso as a potential clubhouse leader who could help the Orioles’ young hitters and discussed the value of veteran mentors.
- They praised Ben McDonald and Jim Palmer as knowledgeable, relatable Orioles broadcasters.
- Open question: Can baseball create a fairer competitive structure without undermining the value of October’s varied contenders?
Music Project
- Nestor described ranking 28 influential bands and performers for WNST’s anniversary, with plans to expand the project around his radio career.
- Mark highlighted memorable shows by Guns N’ Roses, KIX, Garth Brooks, and Buffett, and argued that Tommy Conwell belongs higher on Nestor’s list.
- Arrange and host Tommy Conwell and the Young Rumblers on the show, with the appearance planned around the December 4 performance at the 8×10. (@Nestor Aparicio)
- Publish the remaining music countdown entries at two bands per week for 14 weeks, leading into the December 13 anniversary feature. (@Nestor Aparicio)
- Attend the Tommy Conwell and the Young Rumblers performance at the 8×10 on December 4.
- Prepare a personal top-28 concert list and related stories for a future appearance.
Ravens and Cowboys
- Review of the Ravens’ close win over Dallas in Rio.
- Discussion of Lamar Jackson’s rushing threat, goal-line strategy, Derrick Henry’s usage, and offensive-line concerns.
- Assessment of Dak Prescott’s leadership, Dallas’ receiving weapons, and defensive shortcomings.
Orioles and Broadcasting
- Pete Alonso’s first Orioles season and possible influence on younger hitters.
- The importance of veteran mentorship in player development.
- Praise for Ben McDonald’s accessible analysis and Jim Palmer’s expertise and longevity.
Baseball Economics
- Debate over competitive balance and whether smaller-market teams can sustain success.
- Comparison with the structural inequality of college football and basketball.
- Uncertainty about future baseball labor and financial arrangements.
Live Music
- Mark’s memories of Guns N’ Roses, KIX, Garth Brooks, and Buffett concerts.
- Nestor’s anniversary project ranking influential artists and documenting concert experiences.
- Discussion of upcoming Tommy Conwell and the Young Rumblers plans and the broader role of music in Nestor’s future storytelling.
Nestor Aparicio 0:01
Welcome home. We are WNST AM 1570 Towson, Baltimore. We call this thing Baltimore positive. It is positively our 28th anniversary. It is a rock and roll time for me. I’m celebrating my music memory bank with our newest sponsor, Rosedale Bank. Kevin Benson’s going to come out on Friday. They’ve been my bank for a long time. It’s like a really true story about how they saved my company during PPP. I’m finally getting a chance to scream about it. Feature a lot of things they’re doing on the East Side. We’re going to be in Essex at Pizza Johns on Friday, doing the Maryland Crab Cake Tour with the Kiss Face Bird. It is all brought to you by the Maryland Lottery. I’ll have these to give away on Friday when we convene. There’ll be new playoff teams and a whole new scenario on the baseball side. The Ravens get ready for the Tennessee Titans, and we want to thank our friends at GBMC and Farnin and Dermer, the Comfort guys, including Zach, who came out last week with Casper Wells, former big leaguer. We talked a lot of baseball and labor and all that. I think this is going to be a football conversation, even though this guy’s got a baseball name, but it probably can come with a rock and roll heart because, dude, the meatloaf show is happening at Ramshead at lunchtime a couple weeks from now. So if you really want to do something, Mark Messina is here. He is the infamous brother of the Hall of Fame. How does it feel? You make you feel nice when I say the your brother’s a Hall of Famer. I mean, you get that every day, but I don’t get a chance to say it much. No,
Mark Mussina 1:20
I don’t get it every day, but no, it’s good. It’s good. It beats the alternative, right?
Nestor Aparicio 1:24
Well, right. Which was she was waiting to get into the Hall of Fame, like for Bly Levin’s family. How are you? People don’t know. Like they know you and I are friends. They know we might wind up at the AC/DC concert in Philly, or I might have you down here for when Tommy Conwell reopens the eight by 10. Tommy Comwell and the Young Rumbers are playing the eight by 10 at December Moose. Are they really?
Nestor Aparicio 1:45
See, this is why I saw.
Mark Mussina 1:47
I saw him at the eight by 10 with the Little Kings.
Nestor Aparicio 1:50
So did I.
Mark Mussina 1:51
Back, yeah, you were there. You got that Sax
Nestor Aparicio 1:53
player. He was killer, man. That guy. That he passed away, the Sax player from the band a few years ago. Yeah, I gotta believe me. I’ll get Tommy on before we we don’t play the Eagles this week. We do play the Cowboys though, and you’re a Cowboy fan. I mean, you and I famously sort of shacked up and roomated back in my bachelor days in the ’90s. And Andy Mueller’s another one of those guys in my world that you know had Yankee aspirations and different. Where guys like Bachman and you know Howard, the local guy, Allen. We’re all Oriole, Oriole, Oriole, and then Raven, Raven, Raven, or whatever. Maybe there was some Redskin in there sometimes, or something weird provincial to somebody. But in a general sense, you were the cowboy fan. I always had you and Dave Muir, and I didn’t get a chance to get you on last week. I’m not even here to pester you about the loss, because you know to me, I’m I’m I’m just a I’m just a journalist who’s neutral these days, Moose. But the Cowboys, like it sucks being a Cowboys fan. I’m just gonna say, y’all had fun for a while, but like you lose games like this all the time, right?
Mark Mussina 2:54
We’re it’s we’re entertaining. I will say we are. We don’t play boring games. They don’t. They don’t turn out well often. But you know, yesterday was one like historically, like we win that game because it’s in September. And the the later on in the season, when when the weather turns cold, we get worse. When it gets after Thanksgiving, we tend to struggle. But we usually explode out of the gate and then lose our momentum as we go. So it was like when you look at yesterday’s in the aspect of it’s like someone has to win, and the Ravens were in a perfect position to blow another double-digit fourth quarter lead, and the Cowboys were also in a great position to give away a game that they had every opportunity to win, so they couldn’t both lose. And yesterday just happened to be us,
Nestor Aparicio 3:50
dude. When you hook the corner and you pull them down and you get the ball at the one yard line, first and goal, you should at least force Lamar to have to come out and get four points and not three, at the very least.
