Allen McCallum and Nestor discuss the legend of Cal Ripken, 2131, Davey Johnson and Orioles Magic on Saturday night at Camden Yards

It was quite a Saturday in Birdland. The day began with news of the death of Orioles player and manager Davey Johnson and ended with a near no-hitter and an old-school “Magic” win over the Dodgers in the aftermath of a massive 30th Anniversary celebration of Cal Ripken and 2131. Our Allen McCallum was at Camden Yards on Saturday night and was the WNST clubhouse reporter in 1996 and 1997 when Davey led rare winning teams during the Angelos era. This is a deep dive on Orioles lore and history.

Nestor Aparicio and Allen McCallum discussed the recent Orioles game celebrating Cal Ripken’s 2,131st game, noting the 30th anniversary and the no-hitter bid by Grayson Rodriguez. They reflected on the low attendance and the emotional significance of the event. They also remembered Davey Johnson, who passed away that day, highlighting his impact on the team and his strained relationship with Peter Angelos. The conversation touched on the Orioles’ current season, the potential of young players like Sam Biscotti, and the need for better fan engagement and team management. Allen McCallum and Nestor Aparicio discuss the emotional experience of attending a Baltimore Orioles game, reminiscing about the energy and nostalgia of being part of the community. They reflect on the significance of Cal Ripken and the Orioles’ history. Nestor highlights the rarity of two people of color discussing baseball in Baltimore. They also touch on a personal anecdote about a Maryland crab cake tour and a debate over lamb chops. The conversation ends with a light-hearted mention of their radio show and a promise to reveal the top three places in their “tastiness” rankings.

Cal Ripken 2131 Game and Davey Johnson Tribute

• Nestor Aparicio discusses the madhouse over the weekend, including Cal Ripken’s 2131 game, the Orioles’ West Coast trip, and the Dodgers’ show on Friday.
• Nestor mentions the 30th anniversary of Cal Ripken night and the no-hit bid, expressing his desire to watch the game on TV despite having a press credential.
• Nestor introduces Allen McCallum, his long-time baseball insider correspondent, and mentions their shared history of covering Davey Johnson’s teams 30 years ago.
• Allen McCallum reflects on the 30-year gap since the event, sharing his experience of attending the game with his father and sister, and considering the weather forecast.

Attendance and Atmosphere at Cal Ripken Night

• Nestor and Allen discuss the attendance at Cal Ripken night, with Allen noting that it was not a sell-out and that the rain kept many people away.
• Nestor expresses his disappointment in the low turnout, comparing it to other significant nights at Camden Yards.
• Allen describes the seating arrangement, mentioning the left field stands were open and the crowd was a mix of Orioles fans and Dodgers fans.
• Nestor and Allen discuss the energy in the stadium, with Allen noting the significant number of Dodgers fans and the excitement of witnessing a no-hitter.

Emotional Moments and Reflections on Cal Ripken

• Nestor and Allen reflect on the emotional moments of the night, including Cal Ripken’s speech and the presence of his family and former teammates.
• Allen shares his admiration for Cal Ripken’s ability to connect with the audience and the significance of the moment for him.
• Nestor and Allen discuss the impact of the event on the community and the broader implications for the Orioles and baseball fans.
• Allen highlights the importance of the moment for Cal Ripken, who has experienced significant personal losses and is now reflecting on his career.

The No-Hitter and Its Impact

• Nestor and Allen discuss the excitement of the no-hitter, with Allen describing the tension and anticipation in the stadium.
• Allen recounts the key moments of the game, including the break-up of the no-hitter by Jackson Holiday and the subsequent comeback by the Orioles.
• Nestor and Allen reflect on the significance of the no-hitter, comparing it to other memorable moments in Orioles history.
• Allen shares his personal experience of watching the game, including the excitement and disbelief as the no-hitter was broken up and the Orioles won.

Davey Johnson’s Legacy and Influence

• Nestor and Allen discuss the impact of Davey Johnson on the Orioles and his legacy as a manager and baseball figure.
• Nestor shares personal anecdotes about his interactions with Davey Johnson, including a memorable encounter at the 1998 All-Star Game.
• Allen reflects on Davey Johnson’s influence on the team, particularly during his tenure as manager, and his ability to manage and motivate players.
• Nestor and Allen discuss the challenges Davey Johnson faced with Peter Angelos and the broader implications for the Orioles organization.

The Future of the Orioles and Team Dynamics

• Nestor and Allen discuss the current state of the Orioles, including the team’s performance, management decisions, and player dynamics.
• Allen highlights the importance of the Orioles signing Sam Biscotti, a player of color, and the significance of having diverse representation on the team.
• Nestor and Allen reflect on the challenges the team faces, including the need for better management and player development.
• Allen expresses his optimism for the future, emphasizing the importance of nurturing young talent and building a strong team culture.

Personal Reflections and Final Thoughts

• Nestor and Allen share their personal reflections on the weekend’s events, including the significance of Cal Ripken night and the no-hitter.
• Allen expresses his gratitude for the opportunity to cover the game and share his insights with the audience.
• Nestor and Allen discuss the broader implications of the events for the Orioles and the baseball community, emphasizing the importance of community and legacy.
• The conversation concludes with a mutual appreciation for the game of baseball and the shared experiences of covering the sport.

Energy of the Community and Cal Ripken

• Allen McCallum expresses his longing for the community energy and the special moment of watching fans lose their minds, which he didn’t realize he needed.
• Nestor Aparicio quotes Allen’s sentiment, emphasizing the importance of the experience and how it felt good to lose his mind after a long time.
• Allen McCallum confirms the accuracy of Nestor’s paraphrasing, indicating a shared understanding of the emotional impact of the event.
• The conversation touches on the significance of the city of Baltimore and the nostalgia for bygone heroes, particularly Cal Ripken.

Diversity in Sports and Upcoming Events

• Nestor Aparicio highlights the rarity of two people of color discussing baseball, specifically mentioning his Venezuelan background and Allen’s African American heritage.
• The discussion shifts to the Baltimore Orioles, a team that has recently had notable achievements despite being in last place.
• Nestor mentions an upcoming event, the Maryland crab cake tour, and shares a personal anecdote about a debate with his wife over the ranking of lamb chops.
• Nestor announces plans for the next Tuesday at the Beaumont, including his intention to try fried lobster tail, and teases the top three places in the tastiness tour.

Final Remarks and Sign-Off

• Nestor Aparicio reiterates his identity and the purpose of their show, emphasizing their local connection and positive outlook on Baltimore.
• He humorously requests the return of his press pass, indicating a light-hearted approach to their work.
• The conversation concludes with a sign-off, expressing anticipation for future discussions and events.
• The overall tone is friendly and informal, reflecting a comfortable rapport between the hosts.

Allen McCallum and Nestor disc…Saturday night at Camden Yards

Sun, Sep 07, 2025 12:46PM • 1:06:47

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

Cal Ripken, Davey Johnson, Orioles Magic, Camden Yards, no hitter, baseball history, Peter Angelos, John Miller, Sam Haggerty, team performance, fan engagement, baseball legacy, player development, community impact, sports management., Cal Ripken, Orioles Magic, Camden Yards, Baltimore community, sports talk, baseball, Maryland crab cake tour, lamb chops, fried lobster tail, tastiness treats, WNST, Allen McCallum, Nestor Aparicio, African American, Venezuelan.

SPEAKERS

Allen McCallum, Nestor Aparicio

Nestor Aparicio  00:01

Welcome home. We are W, N, S, T am 15 70,000 Baltimore. We are Baltimore positive. And this is football season, but we’re going to be talking about baseball because it was kind of a madhouse over the weekend. Cal Ripken, 2131 game the West Coast trip for the Orioles, the Dodgers coming in show Hey pitching on Friday, last place. Sure, lots of reasons to watch if you’re a hardcore Orioles fan, but certainly the 30th anniversary of the Cal Ripken night, not the same kind of crowd, not the same kind of reverie, and then the no hit bid. Alan McCallum has been my baseball insider correspondent, insider and outsider, and all the way through, back to 27 years of w, N, S T, he attended the game on Saturday night. I did not, you know, the start of football season for me, probably just led me in the rain and just all of it was on TV. I felt like I wanted to watch it on TV and see it on TV. If I had a press credential, I’d have been down there, but I didn’t, because I wanted to interact with machine and some of the other people. But you went down give me your Saturday night, because I reached to you in advance of this, really, to talk about Davey Johnson, because you covered Davies teams. We covered Davies teams together 30 years ago. So what? What a weird Saturday that began a weird Sunday night of football in Buffalo. Alan McCallum,

Allen McCallum  01:30

yeah, it’s good to talk to you, Nestor, I gotta tell you, the first thing I would say is that 30 years goes by really, really quickly, like

Nestor Aparicio  01:38

a song, right? Like, we should write a song about how fast that happened, right?

