Luke Jones and Nestor discuss the many young players of interest in the Ravens’ first of three preseason games in August hosting the Philadelphia Eagles.
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
ravens, year, ronnie stanley, good, team, days, play, offensive line, season, tackle, injuries, paid, orioles, camp, talking, player, drafted, football, week, luke
SPEAKERS
Luke Jones, Nestor J. Aparicio
Nestor J. Aparicio 00:01
Welcome home. We are W, N, S, T, House of Baltimore and Baltimore positive. We’re good spirits this week, despite how the Orioles outcome began beginning of the week, because football is almost here, and they’ll give us reason to drink and eat and complain every Monday, Luke Jones is here. He is not drinking or eating or complaining. He’s out knowing smells they allow him, so he has nothing to complain about. He gets to go out there in the heat and Chronicle all these things. And of course, on Friday, the cheese steak eaters will be down here for some fake football. We’re going to be back downtown on Friday the 23rd for the cheatstros will be at fadelies doing the Maryland crab cake Tour presented by the Maryland lottery about the gold rush. Seven stumblers to give away. Have a handful of these. We’re gonna have the Raven scratch offs by the late part of the month, and then into September, we’re doing tons of crab cake tours. We’re doing 26 oysters in 26 days. Don’t know if you’ve heard or not, but this is, this is false advertising. We’re not really 25 years old. We’re 26 years old now at wnsd. So we’ll be celebrating with 26 oysters in 26 days, in 26 ways. All of it brought to you by the Maryland lottery, liberty, pure solutions, in conjunction with our friends at Jiffy Lube MultiCare, Luke has been going back and forth to owing smells. He will have the privilege and honor of seeing maybe a first place baseball team next week at the Orio park at Camden Yards, but between now and then, hey, I didn’t make you go watch fake soccer on Tuesday night, so you didn’t have to do that with Pulisic and those guys down there at the stadium, but the black wing is open now. Please get me a cocktail. Save me a seat at the black wing. You were not a part of the renovation, so I’m not going to bother you with all that. I’m not like Coleman and those guys eating free food yet. Stuff to do you work for a living. So does the Ravens right now, and these what used to be called two a days, and used to be hazing, all the crap that went on Tony Syracuse and hard knocks. Give me a little update. What are you seeing out there? What are we going to see on Friday night? Certainly, you know, you know injuries are going to happen. It’s August. Yeah.
Luke Jones 01:53
I mean, as for Friday night, we’re going to see young guys. We’re going to see those guys on the offensive line that are vying for a starting job. We are not going to see very many starters. I think that’s evident, if you’ve paid attention the last couple of years, really, from the moment that J K Dobbins tore up his knee at down in Landover. And you know, it’s kind of that’s kind of been all she wrote for the established starter since then, which I’m fine with. I think you have to be understanding the big picture and understanding what can happen. And I think for a Ravens team that had a relatively healthy first couple weeks of camp, the injuries have started to pile up a little bit here, not the season ending variety, other than Malik ham the second year edge Russia tours ACL last week, which was unfortunate for a local Baltimore kid, but Arthur millet, dealing with a knee issue that John Harbaugh was kind of vague about, said that it’s not anything season ending. But when you say that, I mean, yeah,
Nestor J. Aparicio 02:53
not season ending and, I mean, pick your words. If I were there and I were Chad Steele, let’s say, don’t say that. I mean, that’s kind of a little alarming thing to read. I thought,
Luke Jones 03:03
well, and that’s why that, to me, indicates that he’s probably gonna be out a little while. Because, I mean, not season ending, I mean, the Super Bowl six months away, still, right? I mean, what do you think about it? So, but I think part of that was he flat out, said they’re dealing with something that they’re looking at it right now. They’ve got to figure out exactly what it is. So it’s odd because I was standing right near Arthur millet at practice the previous day, right toward the end, and he seemed fine. So I don’t know if it was more something that’s been bothering him and has progressively gotten worse, but they have depth in the secondary. We know that, but Arthur millet was a understated part of what they did on the back end of the defense last year with what he could do at the nickel spot and his ability to blitz and, you know, not being the exclusive nickel, but certainly being a guy that matches up against slot receivers and and filling a very specific role in the back end of that defense and sub packages. So he’s going to miss some time. You know, we’ve already talked, you know, Tyler Linder bombs a little bit banged up right now. I think they’re just being very, very careful with him. I don’t think, you know, I haven’t gotten any indication that there’s real concern there. But still might be a little while he’s an NFL center, he’s
Nestor J. Aparicio 04:13
going to get banged up plenty this season. Don’t need to beat him up in August, right? Well,
Luke Jones 04:17
and that’s the thing. And he’s, as we’ve said, he’s the one part of your offensive line you feel really good about everything else is maybe, or a veteran holding on, like Ronnie Stanley, or guys that we don’t know if they’re going to start or not, let’s
Nestor J. Aparicio 04:32
just call it four question marks and a Linder bomb. That’s what it is, right? Sure,
Luke Jones 04:36
literally, sure. Yeah, you have a Pro Bowl center and four question marks. Now Stanley’s a less, less of a question mark than some of the other positions, but he’s still a question mark because
Nestor J. Aparicio 04:45
it’s a question mark for me as to how good he can be at this his career. What is he a seven? Is he an eight? He ain’t a 10 anymore. I mean, and he’s not going to the Hall of John Ogden or Tony Boselli. Um, so what will he be over? For 1920, 21 games this year. I don’t know. Man, I don’t know. I mean, that’s a freaking question mark. That’s a question mark. I have lots of questions about that position, his ability to play it, his ability to maintain it, and what they do if he’s a six, yeah, well, if he’s
Luke Jones 05:18
a six, he’s probably still playing there, because I’m not, is Patrick McCarry is seven.