Mark Mussina 4:02
And it was the funny thing. And they never call offensive pass interference, like you know that they call it. It has to be blatant and obvious. But you could tell in watching on TV, the D-back got up and thought like that flag cannot be on me. And then they called it on, and it was it was such a bad call, but you never see it called. And you know, in basketball, it’s a hook and a hold, and that’s a flagrant one. So it’s like I don’t know, but Flowers got his
Nestor Aparicio 4:30
early in the game too with the push off, right? So he got his.
Mark Mussina 4:33
So you know, I I mean, Dallas is we have defensive problems, and um, you know that that 55 looked pretty good.
Nestor Aparicio 4:42
He was all over the place. 50 who 55.
Mark Mussina 4:45
Yeah, he’s he’s kind of burst onto the scene. But I think at the end of the day, the Ravens are there. I when I watch and and I know I you hear a lot of the the stories of in the second half why don’t we use Henry more in the second half why don’t we use Henry. I don’t understand why when the Ravens have the ball at the one yard line that they can’t get Lamar on the edge and give that threat of the run pass because even if he’s running he’s so hard to tackle. Well, that’s
Nestor Aparicio 5:13
where Ricard was useful in the fat back Greg Roman system that was designed to run. Most I don’t. We’re three into this, right? And they, the the left tackle’s gone. They’re playing with the the starting guard as the starting center because he’s third string at the end of the game. Simpson stinks. Rosengarden’s decent, you know, in the offensive line. But like, I don’t know what it was built to do. Is it really built to run Derrick Henry, or is it really built to protect Lamar? Two different philosophies, and the notion that Lamar doesn’t want a mesh point as much. He did it a few times, very effectively. You don’t want to get him hurt. I’m not. Believe me, I was the guy for years. He can’t run into linebackers. He just can’t do it. Ask Carbaugh, who had the deal for this JV McCarthy guy here earlier. So for me, the notion that what you’re trying to do in the offense, from Roman to then Munkin, who’s doing a decent job in Cleveland, I guess, to now whatever Declan Doyle in his 30 year old mind of I have this Rolls Royce quarterback, but I can’t. We don’t want to run him. We don’t want to really get him hurt. We have Derrick Henry for that. Justice Hill. We have other ways to do it, but they’re to your point. They’re not. It’s not the same as the play after Lamar gets into space because the other other 11 guys got to get the awakening. He might run, and if you and you get put to sleep, 346, plays, he drops back, he throws, he drops back, he pounds the ground. You might sack him. You get a couple of runs, but that one play every 1012, plays that he gives you some razzle and dazzle, it changes the way you have to think, let alone play defense,
Mark Mussina 7:01
and I agree with him. You know, you see him last year when he was hurt for so much, and when he couldn’t run, he’s he’s certainly you know the offense is certainly much more vanilla. So, but you don’t want to get him. You’re right. You don’t want to get him beat up in in September. So it is that balancing. It’s almost like he’s on a pitch count because you you really need him to be able to run in January when you turn him loose, and he needs to be
Nestor Aparicio 7:29
101% healthy at Christmas, and that’s impossible to do in this league.
Mark Mussina 7:34
Yes, so I do, and I understand that, and it’s and you figure you know if we’re at the one yard line and we can’t give it to Henry and get get a yard. Then how good are we anyway? But I mean, the touchdown pass he threw to to put him ahead was not an easy throw, and he had to like triple clutch it and kind of thread it through. And so I don’t know, but that’s this offense is incredibly dynamic when Lamar is rushing for a significant, and I think he ended up with 50 yards yesterday on eight carries, which is a big number for an NFL quarterback. Well,
Nestor Aparicio 8:06
22 on one carry, which was the awakening. You know that was the play that woke everybody. Mark Masin is here. He’s only here for a limited time. He is a Cowboy fan. Yes, he’s Mike’s brother. We’re going to get to some rock and roll. Just staying on the Cowboys for one minute out of the Rio thing, there was a feeling for me, and I thought of you, Emure, anybody else that’s a Cowboys fan or involved with a Cowboys to watch Dak Prescott, and I’m like, what’s he eight years in nine no 11? Okay, on the back end of Romo, on the back end of you know Aikman and Stallback. I mean, it’s kind of like the Ravens. We’ve had Flacco and this, and you know, whatever we had at the beginning that was a mess, or like the Packers that always sort of only had one quarterback until this point. I watch Prescott, especially in the second half, when there was some distance and there were there was some some some things were going right for them in the passing game, it became clear they were in the game and they could win this game. And there was some calm about the offense, about the way they got in two minute, the way they got in four minute, the way they got to the line of scrimmage, the way he commanded things that really made me feel like he was going to win the game. And this is this will be perceived as a knock on Lamar, and I guess it is. They don’t. They don’t get calm like that. I mean, it certainly wasn’t that way previously. As Lamar, I mean, Lamar’s still pounding the ground doing all this stuff. It just doesn’t feel calm. And we’ve done this before, and we practice this all the time with the Prescott thing. I just thought he was going to win the game, even on the pole in the corner where Wiggins got hooked. It just he was commanding things in a way that I think I want to see my quarterback do it at that level in a way that maybe Tyler Shuck did it for 30 seconds last week, you know, and it looked good for a minute, but it doesn’t. Felt like Prescott. It would give me some confidence if I’m a Cowboys fan that I saw that sort of operation.