Allen McCallum  01:41

It’s unbelievable. You know, I was there with my father 30 years ago, and I, my father has since passed, but it was something that I, I remember fondly. And I, my sister wasn’t there, so I wanted to go down with her. We went down with a couple of friends. You know, I pondered whether or not to buy the tickets because of the weather the couple of days before, because it looked like it was going to rain throughout, and that just sounded like a bummer. But I was like, You know what? I’m looking at, the probability it’s, I think it’s worth a shot. I think it’ll be good night.

Nestor Aparicio  02:21

Are you still a Birdland insider

Allen McCallum  02:24

to subscribe? Do I still have a subscription? Yes, no, I do not.

Nestor Aparicio  02:29

Okay, so I’m asking for this because you’re one of those 13 game season ticket holders for 100 years. With the plan I thought this, I have run into in my circle people that you know, people Howard share was on the show a couple weeks ago and admitted he had over grand left on his thing that he didn’t use this year, that you use or lose. I’m thinking like Saturday night would be the night that you use it. If you have clients, if you have a grand left, if you have $280 whatever you gave them, gifted them, thinking this was going to be a good year. You know, no ravens game in advance. Sunday night. You didn’t have to go to the game. Sunday night, it’s in Buffalo. And I think these Sunday night games wear people out with drinking all day, eating all day, waiting all day, playing all day, that like Saturday night at the ballpark in the rain, when it was on TV, felt a little bit for me and my wife, like we were going to sit at home and watch it, and that’s and I was committed to it. At 530 I had it on, right? You know, absolutely, you know, so like, I’m watching it all, and I thought it was a I’m at the point now where Alan, I don’t want to be disrespectful to Cal Ripken. I’ve been all over the world with Cal I’ve interviewed him over the North Pole. I have that distinction. I’ve stood on the Great Wall of China with Cal Ripken and his first wife. I, you and I were locker room to locker room, city to city, New York to Cleveland to Boston to Detroit to Milwaukee to Toronto with Cal Ripken, right? Like so I did all that. Cal’s not a hero to me. Cal’s a dude I know and I respect and I like him, I mean, and I actually watched the videos of you and me and Ray Bachman interviewing him 20 years ago when he went into the I mean, it’s all on YouTube. It’s click away, just put Nestor Allen and Cal Ripken, and it all pops up, and you can see how we treated Cal Ripken then, and how we were treated on Saturday night as a media entity without press credentials. But I would say this, I don’t the hero worship part of it I found to be like, Cal’s got to be a little uncomfortable with this. And even he said I didn’t, wasn’t really looking forward to this, but it’s been more fun just seeing old friends. That would have been the fun part for me. Seeing Rafael Palmeiro would have been fun for me. But who, by the way, looks in better shape than he did when he it’s a long story, but, but to stand in judgment of all of it, they’re trying to sell tickets. It was the 30th anniversary. It’s a great idea to do it. I thought it was kind of clunky, you know, from the Kevin Brad, just all of it on television. It, it felt a little like, now, why are we here again? And what, like, what? And where’s the first wife, and where’s the daughter, and Where’s Billy, and like, like, people are asking all of this, and why Steven Rubenstein on his phone, when Cal Ripken speaking, and where’s everybody? I mean, if. Like, how many people are really there? 30,000 maybe.

Allen McCallum  05:03

Okay, so there’s a lot there. You know, I would say, I mean, they, I think they described it as a sell out. It was not,

Nestor Aparicio  05:10

I mean, right off the bat, you’re going down to Trump landing of you’re gonna lie to my eyes and tell me what my eyes are. I should wash them, because it’s Cal, and it has to be, so that doesn’t have to be, I mean, like I would have gone down, you know what? I mean, I would have gone down. I just I didn’t, and I felt like somebody else would take the seed, and I did all of that with Cal. I was there when it really happened, you know, so, and I’ve been there for the last 30 years of everything else that’s happened too, um, that I’ve stood witness to. So there’s, and that’s the attrition part of it that really kind of makes me sad. You know, I want cow to be a hero and like the place to be mobbed and all that, and I wanted to be wonderful, but what happened in the baseball side wound up to make it top five all time. Camden, yards night, Allen, I mean, like, I know it’s an instant classic, and we’re 12 hours removed because we’re shooting this on Sunday. But like I looked at it, I woke up this morning, probably should have been there last night.

Allen McCallum  06:08

So, so there’s a lot there. I would say, first of all, you know, they closed down the left field stands a lot, unless it’s a giveaway or they think it’s a big thing. And those were open, you know, I would say was, I think it’s probably close to 40, okay, maybe 38 it wasn’t empty. I think the rain kept a lot of people away that were like, you know, let’s go down late, and we’ll see how it is. But it was a good crowd, for sure. That was a lot of

Nestor Aparicio  06:36

Dodgers fans too. I mean, it was a Saturday night. I mean, there were a million reasons to go. But I really thought, like the Birdman membership thing would be, like, somebody would call me and say, Dude, I got $1,200 on my thing. You want to go? Just come down. I’ll buy drinks all night. You know what I mean? I that I feel that energy about the team, and I thought it was a night to pour your love into the team. It really was.

Allen McCallum  06:57

So I was in the upper when I had, when I had 29 game plan with my sister and my dad, we sat in Section 350, 2/3, base, side, halfway up the upper deck. Those were, those are great seats. I got 362, last night. So from our vantage point, we knew they were Dodgers fans, and you could see some of them, but it was but you could hear them. I could hear them more than I could see them. And it wasn’t until I went home and actually watched the whole game back on replay at home on TV that you could see the huge number of Dodgers fans that were down on the lower deck, on the third base side and in other areas in the lower deck, and it’s like, wow, I I could hear them, but I didn’t realize how dramatically different the seating bowl looks.

Nestor Aparicio  07:44

Well, they were witnessing their team throwing no hitter all night long.

Allen McCallum  07:49

It wasn’t just them Ness

Nestor Aparicio  07:51

so you were cheering for the no hitter. I hope right.

Allen McCallum  07:57

Let me get there. So, we got, you know, we get there. And I’ll tell you, a lot of there were probably 35,000 people in the seating bowl at the time of the ceremonies, because a lot of people were still coming in. I think a lot of people got there late because of the weather. Traffic downtown was really, was really complicated. Oh, the cycling thing, right? Yeah. So I think a lot of people were still trying to get there when all that was happening. We knew all we we planned ahead. We got there about 20 minutes before started. They delayed it for a few minutes, which was really good. We got there as and got to see the whole thing. You know, I was there 30 years ago in the stands, and it was electric, and it was amazing. And I’m not from a cynical standpoint, I will tell you, yeah, some of it felt a little forced, a little small seat, because they’re trying to recreate all this stuff. And I

Nestor Aparicio  08:57

said to my wife early on, like it’s a little hokey, a little hokey, little hokey pokey, but

Allen McCallum  09:02

it’s, it’s at that moment you ask yourself a question, is it worth it to you to just give into it? To see these players, to see Harold Baines and Eddie Murray and Jim Palmer, that’s what made it

Nestor Aparicio  09:15

special. I 100% agree with you, right?

Allen McCallum  09:18

Hey, remember, remember these guys make the joke every time I see Harold Baines, I turn to somebody and I say, right now today, if someone called Harold Baines and said, We need a we need you to get us a base hit in Alaska, he’d get on a plane, fly for for however many hours, land there, get on a in a van, drive to where the sled dogs were, get on the sled dog team. Go for three hours. It’ll be 10 degrees below zero. He can work the count to three and one whistle a line drive in the center field in the game. You know those? Those things matter to me. And, you know, look, the vet that Cal drove around the ballpark in was sexies all get out.

