In an effort to release all of his Almost Famous-era rock and roll interviews from his time as a music critic at The Baltimore Sun, Nestor Aparicio found an October 1989 chat with legendary keyboardist Jonathan Cain, just as his new band Bad English was approaching Hammerjacks. Some Steve Perry chatter here from four decades ago as Journey has gone its separate ways into the wheel in the sky of Rock and Roll Hall of Fame immortality.
In 1989, Jonathan Cain discussed the formation and current status of Bad English, a band he formed after leaving Journey. The band is touring in smaller venues to promote their album, focusing on club and theater shows. Cain explained the band’s origins, including his collaboration with John Waite and the addition of Neil Schon and Dean Castronovo. Bad English has performed 36 shows, primarily their own material, and aims to support their record as long as possible. Cain also touched on the disbandment of Journey, Steve Perry’s solo projects, and the band’s financial backing by Trudy Green.
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
Bad English tour, album promotion, smaller venues, career transition, lead singer, band formation, recording process, guitar auditions, Neil Schon, Dean Casanova, Journey disbandment, Steve Perry, solo projects, club tours, sports fan
SPEAKERS
Nestor Aparicio, Jonathan Cain
8
Nestor Aparicio 00:21
Hello, Hi, Jonathan, yeah, Nestor, how you doing good? Hey, I spoke to you a couple years ago when the journeys came around here.
Jonathan Cain 00:27
Yeah, your name sound familiar? I said, I think I know this guy.
Nestor Aparicio 00:32
Well, I don’t know if you know me, but anyway, what is, what is going on with the bad English people at this point?
Jonathan Cain 00:38
8We’re just, you know, doing our tour here, kind of riding a smaller venue tour, and doing clubs and small theaters basically to promote the album. And you know, we felt that was a better situation for us than, you know, going out with a band and getting put on opening sort of situation, just because, you know, the caliber players and the people involved,
Nestor Aparicio 01:09
okay, what happened to get this whole thing together? I know you’re probably the person to talk to. I said, when this whole interview thing, I don’t want to talk to Kane. I talked to him once before, and then I said, Well, this guy is the link. I mean, you knew Sean from journey. You knew away from the babies. So just seemed
Jonathan Cain 01:27
like, you know, the natural next step in my career was to, you know, work with two people I really care a lot about, and who I thought, you know, would be an interesting combination. I’ve, you know, been a producer for the last few years, and have had the pleasure of putting some great musicians together, Jimmy Barnes project and Michael Bolton. And, you know, I watched Jimmy Barnes and David Lindley, you know, rip it up. And, you know, David Linley and Neil Shawn and Tony Brock. And, you know, put Randy Jackson with these people. And, you know, really had some fun things happen out of it. And so I sort of sat back and, you know, thought about who I’d really want to play some rock and roll with again, and I was looking for a lead singer, and it was just a matter of timing with with John. I was on the road with Michael Bolton. I was his musical director for the heart show about a year and a half ago. Yeah, I saw that show, and it was when he had to hit right. The doctor produced that right. And it was like Trudy Green was sitting there up the manager heart, and I wanted to get involved with Trudy. And I was asking her about singers, and she had signed John Waite, you know. And so I said, Well, I have him call me. So he called me, and the next thing, you know, we were talking about old times and doing a new thing, you know,
Nestor Aparicio 02:59
how did the baby’s thing come together and fall apart? Well, the babies actually
803:03
was waiting with came together before I was in the band. I think that was back. It was a British band, right? Yeah. They got signed in England. They, I think they got signed back in 76 or 70 I think 76 is when their first record came out. And they got signed on a video they had sent to Chrysalis, you know, that was sort of a new way of getting signed. And, you know, they were kind of ahead of their time there.
Nestor Aparicio 03:31
Now, when did you join? Were you there for? Isn’t a time. And, yeah,
03:35
I joined for every time I think of you, which was they had first out, right? And, well,
Nestor Aparicio 03:40
8how did they find you? Well, I
03:42
just auditioned, you know, it was a street thing. I just, I heard about it, you know, to the grapevine, and friend of mine told me to go audition. So I auditioned, and kept going back. They were less than two weeks of auditions, you know. And I just, I got the gig.
Nestor Aparicio 03:58
Where are you from?
03:58
Chicago, Chad.
8Nestor Aparicio 03:59
I never knew that. I always thought of you as San Francisco person, because all the rest of the guys in Germany were San Francisco. I
04:05
was originally from Chicago, moved to LA for eight years, and so I did my time there, you know, Purgatory, Purgatory. And then, you know, got picked up. The reason the babies folded was sort of a couple things, that situation, and with chrysalis and dad management, I think, at that point, and we just had some problems, you know. And there was, really, no, it was a turntable hit, the babies still don’t have a gold album. Really, no, there’s no two
Nestor Aparicio 04:41
songs. And then went 13. I looked it up last night, but anyway, John, John was having some problems with his solo career after a change, got re released with and it became a hit. And then I remember hearing him on the radio, oh God, about a year and a half ago when he had a song that he wanted to. The push, and it just never happened. I don’t remember the name of the song. These times are hard for love. Hard time, yeah, hard times for
05:06
8lovers. Yeah. I
Nestor Aparicio 05:08
thought was a good song, and it never happened. Well, EMI
05:10
went down the tube. See, that was EMI Manhattan. They went belly up right about the time of the release, so they lost that record too. So that was bad time for John. And he had just gotten tired of the solo, you know, fire, you know, did you’re always on in the frying pan. It seems like, you know, when you’re a solo artist, and there’s a lot of responsibility, you know, the beer. And I think he just got tired of it. And so, you know, bad English, I was just tired of, of, you know, doing just all the producing thing was fun, but I, you know, I was really looking for a
Nestor Aparicio 05:48
band. Why the name bad English.
805:52
It was one of those accident things I was, I was reading this manual, how to play pool, and we were waiting for the mixes to get done, and we were all playing pool. And we started playing pool for, you know, small change. And then it got, you know, we were playing pool for sushi. And then it got to, like, 100, $200 pool matches. So I was reading these manuals just having, you know, fun playing around with technique and English. Of course, on the pool table was left and right center and bottom, I was showing Neil left English and right English. And Neil would hit a ball with left English and go the exact opposite way it was supposed to. I looked at Neil and I said, Man, we have a new one for the book, Neil. It’s called Bad English. You know, we laughed and we walked away. And the next day, I just somebody had said something about bad English, and our manager, Trudy Green said, That’s it. That’s the name of the band. I said, Really, I didn’t even know, you know, it’s one of those coin a phrase.
Nestor Aparicio 06:46
What was Neil doing at this when did this whole thing? Okay, this was a year and a half ago now,
06:52
got together a year ago in June. So it’s been a year, 15 months now, yeah, 15 months, and Neil really hadn’t joined the band till September, the end of September, you know, why did he get in? Well, he we’ve been looking for guitar player, kind of going. We had been looking for guitar player and drummer. We Ricky got in early on this thing. We had about six songs, and we had got, gotten a record deal solidified with epic, and they wanted to hear more material, and they we knew we needed a great guitar player. So we, you know, we’re auditioning people and writing songs at the same time. We tried a lot of, you know, great players, but Neil would come down and help us with our demos and stuff, and was interested in the band, you know. And I just thought it was the key in on Neil was a good idea. And, you know, he, he kept calling us up, asking us if we’d found a guitar player yet, you know, when he was working on a solo album late night, you know.
Nestor Aparicio 07:55
8And did you have to twist his arm pretty much or much? No, he,
07:58
he eventually, you know, saw a good thing. He heard that the material. Really liked it, and, you know, had a really good time playing with John and I. So he came along fairly quick, you know, but we, he brought Dean Casanova, which completed the band and was a valuable player, you know, to the whole where’s he from? He’s from Salem, Oregon, and he was playing with a band called The wild dogs up in Portland, bash metal band, actually. And, you know, he called me on the phone. He said, I found the drummer, you know, I think this guy will be perfect for the band. And he brought him in, and sure enough, he was great. So where did you do all this recording? And getting to LA, we the band went to LA. We spent about six months writing, and five months writing in San Francisco, and then, like when Neil joined, we finished writing the album. John lives in San Francisco. Then, no he, he was staying in San Francisco just we rented an apartment for him. And he was staying writing in my house. And then we moved it down la for the guitar and drum auditions, you know. And Neil ended up coming down, and he’s actually moved down to LA now.
Nestor Aparicio 09:13
So all the the action was happened by you and you and John, pretty much. And then Neil got it started. Then,
09:21
you know, of course, Neil came along and was the icing on the cake, really, with bringing Dean in and stuff. Okay, where does
8Nestor Aparicio 09:27
this leave? Journey defunct.
09:31
Journey pretty much had been abandoned by Steve, you know, he decided he wanted to, you know, go on a solo and didn’t have the energy to maintain the sheriff journey. You know, I didn’t want to wear the badge anymore, and felt the responsibility too great. And he had things in his too life that he wanted to straighten out. Had lost some members of his family to cancer. And stuff. And really just wanted to slow his life down, you know, didn’t want to run, run with the with a journey machine, you know. And so,
Nestor Aparicio 10:11
is that bad? Is that a shame? Not
10:13
8a bad thing? That’s just a becoming, a time in your life when you either want to do this or you don’t. And journey, you know, was an army of of energy, you know, and he was at the head of it. And, of course, there was a lot, lot of heat to be taken. And, you know, he, he gave his, he gave a lot of his life to journey. And I think that, you know, he should be remembered for, you know, being a great singer and a great front man, and not to be, you know, looked at it any other way. I think he gave a lot, you know, of his heart to this business and to our band. So, you know, if it comes a time in his your life when you got to say, hey, I want to slow down. I gotta, you know, I gotta go along with it. Yeah, okay.
Nestor Aparicio 10:56
So what’s he doing now? Anything musically or solo thing. He’s
10:59
been, he’s been sort of making an album, you know, at his own leisurely pace. Of course, we wouldn’t have stood for that, you know, but he’s got enough cash that doesn’t really doesn’t matter to him. He’s more interested in doing it, you know.
Nestor Aparicio 11:14
I mean, you got to do something with your time, you know what?
811:16
I mean, it’s just, he’s, you know, he’s toying around with it. He just keeps writing new songs and playing around with it, and then it’s like a car, you know, he’s fine tuning it, and eventually, over he’ll release it, so you can pick up the phone and call Steve Perry tomorrow, and I have he’s called my house. Yeah,
Nestor Aparicio 11:30
we’re in good terms, yeah. Okay, what happens to Jackson and to Jeremy? How was
11:36
Michael Ferris playing with Billy Idol? Oh, is he? And he’ll be, he’ll be out with that tour. And Randy Jackson joined Breakfast Club. Oh, did he so, you know? And of course, Steve Smith has his jazz career with vital information. What
Nestor Aparicio 11:53
8about Ross Valerie?
11:54
And Ross is playing in a band called the view back in the Bay Area.
Nestor Aparicio 11:59
He’s like a Bay Area legend at this point, yeah, he
12:01
said, they’re trying to get signed. They still haven’t been signed by the final record company, but they’re, you know, making demos and working on it now with
8Nestor Aparicio 12:08
bad English. Was this thing financed by you? Or did the record company sign you up ahead of time when you’re just your your past valors? Or it was
12:17
kind of, it was Trudy. It was Trudy. Trudy supporting us.
Nestor Aparicio 12:23
Is Trudy? He or she? Trudy green. Is
12:26
8she okay, making sure she’s hard, okay? And Trudy and and myself. And you know, of course,
Nestor Aparicio 12:33
is that green with an E or Yeah? Trudy green, right? E, any Yeah, okay.
12:38
And so, you know, she believes, and I believe. And, you know, I came maybe some eight, nine grand out of pocket, not a big deal or, I
Nestor Aparicio 12:46
mean, but I was wondering, I mean, all these bands that come up out of nowhere have to push and push and push to get a deal with you guys on your name, I’m sure. Well, we
812:55
didn’t get an easy deal. We had to prove ourselves. We had to make a demo, and had to get, you know, approved.
Nestor Aparicio 13:00
They didn’t want rehashed and journey and babies in Santana or whatever. We
13:05
did the demo at my house, and I engineered and produced it, and then they turned us to Richie Zito, who was, you know, in line to do John’s record. And John had been signed to Epic, but they just didn’t want a band, you know, without, without hearing right? So, I mean, he it seemed like a natural thing since we were assigned to CBS to go to Epic, which is a subsidiary, because I can’t really play in any other label because of my journey obligations. So epic seemed like the right choice.
Nestor Aparicio 13:38
8So you journey is going to have to make another album or default on its contract, or, or have you worked something out
13:46
that’s kind of, if journey is not together, there’s really no contract. You know, you know Steve Perry O’s in a lot of albums, but that’s his deal, right, right.
Nestor Aparicio 13:56
Okay, what is your show like at this point? How many shows have you done?
14:01
We’ve done about 36 shows. Oh, wow, I didn’t realize it. We’ve been on the road for about two months. We opened up this thing in Japan with Jeff Beck, and it was really good. Okay, so which, what songs are you doing? We’re doing nine songs from the album at the time,
8Nestor Aparicio 14:20
off the bad English out now, are you doing baby songs?
14:23
Some cities we do. Some cities we don’t the baby cities. We play head first. But you know, I mean, some towns just weren’t very big babies fans,
Nestor Aparicio 14:34
you know? Are you doing every time I think of you or Okay, are you doing any journey stuff? No. Are you doing
14:42
8with stuff? No,
Nestor Aparicio 14:43
no,
14:44
it’s adding much. We’re promoting. It’s not a Yeah, I
Nestor Aparicio 14:47
mean, you have to do something more than nine songs we have.
814:51
We have a couple other, you know, solo interludes and stuff that we’ve added, you know. So give everybody a chance to stretch out.
Nestor Aparicio 14:59
Is Neil doing the song y’all did on the on frontiers tour? No, because I remember he had a solo song. I’ll
15:07
play it. No, no more lies. No, right? We’re not doing it’s pretty much a bad English show, you know, and everybody’s been real pleased with it so far.
Nestor Aparicio 15:16
8You think that that’ll disappoint some people who don’t know about it, yeah,
15:19
but I think that when they see the band, they’ll understand why we’re doing this and why we’re playing strictly bad English material, you know.
Nestor Aparicio 15:28
I just think some people will come and say, you know, you know, maybe they’ll throw one journey song and one, you know, missing you, or something like that in there.
15:36
Well, it’s kind of, you know, it’s that was that time, and always look back on, I mean, it’s like Phil Collins going with Genesis and doing his solo stuff. It’s not really Genesis, is it? Well, I guess it isn’t what it’s like Robert Plant playing Zeppelin. You know, he doesn’t really do much of it, you know, he had to this last tour. But
8Nestor Aparicio 15:56
good stuff too. It
16:00
still holds up. What
Nestor Aparicio 16:00
about the crowds? Now, it must be something to I know. I have the the escape video from from Houston, and I look at you guys, and you know, all these people, and they’ll try, I’m going to come down and see, and there’s going to be seven, 800 people, yeah, what’s, what’s that like? Well,
16:16
8it’s a new experience for us. I used to play clubs with the babies, of course, and, you know, always enjoyed it. Sometimes it’s a little crowded on stage, but I think overall, you know, Neil has really enjoyed it. He’s never done club tours. His first club tour, you know, all these years, he’s always been in stadiums and coliseums, and he was kind of apprehensive at first, but I mean, it was one of those things where, once you’ve done it, and, you know, you played these places, it’s, it’s really fun. It’s, you get an intimate feeling. You get to see the people react to your music, actually see them. You know, I really enjoy it a lot. I enjoy people, you know, at the edge of the stage and shaking their hands and sweating on them and throwing water around them. And, you know, it’s a lot of fun.
Nestor Aparicio 17:01
You’ve got two hits now, how long you can you can hold this one out before you keep
17:05
going with this record. Is as long as it’ll they can keep pulling them out of the hat. We’ll stay out there and support this record. We put 13 songs on the record. We we gave, we gave them a, I think, a pretty good menu, and there’s a lot to choose from out there. So, you know, we’ll, hopefully, we can stay alive with this record, that was our plan, and then hopefully, you know, back to the drawing board with another album. And I think we’re at least looking that far. No, okay,
Nestor Aparicio 17:35
well, nobody else think was sure whether this was a one shot thing. I mean, yeah, a lot of people have been saying that put a semi All Star band together, and you got to, you know, you have your doubts about, yeah, well,
817:46
there’s been a lot of disappointments in the past, and everybody has a reason, you know, to be doubtful, and nothing worse than getting into a band only to have it break up. I think it’s very discouraging for the fans, and they’re the ones that ultimately lose as well as, you know, players that have a good thing, you know, and there’s been plenty of bands that have broken up, you know, great bands for, for real silly reasons. Start with the Beatles, it’s good to be back. And, you know, we really, I haven’t played Baltimore, and eons, it’s been,
Nestor Aparicio 18:20
I don’t think you’ve played Baltimore. I know you didn’t play here as a journey. I never
18:24
I think we might have done it close to it and the babies with Alice Cooper. I think we might have come close there. But I’ve never really played Baltimore. So looking forward to at home in the Orioles. What can you say? Hey, good year this year. Well,
Nestor Aparicio 18:39
8you’ve got the teams there this weekend. I think, you know, we think you should rent your house out this weekend back in pretty, pretty insane,
18:47
having the Niners win the Super Bowl and then, kind of like the Giants and the Mets, you know, thing, it feels real good, though I’m real, real excited about, I
Nestor Aparicio 18:57
know you guys are pretty big sports fan, especially with the Niners. These guys used to pump the satellite in there, didn’t you? Oh yeah, we
19:02
were big on the diners. I’m still a big Niners fan, you know, Joe Montana’s a friend, and, you know, I like them, and I like, I like the whole organization, like, there’s a little classy bunch of people, and Barlow’s a great guy, and, you know, they’re all just really nice. So it’s nice to be in, you know, and a little bit on the inside there.
8Nestor Aparicio 19:24
Did you go to the game last year?
19:25
I did, sure did. But this year on looks like the road, you know, but I’m running a sound check. Nestor, so is there anything else you want to go? I’ll
Nestor Aparicio 19:36
see you Friday. Okay, it’s been
19:39
8good talking to you. And, you know, hopefully come back and say hello and introduce yourself.
Nestor Aparicio 19:43
I’ll probably be down for the sound check. You guys doing a sound check in Baltimore, we
19:46
do a sound check everywhere.
Nestor Aparicio 19:47
Well, I’ll probably see at five o’clock at hammer jacks on Friday. You’ll love hammer jacks. It’s really fun, the biggest club on the East Coast. Fun. See ya. Okay, man, bye. Bye. Fellow members of.