Mark Mussina 10:07
Well, when you, I mean, they’ve they’ve surrounded him now with so many weapons, with with Pickens and and C.D. Lamb and Flannoy, who’s a good third receiver. They got a quality tight end, so he has all the pieces, and then and now we can run the ball a little bit. And it’s not like the Emmitt Smith run the ball, but when you put all those weapons around him, and yeah, he’s he’s he’s seen it all, and so he’s he. You just look back. He was better than I thought
Nestor Aparicio 10:37
he was, right? Like I mean, just watching him for four quarters, I’m like, you know, he’s. I mean, not just credible. He’s a $60 million quarterback. But, I mean, first the goal on the one. I I don’t know what you know. I well, and then the operation gets bad. That then they they get a they get a flag at the time where it made me think you Cowboy fans die of this all the time. Right,
Mark Mussina 10:56
and I think the last throw. I think Pickens was open and he just kind of bailed out on it, threw it over his head. So, so those are there are just those plays that that the great quarterbacks make. And Dak falls into if you well, you saw the stat that they put up. You know their regular season records and then their postseason records for both of them. And and Lamar’s three and five and Dak’s two and five, and they all kind of fall into that category where John Elway fell into until you get into one playoff run and it and it puts it all away. So that’s what both of these guys are hoping for. But I think different than Lamar needs to stay healthy. His legs need to stay healthy on Dak side. He needs the people around him to stay healthy. But offensively, the Cowboys have weapons coming out of their ears. It’s just, can we stop anyone on defense?
Nestor Aparicio 11:44
Mark Messina is here. He is my friend. He’s the county commission up in Venturersville in beautiful Pennsylvania. It’s baseball playoff time. Anything, anything on the Orioles? Anything you want to say? I mean, and then we can get to the other teams if you wish. Just a month of baseball here. Somebody will win. It’ll be the pitching. It’ll be the defense, blah blah blah. It’ll be the clutch hitting. You get what I mean? It will be. It will be. It’s
Mark Mussina 12:05
all. It all comes down to it’ll be the pitching. That’s my nuclear lush
Nestor Aparicio 12:08
for you there.
Mark Mussina 12:10
I tell you what. What? What is even more astonishing, I think, about the Pete Alonso years that he did not come out of the gate very well, and I don’t know if he was just pressing because he’s in a new organization, or he’s just trying to do too much. He did
Nestor Aparicio 12:23
most of this in four months, not six. Yeah,
Mark Mussina 12:25
yeah. So I I think he is a cornerstone to build upon. I think other guys can see that they can come here and have success, and he’s it’s hard for him not to speak highly of it, even though they didn’t make the playoffs, because he did well, so he must like you know hitting in Camden Yards and like being part of the American League East, and and I think it helps. I was just it’s funny because I was I was texting with Alan McCallum earlier today, and I just as people talk about the home runs, they talk about the RBIs. He still hit 270. I want to say, and and I said to Alan, now that he’s, even though he was the elder statesman, even though he’s on his way to Cooperstown and he’s had 50 home run season stuff like that, he was still the new guy in the locker room, and it’s hard to come in and he and he seems like such a nice guy that he would not be the kind of guy to walk in and say to Gunner like this is my locker room because I’ve been here for 24 hours. Now that he’s been here a season, it is his locker room, and he has. You would think his presence and his that he will be able to help these guys to go from hitting 230 to hitting 260, and the mindset of it, because Alonzo’s not just a home run hitter. You will see the line drives up the middle. You will see the guy that that just doesn’t try to hit the ball in seats every at bat, and the whole you know lift and pull and lift and pull and and you just can’t have a lineup with with four and five guys that are first round draft picks that are bonus babies that are all these guys hitting 220 something you’ll just never win so somewhere in it there has to be player development aspects and you you talk with all these the Oars are certainly young and talented there’s no doubt about that and in baseball I think more than any other sport, they talk about the the older guy. You know, I remember when Mike just showed up and Mike Flanagan was in the bullpen, and Rick Sutcliffe had just got signed, and how instrumental it was to his career to have these guys who aren’t just good; they’re former Cy Young winners that he could learn from. They could talk to him about you know just like how to be a professional pitcher, not just when you’re on the mound. What do I throw in this situation? Like how to carry yourself and what to do all year off season. How to do this and how to do it well. And if Alonzo can’t teach these guys, I’m not sure who can.
Nestor Aparicio 14:59
Tell me the first time. You met Ben McDonald because he was a better prospect than your brother, and your brother’s in the Hall of Fame, not going to the Hall of Fame there and sign the contract. And the thought that Ben would ever be this good at doing the the broadcasts because he’s great at it. And I, you know, I knew Ben, you knew Ben, your brother. Obviously, I dined with your brother and Ben, and it was clear your brother was never going to go into broadcast, but but Ben, it’s it feels unlikely to me that that guy I met, like like Greg Zahn, I’ll hear that you like talkers and whatnot. But Ben is not just like really he’s very sophisticated at the game of baseball, like in in teaching baseball in teachable moments, and watching him every night is really-it’s a joy at this point in my life that I do watch it. I like the box. I think the box on TV. I think the last time I had you watch, it’s completely changed. I go to the game now. The game’s not as good in person. It just isn’t because I can’t see the box. The box, the box has changed the the way I watch. It’s like watching poker when you know what’s on the river. Yeah, I mean it’s just a different way to watch the game, right? And it’s a better way to watch the game for me. But Ben’s great, and and I feel like it was very unlikely the 30 years ago he would be the guy doing this gig right now. That’s all.
Mark Mussina 16:15
I what I think he I think he brings a sports talk mentality to it that it’s it’s it’s still supposed to be fun, and you know we had the you get the angry sports talk guys, and it’s just it it it’s that that works when you’re angry about something, but it doesn’t work every day. After a while, it gets wearing. And am I allowed
Nestor Aparicio 16:37
to be angry about the Orioles? I’m allowed, right?
Mark Mussina 16:39
Well, yeah.