Nestor J. Aparicio 05:22
That’s a real problem. That’s a real problem.
Luke Jones 05:24
I mean, it is, but at the same time, I guess my point is he is at least somewhat of a known commodity, whereas, right now, you don’t know anything about these other guys that are going to be starting right? I mean, Andrew Voorhees looks like he’s gonna be the left guard has had a nice camp,
Nestor J. Aparicio 05:42
and another guy an injury issue that shows career down to begin with, right Sure, sure,
Luke Jones 05:46
but veteran players have been very complimentary of him, at times unsolicited, going out of their way to compliment him. So I think there, there’s, albeit cautious, but optimism as far as what he can do at left guard, but right guard, for me right now is still wide open. Right tackle. I mean, sure you have McCarry and Rose and garden there, but Okay, how’s that going to look whoever? So I’m going
Nestor J. Aparicio 06:07
to ask you now, we’re a month out, we’re a month out on Kansas City. Who starts right now? You don’t have to be right about it. You just have to guess. Stanley
Luke Jones 06:15
Voorhees, Linder bomb, right guard, I still don’t know. I mean, FAU le Lay’s getting all the reps there. I’m just, I don’t, I have a tough time that I don’t have a tough time buying that a 380 pound tackle suddenly going to be a guard who has to pull and move, move his feet and all of that. But I mean him or Ben Cleveland at right guard, I guess, you know, I’ll throw another name out there. That’s a dark horse right now, just because I think he’s actually quietly turned some heads. The guy who’s on the practice squad last year, you know, number 62 watch him on Friday night, because he will definitely play a lot. Let’s see how Tayshaun Manning does. I’m not saying he’s going to start, but if you tell me, if you have the purple crystal ball, and you would tell me, he might factor in at a garden
Nestor J. Aparicio 07:02
his name, so I’m taking notes. Now. This is the first time I’ve done this week eight, you know, like, this
Luke Jones 07:08
is the first time I mentioned his name, because that’s why I said he’s a dark horse. I mean, it’s not someone that’s really been on my radar. But if you kind of look at practice, if you look at the depth chart, he’s kind of, you know, he’s been, he’s been angling for more steps with snaps with that second team and well, you do the math, if you’re not sure about your first team right guard, then the natural inclination is what to look at the second team right guard, and he’s been getting snaps there. So we’ll see. Again. I’m not if I’m predicting right now, I guess I’ll go with FAU Lele because he’s gotten the the lion’s share of the snaps, but I need to see it in a game setting before I feel better about that. And then right tackle,
07:48
a week ago, I
Luke Jones 07:49
would have said McCary, the fact that Rosengarten now is starting to get first team reps, it feels like they’re they want him to be the week one right tackle. He’s got to go out and do it, though, and if he’s not quite ready, then I feel okay about McCarry at right tackle, but ideally you want McCary to be that guy that can play anywhere at a moment’s notice, including left tackle. To your point about the questions with Ronnie Stanley, so my my August 7, August 8, August 9. Prediction of the O line is Stanley Voorhees, Linder bomb, I guess FAU le lay and I think, you know, I’ll be a little more bold and say Rosengarten, because he’s starting to get first team reps, and we’re still a month out from the opener. But obviously, how they play in this preseason game, in these next three preseason games, other than Linder bomb, and I don’t think Stan Lee’s going to play in those because what’s the upside there? I think you get an idea of how he can play in the game and practice without putting him at risk of an injury. But those other three spots, I mean, guys got to play. They got to go out and look the part, even if the offensive line as a unit looks choppy, because you’re not going to have Linder bomb out there, and you’re presumably not going to have Stanley out there for these fake games, but these games aren’t fake to the guys that are trying to earn a starting job, and that includes Voorhees, who has, to me, of those three open spots, has the strongest grip on a job right now, but he certainly still has to go out there and look the part. And you know, again, veteran players have spoken highly of him, including some times where they’ve gone out of their way a little bit. And that, to me, is what’s telling you, ask a player specifically about some another player, they’re never going to say, Oh, that guy stinks. Or they’re never going to say, Oh, that guy’s not very good right now, they’re, they’re going to be, you know, maybe they’ll throw a little bit of constructive criticism in there, but they’re going to be overly positive. I
Nestor J. Aparicio 09:43
remember when Mike Flynn said, Marshall yonda guy is going to be okay. Yeah. I remember Mike Flynn and odd and are like, this guy could play, you know, he’s going to Hall of Fame too, but, but you see that early, early on, when, when veteran players, you mentioned 62 so I had to throw Mike Flynn’s name and. Here. But when you mentioned that you know Ronnie Stanley, would know the difference, by the way, on Ronnie Stanley, because so Chad Steele called me today and said, you can come out and cover camp next week, because Luke’s covering the Orioles. And I went out there, the first thing I’d be looking at is that is like, How’s Ronnie Stanley moving? Because you’re not going to see him in these games. So, like, that would be the peel in the onion back that, if you and I were having a beer today and just talking about, like, what you’re seeing out there, if you said to me, you’re you’re filling in for me today and I’m going out there, what am I looking for? I’d be like, the rotation on the O line. That’s the only thing I’d be looking at, maybe how they’re using different people in the secondary, because I’m unfamiliar, especially with Mollet not being out there and them drafting a kid, I’d be like, All right, what’s rotation looking like a nickel and dime and Bay, if there is such a thing as a base, I don’t know, um, but I’d be looking at Ronnie Stanley and saying, how’s he moving? I don’t worry about Linder bomb if, especially if he’s not, if he’s injured or not moving around. I’ve seen enough of him. He’s 24 uh, he’ll be okay. Um, I’m way more concerned about the offensive line from the Stanley positioning in that if anything were to happen to him, or he’s not an eight, if he’s not very good, and I don’t know that he can be, that’s my question. I don’t, I don’t know that he can be a plus guy, not an average guy at this point. I know he used to be a super special guy and but, you know, so was Marlon Humphrey at one point, until he dogged Simone Biles for being a good sport, idiot. I need to say that out, idiot. And you say it twice because said it on the internet, but Ronnie Stanley, that would be what I was what? How’s he moving?
