The Maryland Terps season ended with a thud in a Sweet 16 loss to Florida but the madness of March was much more about the dangling head coach and the swirling rumors of his imminent departure for greener pastures at Villanova. Luke Jones and Nestor assess the mess left behind when the highest paid employee of the state has no loyalty to the school, program or his “student athletes” in the NIL and portal era.
Nestor Aparicio and Luke Jones discussed the aftermath of Maryland’s basketball loss to Florida and the potential departure of coach Kevin Willard to Villanova. They highlighted the impact of the transfer portal and NIL deals on college sports, noting the shift from long-term team development to short-term reloading. They reflected on Maryland’s recent successes, including a Sweet 16 run, and the challenges of maintaining a competitive program without stable leadership. The conversation also touched on the financial aspects, with Willard being the highest-paid state employee, and the broader implications for college sports in the era of NIL and transfer portals.
Nestor Aparicio 0:01
Welcome home. We are W, N, S, T, am 1570 task, Baltimore. We are Baltimore, positive. We are positively at the end of March, madness for the Maryland perspective, in the beginning of the baseball season, Luke and I are in Toronto, Canada. We’ll be at skydome this weekend. We’ll be back at Camden Yards for Monday for full opening day coverage, and then on Wednesday will be a fade leads Alexa demark, and we will have scratch offs in the Marilyn lottery to give away and second day of Orio baseball. But a whole weekend ahead here will be getting into the pitching and the hitting and all that good stuff and the Red Sox coming to town. But Luke, we didn’t do a ton on Terps basketball this year. I don’t think it’s any secret that I have felt us to be a little outside the realm of all of that, but it comes inside the realm when they make a sweet 16 run, when you and I are running around another country trying to find the game on TSN, TBS, CBS, some of the S’s, I don’t know, but we did watch the game, and it got away. But the story really isn’t Derek queen or I’m from Baltimore or Julian Reese or his sister being at the game. I mean, the story is just an integrity issue for me with college basketball and my Fandom of it to say, I mean, look, I walked around skydome on on Thursday opening day, and I ran into Terps fans, Orioles fans, and all of them were like, is Willard even going to coach the game? Is he going to coach the game in the Sweet 16? He didn’t show up for for dinner. I mean, it’s a tragedy for the program. What’s happened in a year where they went to the Sweet 16, all eyes were on them Thursday night. You know, there were various points of the game where they could have won the game, and they didn’t shoot the ball well, they certainly didn’t rebound well. That’s been an issue all along. But just as a guy that had Tom McMillan on two weeks ago, a guy that had Walt Williams on a week ago, a guy that’s been with us since 1973 pu to everybody down in College Park, and especially to Willard and this college basketball in general, we are feeling the brunt of the portal and of the n, i, L, and it really leads to a diminished version of what we used to love. That’s all I’m going to say. Larry Bird, Magic Johnson and all that. Yeah.