Nestor Aparicio 16:40
The 20th anniversary free the birds. No, I get it. I’m allowed to be angry, right? There,
Mark Mussina 16:44
there’s this level of sometimes broadcasters get this professorial, like I am expounding, you know, great information. You should just shut up and listen to me when it’s really like listen. I I know what I’m watching too. Like just tell me, and and I think Ben makes it relatable. There’s there’s that aspect where you’re kind of like we’re we’re sitting we’re sitting in the bar watching the game, and he’s talking. Now in this aspect, we can’t talk back to him because he’s on the broadcast, but he just gives a a realness to it. The other thing about like Baltimore broadcasts, when you talk about big, tall, right-handed pitchers, what makes Ben you know Palmer’s been great for 100 years, and just because he’s so knowledgeable, his memory so his his memory is so intact of the things that happened so long ago, but I always got this impression with whatever Jim said. He kind of ended it with like, “And how can you question me because I’m in the Hall of Fame and you’re not? And it never came off to me as like obnoxious. It just came off as like you know. It’s Jim
Nestor Aparicio 17:58
though. I mean, if you know Jim a little bit. It’s just Jim’s Jim, and you know, I I accept it as he’s been famous for 60 years and been in the spotlight at a different time and place than even your brother. Where baseball in the 60s is you know 70s was just a different spotlight. Um, underwear ads, Monday night. I mean, he sat in the booth with KoCell and did games for years. I mean, like it’s it’s insane how blessed we are to have Jim Palmer. Like, and I just gave you a softball to talk about Ben McDonald and your brother in that era. But like, we have Brooks and we have Palmer, not just great players, not just great people, not just great community people. But no offense to your brother who went off play for the Yankees and some other places. They stayed here. They never left. They gave their whole life to baseball. They, you know, Brooks died doing baseball things, and Jim’s 80, and still wants. And Jim wants to do more games than he was doing. You know what I mean? Jim, Jim likes doing this still, which is that’s the real gift in it that they still like doing it. You know, there’s a reason your brother and Roger Clemens and a lot of they just don’t want to do it, and John Smoltz loves it, right? So I I think it’s and it’s harder work than it looks like it is, and I think Ben makes it look effortless in a way that maybe I didn’t realize 35 years ago when I met him and your brother that he would want to do this and be so great at it, you know.
Mark Mussina 19:17
And I I do I think Jim’s I think Jim has been effortless too, in a different way, and he has that. I like I said, Jim has that. I’m just I I know what I’m talking about more than you do because I’m better at this than you were about pitching, but it doesn’t come across as unpalatable. It comes across like, yeah, I’m I’m I’m happy to listen to Jim Palmer talk about pitching.
Nestor Aparicio 19:45
I love somebody who’s in command, who’s a real expert, not a fake expert. Exactly.
Mark Mussina 19:50
So, and it’s different, like like Tom Brady’s kind of the same way because who’s going to question Tom Brady? But he doesn’t have that. That smoothness to it that that Palmer has, at least not yet. So I don’t know. We’re all
Nestor Aparicio 20:06
looking for that, right? We watch all these old jocks. Some of them have more smoothness than others. You know what I mean? Like, and I I watch Red Zone like you, and I hear week after week, and some of people get better at it, and some don’t. But when they’re good at it, we don’t. Maybe we don’t give it enough praise because when I watch it every night, I mean, being a baseball fan, Moose, and we’ll see it this month with the playoffs and stuff. Like you’re all in, and it becomes a family thing. Like the voice of Jim Palmer will resonate in my in my ears forever because three hours a night, 120 nights a year for 50 years of my life, you know it’s like Alex Trebek. If you’re you’re you know like if you watch a show, that’s what it is. And Ben’s becoming that, and I think that’s cool. You know, and
Mark Mussina 20:51
I think too, as you talk about people get better, I just think Ben and Jim were always good. I never heard Jim like oh he’s Jim Palmer, but he’s getting better, and I don’t know how long he’d done broadcasts before Mike got there. But like he was, I’ve I’ve always thought he was good, and and Ben was kind of just like you know right out of the gate. He he was good at it. I and again we talked about personalities, and it’s it is fascinating because they’re both tall, they’re both right-handed, they’re both pitchers. They were boreals, and but their personalities are different. But they both work so well. And as you said, there are there are lots of cities that have broadcasts that the the team is not as talented as. You better
Nestor Aparicio 21:31
hope the team’s good because the broadcast might just be okay on any given day. And I agree with that. Mark Messina is my guest, and this is a chance to we’re going to do some music here. But I got to kick the Cowboys in the nuts one more time. Tony Romo was great at it, and then wasn’t anymore, and now he’s gone. And it was weird. Jim Nantz doing with JJ Watt, and I’m like, what? What? Oh, Romo! Oh my God, he’s gone. You know what I mean? Like it took me three weeks to be like that was Nance’s partner. Boy, when they were good the first three five years. I mean, really, really good. You know, to sit and watch whatever game Tony Romo was doing. It was Arizona Cardinals was good game. I don’t feel that way about any of the broad. I think Ross Tucker does a great job. Anytime I hear him, and I know Ross, and I’m friends with Ross, but like I I hear the voices. Kenny Albert, my friend. You know, I have people, Ian Iron Eagle and his kid now doing games, but there is some Romo’s. They just disappeared him. Your former Cowboy guy, right? And
Mark Mussina 22:26
I don’t. I mean, in the world of all that happens, like it was. I mean, I know it’s DUI, and it’s not. It shouldn’t be applauded. It shouldn’t be. But he has
Nestor Aparicio 22:38
no basis of being a criminal in his whole life, right?
Mark Mussina 22:41
Should it be a death sentence? Like, I don’t. Oh, Mike Arvid’s on
Nestor Aparicio 22:44
TV every week. He did all sorts of stuff when he was a cowboy. You know what I mean? Like, yeah. I mean, we have a we have a culture of forgiveness. I I don’t know what’s up with. I just thought the Romo thing. It’s like they just. It’s like John Gruden or Colin Kaepernick. It’s just you’re gone. Yeah, they just blackballed him. Yeah, he’s gone.
Mark Mussina 23:00
I can’t imagine Romo won’t be back somewhere
Nestor Aparicio 23:04
if he wants to do the work. He’s got $100 million too, right?