Luke Jones 11:33
I think he’s moved well. I mean, the biggest thing that’s really stood out for me Nestor and look, I mean practice, especially when you don’t go fully live. And I’ll give you a perfect example of the difference, even when you’re doing even when the pads are on, even when you’re going thud, which is basically live to the ball carrier, and then you stop when you see a fully live play. And the Ravens ran one play that was completely live on Tuesday, and it was the third team guys. It was the rookies, and Sanusi Kane made a big hit of Kadri Ismail son, Kadir, who, by the way, Kadir is having a nice camp. You know, I don’t know if he’ll land on the practice squad, but he’s had a really nice Kim. I wanted to give him a little bit of love, because he’s competing his butt off. Certainly not a, oh, just happy to be here, kind of situation. He’s worked hard, but that specific play was so much faster, so much more intense, so much more physical than anything I’ve seen in the the rest of camp. And that’s not a knock to anything else. It just speaks to how different the game truly is when you take the governor’s off entirely and just say, go at it. Go play football. Tackle. You know, it was one play on Tuesday, and I’m like, Man, that is such a difference than everything else I say anyway, bringing it back to Stanley, he’s been healthy. He’s taken part in every single practice. He has not gotten any vet days. He has not alternated, you know, he’s missed a few reps here and there, in terms of, like, when they give a guy a breather over the course of a two and a half hour practice when it’s 97 degrees, which they do that for all the linemen. Mind you, you know they’re they rotate a little more when it’s really, really hot. But he’s been healthy. I think he’s moved well, am I? Am I going to sit, sit here and say that I had the discerning eye of offensive line play to say, Oh, he looks like all pro Ronnie Stanley again. No, I can’t sit here with any level of conviction, and say that he’s looked like that, but,
Nestor J. Aparicio 13:23
well, Josh Alessandro would know, right? You know what? I mean, like he would know what it looked like and what it looks like now and saying, and he’s been around this for 3540 years, knowing guys deteriorate. No one guys can and can’t do things when they shouldn’t, shouldn’t do things. I mean, like that would be the part of my media credential in the old days of me talking to Jim coletto and John Ogden and the other players and saying, how’s it going? Because they would light up. They would light up and say, Hey, he’s back. He’s Notre Dame, he’s back to where he was. Or at least, don’t worry about him. You know, somebody would say to me, don’t worry about him. Billick would say, Don’t worry about him. He’s gonna be fine. And that would tell me all. I and Kevin Byrne was at a point, and if Chad Steele wonders the difference between him and Kevin Byrne, but beside knowing football and being when Kevin Byrne would say he’s fine, I would take that as gospel 20 years ago, when they didn’t lie to anybody, when that wasn’t the hardball game, the hardball game has been different about what they’re gonna bullshit you about. Like, quite frankly, you know that? I know that, like, just in a general sense, Ronnie Stanley better not be something that isn’t an IS. He’s got to be an IS. I mean, I and I keep going back to that day when he tumbled and fell, and I turned to my wife aghast and said, they can’t win the Super Bowl without him. I felt that way four years ago. I don’t know that I feel that way, but I don’t feel left tackle can’t be a detriment. Left tackle last year, strong position, not an adequate position for them. Well,
Luke Jones 14:51
I mean, but they went 13 and four with attic at best, adequate left tackle play last year. So I don’t. Know if I necessarily agree that it has to be strong or the absolute strongest, it’s got to be stable, though, right? I think it’s got to be stable. It’s got to be something that’s reasonably dependable at the very least. I mean, look, Ronnie Stanley is not being paid as a $20 million tackle anymore. I mean, that was part of him taking a pay cut and then voiding the last year of his deal, and he’s got a lot to play for. I will say this like I said, I think he’s worked his butt off. I think the fact that he’s practiced every single day speaks to him realizing and recognizing and being cognizant of where he is at this point in his career, and understanding he’s playing for a job, whether it’s in Baltimore or wherever his next stop is going to
Nestor J. Aparicio 15:40
be a costa right now, and say, Could he play like a $20 million tackle? I would be interested to see what he and Joe and John would say. He just, he’s not that guy. He’s what he is right now, which is like Odell Beckham last year, Good, fine veteran, good. And I’d like, I think you would honesty from them about what they really expect from Ronnie Stanley at this point, because they expect more from linderbaum.
Luke Jones 16:05
They do, of course. I mean, yeah, I mean Lunder bombs the anchor their offensive line now. I mean, he’s going to be paid like that in the next couple years. I’m sure he’s going to probably become the highest paid center in football, or in that top two or three realm, and frankly, has played like that. You know, he’s
Nestor J. Aparicio 16:21
way more money than Ryan Jensen,
Luke Jones 16:24
sure. Well, yeah. I mean, just because the sheer growth of the salary cap, it will be way more than him. But I think what they would tell you if, if it were me envisioning giving them the truth serum and then being honest with you, is, look, we’ve got some questions here. I mean, come on. We’ve all watched how the last four years have played out. It’s unfortunate as heck. This guy was so good we paid him, and then he wrecked his ankle to two days later, literally two days after they gave him that long term contract. So we’re hoping for the best. We feel optimistic that he does seem healthier than he’s been. He’s been able to practice every day. He’s been in the building, even going back to the spring, was here. So
Nestor J. Aparicio 17:04
they didn’t feel like they needed to replace him, right? I
Luke Jones 17:07
mean, they, you know, it’s easier said than done. I mean, you know, you’re not, you’re not drafting a left tackle at 30th you know, we talked about this with Rose and garden being drafted in the second round, whether he’s going to be ready to play right tackle. So I think they’re hoping for the best. I think they’re cautiously optimistic at the same time that I don’t think they’re going to let you know they’re not going to let their offensive line go down the drain. If Ronnie Stanley is what he was last year, or some version that’s even a little bit worse, you know, they’ll, they’ll pivot to McCarry. They’ll, you know, I wouldn’t be shocked to see if they’d even move rose and garden over to the left side to see what that looks like. You know, he protected The Blind Side at Washington, albeit for a left handed quarterback, but it’s still the same principle in terms of, you know, you were protecting the blind side. You know, they have Josh Jones, the veteran that they brought in, who’s played some left tackle before, you know, has at least practiced there a good bit this summer. So, so we’re gonna have to see, I think they’re hoping for, certainly hoping, hoping and envisioning better than last year. But if they’re do, I think that they’re honestly sitting there with realistic visions that Ronnie Stanley is going to be a pro bowl caliber left tackle anymore now. And I think the pay cut was a reflection of that, because Nestor, as you know very well, when you ask someone to take a pay cut, what is your typical alternative? When they balk at that, typically, that means you release them. So I’m not saying that that definitely would have happened with Ronnie Stanley, because we know what the cap situation and ramifications would have been. But you know, when you’re approaching a player about taking a cut in pay, there’s usually, you know, there’s an alternative there, where you move on from the guy entirely. So I don’t know if the Ravens definitely would have done that, but look, I mean, I think they’re being realistic with where he is. I think they’re hopeful that he’s going to be healthy, and he has been healthy to this point, you know, going through spring and summer practices. But, you know, there’s, there’s doing that, and then there’s stopping miles Garrett, or stopping Trey Hendrickson, or stopping any other premier pass, you know, TJ watt, obviously. So you know, there’s a question mark with that. And you know, do they need Ronnie Stanley to be a 10? No. Do they need him to be a nine? No? Do they need him be an eight? No, he wasn’t an eight last year, and they got as far as they did so, but they need him to be solid there. They need him to be dependable there, at the very least. And you know, that’s what the assumption that, oh yeah, you got to figure out your other three offensive line spots so. But he has been healthy. He has been able to practice. He does seem healthier than he’s been in recent years, but it’s called spade a spade. That’s been a pretty low bar, unfortunately. So I think there’s cautious optimism, but I can’t sit here and say with any strong conviction that that the Ravens had this expectation that Ronnie Stanley is going to be great. In 2024 I think they’re hoping he can be better than he was last year. And you know, in that solid, the good range in what is going to be a contract year for him. And you know, you hope he you hope he can be that at least. Because, again, you’re still trying to figure out these other positions that you’re replacing starters. So it’s still very much a work in progress. And you know, here we go again. We’re talking, uh, ravens, and we keep defaulting back to talking about the offensive line. Imagine, and
Nestor J. Aparicio 20:25
I was going to say to you, so, you know, clearly the the two guard positions, who the right tackle is going to be, it’s going to be rose and Garten, at some point, better be um, and Ronnie Stanley, better be upright and left tackle. Because if we’re talking about McCarey, left tackle, big, solid right tackle, you know, some Simpson signing they’re going to make, you know, like, if that’s where we are in three weeks, they have failed miserably in the off season. And trying to address this, if they’re still picking up pieces, and Voorhees isn’t the answer in Cleveland’s not. I mean, all these guys that they’ve that we’ve talked about forever, forget the offensive line. We’re playing the eagles on Friday night. Luke Jones is here. He’s Baltimore, Luke. You can find him out, but covering the Orioles as well and trying to figure out the Grayson Rodriguez thing, and get them back here and see if they’re going to be in first place or not. What else concerns you? I mean, I know deep down, I spent enough time with you. We get together on the field, off the field, you think they’re going to win 11 or 12 games, right? Like I don’t even know what the Vegas number is on them. You think right now, if I were to say to you, you bet me something that matters to you? 100 bucks, 200 real money. Um, you’d say, yeah, I get them at 11 and a half. I’ll bet the over on that. I think they’re good for 12 or 13 wins. That’s a lot of wins, right? 10, 1011, would be a little disappointing. There’d be some bad interceptions for Lamar and some bad days for the offensive line if they lose six or seven games around here, right? Like, that’s how high the bar is for them, right? Even the Orioles, they were supposed to 105 this year. Now they don’t have the number two starter. Like, now it’s just like, get to the playoffs. Um, Barry bloom, by the way, is going to join us next week. He’s in Maui. He texts me back. He’s like, they’re better off being a wild card. So that’s where I am with some old timers. I don’t think the ravens are better off being a wild card. I don’t think the ravens are better off playing more football in January than less. I don’t think they’re better off playing on the road. I wouldn’t say they’re better off going to Buffalo in Kansas City next year, as opposed to what happened here.
Luke Jones 22:17
What else are
Nestor J. Aparicio 22:18
you worried about? I mean, obviously, lamar’s health, I think Derek Henry’s and is not a might be, um, I’ll even buy in the flowers, and Bateman being a little better, and Andrew’s being healthy and like, I mean, I’ll buy into things will be okay for the offense. So what? What then worries you? Yeah,
Luke Jones 22:36
well, and to go back to your I don’t know if I see them as a 13 win team, because I There are very few years where I think they’re going to be that good, just because 13 wins exactly, and yeah, and that’s why you’re and that’s why you’re never going to see, you know, and you know me, I’m not a sports gambling guy, but you’re not going to see someone with an over, a team with an over, under a 13 and a half, right? I mean, I mean, unless you’re talking about, like, oh, seven patriots, kind of crazy stuff. But you know, I think they’re going to be an 11 or 12 win team. I mean, I do. And you know, where Cincinnati falls into that, where the rest of the division, we’ll see. And you know, you mentioned lamar’s health. I mean, that’s any team’s quarterback health. I mean, Patrick mahomes hurts himself this week at chiefs camp and is in jeopardy for the start of the season. Or, you know, look at burrow with the calf issue last year, even before he hurt his wrist against the Ravens. Look at how that hindered him the first couple months of the season. So any team quarterback health is paramount, right? But beyond the offensive line, and we’ve talked about that, we’ll continue to talk about that, I think you still look at the pass rush. I think you look at the fact that you lost your Davion Clowney, who was really, really good for them last year. And I get it, you didn’t want to give the kind of long term commitment and the kind of financial commitment that he got in Carolina, which was a nice payday for a guy that’s, you know, what, 30 years old, or on the other side of 30 at this point.
Nestor J. Aparicio 23:55
But, and by the way, that money, that margin money you talk about, that’s what happens when the quarterbacks make it 50 million. And that wasn’t the case two years ago. That is the case now. And there, these are those decisions of funny money with obell Beckham last year, funny money last year with Clowney. But you know, like they had a little funny money that doesn’t exist anymore, and it won’t exist once they start paying Linder bomb and paying Kyle ham. I mean, that’s just, that’s, that’s a sport once the quarter is
Luke Jones 24:23
awesome, right? But there’s all it’s not that’s a little too simplistic, though, because the cap’s going up a whole lot. I mean, it has. And keep in mind, you mentioned Linda Bahman Hamilton noted, and I agree. But keep in mind Ronnie Stanley is going to be coming off the books, and even if you resign Ronnie Stanley, he’s not getting another 100 million dollar contract. Marlin Humphreys, getting to a point where value does it align with what he’s being confident. Roquan
Nestor J. Aparicio 24:47
Smith got money right out of the shore. They took away from everybody else. They got 200 clean out of here, right?
Luke Jones 24:52
But I would also point out, you know, they’re also paying a running back way more than they were paying running backs the last few years. I mean, Gus Edwards say what you want. And again, I. At it. Gus Edwards did not look the same last year as he did in previous years, but what a tremendous value he was for them over the last four to five years. So, you know, you’re paying your you’re running back more. So, yeah, on the margins, you you have a little bit less disposable income, you know, as it pertains to the salary cap, well, that’s what does take away from a clowny that you don’t get. You don’t get the luxury of having that anymore. Well, I mean, and keep in mind, clown didn’t make a lot. I mean, you can create a few million dollars here and there. I think where you have to be careful and where I think the Ravens really fell into trouble during the Joe Flacco contract, big contract era was, I think they paid too many players in the middle class. I think you can have your premier guys, your your five, six guys that are making, you know, very competitive money as it pertains to their position. You know, the Ravens right now. Put Lamar aside. Roquan Smith, Marlon Humphrey is still in that bracket, although not quite as high as he was three, four years ago. Mark Andrew BK, now. Mark Andrews, right? I mean, Derek Henry is a, basically a one year deal with the team option. So that’s not really, but, but it’s more than you were in the past. So anyway, you’ve got those premier guys. But I think where the Ravens really fell into trouble in the 2014 1516, 17 era was, I think they had too many guys in the roster that they were paying two, three, $4 million to at the time that weren’t really moving the needle as much as you needed. Those guys that you like, that are good depth players, just a guy, as they would say, just maybe guys that are good special teams players, but they’re not like a standout defensive or offensive player. I think that’s where you got to be careful. I think you can have your other big contracts in addition to your quarterback within reason, but you really need to get tremendous value from guys that are on rookie contracts. And I don’t just mean your Linder bombs and Kyle Hamilton, all pro type guys that you know you’re gonna have to pay. I mean, the guys that are really good depth pieces, like, here’s a great example for you. Know, Patrick Queen ended up being that, and he got paid and went on elsewhere. They need Trenton Simpson now as a second year player, third round pick, guy that they really liked. They need him to and I’m not saying he won’t have some some growing pains this year, stepping into a starting role here and there. I mean, Queen had that a couple years ago. Talked about that a lot with Patrick queen, but he needs to come in and can he be a really good value for you the next couple years?
Nestor J. Aparicio 27:28
No one notices, coach, yeah, yeah. But I mean, well, you mentioned the Flacco thing. I want to go back to 1450 once Flacco got paid. And you’re like, well, they kind of, yeah, they paid you the issue during those years, I think. And I look it up, but I lived through it. So we go back. They did not have rookies that worked out, like Kyle Hamilton and Tyler Linder bomb. They didn’t say flowers. They did not Perryman. Didn’t spark that. You know, certainly the Sergio Kindles and he was before that. But I’m thinking about who was the Arthur Smith. Think about it. Arthur Brown, right, second, second, third round, guys, it
Luke Jones 28:04
didn’t work, you I can go do this almost off memory, but in 13. Matt Elam, first round pick, bust, second round pick, Arthur, brown bust, 14. CJ Mosley, first round, worked out second round, what it was. Timmy Jernigan, okay, but not the you know, I think there was a thought when they drafted him that he would be adjusted. Madame certainly did not become that. You know, he wasn’t bad, but wasn’t great, either. They ended up trading him as he went to his contract year 15, Rashad, Param and bust Max Williams ended up being a decent blocking tight end, but that’s not why they drafted him in the second round, third round. What was it? Carl Davis, who was essentially, kind of tabbed to be the guy that would step in for Haloti nada, who was traded at that point. Obviously you never thought he was going to be that, but was not a starting caliber player, you know. So you go to then you go 16. You had Ronnie Stanley, all right, hit on that, regardless of what’s happened later in his career with the injuries. But then Kamala Correa, Bronson, cafoci in 17 it was, you know, I mean, Tyus Bowser who worked out, but not until three years later. And so the
Nestor J. Aparicio 29:13
suck to your point, Flacco got ran out of here, on that, on all of that, nobody performed around him in that way, the way that Lamar has the benefit cheap center, world class safety, you know, like just a game changing defensive piece that they’re paying league minimum or rookie contract, I say so that helps a lot. And
Luke Jones 29:38
also, I mean, with Lamar, and we can certainly debate how well all of them have worked out to this point, but they’ve invested in draft capital and wide receivers, whereas Joe Flacco, I mean, they traded Anquan Boldin and then signed Steve Smith a year after that. Jeremy Maclin, you know, Steve Smith was good at the end of his career, but it was Steve Smith at the end of his Yeah. Oh my. Wallace was actually one of the bigger success stories they had. Maclin was a total bust. And everyone they drafted in that era was a total bust. So anyway, I mean, I don’t feel like rehashing that too much more, but you asked me things that concerned me, and we went off on this big tangent. Outside linebacker, you know, always a little bit banged up right now, little bit of an ankle issue. My only concern is, is it the same ankle as last year? They downplayed that. I don’t think it’s a major thing, but he’s missing a couple days here, assuming that’s not a major thing, I feel cautiously optimistic that he’s going to take the next step. I think he it was understated, but I think he low key, had a pretty good year last year, albeit, was a guy that didn’t have to be the guy, because jadevion Clowney really jumped out, and Van Noy did what he did, but OA was still productive for them. They need a jump from him. They got van Noy back. I think van Noy has a chance, even at age 33 to continue to thrive in the role that he’s in right now, which he was the kind of guy that was asked to do a lot throughout his career, play off ball, drop into coverage, rush the passer, set the edge, whereas the ravens are really asking him, as they did last year, to really just rush the passer. I mean, yes, he plays the run, but he comes in in more obvious passing situations, and he’s more of a nickel edge guy because they play Malik Harrison at the SAM in early down situations, but
Nestor J. Aparicio 31:25
he’s a real hardball guy, right? Van Noy, yeah,
Luke Jones 31:27
I Yes, and no. I mean, they like him as a player, I don’t know, personality wise, if he’s that much of a you know, you see Kyle van Noy on some of the media stuff he does. It’s not really my cup of tea, but he’s a good player. Anyway. Who else, though, when you talk about your outside linebacker rotation, you need four or five guys, and that doesn’t mean all five guys are all going to have six sacks, but you need those guys to be productive, because you don’t want van Noy have to play 50 snaps a game. You don’t want, oh, wait, to have to play 60 snaps a game. So Where’s David ajabo right now? Well, he looks healthy. Can I sit here and say that I have confidence that he’s going to realize all this potential? I want to see what he looks like in the preseason. They’re going to run him around Friday guys like him, right? Yeah, he’s got to play. I mean, he’s got to play. One of the things that was said about him, even before he tore his Achilles at his Pro Day was he hadn’t played a lot of football at Michigan. He was green. He was raw. He was considered a guy that had huge upside, huge upside. And remember, he would have been a first round pick, and the Ravens ended up getting him in the second round. So not faulting that pick, but he’s missed so much development time, and he just needs to play. So you have him. Adisa Isaac, the third round pick, just got back onto the practice field. He’s dealt with a hamstring issue that’s hindered him going all the way back to the pre draft process. So you know, they need to get him on the field and developing they’ve got tavius Robinson, you know, we’ll see about him in his second year. Point is you have Kyle bannoy and adopt a away, and even away, there’s still some questions in terms of him living up to the first round hype with when he was drafted three years ago. But if I’m assuming he’s an IS, even if it’s not an All Pro is, kind of is. It’s an IS, but after that, I mean, there are snaps there for the taking, and these young guys need to step up, and are they going to get that? We’ll see. You know, I I’m I want to believe in David ajabo Because he’s a good story. I feel bad for the kid. He’s had rotten luck from an injury standpoint, but, gosh, he’s just missed so much development time. And I’d be lying to you. Asked me about Ronnie Stanley and how he’s looked at camp, you know, a job. Oh, he’s been really quiet, really quiet. You know, I’ve not really seen him flashing the way that I’d like to see him when he’s matching up against the second and third team offensive line, and that was part of the problem last year with a job. Oh, even before the knee injury, he didn’t really stand out in the preseason when he’s going up against backups. And if you’re going to be a guy, that’s going to be a factor, you got to show something. If you’re going up against backups, you know, I’m not saying you got to have six sacks at a preseason game, but come on, man, you got to show something. So really watching him, really watching tavius, Robinson, Adisa Isaac, still got to ramp up some. But if there’s one area on the defense that, yeah, I’ve got some, I don’t want to say grave concern, because, my goodness, Nestor, we talked about the the pass rush so much last summer, and they let the NFL at sacks. And yes, Jade beyond Clowney was a big part of that, but that he wasn’t the only reason why. What did they do? They scheme right, sim pressures and and lots of the
Nestor J. Aparicio 34:41
McDonald’s thing too, to some degree too,
Luke Jones 34:43
there’s gonna be some real questions about where that drop off is, right. And I’m glad you brought that up, because if you’re gonna ask me another concern, and look, I I have no reservations about Zach or as an individual whatsoever. You know, he’s worked hard. He’s worked his way up the food. Chain. He, he went to Jacksonville for a year with Joe Cullen, you know, with the previous regime, with the Jaguars, with the Urban Meyer fiasco, came back. You know, he’s put it he, you know, he’s paid his dues. You know, he’s been a an assistant NFL coach from the time, you know, three months after he retired, he joined the ravens and started cutting his teeth at that point. But the transition, as was the case, transitioning from wink Martindale to Mike McDonald, you know, could it be a little choppy early in the season? Sure, but I’ll, but I’ll say this, even if everything about Zach or works out and a year from now, we’re talking about him as a hot shot head coaching candidate in the same way we talked about Mike McDonald before he wound up in Seattle. I think they’re going to have to do a lot of the same things for their pass rush, right? A lot of the same things in terms of disguise and stunts and games at the line of scrimmage and twists and sim pressures and all that. And, you know, the other guy, that’s an X factor that could, I could see. And this is not any knowledge I have. This is just spitballing, just a Mata BK having the year that he had. And, you know, do I think he’s going to match 13 sacks again? I think that’s ambitious, just knowing how sacks and year to year type stuff, you know how that, especially from that position too, yeah, but to that point, you and you just, you kind of just started to make my point for me. I didn’t intrigued to see if there are some scenarios where maybe the Ravens start using Justin madam Bucha, a little more like how the Chiefs use Chris Jones, which is on some passing situations. Maybe you kick him outside and rush from the edge, and maybe you try to bull rush an offensive tackle who’s, you know, unsuspecting of that kind of alignment. So, you know, I don’t think they’re, I’m not saying that’s going to become something they do extensively, but I could see that, especially with them having some questions with the edge, you know, and because they love Mata Bucha, I think Travis Jones is a guy to really watch that could really take a big step. So maybe they use him on the edge a little bit more. But if that’s that’s my concern, they’ve got depth, you know, I think Trenton Simpson is going to be fine at inside linebacker. I do think they’ll probably use a little bit more dime to get him off the field in some obvious passing situations. And they did the same thing when Patrick queen was a young player. So I don’t think that’s any knock on Simpson. I think it’s just, hey, you have all these secondary pieces. Use them, you know, when it comes down to it, if it’s an obvious situation, put Kyle Hamilton at the dime and go with that. So, you know, I think they have enough depth even to endure and survive the millet injury, even if he’s out into the start of the season. I mean, we’ll see. But, you know the pass rush, I still know that that’s a lot you’re having to replace with your Davion Clowney and I, I think they can do it in the aggregate. But what does that mean? They need to continue this collective effort that they’ve run so effectively the last couple years, and you hope will continue under Mike McDonald. He’s Luke Jones.
Nestor J. Aparicio 37:59
He’ll be monitoring all things Ravens. Friday night the Ravens get together with the Eagles for fake football. We are watching a lot of baseball this weekend, monitoring this whole Grayson Rodriguez situation. Everything we do is out at Baltimore positive these days, obviously up on YouTube. And at am 1570 and you tired yet. I mean, once camp really end, when do they stop letting people out there?
Luke Jones 38:22
You I think it’s what the end of next week. So we’re, you know, we’re starting to wind down, but hey, we say that, but still have almost a month until the start of the season, right? So, I mean, you know, with this early start to camp, you only have three preseason games now it leads to, you get to the end of training camp in the way that fans are coming out, but there’s still a lot of practice time to go even after that, so still have a long way to go. I think for the ravens, the biggest development this week that’s been a little disappointing is, you know, some of these nagging injuries starting to crop up, but it’s football. I mean, you can ramp up as much as you can. The only way you eliminate injuries from football is what you eliminate playing football itself. I mean, it’s just, you’re going to have some of that. Fortunately for them, it hasn’t been anything catastrophic. But, yeah, the millet injury, you know that that’s sounds a little problematic until we get a little more clarity on that. I mean, again, saying it’s not season ending, well, that’s great, but we’re six months of the Super Bowl. That doesn’t mean he might miss some time here. And you know that you wonder about his status early in the season even, but we’ll find out, you know, we’ll find out about some of these other guys as we get closer to the start of the season. And in the meantime, buckle up for preseason football, which is something I guess, to hold us over until the opener in a little under a month. Plenty
Nestor J. Aparicio 39:43
football ahead, plenty baseball ahead. I have said to John Feinstein this week and John Eisenberg and I had a long chat about his bird tapes. This is, like the most exciting couple of months. I guess it sucks for me being locked out, not asking questions. I never sort of envisioned that, but I’ve been waiting. My whole life I’ve been waiting 33 years doing this crazy radio show. 26 years I got to change my cupcake. I think I’m gonna do a 26th anniversary oyster. I’m trying to figure that out with with Jessica from our web team. But this these next six months for the level of expectation on all of this to see where we are on Valentine’s Day where we are when the Orioles go back to to camp in February, to see if there have been parades, to see if there have been injuries, to see if there have been triumphs, tragedies, losses, because the level of expectation amongst the fan base here, especially for the baseball team that’s never won and the football team that can’t win, right, like the football team, they can’t win games. They can’t win next month or in October or November. They can be 12 and, oh, and they haven’t won anything, um, because the fan base now is New Orleans or boss, Super Bowl or bust. I mean, they’re talking that way out there. I heard guy Saint Jacoby Jones. He’s from New Orleans. We got to get there. It’s August. I That’s a nice, noble goal. But the fans, you know, a three and out for the Orioles in October and the Ravens taking a face or the second week of the playoffs. Oh, my God, most of the 26 years we’ve had the station that’d be a pretty damn good year going two weeks into the playoffs for both teams, that wouldn’t be good enough here. And that’s a that’s a different bar that we’ve set around here. I think, right,
Luke Jones 41:21
it is, and that’s a good thing. But we also need to remember one team’s happy at the end. And look, I mean, we’re going to be talking about this a lot with the Orioles, and I don’t want to blame it, because this is a raven segment. But if Grayson Rodriguez is out, and we’re wondering if he’s going to pitch again and all that, that really changes my expectations, as far as what you’re really going to be able to expect, you know, in terms of October, if you’re taking your number two starter out of the equation after you already took your previous number two starter out of the equation,
Nestor J. Aparicio 41:50
now your number two start. Yeah, so
Luke Jones 41:53
but, but I think that what you just said is also a reminder to all of us still enjoy the ride here, because there are lots of cities right now who don’t have one decent team, and at least you know, and look, the Orioles don’t get a pass. We know how lousy the better part of the last 40 years have been, but the Ravens from 99 on 2000 on have been very relevant just about every single year. I mean, that’s a quarter of a century. Now, they have been relevant other than a couple seasons. And even those seasons, what where were the years where there were no expectations? Oh, two. And they ended up going seven to nine that year. Horribles first year, and they ended up going to the A F, C championship game that year, the rookie quarterback. I mean, those, those are really the only two seasons where you really would say, going into the season, there were not very high expectations. I mean, even,
Nestor J. Aparicio 42:55
like, think about this is the highest of expectations. I guess your point. There was never a year where they were expected to win the Super Bowl, not even the McNair year when they were pretty good. They had a good quarterback. They were a favorite. They were never the favorite because Tom Brady existed, Roethlisberger. I mean, other teams were of that ilk, baseball wise, they were the best team last year. They’ve proven sort of over the course of time, even with these injuries, they can be the best team this year, baseball wise and football wise. They were the best team last year and effed it up, and now they’ve come back, and I think Vegas has them as the favorite, right? Are they the Kansas City would be the favorite? But no, they were. They were they played third or fourth championship game The Last time they played. They were a four and a half point favorite to go to the Super Bowl at home. So, um, they’re, they’re still a one, two pick, one, one a pick. The level of expectations just really high here, and it’s August, and, um, that’s advantage that as a host, as a citizen, as a radio station owner, as a you know, just being out and having this level of expectation and the spotlight on every decision Brandon Hyde’s making, right and every hard ball’s always kind of had that three runs in the AOC championship game, but and Zach Britton on the bench for Bucha alter. But the the analysis of maneuverings in game maneuverings has just ramped up for Brandon Hyde in a way over the next 60 days, where every pinch hitter and every bullpen decision, we haven’t had that, we haven’t had that in a long time, and it’s good and it’s so I’m ramping up for that. Luke’s doing a lot of sports. I’m doing a lot of sports. I’m doing a lot of sports. We’re doing a lot of sports around here, but still mixing in all sorts of good stuff. We had Steven page on this week, formerly the Barenaked Ladies. He’s playing on Monday, my wife’s favorite musician. So we’ve had some Canadians on. I still can’t track down Getty Lee, although I did find him, it took me to the ninth inning. I did find him. He’s in the third row, right underneath the bug. So if you’re looking for Getty, he’s got the. All cap down. He was with a guy that looked like a rock star like me, with Luke. I’m Nestor. We are W, N, S, T, A M, 1570 tasks in Baltimore, and we never stop talking Baltimore positive, even in the midst of a pennant race. I.