Luke Jones 2:14
We went from a certain naivete as far as student athletes and amateurism and what players should be entitled to, considering how lucrative the business of college athletics and more specifically, college basketball, football, first, of course, but also college basketball. But we swung from that to what it’s become, which is this wild wild west. I mean, the transfer portal opened during the postseason, which is just absurd. I mean, same thing with bowl season, with college football. And, you know, you think and bring it back to Maryland basketball, specifically, you think back to, you know, not even having to go back to Tom McMillan or lefty Roselle or any of the teams of that era. Just look at the oh two national championship team that had Juan Dixon and Lonnie Baxter, you know two seniors, right? You’re going back
Nestor Aparicio 3:13
a quarter of a century here. Dog, I know him. It’s I am, yeah,
Luke Jones 3:16
but, but you think about that team and the way it developed and grew, and it had the disappointment of the previous year in getting to the Final Four and losing to Duke despite having a big lead in the first half and all of that. You know, there was a there was a graduation process there. There was a development process there, as a team, the growth that they went through together. Well, they could
Nestor Aparicio 3:43
get a program. It was a program, right? That it’s just ongoing thing,
Luke Jones 3:47
right? There’s just none of that anymore. And, well, certainly not when your
Nestor Aparicio 3:51
coach rolls out. I mean, this weekend, they have nothing. They are an empty cupboard all of a sudden, right? Like,
Luke Jones 3:57
I mean, barring something strange here in the 11th hour? Yeah. I mean, it’s there. There’s very much a sense of where do you go from here? You assuming he’s off to Villanova, which, it seems that way. I don’t have any I don’t know how
Nestor Aparicio 4:12
he could come back. I mean, you know, as we sit here, you’ll be gone by the you’ll send the wnst text. But I don’t think he can come back. And he’s the highest paid employee in the state. That’s another issue. We we sit and pitch about everything going on in Annapolis, about how much money this group’s getting, that group’s getting. What are we getting for this, the bridge, all the important things going on. This is the highest paid employee in the state of Mary. I just want to point that out, because it is that is mind blowing. Some people don’t even know that, but that’s
Luke Jones 4:41
true, and that that’s true in a lot of states where you’re talking about the
Nestor Aparicio 4:45
especially the red ones, when the football coaches come so although I’d
Luke Jones 4:49
say that, I think that just that’s college sports, right? I mean, big time head coaches in football and basketball are going to get a lot of money, a heck of a lot of money. I’m not saying. Whether it’s right or wrong, it’s reality. But I just think back to 2002 and they made it to the Sweet 16 in 2003 this is only the second time Maryland’s made it to the Sweet 16 since then, and how enjoyable it felt like it was on Sunday night when Derek Queen hits the shot and they’re going to the Sweet 16, and how that was just ruined by the reality that is college basketball and college sports in 2025 and I don’t say that with without acknowledging that, yeah, there, there are questions about Maryland’s athletic department and what’s going to happen with the ad, what’s going to happen with a coach, what’s going to happen with n i L, you have a school that is in the Big 10 that wants to maintain its place at the table as college football continues to evolve, and these power conferences are what they are, and we’re assuming we’re going to see some kind of super Power conference at some point in time. So I understand that at least as much as I can, as someone who’s not covering it directly, but you just kind of look at this, and I think for a lot of people, and look, if you’re a die hard Maryland alum, you know, maybe not, maybe not so, but I think for a lot of people, they’re struggling with what this new reality is in college sports, and just how much it’s worth it, right? I mean that the idea that college basketball what it was in 2002 which is 23 years ago, but not 60 years ago either, the idea that building a team in that fashion is even a thing anymore. Just you know that that’s gone, and now it’s a case of, you better have a coach who’s making a lot of money. He’s got all the n, i l resources that he needs, and he better be using the transfer portal. And you know, you’re paying hired guns, and it’s just a matter of, you just try to reload year after year after year. You know, there’s no idea of recruiting someone like Derek queen and expecting him to be there for more than that one year. And look, the idea of a one and done college basketball players is hardly new. We understand that. But it’s just there’s, I don’t want to call it icky, because look, college athletes who generate revenue for their schools to the lucrative degree that we’ve seen in recent decades, absolutely deserve their piece of the pie. So I’m not opposed to that, but this system that we have with so few guardrails, I do view it, and I say this more personally than anything, it absolutely has impacted my enjoyment of not just Maryland athletics, but more specifically, just college football and college basketball in general. I mean, I I can think back to being 14 years old and sitting there with middle school buddies. I had one friend who was a Duke fan. Don’t judge me on that. I had one friend who was a couple friends who were North Carolina fans, and we would sit there and we could name you the 10 deep roster for every single school in the ACC for basketball. I mean, that’s what it was. You can’t do that in this day and age, because the rosters turn over as well.