Mark Mussina 23:07
What
Nestor Aparicio 23:08
he’s got $100 million. He doesn’t have to work. Yeah, I mean, Mark Massini’s. All right, so let’s go away from work. Let’s go away from you know baseball playoffs, football, that stuff. Rock and roll. Saw AC/DC on Tuesday night here in in in Philly. They’re going to be on the lists. I’ve been to a lot of rock and roll shows with you. You and your brother are a part of my Van Halen story, a part of my Bon Jovi story. Some of the bands that we shared, shows we’ve shared together. Meatloaf, who’s not in my 28, but you and I had the music.
Mark Mussina 23:41
28. Hold on.
Nestor Aparicio 23:43
Oh, okay. So I’ll recap this for you and for anybody in the audience. A friend of mine this summer went to a concert and said it was the best concert she’d ever seen, and asked me what the best concert I’d ever seen was, and I was like, “That’s kind of loaded because I’ve been to 1000s. I’ve been to 1000s of concerts, and she said 1000s, and I’m like 1000s, and then I’m like, may you know, I I should archive this. I should get my AI involved. I should get my ticket stuffs. And when the 28th anniversary of NST, and you were here for the first day of that, it was August 3rd of 1998. We opened the station. I had been on the air seven years before that, but every year I do an anniversary something. 25 crab cake started the crab cake tour. 26 oysters last year I did 27 of my favorite local places and like things to eat. A lot of them were pastries as it turned out, but nonetheless. So this year at 28, I’m like, what am I gonna do? And I’m like, you know what? 28, and I played with my AI and my clone a little bit. And the idea was like, let’s do the 28 bands that have shaped my life. I mean, I went to Machu Picchu this year because Brian Adams was touring in South America, and oh my God, AC/DC showed up in Chile two days later, and I’m I like built a a very inexpensive South American vacation around that, right? So like, I’ve been vacationing. I’ve seen you two in Seoul and in Tokyo. I’ve seen Bruce two different times in Australia and New Zealand. I mean, I was over in Europe seeing you two in Ireland, you two in Paris, Springsteen in Spain. So people ask me about this stuff, and like you think of me as a sports guy when you don’t when when you think of me. And I’m football, baseball. I do politics now. I do food. I do all sorts of things, right? I’m a bon vivant at this point, and but I do what I do, you know. And when I have experts on, I enjoy it. But the the music thing for me was wheelhouse. When I met you in 1992, 93, I had just finished being a music critic, and like all of that, I I’m bringing that back to life and have all of these pictures and artifacts and cool stuff. So I’m sharing it. So that’s what I’m doing. So when I say like, do you have like if I say to you what’s the best concert you’ve ever been to? Do you have one?
Mark Mussina 25:55
I see. I have some that come to my mind right away. What’s the first
Nestor Aparicio 25:59
memorable one? If you just say memorable, maybe not the best, but like.
Mark Mussina 26:03
And this, I’m almost embarrassed to say this. When I saw Guns N’ Roses in 2011, when I say it’s Guns N’ Roses, but it was I also say it was Axel and his Merry Men. I think who was the guy, Bumblefoot or Buckethead or whoever was playing in the band, it was just there was no slash, there was no duff, there it was just Axel and a bunch of hired guns. I saw him in in the hockey arena in Wilkesbury, and they were unbelievable. And
Nestor Aparicio 26:34
it’s amazing when you get a night like that, right? Like I could ask you the best baseball game you’ve ever seen, or you you know, and you’ve seen big games with your brother, Yankee Stadium, like all that, and like, dude, I’ve I attended to drive, I attended home run throwback, I’ve been the 27 Super Bowl, I’ve done all this, but to see the Rolling Stones on the beach in Rio, I don’t know that I could even express what like that looked like with 1.7 million people. Like I’ve I’ve done things like that, but to me, it can be a concert in Wilkes-Barre on a night when you catch the band on fire, and I’m literally in my mind right now, my heart. I’m having lots of you on to talk about these experiences because I really am trying to think of that incendiary night that I saw something like I saw Starship this summer up by you, just west of east of Harrisburg at the casino in a field. I mean, Mickey Thomas is still as good as anything. I mean, I saw AC/DC 24 hours ago, and it was as good as AC/DC has ever been in a way where, like, it was just a great night. And I feel that way about music. Does that for me, where like a ball game doesn’t anymore, Moose? No offense. I mean, ball game can only just be a ball game unless it’s a no hit or something really special happens. I feel like almost every concert feels special to me.
Mark Mussina 27:44
I’ll tell you another one I saw: kicks in the early ’90s at Fiddlesticks, which is a
Nestor Aparicio 27:51
where’s that?
Mark Mussina 27:52
It’s in it was in Milton, Pennsylvania. It’s not there anymore, but it’s it’s kind of like a Daytona’s was down in Riviera Beach
Nestor Aparicio 28:00
or nightclub. It
Mark Mussina 28:01
was a nightclub, right? You know, there’s there’s 500, 700 people packed into this place, and
Nestor Aparicio 28:10
early ’90s. So Kickstarter
Mark Mussina 28:12
Whiteman was great. It was because right after you know, blow my fuse and all that stuff. Grunge had shown up, and this is where they were playing, and and that’s one of them. That that’s one on the if I see that’s awesome
Nestor Aparicio 28:22
because like I tell people I saw the alarm at Hammerjacks and dude I when anybody would ask me of the greatest concert I’ve seen and dude I I went to Live Aid I mean I Amnesty I’ve sat in the front row for all everything I’ve interviewed Robert Plant over soup and a salad like I’ve just done amazing-ish, but like I would say the alarm at Hammerjack. Some people say, “Who are the alarm? I don’t. Where you know, like, what’s the song or whatever? And I’m like, no, that was just I saw rock and roll that night, dude. Like it was just like, and I found the review I wrote that night, and it it definitely praised them. But I’m 21 years old. I’m in the middle of it. I didn’t think I’d be 58 alive, still talking about it and saying, “Man, that was that night at Hammerjacks with the alarm that was really like something to talk about. And um, like you with kicks in a bar in the middle of where the hell is Milton, Pennsylvania? Can you please tell me where that is? So I don’t think. It’s like
Mark Mussina 29:17
20 minutes from me, like that. Oh,
Nestor Aparicio 29:19
it’s it’s Matsville. Okay, it’s what it’s calling it Waysport, Waynesport. Okay, so it’s not like outside of Harrisburg or State College, something like that. Okay, I’ll tell you
Mark Mussina 29:27
another one. I I saw Garth at at the Cap Center, whatever it was called, USA or whatever it was called back then, probably in ’94, and
Nestor Aparicio 29:36
he’s really come. He’s coming into his own then, right? Like yeah, it
Mark Mussina 29:39
was fun. I mean, he was he was movement. He he was. It was fun, and I just I remember that.