Nestor Aparicio  10:07

And my wife’s a Corvette person. She loved that that’s

Allen McCallum  10:10

beautiful. And just, you know, to hear, to see John Miller, and to hear that voice in camp, I mean, I hear him all the time, but to hear him in Camden Yards waxing poetic about Cal, and then to see Cal, and you know you

Nestor Aparicio  10:25

John Miller waxed about Eddie, just to get a cheer. Absolutely look.

Allen McCallum  10:31

You mentioned the time that that we interviewed him. And I mean to me, that is what that is, one of the great singular moments of my life, getting to to interview Cal with just us in a room, right? But but to hear, and during that period of time, not just with us, he talked about how he wanted to be in a situation after he retired, and step away and think about and at that point reflect on what he what happened and what his career was. And in that moment, he felt like it would be real. And that’s this moment. And you could hear him towards the end of his his brief speech, break up a little

Nestor Aparicio  11:09

bit. He got emotional, yeah,

Allen McCallum  11:10

and for me, whatever else you think about what happened that was worth it, I agree to hear Cal Ripken in a moment his life after his father and his mother have passed, and his kids are grown, and you know, he’s in this ballpark, and whether it’s sold out or not, there are 35,000 people staring down at him, shouting his name and and leaning into a moment and knowing that for all the things that he’s been through the and those moments, he’s he’s on the he’s on the back end of having those moments and knowing that they you know that when they come again will be, will be less than before. I think all those things play into how you how he perceives a moment, how we perceive a moment. You know, they’re making jokes at the end of the game on the show. You know, 30 years from now, the 60th anniversary will be talking about this game. And I was like, I doubt Cal is going to be here for a 60th right? So, I mean, it’s not impossible, but it seems unlikely. Well, I

Nestor Aparicio  12:14

don’t know how many more runs around you’re going to have, and Ryan throwing the pitch to him and all of that. I again, I don’t regrets. I’ve had a few, but then again, too few to match. I regret Saturday, but I will tell you this, watching the no hitter sitting here, watching it, having my wife fall asleep after I fell asleep, when we waking each other up, and me yelling into her the Orioles just won the game, and she yelled, caught the you know, and, um, and she came running in, and I’m watching, and I’m like, oh my god, this is, like, one of the top five all time things I’ve ever seen in in modern Oriole baseball since Camden Yards came because, because Doug the senses, is a whole different level of like winning. I’m talking about since Angelo’s bought team, since the stadium was erected. You know, I always joke about the Pope, McCartney, Billy Joel, Jimmy Buffett died. They, they canceled on him and Van Halen before they could actually play the stadium. But that stadium is Delmon young, 2131

Allen McCallum  13:21

Mike Devereaux catching center field, fair enough.

Nestor Aparicio  13:25

So let me but the no hitter, the no mo no hitter, is a night that I wish I had been there, you know? I’m thinking that the statues night there was a statue night that was a big night, the curse of the Andino night I was there that night, you know, so like so nights, clinching nights. I’ve been there for clinching nights, and there’s 22,000 people there, and it’s it, it saddens me that modern It saddens me to see them honoring Ripken, where it’s far less influential and significant than it used to be. But it heartens me on a night when they almost get no hit. And wouldn’t that have been something like, I mean, we can write a book on the game Saturday night, Alan, we haven’t talked about that, and I called you about Davey Johnson. Alan McCallum is here. We’re trying to talk baseball in a football season. I even said to my wife, like, after Buffalo and Lamar and Josh, I don’t even know where the oxygen is in this city on Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday of this week for what happened on Saturday night. But like we got I called you about Davey Johnson, and then one of the greatest Orioles memories and evenings ever broke out. But let’s go to the no hitter a little bit I haven’t even talked to you about besides, oh yet. I mean, like, my god,

Allen McCallum  14:36

so let me break this down for you. You asked me about my subscription plan. I gave up the 29 game plan a while ago. I work in DC. Life has gotten complicated. Sometimes it’s easier to watch it on TV. I go when I can go, I will tell you that my history with the Orioles attendance the last couple of years has not been great. I’ve seen them lose. Lose a whole lot more than I’ve seen them win in the last two seasons,

Nestor Aparicio  15:04

okay, including playoff games. Well,

Allen McCallum  15:07

yeah, let me, let me put it to you this way. I I’ve seen, I had seen them win one game this year or last night at home, and it was a, it was a game where they scored all the runs in the first inning, we walked in in the second inning, they won the game. I never saw them score run. Okay? I think I saw them get to hit, an infield hit and a blooper to the outfield, and they won the game. But I never saw them do anything during there have been a

Nestor Aparicio  15:37

lot of nights the last two seasons where they just haven’t hit the ball at all, and that’s going on.

Allen McCallum  15:42

Went to Toronto last year. I was going to go see two games. The first game I was I was going to go to Grayson Rodriguez was supposed to pitch. Grayson got, got pulled from the or scratched from the start, he hasn’t thrown a pitch in the major leagues since then. Okay, so it’s your fault.

Nestor Aparicio  16:07

Well, I want to remind everybody I was sitting next to you when Jeffrey Mayer happened.

Allen McCallum  16:11

I’m aware. And then the only run they scored in the whole game was a Jackson holiday home run. And I was like, I’m cursing this club I was supposed to go to the next game, and I said to my I said to who I was with, like we’re not going tomorrow, because I I’m not going to see that. I can’t see this again. And they won. We did something else fun. So cut to last night. Game starts. I’m with my sister. I’m with good friends. You know, we’re talking about what, everything that’s happened. We’re talking about life, other things. And, you know, at some point I turned to my friend Sean, I’m like, This guy’s dealing, like he’s dealing. It was one of those moments when I remember when Mike Messina is pitching for the Orioles, you know, those moments when he was going deep into the game and he wasn’t throwing, he was throwing no hitters, and I am sitting, I’m talking to Mark Messina, I’m talking to you, and you’re talking about how I’m waxing poetic about about the game.

Nestor Aparicio  17:11

Well, you were at the Messina no hitter game on the Friday night, right? I was Indians game, yeah,

Allen McCallum  17:16

I was deep, and you accused me of waxing poetic. I was like, it was the it was one I did the

Nestor Aparicio  17:20

show at Hooters that night, and I had a date with Robin, my old girlfriend. We sort of was a first date kind of thing. And we went across the harbor that night and what and had it, had a dinner date, and I got up in the sixth inning and Messina was throwing. You never forget where you are when someone’s throwing a no hitter, especially when you’ve walked out of a no hitter, as I have, and I have a ticket stub, and I did my show from Jack Murphy stadium and left, and a no hitter happened that night. So like, I, you know, like Tony Gwynn was part of it. He was in the lineup and went over for four so I, like the no hitter thing has haunted me forever, and the fact that this became a no hitter, and Luke was texting me because our tech services had a little bit of a five or 10 Minute lag in it when we sent out the texts. And he’s like, I’m afraid to do this and have it broken up. And I’m like, don’t you know, it’s Saturday night. If people are into the Orioles and into Cal Ripken, they’re into it. And it was, you know, it was 10 o’clock Saturday night anyway. I just, I really thought it was going to happen Alan, like, so what I mean, like, I’m watching it, and I’m like, finally. I didn’t know you were at the ballpark. I was like, finally Luke is going to get his note, because he and I have had 20 years of friendship now and radio, and I can’t wait to get him on, but you are, Luke’s gonna say, Yeah, I was there, but we got to talk about the ravens and builders. Josh Allen the Lamar that, you know, there’s gonna be all that this week. You know, I know you’re not,

18:49

I’m not gonna

Nestor Aparicio  18:50

get so I you’re tuning in to hear Lamar and Josh and bills. We gotta talk about this. We gotta talk about this game.

Allen McCallum  18:57

I remember Sandy a Lamar hitting that line drive to break up machine as a no hitter, I’ve seen a lot of stuff, Nestor, I’ve seen a lot of it because of or with you. I haven’t seen a World Series game in person, and I haven’t seen no hitter. I have tickets. I have tickets to the Wilson Alvarez no hitter that I could not go to because I was at a wake for a family.

Nestor Aparicio  19:19

My kid called me, my kid never invites me to do anything, and he invited me to go to the Hideo Nomo game that night. Was early in the year. Was in April. People around here still cared about baseball in a big way then. And Mike Peters of the alarm was playing in the record theater that night, and I had just sang on stage with him a couple of nights before, and I’m like, I love Mike Peters. I went to Mike Peters that night, and I watched the no hitter in the corner of the record theater in the rec room on the television. And I’m like, You got to be kidding me, my kid went to a no hitter and I didn’t. And of course, the next day, the Orioles took out an ad in the sun selling ticket stubs to commemorate the big event for Red Sox. Like literally, people forget this stuff. I don’t forget it. But the one. Thing I have never done, by the way, the day that David cone threw the perfect game, yeah, Scotty P, Scotty P, from amici is my life for friend. And by the way, amici is number three on the countdown for tastiness. So, you know, two and one are pretty damn good, if only three, right? So we were supposed to go see Springsteen at Brendan Byrne arena that night. It might have been giant stadium, don’t quote me on that, but it was Springsteen in the E Street Band, and it might have been the stadium, but either way, it was summer, obviously baseball, and it was like a Wednesday afternoon or Thursday afternoon was a day game, and Scotty piece like, Hey, man, let’s go up and see the Yankees in the afternoon, and then we’ll go across the bridge and we’ll go to Jersey. We’ll see Bruce. Okay, I’m in night before. You know, I got the kitchen in the meat. I didn’t go. I missed the perfect game. Yeah, so it has been a lifelong quest of mine. The no other thing is a thing for me, and now all I want to have happen is for you to be at one I’m committed that I walked out of my bud Smith game in San Diego. It’s never going to happen for me. So here’s the weird thing about the game Saturday night that I want you to attest to is that the drunks that sit out in the bar and the girls that don’t know anything about baseball just like the color orange, and people that are Cal Ripken worshiping and all of that, and the rain and all of that, I’m assuming 99.9% of the people stayed that no one went over to pickles in the seventh inning, that no one walked out of a no hitter. You know what I mean? Like, like, like, I’m just assuming the whole bowl was down on it. Maybe I’m wrong, because the way they shoot these games on TV, it’s like Trump shoots his presidency. Yeah, Trump shoots his presidency. Everything about it is. Greg Bader, homogenized, so everything is bigger, better, perfect, awesome, great. Rob long Melanie Newman sits with Cal rip, like all of it, but to me, the the no hitter thing, I don’t know if people we know how special it is, or whether they’re pissed about it’s the Orioles and they’re the home team’s getting no hit. If they’re that dumb to think that they’re rooting against it like I don’t know what the buzz is around baseball people in the upper deck for that sort of an event, because it’s so rare, scarce. It’s like seeing the northern lights or something, man, you know.

Allen McCallum  22:26

So, you know, the thing about a no hitter is that you don’t always understand until later in the game that it’s happening, okay? But a lot of people were there because, you know, all the stuff that happened there, you know, you’re getting these other things that are going through the game. You don’t know what they’re going to what, what kind of surprises there are for cat involving Cal, so people were staying and then by the time you get to the sixth or seventh inning, you’re like, like, I said, I’m like, This guy’s dealing, you know, before when with Mike Messina, I’m in the press box, and you can see it right in front of you, you know, we’re in the upper deck. It’s a different vantage point, but you could see how they were reacting to it, that he was throwing, throwing spectacularly well. And then you go, I can come home. You’re watching, you’re watching this ball dance all over the strike zone. It was really in and out of the strike zone. It was really incredible. To answer your question. There were a few people that left, but, but most of the people were there at the end, there was, there was, and then

Nestor Aparicio  23:22

if you’re there at the end, you’re there at the end of the end, and then you stayed for the miracle, right? So that’s what I’m saying. Like, how many people could say, well, they made a comeback and they won a game. They shouldn’t have wanted, it was Oriole magic, but I had, I wanted to die. Wanted to get to the Baja beach club, or whatever is going on, right? I would think disdain for the no hitter part really let and you could feel the energy on TV of, oh my god, they might win. This guy can’t throw a strike. You know what I mean,

Allen McCallum  23:50

like? And that energy was that energy was real. Look. So we got to the eighth inning, and I turned, you know, they went out so quickly in eighth inning. And by this after the sixth inning, I’m looking at his pitch count on my phone, like, how far are they going to let this thing go?

Nestor Aparicio  24:06

And because they are independent race, they are in first place, they’re going to need him for Game Two, right?

Allen McCallum  24:12

I think after the seventh, it was like 94 and by the by the eighth, it was like, like 100 and it was, it was it was just past 100 and I was like, I think they’re gonna let this guy do this. And I turned like, I think we’re about to see no hitter. I mean, at this point, I was like, and there was a moment of me where I went, I can’t believe I’m going to see the Orioles get no hit. And then I went, I can’t believe I’m not gonna No, no,

Nestor Aparicio  24:39

no. I can’t believe I’m going to see the Orioles get no hit on Cal Ripken anniversary night, in front of everybody by the freaking Dodgers that, you know, that Koufax and Drysdale and, you know, in front of Jim Palmer, in front of Eddie Murray, who played for the like,

Allen McCallum  24:53

I’m thinking, like, I’m a jinx. I can’t believe it’s happening. And then it’s like, oh my god, I can’t believe this is happening. Mean, I think I’m going to see

Nestor Aparicio  25:01

no hitter. Of course, this is going to happen tonight, right? Like so and

Allen McCallum  25:09

the Alex Jackson comes out, comes up 333, pitches he’s gone, and then Toby mayo, to his credit, because I was like, Oh, he’s he’s going to strike out 15 times in one swing. He put a good, he put a good swing on the ball, and he just missed it. Mayo, just missed it. And I was like, this is going to happen, and Jackson holiday comes up. I think he, I think he felt, did he? I think he fell off one pitch when he hit that boss, like, oh my god,

Nestor Aparicio  25:45

oh my God. And I sat up and I’m like, that’s gone. I’m like, that’s gone.

Allen McCallum  25:51

I thought for a second that the arc was gonna the wind was gonna get it and the arc was gonna hold it in.

Nestor Aparicio  25:56

I thought was gonna at least hit the wall. It was a hit. No hitter was over the minute the ball hit the bat, nobody was catching that ball.

Allen McCallum  26:03

And it was, I mean, at that point, is incredible. All right, great. So they broke it up and then like, Oh, great. Well, I’m just gonna watch the Orioles lose the game. And there were a few people that did leave at that point. So our friend Gail, turns to us and says, you know they can win this game. And I was and I turned her and I said, I appreciate your optimism, Gail.

Nestor Aparicio  26:28

I left the len Dykstra playoff game to honor Davey Johnson. I found my ticket stub. I’ve literally found my ticket stub. I left the len Dykstra game in 86 at Shea Stadium. I heard the home run on the freeway in traffic, and I was with a Mets fan. It did not go well. So I remember these moments where you walk out and if you’re crossing Pratt Street, and you’re like the Orioles did, what? Like my wife went back to bed after the no winner got broken up, she went to bed, and I’m screaming at her. 20 minutes later, I’m like, they won.

Allen McCallum  26:57

So Jeremiah Jackson, who I love, by the way, I pray this kid is real, because I love his approach at the plate. Smokes the double into the gap, you know, and then everybody’s hoping for gunner to hit a home run. Gunner gets hit. And once they’re once, both of them are on, on on base. I’m looking at description like, okay, Mounties had some pretty good at bats the last week. All right, he walks. And the moment for me was cowser and cows who they call the milkman, who I believe they should call the Swiss cheese man, because the amount of holes in his swing. I’m like, he’s either going to hit a home run or he’s going to strike out, and he walks, and I’m like, Oh my God, this guy can’t find a plate. And you’re thinking at this point, everybody in the bullpen, at that point, they were all spectators. There was no mindset to come in this game. There was no mindset that they needed to help participate. They wanted to see a no hitter like everybody else. And suddenly they’re called into action, and nobody is mentally ready. Independent Race game for them. But not only that, they lost four in a row, and they needed a win, but everybody became a spectator, spectator to Yamamoto is absolute gym, and they were ready. And when cows are once, cows are walks in the other run. I’m like, oh my god, they could this is real. So I test, I test. Texted Mark Messina after the game. I said I watched two baseball games tonight. The first one lasted eight and two thirds inning innings, the second one lasted in the span of an out that never came. Both were incredible. I can’t believe I saw this, because Emmanuel Rivera comes up, and I I turned to everybody, and it’s like Mario Rivera gets clutch hits, and he’s gotten the biggest hits for them all week. I don’t know what kind of player he’s gonna ultimately, ultimately be, but both last year and this year, when he’s come up, he’s gotten big hits for them. And Tanner Scott comes in. That ball he hit was almost on the ground, Nestor, I mean, he all. He hit that ball almost off the ground into center field, and the place was by the time he got to the plate. The place was electric. The place was wild. And people at that, by the time he got to this place, we believed he was going to win. Most of the people believed where they were going to win. I was like, they they can win this game. And when he hit the line drop, there was a moment earlier when Jeremiah Jackson got the double, and they pinch ran for him. And I was like, that run means nothing. What are you doing? And I understand that he thought he’s thinking, well, they’re in if they tie this game, they’re going to put they’re going to pull him for a real outfielder anyway. Okay, fine. But I was like, they need to save the pinch runner for the winning run. And they did with Mateo, good call. That ball gets hit in the center field, and you know at that point they’re going to win, because Mateo is on second base, and you know, you know as soon as the ball hits the grass that they’re going to win, but you’re

Nestor Aparicio  30:16

always somewhere in the pig town. I mean, I’m

Allen McCallum  30:18

telling you, your brain could not process that 20 minutes ago, they were about to be no hit, and that you’re watching the runner that’s going to win the game round third base, like I’m in a weird time dispersal thing in time and science fiction, and I’m seeing something that is not happening. This is not happening. And they won that. They won that game. I can’t I’m surprised to have a voice today, because I was screaming every player, everybody’s jumping up down, everybody but the Dodger fans are behind.

Nestor Aparicio  30:54

That’s why Sam’s a top five Oriole Park. Moment ever, ever on Saturday night, and it came out of dust. It

Allen McCallum  31:06

was, if you ever believe the idea of Oriole magic, it was there in it was there last night. Something happened that was not well.

Nestor Aparicio  31:16

If I get my press credential back rightfully next year, and I go on to write um, orange rain, I don’t know you come up with whatever it’s going to be called. If there’s an Oriole parade in the next three years, the beginning of the book would you literally the book will start on the 30th anniversary of the disappointment of all of this holiday being a one, one and breaking it up, just all of it. I mean, just all of it was magical. Alan McCallum is here, so Alan in the at the end of the day, it was just one game, and we’ll see what happens in the future. But I reached you about the Davey Johnson thing, and as it intertwines me, what a day like, I mean, what a weekend with football starting and just all of it wake up on Saturday to Davey passing away, and I found out kind of early in the morning, I saw it on my timeline. And, you know, and I’m always, I’m a journalist. Is this a hoax? And I’m like, he’s 82 Yeah. And, um, I have so many things I want to say about Davey, which is why I reached to you way before no hitters in Yamamoto and Cal, 2131 and Mark Messina and I did an hour together last week. If you want to go check that out, about 2131 I’d love to talk to his brother. Like to talk to half of those guys in that line. I’m like, Man, I’d love to talk to Ben McDonald for an hour about this stuff. And be in there. Like to talk to Cal again, if they let me and his son just about this stuff, because it was all very intimate to me and the Davey Johnson thing, and I told my wife some stories, and that’s what led me to texting you on Saturday, late in the morning and saying, Hey, man, we got to talk about Davey Johnson a little bit, because my wife was unfamiliar a little bit, you know, kind of came into the movie a little later. These youngins might not but, I mean, I remember Davies player. I remember, I remember Davey wearing a black hat, 72 as an Oriole. I mean, I there was my first Oriel team. I remember Redmond and, you know, Wayne, Wayne garland, and was coming in for Brooks. And that era of Oriole baseball was very good. They were good team, 7374 the trade for EARL WILLIAMS. And I will say this Saturday is really a weird day. Alan, my wife, said to me, the Bowery antique over on Harford road across in the barn. It’s there. They’re going out of business. And I had never walked in there. My life says antiques. I didn’t think it had sports stuff. I went in there. They had baseball cards, football cards. I found skip Jack’s score cards from 1984 like I found all look it was I bought a, I bought a, I bought one thing. I bought a Sports Illustrated Joe Namath cover in night from 1970 for $1 I spent $1 but, but I touched EARL WILLIAMS, 1973 it was mint too, 1973 baseball card, and I turned it over, and I said to her, and this is on the day Davey Johnson dies, crazy, and I was explaining this to her in the morning, and now I’m holding his baseball card in Parkville, and people around me are talking about the Orioles, and I went to the parade in 83 I’m hearing people I didn’t get recognized, which was fine, because I was Just trying to, like, look, I was rummaging through stuff, lots of stuff, football cards, all sorts of stuff that’s in my lane. And, um, I held this EARL WILLIAMS card, and I turned it over for my wife. He like, 28 home runs in 7123 like, he was like, gonna change the Orioles. It was a big deal that Davey got dealt out, and then Davey went on this path to managing the Mets, being a legend in New York, the Reds thing, the other jobs he’s had, right? Yeah, and, but he came to Baltimore, and I wrote Peter principles. I hope everybody reads it, if you’re this far in and. Think I’m the Jackass and Allen’s the straight guy, and I’ve written chapters. Spent days and weeks and months when my wife was battling cancer, writing the Peter principles for Adam Jones because he asked me about an oral history. So I hope at some point Adam Jones reads it as well. But to understand how screwed up Peter Angelos was, how screwed up their management structure. Was how Davey was going to take the job, and they insulted Davey, and then Davey said, F you. And they, you know, they went another direction, and they hired Phil Regan, and it didn’t work out well. And then Davey came back, and then Davey and he didn’t get along. And Davey loved me because I shat upon Angelos. I told the truth. So Davey never really wanted to be nice to me. He was kind of a hard ass, smart ass, kind of a guy you were not in Fort Lauderdale. This is in 1997 I’m doing my show live. So it was just that Ray Bachman would speak to this ISDN, line speed things, equipment issues, the phone company 1997 there is no internet. We’re using landlines. There’s barely cell phones. So I’m in the lobby of the Doubletree in Fort Lauderdale, and all the players are coming by. So like, I think this thinking of the era Alomar, surhoff, um, Rick down, Scott kaminicky. I’m just thinking of people that I have pictures, um, Alan Mills, moose, you know, like all these people are coming, Brady, there’s people are coming by and doing the show, and Davey comes down during my show to go out to dinner, to have a couple of nips. They played an afternoon game, or was an off day, or whatever it was. And he comes down, and he sits eight feet in front of me, puts his feet up, orders a Bud Light, and watches me do my show. And I invited him on to the show. He’s like, Nah, man, I got my own show. I got my own show. On BA, on, sure, watch the show, man, I just want to hear what you got to say. So he’s like watching nasty Nestor do live radio, refusing to come on, but sitting there for 20 minutes, 30 minutes, watching me interview his coaches and laughing. He got a kick out of me. Davey always liked to believe that Davey and I, we played with my cousin, right? I mean, like big time. So he had the different kind of respect for the Aparicio thing, and he was always poking me and testing me. He was always a smart ass with me. But you know what I knew he liked me was the next year the thing with angelos, it needs to be read and not told the fact how much they hated each other, the the faxing back and forth, the blame, the you can’t fire me. I quit. Like, unbelievable, after winning 100 games two years in a row and going wire like, how in the 3.6 million people in the stadium? Cal Ripken, like, it’s just, you can’t even explain it to people. 30 years later, how big the Orioles were and the Ravens were wearing Barney suits. At this point, they just come to town. PSLs, Vinnie, test, divert, list, all of that. Rosenthal is killing the Ravens every day. Killing Angelo’s every day too. But Davey quits, has no job, and in the summer 1998 the all star game was in Denver at Coors Field. Davey got a gig with Coors Light, wearing Coors Light swag, signing autographs and doing handshakes and pictures at a bar in lodo from like three to four on workout there, whatever. And I’m there with Scott walk. There was one time photographer Cal Ripken, and I’m going to walk around Denver. Tom cap was with me too, and I said, Davey Johnson’s doing a meet and greet at this bar. I’m going over, I’m going over, I’m I’m gonna go over and talk to him and get some information. And I walked over to the bar and Davey sitting there alone. Nobody cares you. Davey Johnson, yeah. Like it wasn’t that good people in Denver to care about baseball so much here at the beanie babies, as I remembered it, um, baseball was new in Denver at that point, so, like it was just a thing, Davey sitting there alone, like there was no line. There was, might have been three people to get a pick, you know, but like they had time to talk to me, sure it wasn’t a wham bam autograph, get out of line thing. Davey just bought me a beer and sat there for a half an hour and bled my ears about Angelo’s, about everything that happened, about all of it, with a smile on his face. And then I saw him again. He managed the Nationals for years like and I, I never had, I never went down there for that. But I saw him the last time in life I saw him at Dodger Stadium, managing the World Baseball Classic team. Brian Roberts was on that team. Jeremy Guthrie was on that team. I saw dice K pitch for the Japanese and Ichiro. And at that point, Dennis Manion was was the president of the Dodgers and got. Tickets behind home plate. I mean, I was at the game, sitting next to Larry King, sitting next to Alyssa Milano, like it was an unbelievable experience that was afforded to me that night because I was in LA for the owners meetings. This is when bashati came up and threatened me about talking to his coaches. This was literally that trip. It was the owners meetings were in LA Dana Point unbelievable. And the next night, the World Baseball Classic was happening, because it was in March, and I’m like, I want to go up to Dodger Stadium. So Jen and I went up, and I had press pass I was on the field, so I went on the field, interviewed Brian Wright. You can go to YouTube and watch it all, but my last entree with Davey was on the field talking about how much he loved Baltimore and how much kids were born here. Born here. And he just had to smile about him. And I snapshotted that when he passed on Saturday, and I wanted to remember Davey in some way, because it Alan. It’s been 30 years for Ripken and 2131 Davey was only here a minute, right? Davey would manage the team for two years, and was such an integral, huge, huge part of everything that was right and everything that ever went wrong about the Orioles you don’t know like about how effed up Peter G Angelo’s was.