Nestor Aparicio 8:20
They’ve done everything they can do to make it less interesting, less engaging, less impactful, and they’ve added more games, more conferences, more teams you’re playing USC, but it is by far less interesting than it used to be in so many ways, in so many ways, and far less engaging over the course of a lifetime. You know what they’re doing here and now, this choppiness of here and now offends old people like us who fund it, and then the students don’t care either. You know it’s it’s this, this is not an engaging thing for being the big man on campus. As a matter of fact, the exact opposite of that is true, and I’ll give love to my friends over at Towson. I had Pat scary on a couple weeks ago talking about, hey, that’s the kind of university there that’s going to be able to bring kids in and keep them around for three or four years, and they’re going to know Towson, and they’re going to know the businesses, and the Towson hot bagels that gives them free food and the CVP that has them around there is going to be on smaller campuses and smaller if you like college basketball and if you can be that kind of program, but there’s a whole different level of money and intensity that’s going to have to be involved if you’re going to compete in any of the big money sports in college that goes for basketball, football, Wherever the money is wrestling at Penn State, for crying out loud. You know, whatever, whatever the big thing is, there’s going to be have and have nots, and there’s going to be, is this enjoyable if I wear the state flag, you jersey, wherever I am, for whatever my sport is, male, female, whatever it is. And. Do I feel invested and invested in it? Do I feel a part of it? And certainly the Kevin Willard thing in Maryland, I mean, going back to Len bias, and going back to kids dropping dead on the football fields, and all the stuff that’s going on, and building new new facilities, and all the money that it’s going to take, all that’s been done, dude. And in the end, the football team sucks and is always going to suck and no one’s going to care about it. That’s a fact that’s been going on my whole life. As long as the commanders play on Sunday and the Ravens play on Sunday, they’re not going to matter on Saturday. But college basketball, Maryland thinks it’s a basketball school acts like a basketball school wants the fun football because it needs to. And this is all a part of playing at that higher level that Rutgers can’t seem to get to, and these, you know, the West Virginia’s are never going to get to as state schools, but it really is just going to be about rich people funding this and that whatever they’re funding, they’re not funding loyalty with with the highest paid person in the state who, on the night before the biggest game of A generation, doesn’t even show up for his team dinner because his ass is out the door. He’s a disgrace. I mean, I’m I just like to allow all this to happen, and the portal opening this week, and the coach is all getting in on this at this time of the year. Pu, it’s gross,
Luke Jones 11:17
well, and, and I just look at it. Look Kevin Willard, assuming he’s and as someone’s listening to our conversation, maybe it’s even official at this point in time, but assuming he’s going to Villanova, he’s hardly the first coach that’s done something like this. Let’s, let’s be clear. Oh,
Nestor Aparicio 11:33
in the south, these football coaches have been running out on airplanes and lying. I mean, Kevin Willard did
Luke Jones 11:37
this to see no to come to Maryland, right? So let’s, let’s have some, you know, let’s be self aware on that front, at the very least. But I just think the way that it was handled over the course of the week, it really hijacked the enjoyment of it all. For everyone. You know, how much is players cared? How much that distracted them? Who knows? I mean, again, it’s the culture now where it’s not for long, right? It’s nio doesn’t leave them. They’ll leave him. That’s the deal. And you wonder, I mean, who are these guys might be joining him at Villanova? Who knows? So, I mean, it’s but it was a week that should have been so much more exciting and so much more fun, and it ended up not being, because the Willard distraction just hung over all of it. And look, some of that’s unavoidable in certain search certain circumstances, but he could have handled this better. You know, there’s no question about that, and I don’t look at first, it felt like some refreshing honesty. But then as he’s kind of talking out of both sides of his mouth, it’s like, all right, man. You know, we kind of see what you’re doing at this point, but it’s just disappointing because, again, you just said it a couple minutes ago. As much as Maryland athletic fans and Maryland basketball fans have branded themselves as a basketball school over the last few decades, has it really been, though we’re talking about two Sweet 16, it’s
Nestor Aparicio 13:07
a women’s basketball school, is what I’m sure it is, right? But, but
Luke Jones 13:11
I just, you know, you just look at this and now putting aside the disdain for Willard, because assuming he’s gonna be out the door, he’s gonna be out the door and Villanova. Villa Villanova will become the new Duke for Maryland fans to root against. But where do you go from here? I mean, you don’t have an athletic director. All of the issues that Kevin Willard brought up from an N i l perspective are real, right? I mean, I don’t think he not saying there weren’t points made that didn’t have merit, but you have that you’re at, you’re at a different place in the hiring cycle, as the calendar is turning over to April. I mean, the big time coaches that that moved, that shifted and or elsewhere Generally, those are programs that fired their coach because they didn’t make it to the NCAA tournament, or, you know that, and we’re a couple weeks out from that at this point in time without an ad. So you really, I think the biggest fear for Maryland fans at this point in time is not that there isn’t a coach out there that you can hire that, you know, let’s be clear. I mean, kept it’s not like Kevin willard’s a two time national championship winning coach. I mean, one sweet 16. I said to you, can you imagine how this might the perception of this changes if Derek Queen shot rims out at the buzzer against Colorado State and Maryland doesn’t even make it to the Sweet 16. We’re having a way different conversation from a perception maybe
Nestor Aparicio 14:45
scrapple up in Villanova on Wednesday already. I think you
Luke Jones 14:49
would have had many more. You probably would have had many more fans. Kind of shrug and say, Good riddance, man. Your team choked, you know. So. So there is some I don’t know if irony is the role
Nestor Aparicio 14:58
they didn’t play. Well. On Thursday night. We haven’t talked much about the game itself, because it’s like the game was overshadowed by Florida.
Luke Jones 15:05
Yeah, Florida’s better. I mean, Florida’s number one seed. And full disclosure, I didn’t see any of the first half. I’m, as you know, I was leaving Rogers Center. I was meeting up with you to have some
Nestor Aparicio 15:15
disclosure. I didn’t see any of the first half either, because TSN didn’t wanted to be getting up, but
Luke Jones 15:20
that was that was hardly a shocking result. So, so it’s but, but the fact that we’re not even talking about that, the fact that we’re not even putting a bow on what was a really enjoyable season, that’s the shame of this, right? And that’s where, again, we swung from the the naivete that existed in collegiate athletics for the longest time to what we are now, which is the wild wild west. You know, it feels very cynical. It feels very it doesn’t
Nestor Aparicio 15:50
feel like something I want to invest in, bro. You know, that’s really the truth. And
Luke Jones 15:54
look, there are plenty of people that disagree with you on that, but well, then let them put their
Nestor Aparicio 15:59
money up. I mean, this is what we’re going to talk a lot about this with the order, but I’m just telling the order, but I’m just, I’m just saying, Are you putting your money where you’re putting your time? Because they have our money, they do. But my point is, college basketball is
Luke Jones 16:09
not going to collapse. College football is not going to collapse under this new system. But what you are finding, and this year’s NCAA Tournament, may be a great example of this. Who was the Cinderella this year, look at who’s playing in the Sweet 16. When you look at the seeding, there is no Cinderella. The team that was a 10 seed was Arkansas, you know, a power conference team that’s not really a Cinderella, you know, that’s a power conference team that wasn’t that good in their conference, but the SEC is great. And hey, they’ve get they have a heck of a head coach. So I don’t know. I just you do wonder where it’s heading again. It’s not going to fall apart. TV will continue to be lucrative. The haves will continue to have a lot. But to you, to your point, the have nots, you kind of just look at the ecosystem and you know it, for me, it I said this to you as we were sitting at an establishment and here in Toronto watching the final minutes of the game. You know, it feels more and more like it’s just minor league basketball, and college football is feeling more and more like it’s just minor league football. And it always was right, if we’re being realistic about it, at least for slave labor, as I pointed at least for a large percentage now. Now, granted, there are plenty of college football and basketball players who never sniff the NFL, in the NBA, so, you know, so it wasn’t 100% absolute in that way. But no, it’s just, I feel disillusioned by it. I suppose it would be the best way for me to describe it personally, seeing this play out at Maryland, which is not a mid major school, you know, to your point, I mean, you labeled it a basketball school. The resources, it is still a really good job. But if you’re losing out to your coach leaving to go to Villanova, look, Villanova is a BIG EAST school that doesn’t have to share its n, i L, right, because football. Villanova football is not, you know, it’s not a powerhouse or anything like that, you know, it’s not a power conference FPS school. So I don’t know. It’s just, it’s so disappointing, just to just sit here and have this conversation about what should have been, you know, what was one of Maryland’s best seasons in the last 20 years, and yet, we’re talking about the head coach leaving and not having any expectation that, you know, that Rodney rice is going to be back. I mean, we know Reese and queen are gone, and, you know, Gillespie will most likely be elsewhere. I mean, it’s just, you know, it’s just, it’s, it’s very deflating for, you know, the loss is one thing again, Florida is better. Like, you know, there’s no shame in being a four seed losing to a number one seed. But just to go out this way and for all the attention to be on Willard, I mean, people saw the video of, you know, their send off rally earlier in the day, Thursday, and the head coach is getting booed. I mean, it’s just ugly, you know, just an ugly scene. And, you know, could have been handled better, but just regardless of how it was handled, the end result of your head coach who, you know, three years ago, you were hoping this was going to be the next Gary Williams for you, and instead, you’re now facing the prospects of being late in the hiring cycle. Portal already open, no ad. All the n, i, L issues that Willard brought up are true. We’re going to
Nestor Aparicio 19:50
win 12 games next year, 10 games. I mean, who knows? You know, but, but that’s this is the kind of program they can’t afford, that they can’t afford to go into that Oriole hole where they’re going to be one. Of you know, a 12 win Non, non tournament team for two or three years while the new guy figures it out. To your point, if the new guys Mr. Money Bags, and they have money, and they can go out and recruit and throw money at players, but it that’s a difficult thing to find. April 1 for head coach, right? Yeah, Villanova thinks they’ve hired that.
Luke Jones 20:20
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, because, you know, even looking at someone like a Tony skin, for example. I mean, he just got an extension at Mason. So, you know, it’s, you know, where do you go from here? You know, do you do you try, you know, some kind of a, I don’t even know who the rehash would be at this point. Off the top my head, I’m, you know, I’m not going to sit here and act like I’m Mr. College basketball. Or do you try to go after a very highly touted assistant coach realizing that 2025, 26 is probably going to be, you know, this next year probably be pretty ugly. But if, but if you do find a right guy, and it’s not like it always has to be the right guy, I always say to you, there’s not one answer out there. There’s multiple answers, but you got to find one. If they can do that, then they’ll be okay, but if not. And something else I said to you, and I don’t say this to mean it as a low blow, but in hindsight, this program wasted a decade on Mark Turgeon, and you don’t want to hire another Mark Turgeon, and you certainly don’t want to hire another Mark Turgeon and and stick with them too long, because then this program will be dead as it turn as it pertains to national relevancies. So I don’t know, man, it’s just it’s a tough spot, and it’s a deflating spot because, and I’ve even said this to you at various times, not so much on the air, but as someone who remembers falling in love with Maryland basketball at age 10, when Joe Smith and Keith booth arrived on the scene. And, you know, Marilyn made it to the Sweet 16 and beat UMass, and thinking about where they were at that point in time. And you know, there was always a sense then of hey, let’s take this program the bigger and better heights. But looking back on it, from 1994 through 2003 they made seven sweet sixteens, and of course, it culminated with back to back Final Fours and a national championship in oh two, those were the good old days. Are they ever going to be that again? 10 years ago? 15 years ago, I would have liked to have say, said, of course they will. Now, I don’t know about that. The powers that be at Maryland, there’s, there’s a lot of work to do when it pertains to what’s going to happen here with the head coach, the ad and sorting out n, i, L, and trying to navigate whatever this is without more guard rails being in place, which I think would still behoove the sport very well, to have more guard rails in place. But until they do, boy, this wild, wild west atmosphere, it’s not fun when you’re on the wrong end of it, like Maryland is at the moment, well, they
Nestor Aparicio 23:02
try forever to get Baltimore to be a part of this. I’ve been on the air 34 years. I go back to lefty, I go back to Bob Wade and the Georgetown pipeline and all the things that happened here 40 years ago now, and thinking about they finally get this kid from Baltimore who’s really special, so special that he only played a freshman year locally, went off to camp for a couple of years, shows up in Maryland for five minutes during a year where other players are there, and they have no depth. He has his I’m from Baltimore, you know, moment in the in the 32 and, you know, they wind up getting 30 games out of the best Baltimore kid of this generation, and he’s going to go on, and that’s kind of part of it too. Is it? You win a recruiting battle in Baltimore and you don’t win much else, and he’s not even around for a long time because he was so good Queen I’m talking about,
Luke Jones 23:53
yeah, and look, I mean, that part’s nothing new. I mean, Joe Smith stayed two years, you know, we could think back to, I mean, before the one and done rule. I mean, you had high school kids going right to the pros So,
Nestor Aparicio 24:06
but from a Baltimore perspective, that’s all, yeah, but they’ve had some
Luke Jones 24:09
other Baltimore kids. I mean, you know, Jolene Reese is a great story, right? I mean, someone who, personally, speaking, I didn’t find to be very good his first couple years, but got better. Stood stuck by the program at a transition time, you know, not, not the same magnitude of Walt Williams staying with Gary Williams. I don’t want to over my sister didn’t stick around, right? Yeah, but stuck around, ended up getting to be on a couple NCAA tournament teams, you know, including a sweet 16 team, a good story, but, yeah, I mean, you know, but 10 years ago, it was diamond stone, which, it was shocking that Maryland got a recruit like that, and, okay, they made it to a sweet 16, but then he was gone, right? So there, that’s part of it. But yeah. I mean, it’s gonna
Nestor Aparicio 24:54
take that. It’s gonna take diamond stones, and there are queens to win Sweet 16 games.
Luke Jones 24:58
Yeah. I mean, the. You are just, you are in a mode now where it is just, reload, reload, reload, use the portal. Use the portal. Use the portal. I mean, it’s, it’s a dip, way different job than it was when Gary Williams was it’s a L
Nestor Aparicio 25:13
job like George coquinas recruit, you know, looking at who Texas Tech might have that might want to one out, you know, literally,
Luke Jones 25:18
I mean, it’s just, it’s, it’s such a different animal. And, like I said, without some, some more guard rails in place. I mean, when you see just the the sheer number of players that hit the portal around college basketball, it’s why, years, you know, decades and decades ago, Marvin Miller and in Major League you know, the MLB Players Association understood that you don’t want everyone to be a free agent every single year. Yet, that’s kind of, that’s kind of what we have with college basketball and football right now. So, you know, we’ll see how that plays out. But again, there are so much uncertainty that makes this you know what felt like you were hoping was a jumping off point for Kevin Willard, not with his team, because you know you’re going to have turnover, and guys were going to leave and all that. But just in terms of for the program to get back to a sweet 16, you’re hoping that, hey, this is the culmination, or this is the springboard, the commencement, for getting back to that point where you’re making it to sweet sixteens with semi regularity, at least instead, man, it there’s, I don’t know if Doom is the right word, but boy, at best, it’s really uncertain, and you feel like you’re kind of staring into an abyss of not knowing what’s how this is going to play out and what the Future of this program is going to be, because coach ad all of that,
Nestor Aparicio 26:44
you can find Luke Jones out of Baltimore, Luker, you can find him in Toronto with me this weekend, we’re here for Orio baseball. We will be at Camden Yards on Monday, one of us will have a press pass. On Wednesday, I will be at fadelies, along with Luke and some other guests. We’re going to be doing the Maryland crap cake tour, presented by the Maryland lottery. It has been an interesting week in in Toronto to start the season as well as the end for the Terps. We’re also going to have liars luncheon coming up with the Ravens in a couple of weeks as well. You can find all of our work out of Baltimore, positive and of course, along our social media lines. Luke is at Baltimore. Luke, I am pretty much everywhere social media travels. We are in Toronto, talking Terps, basketball. We are W, N, S, T and 1570 Towson, Baltimore. We never stop talking Baltimore positive. You.