Nestor Aparicio 29:47
Well, I mean, it’s interesting you put some country in because, like you know, I’m not a country guy, but Jimmy Buffett’s in my top 10. I mean, I’ve traveled all over the world, seen you know. So for me, these 28 bands, when I really did a deep dive in my soul, like what the 28 bands. Were they’re the ones that I’ve way gone out of my way that have stayed with me my whole life. If even if the band like some of the bands that didn’t make the cut, I’m going to give you some bands that didn’t make the cut. You ready? These are 29 down. 29 down were Cheap Trick, Journey, Air Supply, Meatloaf, Tommy Conwell, Triumph, and Rick Emmett, the trio of Depeche Mode, The Cure, and New Order. None of these are in the top 28. The cars. Now I love the cars, but the cars haven’t existed since 1986. You know, I had Greg Hawks on. Greg Hawks, by the way, was a ticket taker and an usher at Merriweather Post Pavilion in the summers of 7172, and 73, he tore tickets at the Who concert there, Zeppelin, the whole deal at Merriweather back in the day. The keyboard player, who’s the primary member of the Cars, if you listen to the Cars. So Boston, Genesis, and Phil Collins, none of them very primary bands for me, but not in the 28, not not the bands that have sort of shaped my life or shaped the music that I still listen to or that I still chase all these years later. By the way, one more not in here. I just realized Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers are not on my list. They’re not the 28.
Mark Mussina 31:13
Have you announced your top 28?
Nestor Aparicio 31:14
No, no, we’re counting them down. So here’s we are, and this is. I’m glad you’re asking because I want.
Mark Mussina 31:19
I’m just going to jump in right now and say, Tommy Conwell, you need a recount there. Tommy Conwell should be in your top 28, but I’ll just leave it at that.
Nestor Aparicio 31:27
He’s at 31, and I think he’d be really happy with that. I mean, I think he. I’m going to ask him. He’s coming on next. I think he got
Mark Mussina 31:33
screwed at 31. That’s what I think.
Nestor Aparicio 31:34
Okay, all right. So I got to write Tom Petty down because I forgot that Tom Petty wasn’t in it. So my top 28 starts with Kiss at 28, and not for any. This is a legitimate list. This is I I labored on this, and I’m still having a problem with Billy Joel and Brian Adams. I’m still having a little problem with David Bowie and Rush, like moving them around a little bit at the top. But I have 28. So what I’m doing is two a week for 14 weeks, and then on december 13, that’s a big day for me, Moose. That’s my 35th anniversary being on the radio. That’s the day I walked into december 13.
Mark Mussina 32:10
december 13
Nestor Aparicio 32:10
will be the 35th anniversary. It’s right around when your brother became an Oriole, right? He became an Oriole in the summer of 91, Camden Yard, right, like that, right? Like so, December 13 of 1991 is when I walked in with Kenny Albert and did the show the first time. So that’s 35. I’m going to change the 28 to a 35 because it’s 35 years on the air, and then I’m going to do 35 like all sorts of stories next year about the 35 times I sat in the front row, the 35 time international concerts, local concerts, bar concerts. You know, big band, small band. Just I’m gonna do a lot of really cool stuff next year to kick up the other bands that aren’t the 28. The 28 I’m tributing right now. So number 27 is John Mayer. My son is coming over in about an hour and a half, and my son turned me on to John Mayer, and I didn’t think I was ever gonna, you know? I’m like that’s my kid’s music. That’s like that Fall Out Boy and all of that, you know, Green Day and all those bands that now are like 30 years later iconic because my kid’s 42. But he’s John Mayer, so 26 is AC/DC. I didn’t write it because I wanted to see him before I wrote it. You know, wrote what I’m writing and what I’m writing are just how these bands have affected my life and what they bring to my life and why John Allen and I would get in the car you know put 200 miles in the car pay 40 bucks to park get subs make a night and come back home the next day and and share with you how much how great AC/DC still is I can’t say that about Motley Crue. I mean, there’s certainly bands I go like now. I’m like, I saw Barry Manilow a month ago, and I love him. I’ve always he he would be somewhere in the next cut, but no, you know, I don’t want to see bands that are no good anymore. Moose that that’s one thing for me. This primary 28, Springsteen’s in there, Rush is in there, Robert Plant’s in there. Sticks is in there. Brian Adams. You two’s going out on the road again. The Eagles are on the road. Sammy Hagar’s on the road. Bonjour. Leopard. These are the bands, and you know. Then there’s bands like REM that are like long gone. You know what I mean? Can’t see them anymore, but they exist in in various forms. I mean, the alarm. Mike Peters is dead. The Smitherines, Patanazio’s dead. So like some of these bands that affected my life, the Bodines have broken up, and you don’t want to Google why they broke up. Just trust me. So there’s you know it’s behind the music a little bit for me in my life and sharing the music because people dig it. People dig the ticket stubs and the passes, and I really do have. When I did kiss, I really do have the 28 minutes of tape. When I had the tape recorder of Paul Stanley and I eating chicken dinner in his suite, and women banging on the door trying to get in with groupies, and I want to tell these stories. You know,
Mark Mussina 34:53
they’re banging on the door, going, “Is Nestor in there? That’s what they’re,
Nestor Aparicio 34:56
dude. I’m telling you, is as God is my witness. I mean, as the God of Thunder is my witness, there were women banging on the door. I mean, Gene Simmons came to the door. The guy who was there, this is an inside poker. The guy who was their bouncer, he had an interesting name. It was an animal name, like you know, Wolf or Sasquaw. He had a name. He wound up being on the tour bus when Gloria Estefan had her had her fall up by you, right? That accident happened up in I believe in Wilkesboro in that region near you, and and she had a very awful. But I remember seeing his name, and I’m like, God, I met that guy. He was Paul Stanley’s bodyguard. You know that he was at the door when Paul Stanley and I were there. So I mean, all of these years later, it is um, it’s amazing. Like I’m having Meatloaf’s drummer on John Maselli on Friday. He was on the stage the night that Meatloaf tried to allow me to do the risotto part, and I got shot down. And I have the the audio of you and me doing radio that day when I had to call in and admit to you that like I failed miserably in Meatloaf’s band. You remember that
Mark Mussina 36:03
one? I do. I remember that you you couldn’t do it, and it was harder than you thought. That was one of them. I thought that Meatloaf show was great when he opened up with Anything for Love. I’ll tell you one of the ones when you mentioned Buffett, and I’m I’m sure I was there with you. Do you remember the time that Buffett came and they had that little makeshift stage-it reminded you something that you’d see on Gilligan’s Island, and that he came out above the the seats just to play for the people on the lawn, and they did two songs. It was like a
Nestor Aparicio 36:36
little crane. They put him on like a little outdoor crane that he did a couple of lawn scenes.