Allen McCallum  41:17

So you mentioned Peter Angelos and and for me, like last night, when John Miller was was speaking at the ceremony, and my friend Gail said, Listen to that voice. And I was like, yeah, and he, he, he isn’t here because Peter Angelos ditched him for whatever reason. I’ll never, I’ll for all the things that might be the thing the most. I won’t I’ll never forget Peter,

Nestor Aparicio  41:42

Andrew, John Miller, sat in my studio and cried. He sobbed live on my radio. I remember

Allen McCallum  41:48

so I mean, you probably have better one on ones with Davey than I did, because, you know, he was always hesitant.

Nestor Aparicio  41:58

And Davey Johnson in my life, other than the two minutes and 14 seconds that are on YouTube from Dodger Stadium in 2000 and whenever, 910, whatever that was like that literally, is the only one on one I ever had with Davey. I’ve just poured my soul like I have one more Davey Johnson story that I will tell you that involves the 1986 nationally championship series. And John Steadman, Don’t let me forget to tell it because I want to tell it because it’s really kind of cool and special. But like the Davey things, where you covered those teams, you were my guy during those two years.

Allen McCallum  42:31

My first foray with you was the week before 2131 and I went down to do that. But I didn’t start covering the team officially until 1996 so Davey was the manager. And you know, the first couple months, you know you’re feeling your way around this thing, who I can talk to, when I when I should speak, when these things can happen. And like they knew who I was, they knew I was there for you. And you know, you have a rep, right? So people are

Nestor Aparicio  43:04

always a really good rep with the team. At that point, they all liked me.

Allen McCallum  43:07

Yeah, people are a little cautious, because they know that you’ll say things that other people people won’t say, um, but oh, the truth. You mean

Nestor Aparicio  43:16

anything up? So, yeah,

Allen McCallum  43:18

yeah, no, that’s not what I’m saying. So Davey didn’t really I knew I was never going to get him on the air, okay, but Davey, here’s what I know about Davey, he was whip smart. He was street smart, he was sarcastic as all get out. He funny. He suffered no fools. He wanted nothing to do with the stupid questions when they come and he, you could always see he had, he was a prototypical manager, meaning he had ideas. You know, the thing about analytics, it’s it’s not that they these ideas didn’t exist before. They have just been quantified in ways that that you can put into a math equation. Okay, but they’re people. They’re people like ops. Are you asked? Are you actually telling me that people didn’t, it didn’t occur to them that doubles plus home runs, plus getting on plus walks means you get you get on base a lot and do things with it. I mean, Davey Johnson’s one of those guys that you knew those kinds of things were percolating in his head, and he didn’t necessarily share all that with you, but you could see that. I’ve seen managers who I wasn’t really sure what their thought process was, okay and but Davey’s not one of those guys, a master strategist. He was a master strategist, but he

Nestor Aparicio  44:45

manipulator and massager and but I never felt like he was dishonest. I always felt like straight up, no, that’s not,

Allen McCallum  44:53

no, that’s not what I’m saying. He just, he just, he played his cards close to the vest. I knew that I. He was not somebody you wanted to have. You did not want him to be pissed at you, because I was pretty sure there was a serious temper in there somewhere. And I also knew that, you know, he could, he could kick back and have a good time with his boys. I was born in 72 so I don’t remember him as a player, but I would, I remember him as I just remember how

Nestor Aparicio  45:20

bad the trade was in regard to EARL WILLIAMS, and in regard to, like, what Earl they the Orioles thought they were getting in EARL WILLIAMS for this, in this five player deal that they didn’t get. And I said to my wife, Davey, went off and played with Hank Aaron. Davey was on the field when Hank Aaron hit the home run. You know what I mean? Like, so, yeah. So, I mean, Davey just had these lives in baseball that goes back to 66 in New York, doing this against the Dodgers on an or David Johnson was a member of the Orioles at 66 you know, like so there’s so many things he touched that he’s a larger than life piece of Oriole history that was a blink of the eye, because he’s famous for Being

Allen McCallum  45:59

a met. And it’s important to say this is veteran, as those teams in 96 and 97 were Ripken and sur Hoff and Palmeiro, Bonilla, Eric Davis, a whole lot of guys that were veterans and played the game. Davey, when it was was the glue. He was a guy that could go to Cal and say no. He was a guy that could go to Cal and say no. And there were times in and around this team that you got the sense that people were might have been afraid to say no to Cal, um, or sort of

Nestor Aparicio  46:38

Cal stayed in his own hotel. Cal made his own rules. Okay? I mean, there are plenty of people who played with Cal. The thought of Cal as selfish. It didn’t say it out loud. There were plenty of people that revered Cal. So like and it went along lines of, sometimes race, sometimes culture, sometimes, hey, we’re on a team. We’re all going to do this together. Like so there and Cal spoke to this eloquently, I thought, with Melanie Newman on Saturday night on television, which was like, hey, the streak was controversial, because no one had done it. Nobody really thought it was all that great of an idea. And now in modern terms load management and innings, you’re always talking about, yeah, my motor thrown in, no hitter, they were gonna pull up so like the game and the world has changed a lot. So Cal, you know, Cal understands it. I don’t think Cal would play Cal every minute of every day, in every inning if Cal were the manager of Cal, because Cal probably knows better than anybody that the streak was nice and all the flowers that come with it, but he probably would have hit for a better average if he’d have played 152 instead of 162 especially after he was third. After he was 30. And that’s just human nature of knowing how old guys bodies work. Now that

Allen McCallum  47:48

I’m I’m a person who both revealed, reveres Cal, and I also understand that Cal was human and not and as a result, not perfect.

Nestor Aparicio  47:57

Yeah, was that an ego? Cal? Did you know Cal, of course, cows arrogant. I mean, I’m a pro Cal guy for the most, most part. I’m just not a hero worship guy, um, but I’m also, I’m a fan of his greatness, and I’m a fan of what a good person he’s been through his life. But I, you know, I can cut that aside from putting a Superman cape on him. You know what?

Allen McCallum  48:17

I mean, absolutely, and it’s important to understand. And you can do that for

Nestor Aparicio  48:20

himself, that thankfully, that when you know Cal, he doesn’t speak, it’s not like being around Cam Newton, where he’s in the third person. You know what? I mean, Cal’s a good guy. I mean, the autograph thing will never be done. And we already mentioned that, of all the extraordinary things Cal Ripken ever did, hanging out, meeting every fan every night. Hey, nobody’s ever done that.

Allen McCallum  48:40

Signed more autographs than probably any human being in the history of the world. Look, um, whatever you think about Cal, you know, staying in other places, for all the people that that resented that, I will argue that Cal saved a lot of people a lot of grief, because if he had stayed with the team in those places, it would have, it would have bombarded everybody and made things more complicated that we could we could debate that forever. The point is that Cal for whatever he was, and you’re right this, whatever you think about streak, it will never, it will never be broken, because no one will ever, will ever allow a player to get that far into it again. Load management don’t want to deal with it, whatever.

Nestor Aparicio  49:20

And that’ll happen, and not because managers have strength like Davey did, or like Earl did, or whatever, but it’ll happen just because that they’ll see the players in investment that they don’t want to run into the ground, see Matt leaders and Buck Showalter, right, like, just in a general sense, these guys are valuable property, you know, and and the pitching thing speaks the way they manage innings and load management. So yeah, I mean, look, all of it’s extraordinary. I don’t doubt that. But to your point, Davey Johnson’s a guy that could have sat Cal at some point and gotten away with it, especially because Davey came after the streak was over. I mean, was in progress, but it was like If David said, Carol, you haven’t had a hit in two weeks. Was, you know, take a day off and just end this thing. And there was a there was pressure to do that. At that point, Cal was pretty rock headed though. I mean, by that point, he already broken it, and it was like, Cal owned the streak. It wasn’t the other way around. It really wasn’t like, if anybody portrays it that way, they weren’t in the locker room the way you and I were. I mean, really, I mean, I’m not being a sports talk, perfectionist or revisionist here. The truth is, Davey could have sat Cal because he had that power that Bill Regan didn’t have, you know what I mean, to choose to be able to do

Allen McCallum  50:33

that look, Davey. My point was that Davey had the gravitas and the and the the presence that he could go up to somebody and say and say no, and that’s important. And, yeah, I’m not sure. I’m not sure Tony Mancino is, is a guy that could that has that juice at this point. You know, when you get to that point, if you’re Calvert, and I think you have, you’ve earned that right to say it. I mean, you’ve gotten that far, it

Nestor Aparicio  50:59

played out exactly the way it was supposed to play out. And the Davey Johnson thing is a is still a real, real pressure point. And on Saturday night to see the empty seats for Cal Ripken night, to see them almost get no hit, to see the miracle to happen, the thing for me that struck me was Eddie Murray, Rafael Palmeiro, Mike Messina, the history and the legacy of all of that for Ripken and how it hasn’t been done since 1983 and seeing that John Miller was thrown out that like, like there to me, the Davey Johnson thing will always be unfinished business and will always tarnish the Angelo’s thing to say, like, that’s really Miller was part one, yeah, and when he walked out on the field Saturday, I said to my wife, this city loves John Miller, like, loves John Miller in a way that they might love John Miller as much they love Cal Ripken. So, like, and so I said, he’s gonna really get cheered. I told my wife, I’m like, he is beloved here, and it when I watched him walk out. I’m like, he these are the flowers he never got here because he was just shat upon and thrown out of here in 1996 and 9730 years ago, for him to live long enough to come back with three rings from the Giants Hall of Fame Ford Frick and all that, to walk on the field, it filled my heart for John Miller to give his life

Allen McCallum  52:23

to this game. I won’t tell you he’s the best that ever did it, but I’ll tell you he’s on the mountain Rushmore with the ones with with whoever is.

Nestor Aparicio  52:29

So, I mean, the night had its thing, but Davey died that day. And I keep thinking, all these guys touch Davey, every single one of them.

Allen McCallum  52:38

So Davey, my what I was trying to get to is that it for all the veterans that were on those teams, they wouldn’t have gone wire to wire 97 if Davey Johnson wasn’t the manager. He just He knew what. He knew how to make that team go. He knew how to play that, that that instrument, there was no accident. All fell apart the next year it was, it was certainly not now you, I did not know when you texted me, I did not know he had passed so when your text came in, my thought was, why did you want to talk to me about Dave Johnson? And then I found out a short time later, so it was a completely different you actually alerted me to the reality that Davey passed away. And, you know, it’s been, it’s been a good minute, and I hadn’t really thought about him in a while, but I spent a lot, you know, in those hours before we went to the game, I spent thinking about just the moments that we spent with him. I remember with Jeffrey Mayer right in the and hearing him speak after that game, just the sense of, sort of, it was the one that game. After that game was the one time that I saw Davey Johnson look like, I can’t even, I don’t really know what just happened here, but we, but we got screwed. I mean, he he had this look on his face like I I can’t of all the things that would happen, I can’t really believe that that happened. And I think everybody sort of had a sense in that moment that that was something that was going to impact this club for the for the rest of the year, you know, or for the rest for the rest of the playoff run. David Johnson was a, was a great manager, a great baseball man, and, and, and he will, he will be missed.

Nestor Aparicio  54:26

Last story for you, because you and I can, you know, we gotta get to some football around here, because, you know, the Ravens played

Allen McCallum  54:32

Sunday. I want to talk to you about the style and the club a little bit before we, before we go.

Nestor Aparicio  54:35

Alright. Well, my last Davey Johnson, p6 I was telling my wife Dave Johnson stories 1986 I’m working at the evening sun. And the the news American had just folded. The news American folded in like, May of 86 and so October of 86 John Steadman had come over to the evening sun. And John was still, you know, this, 15 years of life. He still had left in him. He was still the columnist, Venerable. He. Uh, above the fold at the evening sun now, so we brought him on with Henneman. You know, like we were, Rosenthal just gotten higher. We were pretty good. You know, I was make sure that scoreboard page was always tight with all the agate John came back, and I could look this date up, October, something near my birthday in 1986 I’m 17 years old. John and I had a relationship that was great. Even by two years in John loved me. You know, this is one of the stories of Steadman and I our love affair. Steadman comes in to the evening sun newsroom in his coat from the train station, senior, I brought you something tonight. So what you bring me? John holds him a baseball. Pulls a baseball out of his bag, National League Baseball, black ink on it. The American leagues had baby blue. I don’t know who the National League President was then, but Chubb Feeney, whoever the hell it was, autograph on it. And there’s scuff marks on the side of the baseball. And Steady, steady brings it in to show it to Jack Gibbons, who was our sports editor, Mike Marlowe, Bob Nestor, were there. It’s, it’s one o’clock in the morning. You know, it’s late at night. Steady is in he just gotten off the train. Might have been three in the morning. Honestly, it might have been like in the middle of middle of the night, and steady gives me the baseball. And he says, Davey Johnson gave me this ball. And I’m like, Okay. He said, I want you to see something. Senior. You see this ball here? Davey had a bag of them. Mike Scott stuffing baseballs after the game. Davey brings me in, shows me a bag of balls they’ve confiscated. They’re going to give to the league office. Gave me one of the balls because John was a journalist. John was right about this. Davey was complaining that Mike Scott in the same series when they wore those weird Astros jerseys with the white in the 86 playoffs, Nolan Ryan, right? All of that. I mean, the Mets beat them and won the World Series, right? But this is literally the 86 playoffs. They’re playing the Astros and Nolan Ryan, the whole deal. And I still have that baseball. Steadman did a column because of his relationship with Davey Johnson, knowing Davey from 6667 68 he’s the veteran that when And Dave is like New York riders won’t write about this. I’m going to give it to you steady and I got the baseball, and I’d love to find that column that Stedman wrote about Mike Scott scuffing baseballs. Tell you what, Mike Scott’s career never was the same ever again after that. Go look he I think he was 19 and three in 1986 and I probably never won double digits again. I don’t have the stats for me, but there’s a steady story linked to Davey Johnson, linked to the 86 playoffs and and then the following week, of course, I got World Series tickets, and I went up and went up and I walked out of, I walked out of game three when Dykstra hit the home run. So I’m sorry it was that. No, the Dykstra home run was that week against the Astros, was a NLCS Game. So nonetheless, that’s what a baseball fan I was that at that time of my life. But Davey Johnson, man, like recurring figure in my life. Sam basayo, go ahead the Mr. Rubenstein, by the way, I’m going to give you some inside poker. I haven’t said this out loud. Eric Eddie’s the guy you need to keep your eye on, all right, yeah, he was down in the dugout doing the whole thing. Eric Gettys involved, more so than Rubenstein, but nonetheless, that’s what my sources tell me.

Allen McCallum  58:44

I will, I will pay attention. Look, I’d love to do a post mortem on the season with you so that we can go in depth. Because I have,

Nestor Aparicio  58:53

I have a lot to say about crab cake. I won’t give you any cheese.

Allen McCallum  58:56

I have a lot to say about this club. It’s been a really interesting year. For a lot of the season, you heard, oh, you know, whatever you think about michaelias, you know, he won’t sign any of these guys. Most of these guys are being managed or being represented by Scott Boris. And no, nobody signs early with Scott Boris. So to have that continue to have this conversation is a little ludicrous. Why would gunner Henderson sign with the Orioles when he’s going to make a crap ton of money when he becomes a free agent? So we’ll see.

Nestor Aparicio  59:37

What you love about being here, playing in last place for an owner that makes bobble heads of himself, and they can’t sell out an Adam Jones hero night, they can’t even sell out a Cal Ripken hero night. Like, why would you want to be stuck here? As Aubrey Huff once said, If you get the OP, they need to make this great Alan like, I keep writing about this. I did an hour last week with Marty Conway about the business of the team. Team. They need to make it great. Whatever Saturday night was at magic elixir, those people need to now come back and be engrossed in whatever and but there are, you’re already there the people that are in or in. It’s not about you or me or Hispanic and black or old and older. It’s now about like, Who are their customers? Who’s Katie Griggs trying to get to and how is she going to reach them? By giving people like me a middle finger. I haven’t figured it out. I really, like, these people are curious to me. I mean, I met Eric Garrett Getty last year, and he could not have been a bigger jerk to me, and he didn’t even know who I was. He just, like, had an arrogance that said, Well, I’m never going to shake his hand again. That guy’s not even, like, a real dude. Like, like, that’s my impression of him. And a year and a half into this, they’ve done everything really poorly. Alan, you know, I mean signing visayo, if they get some a headline and makes him feel good, great. But I don’t know if he can play, and if he can play, great. It’s a great deal if he can’t. As Luke and I pointed out, it’s only 80 million bucks. They wasted more than that on Tyler O’Neill, signing

Allen McCallum  1:00:59

Sam visayo is significant for a couple of reasons. One, because they do sign one of their young players, people who who is highly touted. You’re right. He’s, he’s got a big swing, he’s got a big body. If he’s going to catch at all, it’s going to, it’s going to put wear and tear on.

Nestor Aparicio  1:01:16

God, I just mentioned EARL WILLIAMS. Go look at his baseball card. Alan. That’s all I’m going to tell you,

Allen McCallum  1:01:21

there’s, there’s a lot to manage there. We’ll see what his career is, but, but it’s significant one, because they signed one of their one of their guys, but, but maybe more importantly than that, Sam Bisaya is a person of color in Baltimore, and whatever you think about the Baltimore Orioles as they exist right now, there aren’t a lot of people of color

Nestor Aparicio  1:01:41

in their press box, either, by the way, as I point out, being the Hispanic in the in the African American here speaking.

Allen McCallum  1:01:47

So, yes, absolutely. But in terms of position players in a city that, you know, it’s people love Adam Jones. It was, it was great that Adam Jones was the leader of that, of that era of the Orioles, and for as badly as Cedric Mullen stunk it up the last couple of years of his career. After having a, you know, just a breakout season a few years ago, there are people that that were upset and genuinely clamor clamor for him to be resigned, which makes no sense, because he’s not a regular, a full time player anymore, because it’s not stated, it’s not said, but it is important to this community to have someone that looks like the community on that field. And I think that that’s I think that’s something important. So I think that the Orioles need to lean into Samba style. I think they need to take care of his career. They need to take care of you want to talk about load management? You want to talk about, you know, what is the best path to keep him as an impact bat, to to nurture his career, nurture his development.

Nestor Aparicio  1:02:57

To me, they signed him as a first baseman or whatever. They don’t really think he’s a catcher. I don’t think they. I don’t think they, they don’t think he’s a long term, by the time he’s got the $30 million into the baked into this deal, he won’t be a catcher. I don’t think,

Allen McCallum  1:03:10

well, look so they, I mean, we don’t know about Kobe mayo, Ryan mountcastle has been a, frankly, a significant bust for this club. If Sam biscuit, a lot

Nestor Aparicio  1:03:21

of guys on the road to bus dude, yeah. I mean, kerstadt Mayo cows are to some degree. I mean, you know, like, I don’t obviously, rushman, let’s start being like, Yeah, this is the big picture, why we probably should spend more time together and do

Allen McCallum  1:03:36

this later. I want to have a post mortem with you. I’ve got a lot to say from the time we got together with Luke and towards the around the all star game, it’s been a really interesting this this team is, is very Jekyll and Hyde. There’s a lot, there’s a lot of thoughts. But yeah, Sam, besides careers, what happens with him will be important and and nurturing this career for him, I think is something that the Orioles, if they’re smart, will will do, and nobody can pitch

Nestor Aparicio  1:04:03

anymore that they didn’t sign a guy they did. Yeah, and as I pointed out, and I’ll throw myself on the sword here, I would have been the guy giving Mullins money after the 3030 I would have been the guy giving Jonathan scope money. Jonathan scope’s the greatest example for me of like I would have signed that guy. I would have given him four years and 80 million, and said, You’re my second because I believe because I believed they didn’t. They won the battle on that right, Trevor. Trevor Rogers, Mike Elias, believed, even when you didn’t and I didn’t, and nobody did, and sours was hitting home. So I mean, now he’s going to be the opening starter next year. You hope, you hope, right? So hey, look, man, I love you. I love baseball. I love what happened Saturday night, I’m sorry I wasn’t there. I would have been a lot more sorry if the no hitter would have happened, that would have been the poetic so at least I didn’t miss a no hitter, but I didn’t miss anything. I watched it. It was great. And, yeah, I mean, you

Allen McCallum  1:04:54

missed the energy of the community, being in a moment in this season in particular, and watching the. Fans lose their being a part of the fans who are losing their minds was something that I needed, and was and didn’t realize that I needed good and something that was really special in the city of Baltimore on a night when you know we were we were waxing poetic about our, our, our, our bygone heroes of another day,

Nestor Aparicio  1:05:19

I’m gonna quote you on whatever you just said that was very poignant about I was there. I lost my mind. I needed to lose my mind, and it felt good to lose my mind, and it’s been too long since I lost my mind. Is that?

Allen McCallum  1:05:29

Is that close to is that paraphrasing that’s relatively accurate?

Nestor Aparicio  1:05:33

Yes, all right. Allen McCallum, I love him. You love him. He’s our long time Oriole. Uh, Insider. Uh, it’s two people of color doing sports, doing baseball talk here. You know what I mean, a Venezuelan and an African American doing baseball talk in Baltimore for last place team after Lamar and Josh did the MVP thing on Sunday night, we’re doing the Maryland crab cake tour next week. On Tuesday at the Beaumont in Catonsville, my wife and I had a big, big debate and discussion and, quite frankly, a disagreement about how the lamb chops should have been on the list and higher up. So we will have lamb chops next Tuesday at the Beaumont and I’m I’m also going to get the fried lobster tail because I thought it was worthy of my tastiness treats. Tastiness is winding down this week. I’ve already had a spoiler alert that amici is number three. They’ll be upset about that, but the people that are number two and number one won’t be because they’re really good too. And matter of fact, the number two were told to me by the people number three and the number one is number one because it’s the greatest thing on earth, and I had it for breakfast this morning. I’m Nestor, he’s Allen. We are wnst. Am 1570 Towson, Baltimore, mixing in a little baseball in a sea of football. Give me back my press pass. Katie, we’re Baltimore positive. See you soon. You.