Mark Mussina 36:40
He did the the the great what the great station hold up
Nestor Aparicio 36:44
fulfilling station hold up fulfilling
Mark Mussina 36:46
station hold up and he did another one and I don’t remember like the Buffett shows are just fun and I don’t but I’ll never forget that because we’re all in a crowd and all you know he plays a couple songs and everything goes quiet and then all of a sudden we’re like hey that’s him right there, and I remember that.
Nestor Aparicio 37:04
I think of these things like Angus laid down on stage and they shot off these confetti cannons the other night, and I’m thinking it’s they’ve gotten really creative with staging in the modern era and what they can do with AI. And you know, Brian Adams plays three songs acoustic in the other end of the arena, and people seem shocked, and I’m like, well, you didn’t you didn’t do any search on the internet to realize that you know, and I’ve seen that show all over the world at this point, but man, I went to see Seal four years ago, and I like Seal. I’ve always loved Seal. I saw him once at Pier Six and didn’t think it was great, like 30 years ago, and I just yeah, it wasn’t great, but I love Seal, and he was playing at at um at the Anthem, and I had to drop my wife off at the airport. She was flying somewhere, and it was kind of like a beautiful day. And I’m like, tickets really cheap, and I’m like, I’m gonna go down to Anthem and see Seal. And I went down and I had a couple of beers, and I made it, and I went in, and the Buggles opened, and I didn’t realize the connection between Trevor Horn from the Buggles, and and yes, and and 90120 or 90125, and owner of a lonely heart, and video killed the radio star in the Bugles, right? But also he has been the primary music maker for Seal as the keyboardist, and Frankie goes to Hollywood. He did all of that, relax, all of those songs, and his band opened, and then Seal came out, and Seal was three songs in. I’m like, oh my god, this is one of the greatest things I’ve ever seen. And then Seal came out into the crowd, and stood on chairs and was singing in the pit in a way that I had no security, no nothing, and he had this ring on this little gold ring, and I swear to God, it looked like a cocaine snifter from the 70s. It was a pitch whistle, and John Allen taught me, like some musicians have taught me, that when he gets out in the crowd, he blows into the pitch whistle again on pitch, and like, and I’m out there, and Seal is singing to me, like face grabbing. You know, so you want to be free, and I’m like, oh my god, you know. So I’ve, and that happened four years ago, and I wasn’t expecting it. It was so good. I, I next day I went to Philly and saw it again, and I dragged Jen to New York to see it at the Beacon three weeks later, I’m like, because when I get on the one that’s great, you two doing the the the original Joshua Tree. I was at a bunch of those shows, but what they did 10 years ago to bring that back, I saw that show a dozen times because it was just transcendently great, and it was in stadiums too. So I mean, I’m just talking about this, like off the cuff, but when I put it all together and I put it together over the next year and a half, and Moose, full disclosure for you, by the way, Mark Massine is here. I’m gonna let him rap, but this is about baseball because I looked and said baseball’s not gonna play next year. What’s gonna be something that can be fun for me? You know, storytelling and what I. Do for a living now, because it’s not going to Sarasota and sitting in the dugout with Davy Johnson and Earl Weaver anymore. Your brother, it’s not waiting for opening day that may or may not come. Right? I mean, do you have anything on the on the labor thing that you want to say on the way out? You do more rock and roll if you want, but I, you know, I love having you on. You know that.
Mark Mussina 40:14
This is my thought about it, and I think October means a lot because when the the difficulty that that some people might have with this is when you look at during the regular season, the best the best team in the American League was Tampa, the best team in the National League was Milwaukee. Now I know the Dodgers are there, I know the Yankees are there, you know the Cubs are there, but the Mets aren’t. You know there’s there’s big market teams that aren’t, and and now the way it shakes out that the Yankees and the Red Sox, somebody’s going to be out here in two days. So if if we get to a World Series that’s that’s Milwaukee and Tampa, or that’s Milwaukee and Cleveland or San Diego and is it is it really are the people going to come out and say the little guy can’t win? Like last year we had Seattle and or we we Seattle and Toronto got there and then Toronto for all intents and purposes should have beat the Dodgers and the I understand if the Dodgers go out and win, or the Yankees go out and win. If
Nestor Aparicio 41:22
it’s Dodgers, Yankees again, right? Yeah, it is what it is. Then it’s an
Mark Mussina 41:25
easy case to make. Dude, this is a recency
Nestor Aparicio 41:29
bias. There’s right and wrong, and there’s what the NFL is, which you know I got into that with John McClane earlier, just about like how how can the Texans think, you know, like how can the Titans be this awful, right? Just in a general sense, in a league where everything’s built to be eight and eight and eight and nine and nine and eight and whatever, baseball’s not built to be that way. It’s never built to be that way. It hasn’t been built to be that way since, I mean, Messer Smith. You know what I mean? Like, so I look at it and say, until you get this thing more fair, people in Baltimore aren’t going to care when the team’s taking a dirt nap. Same thing with Pittsburgh when they’re not trying, Tampa didn’t try for a long time. Now they’re you know now they got some geniuses. And look, spending bad money in baseball’s easy to do. You know your brother was a miracle. He made it through his whole career and really kept his shoulder together. That’s not happening these days for anybody. And
Mark Mussina 42:17
there’s a there’s an intelligence to it. You saw what Oakland did a long time ago, and and now Oakland’s going to be different when they go to Vegas and they actually have money. But you see the the the Pirates were over 500 this year in a year that Skeens didn’t really do much. The Orioles were almost 500 in a year that they had one hitter. And
Nestor Aparicio 42:37
well, the one thing the Orioles got going for them is they don’t see 13 games against the Yankees and Red Sox and Blue Jays anymore, right?
Mark Mussina 42:42
Right,
Nestor Aparicio 42:42
because those three are going to be huge. Mark, I mean, Toronto’s all in now, right? They got the whole country activated. The next five to eight years, they’re going to be like trying, like for parts where maybe they didn’t and they felt a little more corporately run. I mean, the Orioles are in with three Giants and Tampa,
Mark Mussina 42:58
but so that I think October is going to make some people’s cases, but you know, again with the Yankees, you know, they go in this lineup last night and they won, and and Rice had a huge day and they scored nine runs, but Judge and Giancarlo aren’t playing, so how much of they have any other
Nestor Aparicio 43:15
organization would just be decimated by that,
Mark Mussina 43:18
right, right. So I don’t know, but and the the thing that’s always interesting, and don’t get me wrong, I I think baseball the the the game would be better if there was a structure to it. I agree, but the thing that always cracks me up is then these people go and watch college football on Saturday, which could not be less fair. And don’t tell me that Mississippi State has the same chance that Alabama and LSU have, and they’re in the same conference. Don’t tell me that Clemson basketball and Virginia Tech basketball have the same chance that North Carolina and Duke do. Did
Nestor Aparicio 43:49
you see the Maryland score?
Mark Mussina 43:51
Yeah, I did. Yeah, yeah, I did.
Nestor Aparicio 43:53
Yeah.
Mark Mussina 43:53
So these aspects, and then you you see what Indiana did, and Indiana football they can you know you can burst out of nowhere, but in general, it’s the same blue bloods that are there every year. So, but baseball needs to come up with something, and I I hope it’s not out, but it doesn’t. I don’t know. I’m not optimistic yet, but I’m just going to enjoy October for October, and then we’ll worry about that in November.
Nestor Aparicio 44:20
All right, Mark Masina’s here. Listen, I want you to think more about this concert thing because when I have you back on, when the Cowboys don’t win the playoffs again, I don’t know, man. Eagles stink, command, hardball. I mean, Cowboys still gonna win that division as far as there’s no
Mark Mussina 44:33
quarterbacks left. When when when Hurts got hit on the sideline, I thought, oh my gosh, we’re we’re three weeks into the season, we’re the only team with a quarterback left, but he got up and he’s fine. But I don’t. I mean, half the quarterbacks are gone in our division. We get to we get to 910 wins, but our defense is gonna have a tough time getting to 910 wins.
Nestor Aparicio 44:52
All right, Moose, Tommy Conwell and the Young Rebels. Since I’m gonna tell Tommy, you put him in my top 20, and that he should be
Mark Mussina 44:58
no. Tell him he’s in my. Top 28. See,
Nestor Aparicio 45:01
I’m going to have you make your top 28 now. See, see, I
Mark Mussina 45:04
will. And it, it, it, it. I will say, who’d you have John May? If
Nestor Aparicio 45:07
you don’t get your ass down here on December the fourth, then you know, shame on you, because he always going to be shaking with the young rumblers. That is Friday, december 4 at the eight by 10. We’ve all heard of that. That’s on
Mark Mussina 45:20
the schedule. I think that
Nestor Aparicio 45:22
you know what that we’re gonna make a night of that. I’m gonna feed you well that night. Come down here. I got all the pizza you can eat at Pizza John. The only thing I lived with Messina for like a summer and a half. All he ever ate was pizza. So Mark Messina is just
Mark Mussina 45:33
crab cakes.
Nestor Aparicio 45:35
Pizza Johns. I’ll meet you in Essex. Um, Mark Messina is here. He is. Um, is it okay if I say you’re my favorite Messina? Will your brother be offended by that? Probably. I mean, I’m my
Mark Mussina 45:44
favorite Masina. Yeah, I screwed up. I can’t even speak. I was gonna say I’m my favorite Messina. So I mean, why? Oh, your brother,
Nestor Aparicio 45:50
if he doesn’t come on my show, the other Messina, the Loggins and Messina guy, is going to become my favorite Messina. There you go. There
Mark Mussina 45:55
we go. All
Nestor Aparicio 45:55
right, there he is, Mark Messina. A long time, and I only had you on because the Cowboys lost the other day, but I feel like my soul has been enriched by your rock and roll stories, and that you were so provincial with that kicks leg. I like that. Ah, he is Mark.
Mark Mussina 46:09
That is legit. That would be one of the top five shows I’ve ever seen. That is that is legit.
Nestor Aparicio 46:13
There are a lot of people in our audience that would pick one of the New Year’s Eve nights that they probably forgot and remembered as one of the greatest shows they’ve seen because kicks, the kicks hammerjack shows were incendiary, and I celebrated there probably only five times in the 80s and 90s. Back for more, we are Baltimore positive. I swear, the rock and roll. When the baseball stops, the rock and roll will begin.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai
