For three decades Allen McCallum has been on our team as a baseball expert and Orioles historian. He joins Nestor to discuss the firing of Brandon Hyde, the running of Mike Elias and the lousy look and last-place situation of the Baltimore Orioles. And what comes next amidst the chaos for new owner David Rubenstein, who has big decisions coming for the future of Birdland.
Nestor Aparicio and Allen McCallum discuss the Baltimore Orioles’ recent struggles, including the firing of manager Brandon Hyde and the team’s poor performance. They highlight the team’s decline from winning 101 games in 2023 to 91 games last year, despite a strong start. McCallum criticizes the management’s decisions, such as trading key players like Kyle Stowers and Connor Norby, and the lack of bullpen depth. They also discuss the need for better leadership and accountability from ownership and management, and the importance of developing young players like Coby Mayo and Colton Cowser. The conversation ends with a call for better management and leadership to turn the team around.
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
Baltimore Orioles, Brandon Hyde, Mike Elias, pitching issues, bullpen problems, player injuries, leadership, ownership, rebuild, young talent, lineup creation, bullpen strategy, fan frustration, management accountability, team performance.
SPEAKERS
8
Nestor Aparicio, Allen McCallum
Nestor Aparicio 00:01
Welcome home. We are W, N, S, T, AM, 1570 tasks of Baltimore. We are Baltimore, positive it. It only feels like the end of times as Orioles fans, you know, I’ve been in Vegas for a couple days, and Luke and I have gone at it. And I will say this before I bring Alan McCallum on, those brewers home uniforms from the 80 today look really sharp, so I got that going on this week. I am still watching Orioles baseball. I did catch in when it was four to one, and then four to four, and then five to four out in Vegas at the Encore sports book as part of the Maryland party. Alan McCallum now joins me. He has been part of my party for about 30 years now, and the party feels like it’s over, at least in the near short term. And I know you have a lot of observations about this. You reached me over the weekend, after the firing on Saturday, and said, Let’s get together. I’m like, I’m in Vegas. We’ll get together. They’ll still be in last place when we get together in the middle of the week. And they are and now Elias has spoken before game two of the Milwaukee series on Tuesday night, good 72 hours after sacking his manager. I mean, what an amateur hour. And you know, I know you have some links to Rubenstein, but to me, this is top down, like, what are we doing here? What are we doing here? Yeah, look, I
Allen McCallum 01:27
haven’t heard what he said yet, but it’s, it’s, it’s mind boggling how we’ve arrived at this situation. And it’s not just that they won 101 games two years ago. They won 91 games last year, even with having an awful second half. And let’s remember, through June of last season, they were beating everybody. I mean, I remember they were going through the tough stretch in May, into June, where they beat the Yankees, the Phillies, everybody that they took on. They beat them, and it was hard not to believe in them. And at that point, Tyler Wells was out, and Kyle Bradish was out, and John means was never, I think he took the field for three starts. They had issues. They never had Felix Bautista, they had issues then, and granted. Jordan Westberg went down. They went through that stretch in August where Corbin burns couldn’t get anybody out. Adley rushman stopped hitting him. Governor Henderson went from an MVP candidate to just putting up good numbers. So a lot of things went wrong in the second half, but up through, through June of last year, they were as they were, arguably the best team in baseball, and like someone flipped a switch that ended, and I don’t know why that happened. I’m still trying to figure out everything that’s happened. Well, I’m
Nestor Aparicio 02:57
piecing it together right now, and I haven’t talked much about this at all. I talked to Luke very early in, you know, Sunday evening, after I’ve been a pool all day, and I’m mixing and mingling with dozens, I mean, like I probably had 50 people come up to me on Saturday and Sunday in Las Vegas at the Maryland party with 2000 people, lots of Realtors, lots of men, lots of older men, you know, in the business space, we’re all Oriole people entrenched in Baltimore. Hey, nasty listeners, you know all of that going on. And you know, for me in in marinating about it a little bit, it really feels like when the pitching went away. And I mean, burns wasn’t burns, Eflin wasn’t here yet. Bradish was injured, and that’s what sort of begat Eflin being here means was coming back. Bradish was coming back. Burns was maybe he’ll be here for five years. Maybe Uncle David will pay him before he gets a bobble head for himself. And that was so a year ago this week. I mean, I vividly remember my wife and I being at a yoga studio, and I had the Oriole game on in the car, and she’s like, you’re sitting in the car losing the Orioles. I’m like, Man, at this time they were probably, what, 15 games over 520, games, they were like, they were really good
804:18
this time last year. They were arguably the best team in
Nestor Aparicio 04:21
baseball, yeah, well, I mean, arguably the best team I’d ever seen for a couple of weeks because of the youth. And I know I had you on, I can go back and burn the tapes the way Trump’s burning books. But a year ago, this, this week, this month, I know I had you on and said, Oh my God, this this. It was Fred G Sanford, this is the big one, you know, you know, like, this is it. And it feels like when the pitching went askance, everything else went with it. Every part of the bullpen was never good enough last year, right? So the Kimbrell thing. Thing, and the Gibson not being back thing, and then not having an insurance policy beyond burns and and Rodriguez never really get in the post. Last really never get in the post. Yet he’s rocky Coppinger for me right now. You know his potential got Brandon Hyde fired. All of their potential got Brandon Hyde fired. Well,
Allen McCallum 05:20
let’s talk about Brandon Hyde. Look, I’ve been hearing, I’ve been watching, reading and seeing people belittle him for four years. I mean, they won 101 games, and I can’t remember how many times people were ripping on Brandon Hyde. Brandon had the best manager I’ve ever seen. No, is he? Was he the cause for this? No, here’s things that I would say, I hold him accountable for, rust, lineup, creation, a lot of people can argue about it. I They followed an analytical process. I’m sure he wasn’t the only one involved in that. It seemed very clear to me that he fought putting young guys at times in the lineup as much as the organization probably wanted him to. And here’s a reality, if you are in a rebuild, even after you win 101 games, and all you have coming are young guys. You got to kind of commit to the young guys. There are players testing. Curse dad is one of them. Coby Mayo is certainly one of them that you have to ask the question, were they ever going to get a chance to play if they were going to be here under Brandon Hyde in ideal situations, and if you’re not going to trade those guys away, you have to figure out what they are. So to some degree, I hold him accountable for that. I never thought he was particularly good in terms of managing a bullpen. Buck was one of the best I’ve ever seen with it. Davey Johnson was really good at it. But probably the thing that most eludes Major League managers is how to handle a bullpen. And I don’t think Brandon was particularly good at that. Of all the things this year, I don’t
Nestor Aparicio 07:09
8know that he had the greatest ingredients ever I understand, you know, and Batista for five minutes and and other than that, name, okay, other than that, you know, he did not have Andrew Miller and Zach Britton in his prime. He had Batista for five minutes. All that is not here to defend Brandon Hyde. I mean, I like I, I don’t, I don’t care about much of this, which is really the sad part, because people are coming up to me. I’m a little worn out, just in a general sense, worn out of all of it, and now the second time around, with Rubenstein making bobble heads for himself and now hiding. I mean, dude, dude, dude. I mean, come on, this is it. I’ve been at this 30 years. I’m six, seven owners deep in now. I’m just I’m not some jackass, frustrated fan. I’m somebody that is ashamed of all of this on their behalf, and ashamed that I pimped out to get stadiums built, stadiums renovated, and pined away for 19 years waiting for this guy to come along and and be the next guy that makes his own bobble head, makes commercials, runs around patting himself on the back, and when the team stinks, he’s out of gas.
08:26
Look I will see
Nestor Aparicio 08:29
on Friday having crab cakes at Cocos. I saw Brandon several times over the weekend, and I asked Brandon, did he talk about like the land or the building that? And it was just a getting to know you I don’t Brandon didn’t know him. You know, they were just out having a crab cake at Coco’s on Friday. It was all over marcella’s website. But, like, dude, have them have a little bit of awareness. And he hasn’t had any awareness of any of this. His Whistler, oh, you know all the crap that I’m dealing with now, I see all the beat writers are pissed because they were sitting around Saturday. They had to go out to Milwaukee to find the general manager who’s hiding turtling up.
09:12
I’m gonna get to michaelias in a second.
8Nestor Aparicio 09:15
I haven’t talked to anybody, so let me just all I’m doing right now. I’m breathing. I’m in a yoga yet, either. So God bless. Let
Allen McCallum 09:23
me just finish this about Brandon Hyde, you got the floor Alan, things I would say that that are worthy of his indictment for this year. It’s that this team came out of spring training, and clearly the fundamentals, they don’t look like a fundamentally sound team, uh, defense, thoughts while while playing the game, keeping your head in the game, all those things look like they’re missing. It’s one thing to have bad at bats. It’s one thing that to not be able to pitch. I think we all saw that a lot of these pitching issues coming, but this team doesn’t look like they have their head in the game. And I. Think you have to hold the manager accountable in that fashion. So for that reason, I would say, of all the things I would say, I hold Brandon Hyde accountable in this year for that. Mike Elias, I don’t think there’s anybody that would argue that the level of talent that he amassed wasn’t something that everybody cherished throughout the industry. People loved the drafts that he had and the young talent they had coming up. And obviously these guys are talented. Whether or not that’s going to come to fruition remains to be seen. The thing about Mike Elias, a manager in any position in any industry, seems to me the most important thing you can do as a manager is consider the worst case scenario. What happens if x, y and z happen? If all these things go wrong? What am I going to do? Probably lose
Nestor Aparicio 10:55
in the case of in professional sports, if so many things go wrong, especially within a smaller market, mean you don’t have the artillery, you don’t have the wherewithal for the Dodgers, okay, that they can make it through.
Allen McCallum 11:08
8So you mentioned the Dodgers. Mean the Dodgers bought more pitching than probably any team in the last decade, in this offseason after winning the World Series, and they’re still having is probably more pitching problems than most teams right now, which is an incredible statement about the state of pitching in baseball for michaelias to go into this season, having said at one point in the winter that we’re in on everybody. When Corbin burns and Max freed were still on the were still out there, and having gotten essentially no one except a Japanese pitcher who, to his credit, doing fairly well, and a 41 year old guy who’s been a number four innings eater for a good team in the National League, and one reliever In his 30s, is incredibly questionable, given the fact that you knew the guy that you’re expecting to be your top pitcher was it wasn’t going to be back till maybe August, if that same thing with Tyler wells they lost John. Means, it seems to me that he expects everything that to be to end up in its best case scenario when he does things I sort of get the Gary Sanchez thing because he didn’t want to bring back James McCann, because they’ve got this kid, busayo coming up. You want to create a space for them. Sanchez is a guy you can get rid of in a short period of time. Tyler O’Neill, a guy who hits left handed pitching historically. You say I don’t want to spend the money on Santander because you think he’s going to have diminishing returns. And I’ve got these young outfielders who I believe are going to be great players. I sort of see that. But the reality is, you don’t know anything about those guys. You don’t know whether those players are going to be what you think they’re going to be to spend the money they spend on Tyler O’Neill, who is who is good when he puts up good number, when he puts up when he’s healthy enough to put up numbers, but is always injured. And be surprised that he’s always that he’s injured for the second time in this season, is short sighted to me, to believe that Gary Sanchez, who was a strikeout waiting to happen, is going to be successful in a situation where he’s going to play once a week, doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. There are to think that Charlie Morton isn’t going to age at 4241 42 playing Camden Yards as you bring the fences back in is feels short sighted. To me. It feels like he looks at every scenario in front of him and he thinks the best outcome is the outcome that will happen. And to me, as a manager of any type, that is the poorest approach for which for you to to commit your activity. And I think of all the things with Mike Elias, notwithstanding, not standing in front of some people and saying, you know, talk, ask me questions when you fire your manager, that is the thing that is that he is worthy of the most indictment over you have to they had a spectacular lead on other teams in the American League East two years ago, and they have squandered that, just looking at the fact that the only team over 500 in the American League right now is the Yankees. And as much as they have Aaron judge and spent a lot of money, they’re not that. They’re not world beaters. They can be beaten. And to be in this situation with the Orioles right now, knowing everything that we see with this division, and how even with the injuries and West West is a huge loss, and not having Tyler O’Neill is something that you can you can sort of. Extrapolate what kind of numbers long term he would have to impact this team with all the pitching injuries, even if they got some modicum of effort that was close to what you would expect, they should be maybe five or six games under 500 at worse, and to be where they are right now is speaks to a dramatic level of issue with what’s going on inside this organization, and key number one is figuring out what that is right now. Well,
Nestor Aparicio 15:30
it starts with ownership at this point, right we’ve already fired the manager. Everybody’s already firing the general manager. Then they’re going to have to replace the whole baseball operations while Katie Griggs sits over there and holds a bag open for all those mass and sign ups that they’re not going to get right so financially, and they’re going to say, well, we’re not making money, and this isn’t good, and they’re taking their $600 million of our money that we’re giving them. And I let Craig Thompson from the Maryland stadium authority know about that in Las Vegas over the weekend, much of the chagrin of his partner. I just, I look at this the whole thing. I mean, you’re talking about management, management, management. I’m talking about ownership, leadership, leadership. And the thing we haven’t even talked about is pitching, pitching, pitching, hitting, inning, hitting, hitting, catching, catching, catching, running, running, running, running, and strategy and just how abysmal the players have been, absolutely whatever players they’ve paid brought in too old, too young, Japanese, it doesn’t matter where they’re from, like the players they’ve put on the field have failed miserably, outside of Cedric Mullins for Five minutes, and Ryan O’Hearn, I guess. I mean, Jackson holiday lately. The
Allen McCallum 16:45
question is, why did that from a team, from the team that had many of these same players in June of 24 I don’t
Nestor Aparicio 16:53
know how you played that on the hitting coach, dude. I mean, I don’t or or that there’s some philosophy within the thing that they were banging on trash cans two years ago, and they’re not anymore, or something, you know, like, philosophically, these are all very good players who had approaches at the plate, who had a system, or in this system. They all have a growth mindset. They all have been taught the Oriole way, the midell Elias way of analyzing tape, how we’re going to do pitching. Had the same manager, same leadership, same everything. And all the video equipment, all the stuff that they have, spin rate, you know, just all of that they still have access to, all of that. How can Adley ruchman Be regressing, not progressing? It
8Allen McCallum 17:36
certainly begs the question, Is there too much information? Are there too many voices? And I, you know, I’m not in the rooms. I don’t know how to how to quantify that. It certainly would be something that I would interrogate and investigate right now. Well, they don’t
Nestor Aparicio 17:49
want men like you and men like me in those locker rooms right now asking questions. And that’s part of the problem, that there is no accountability for any of this. The general manager in for 72 hours, and you’re here 15 minutes into this, still talking about leadership. Well, I mean dude, right. I mean, my dude, it doesn’t matter even what he says. After 72 hours, I got the message. The message is really, really clear, and whatever you say, even in contrition, is make believe, fabricated, you know, certainly staged in the middle of Milwaukee. I mean, it’s just been gross dude. It’s been very Angelo seeing, you know what? I mean, it’s been very fail, fail, fail, fail, fail, from Rubenstein and the clowns around him, the Whistler and Mark fine, all of them, Jennifer, who whatever her name is, I’ve never met. He’s refused to shake my hand. I like all of those people, the arrogance that they drip with the the made for television. I’m going to buy everybody beer at the bar over it across the street on opening day last year. And my kids are going to run the hot dog races. We’re going to take the seller back to New York, and when the team’s in last place, who me? No, I mean, I don’t see, I don’t see the cameras on Michael aragheti and David Rubenstein. I’ll see you behind home plate tonight Milwaukee. I mean, like, Dude, it’s gross. It’s gross.
Allen McCallum 19:17
It’s hard to evaluate where David Rubenstein is in this he’s had the team for a year.
Nestor Aparicio 19:23
8Elias, he’s gonna have to be the guy that hires next guy, is my point. And he doesn’t know his arm. I
Allen McCallum 19:30
mean, I don’t do any of us know what Elias had to work with financially. I mean, was, I doubt if the answer was, spend whatever you want, but he’s supposed to spend nothing. I can’t imagine that it was spend nothing. And even so again, we talked about this the last time I was on you have I am 100% on board with draft bats, because the percentage. Of hitters coming along is much higher than starting pitching or pitchers in general, but you have to go get pitching to think you don’t have to is foolish, and you can’t play all of your players because you can only field nine guys at one time. So you have to trade some and move some to get what you need well,
Nestor Aparicio 20:21
and when you do well, and the trap, the Rogers just a mess. I mean that that you said they have to go get pitching. They went and got effling. They went and got burns. They went and got, um, Rogers all in the same they went and got Kimberly last year, right? You know, they went and got guys. They did. They really did.
Allen McCallum 20:37
They got Bradish and they got Coulomb. That’s great, but you have to. You can never say, Okay, we’re done.
8Nestor Aparicio 20:47
You can never say, clarity would teach you that, right? And so would Fuji two years ago too. You can’t
Allen McCallum 20:53
be in a situation where you say, where you give Stowers and Norby away for a guy who you who’s essentially uh, not so different from COVID Again, because you think that you can fix him, why trade two guys like that for a guy that needs to be fixed? He has waited too long to trade some of these guys while simultaneously not giving the players that he expects to go to war with opportunities to prove themselves. I know they’re still saying, Hey, we can get back into this thing, but Kobe Mayo needs to be up here right now today, playing every day to find out what he is. Cursed. Dad needs to play every day to find out what he is, so that in 26 if you believe, hey, we can’t fire the players, and that’s the reality. You can fire the manager, you can fire the general manager. You can’t fire the owner. You can’t fire the players, because they can’t go back through another rebuild. And you have to believe that the majority of these guys have the talent they believed they had, and they need to be worked into whatever they’re going to be, not necessarily MVPs, all, all of them, but hopefully one or two and other players, good, solid players around them, where they can win with. They probably need to spend some money on some veterans to support that, who have won at a position or two. But they need to. They need to. They can’t go back into 26 this, this the rest of this summer and the winter of 2526 has to be about getting enough pitching to support that, and knowing what you’re going to go to war with as you start the season from an offensive and defensive standpoint. And if the guys that they have right now aren’t going to aren’t going to work out, then you need to make other accommodations for them, ultimately, and they need, they need to be making those plans right now that I know they have to sell to the fans. We’re still going to try to, going to try to win this year, because, as you said, they’re still trying to sell subscriptions to a streaming service, and they want people to come out and they can say, hey, the majority of this division is under 500 we still have a chance. I understand they have to say that, but now they have to be thinking about, how do we get back to this in 26 because we still have the foundation of young players, offensive players. Theoretically, we should have Bradish back. I don’t know how you could ever count on Grayson Rodriguez to stay healthy, but you have to say we’ve got Bradish and Rodriguez and Tyler wells. Theoretically, we need to go we need to strengthen the bullpen, which they never did. I think they need to get away from this, this history, this period in baseball where you put eight short relievers who throw 100 miles an hour for one inning and one inning only in the bullpen and say, Let’s go while simultaneously having a starting rotation that only goes five innings every night. If that that’s a formula, it doesn’t make sense. If you have a rotation that you know is going to gas themselves after five innings, you have to have two or three long relievers in your bullpen to help you get through literally every night of the season, because you can’t. It’s hard to have short relievers. Have to cover four innings every night and still stay, still, stay healthy and sound. The idea that everybody’s going to pitch to their top ability out of a bullpen every night is foolish. It’s a foolish thought that has been built around this sabermetrics idea of baseball. And
Nestor Aparicio 24:30
you’re also always going to be using more bullpen than you are using starter in a general sense. So the bullpen, as we get deeper into baseball, you know, arms start falling off even more starters going four innings and 80 pitches and 90 pitches is going to be enough for anybody that just is going to mean more bullpen. And you know, the bullpen was back in my day, Alan, they would say he’s in the bullpen because he’s a failed starter, right?
Allen McCallum 25:00
8Yeah, he only throws two pitches. He can give me some lengths, but he can only go through a lot. Arthur Rhodes, right? Arthur Rhodes is the perfect example of this situation, a guy who had great stuff and failed as a starter. And I remember when Davey Johnson came up, came in and he saw how good Rhodes was out of the bullpen. He said, I just need to know Rhodes was a guy who, when he was young enough, at his best, could go once through a lineup, so theoretically, could cover three innings and then later a short reliever and get people out. And after that, he was done, because he would have for whatever reason. And that works in today’s game, but you can’t have eight guys who only throw one inning. You’re going to wear them out. So I think philosophy has to be addressed. They certainly have to give up some of what they have to get pitching, or they need to spend the money. There’s just, there is no way around that if you’re not going to draft pitching. And again, I don’t have a problem with that, but you have to support your team with pitching, quality pitching. I said to you last time we spoke, there’s no reason on earth that Garrett crochet should not be a member of the Baltimore Orioles right now, none, none. And even after that. I mean, there were guys Quintana, I know, with the Brewers just went down with an injury, but he was there late into the into the off season, and they never took a sniff on this guy or other people. And when they brought Kyle Gibson, never had a chance. He never had a chance. They signed him at the very end of spring training, rushed him through a spring training in the minor leagues, and he wasn’t ready is, can he pitch anymore? I have no idea. The numbers from last season would say that. It’s shocking what’s happened to him, but this was a guy that’s a very serviceable pitcher, never great, who, as is the case with all pitching, has a routine, and we saw it with Jordan Montgomery and others last season that signed late, not having a full spring training, not having your regular routine can really cost a veteran pitcher A lot going into the season. It feels to me like this team was set up to fail because management did not foresee the worst possible, worst case scenario, and expected everything to go well. And when you do that, nothing, nothing tends to go well. It’s hard for me to say how much David Rubenstein is responsible for this, because we don’t know what kind of owner he truly is yet. Yeah, the bobblehead thing was just, it’s that was just a complete and total misfire. It’s great to be the the king of the stands when everything’s going well, but you have to show up. When you really have to show up is when things go are going poorly, that that even leadership
Nestor Aparicio 27:55
is, yeah, that’s, there’s that I don’t think, I think David Rubens a wealthy man. I don’t think he’s a leader of men,
Allen McCallum 28:02
it remains to be seen, but the early returns leave you or leave you wanting to ask
Nestor Aparicio 28:08
he’s a 75 year old man. I don’t see any signs of stepping in front of this when the heat gets hot, and because the heat’s hot, the heat’s real hot right now. Alan McCallum is our guest. I am Nestor. I am freshly backed from the pool, sipping champagne by the pool, actually, just talking baseball the whole time. And I’ve been waiting to talk to Alan Al has been waiting to talk to me. So I’ve been arguing with Luke a lot. You know, last couple we’re not arguing just back and forth. It’s just been so depressing for both of us. And you know, I was saying it’s the pitching, he was saying it’s the hitting through all of this. Now the owner said it’s the manager, or did the owner do it? Or the general manager do it? Or, you know, is this which way is the wind blowing? Tony Manziel is a better manager today than Brandon. I was four days. I don’t and then who’s going to save them? Rick Dempsey, you know, Bill Ripken, Ryan Flaherty, I and Luke has the smartest take on this, and you’ve annihilated the pitching and and rightfully so, because I’m on your side of the argument. But let me give you the Luke side of the argument is, they got to get ruchman Right. They got to get westburg back and make sure he’s right. They got to get cows are back. They have to get their core players, yeah, who are still 20 something and under contract and working on the cheap, that this time next year, those guys need to be the blossomed version of wherever Jackson holiday looks like. He’s headed at least a better trajectory. It’s just been so much regression amongst, you know, blue chip players and injury, you know, an injury. And I’ll throw Rodriguez in on the pitching side of being like, hey dude, he’s supposed to be your 20 game winner. And he had, you know, he’s a horse that had been to the course. And then you got westburg, you got cows, or you start taking those guys away. You told me that on Christmas Day, I tell you, they probably be scuffling, even if Kyle Gibson. Figured it out halfway and had a five era and and to your point, you know, if Gibson had a five era and Morton had a five and a half era, and they hit the ball a little bit, they won some games eight to six,
8Allen McCallum 30:12
they’d be eight games under 500 instead of 15 or 16. Look, you’re saying, I’m saying it’s a pitching I’m saying it’s everything the offense has under has underachieved to a level that is truly mind boggling. I think again, part of it is that in analytical 21st Century baseball, they tell you that lineups don’t they tell you that war is an independent thing for each player, and I believe that a good lineup feeds off of itself. So if you put all of your good players in the number one and number two spot, and nobody has an opportunity to benefit. Juan Soto is one of the richest players in the history of sports right now. He’s a good player, but it’s not like he was a world beater for the years prior to him coming to the Yankees, Aaron judge should be getting a significant amount percentage of his salary for the next 15 years, because hitting in front of Aaron judge was the best thing that ever happened to him. It’s not that he’s not a good player, it’s not that he’s not a great hitter, but hitting in front of a player that makes pitchers have to throw to you matters. So without Anthony Santander, who I understand is not having a great season to start in Toronto, there’s nobody in the middle of the lineup that makes this lineup make any sense, even the best, Ryan O’Hearn, who’s have who started off having a great season, and Cedric Mullins were the guys who were carrying this team when gunner was out and Jordan never got right, and they slowed down a little bit, and that’s why they’re in this, this losing streak that they’re currently in, instead of losing two out of three games every time. But those guys, those are the complimentary players they’re not meant to hit fourth and fifth in this in a lineup like this all the time, they’re the guys if Cedric’s either a leadoff hitter or he’s batting six or seven, same thing with Ryan O’Hearn, and they’re expecting the guys you’re expecting to get that out of I mean, Gunner, I give gunner a little bit of a pass, because he was hurt, and you can see sort of working his way back. Westbrook’s out, but I said to you last time we spoke that one of the best things that happens that Colton cows are who I don’t really trust, because I think he’s a strikeout machine. So far gives Heston cursed out of a they had to play. Heston cursed dad. And so far, he hasn’t worked out to be the player that we were. That
Nestor Aparicio 32:38
stinks. Mel Castle stinks and Mullins has been good, though, right? I mean, given another opportunity, Mullins, you know, I scuffled the last couple of years and a lot of injuries, and we’ve talked about all that, reported himself well, at least in April, at least early going, but
Allen McCallum 32:54
he had a he had a three week scuffle. Other Other than that, he’s been solid through the whole season. Ryan Ahern has been good. Look, Ryan hears issues, and he doesn’t have a position. You can’t tell me we don’t want to have Anthony Santander because we think he’s going to strike out more as he gets older, and he’s his defense is going to be bad. And then routinely put Ryan O’Hearn out in right field and tell me that’s okay. You just can’t, you can’t put Tyler Neil, and he’s healthy in right field, and have short porch right field at Camden Yards, and put Heston kerstad, who was a questionable glove out in left field on a regular basis.
Nestor Aparicio 33:29
8And say that makes sense running around center field at some point. Well,
Allen McCallum 33:34
certainly not in Kansas City, which is one of the toughest center fields to play. If you’re going to have O’Neill and cursed in the same outfield you’ve got to put O’Neill and left at Camden Yards and cursed dead in right? It’s the only thing that makes sense. So from a from a roster usage creation and lineup creation standpoint, this team has a lot of issues, largely because that you can’t tell me that they understood what the middle of lineup was. This lineup was going to look like, and the middle of lineups, whether baseball analysts want to acknowledge it or not, make a difference in the sport. Not having a good number three, number four hitter behind your top two guys, means you’re not going to drive in any they’re great. They’re on base. If they don’t hit a home run, are you going to drive men? I don’t know, and we’re seeing some of that with this team. But beyond that, there are, there’s something. Two years ago, this team had great success with with two outs coming from behind. There was a mentality and a strength there. And I know that doesn’t always stay from year to year, but see this, so
Nestor Aparicio 34:44
we have a name for that here in Baltimore. It’s called Oriole magic. Well,
Allen McCallum 34:47
sure, and that is going, and, yes, the Adley rutschman thing, I’ve
8Nestor Aparicio 34:55
never seen anything like the Richmond thing, like I’m going back to Jim Fuller and EARL WILLIAMS. Williams and drunko Hayes would and Ken Gerhard and Craig worling, all of these guys that were, Ryan Pickering, you know, like all these guys, and you’ll put leaders in there. I’ll throw any of those guys in. I even Ben McDonald was a one, one, just from a pitching perspective, to give a little bit of a clarity to this. I just I it’s one thing to not to be Brian Taylor and never get there. You know, it’s one thing to be any pick, any of the ones, other than maybe Jeffrey Hammonds. For about 20 years, 25 years here, the guys didn’t make it his first round picks. And this is when the guy’s blossoming, and from the minute he shows up, the team starts winning, and then it all stops, and he can’t find himself in any way
Allen McCallum 35:51
when he stops. I mean, it all stopped when he stopped, correct? And let me be let me be clear about this. And I’m before he was drafted, after he came up, when they were winning, I said to you, he’s, he’s, he’s done everything you could ask him to do, but I would never draft a catcher number one, the toll on the body, the impact on your back, the expectation, and this is part of it that he’s going to play every single day, if he’s going to if he doesn’t catch, he’s going to DH too that’s too much for a catcher, too much for a young catcher, too much for a veteran catcher. Is that part of this? I don’t know, but that’s too much to expect from a guy who’s a one, one who you need to anchor your team. That’s the reason why I wouldn’t draft a catcher number one. And the toll on the body is going is, clearly, there’s something mental going on, but I have to assume that there’s a toll on his body that’s being taken that that we just can’t see,
Nestor Aparicio 36:58
and he doesn’t want to talk, right? So
Allen McCallum 37:00
8the reality is, until he shows himself to be at Lee rutchman Again, you can’t bat him. Second, you can’t bat him. Third, you can’t bat him. Fourth, he’s got to go somewhere else in the lineup so that somebody else has a chance to emerge in those spots,
Nestor Aparicio 37:16
or, as my dad would say, till he can get straightened out, until he gets his head on right,
Allen McCallum 37:21
and that they continue to put him in that position, not only hurts him, but it hurts the rest of the team, because there’s nobody after, theoretically, Gunner Henderson and Jackson holiday as he slowly begins to emerge that scares you in the lineup. That doesn’t mean they can’t be productive, and this is a team that clearly is going to need to pass the baton, particularly until you can get a Jordan Westberg back, and hopefully you can get 90 games out of Tyler O’Neill, where he looks like the title Tyler O’Neill, who hit 31 home runs last season and has been productive. Or you bring someone, or Sam biso comes up and shows himself to be the guy that they are touting him as Colton cowser comes back and emerges. One of the one of the most disappointing things about this is that so many of these players were college guys who were on base machines who had great at bats, who walked or hit doubles or what have you. There’s been a lot more strike out as these guys that come up to the big leagues that I don’t think anybody anticipated, particularly management, and that can be overcome to some degree, as long as you’re getting some production out of them. It’s all happening
Nestor Aparicio 38:42
with runners in scoring position. The lob thing is, it’s, it’s astonishing, even in the games where they are being productive from a hit standpoint, on base, plating runners, clutch hitting, situational hitting, um,
8Allen McCallum 39:00
sports psychologist really, really badly. Where’s the psychologist from Ted lasso when you need when you need her, right? But, yeah, there’s clearly there. There are things that this team needs to figure out and figure out in a hurry. And whether it’s psychological or these guys are, have never had this kind of adversity. Whatever it is, you know, they can’t jettison Adley Russia at this point in his career. They just can’t. All right, let’s, let’s
Nestor Aparicio 39:30
talk at a higher level on the Rubenstein thing and the Elias thing, because that’s really the big story here, other than getting hurt players back that are young and having them perform whether Rodriguez is ever going to pitch again, like all of these things, radish later this summer, all the things that they talk about, the leadership part and the getting it right part, you and I never had to have a conversation again about that. After about 2001 2002 there was. No hope. There was no thought that these people know what they were doing. Any success Bucha Walter, Dan Ducat McPhail would have would be in spite of ownership, not because of a great ownership, you know, and actually the worst ownership I can possibly imagine. And then there’s this, and I don’t know what this is, but I’m judging it, and I I’m judging it from the inside of the outside, because I know plenty of people on the inside who talk to me still to this day, especially when times get bad and they want to tell me what’s really going on. So that happens all these years later, because I’m me, and I was in a pool with 2000 mover and shakers in Vegas couple days ago, and had people connect. People connected, telling me stuff, um, because they’re all connected the notion that Elias is the wrong guy, right? I mean, you, you’ve been hard. You’ve been hard on Mike. Elias Allen, so have I. So is everyone right? If David’s going to be hard on him, I don’t know that. David rubicide knows enough about baseball to knows enough about baseball to have a grown up conversation about baseball. Really the kind of conversation you and I’ve had your last 45 minutes. David Rubenstein has no he’s just not a baseball guy. I mean, I know enough to know enough. I’ve heard him speak about how little he knows about baseball. So the decision then to hire the next hack Gillick, I’m throwing a name out. Dave Dombrowski, whoever it would be. Um, this is where Peter really failed everything in trying to purport himself. Well, we’re gonna make Bobby Bonilla, D, H, er, and we’ll think Chris widger. I mean, this is the owner saying this stuff drunk out at the barn in 1995 I’m not looking for Rubenstein to be that guy, but I know enough to know that whatever he says doesn’t even add up to make any sense, because you and I have forgotten more about baseball than David Rubenstein knows that’s a fact. That’s just yeah, that’s baseline, and so I don’t know where we go from that when he has surrounded himself with the Whistler and Katie Griggs and I, who Mark fine, who came from the circus out the PB, PBR, and whatever, like, like, who, who’s going to hire the baseball person around there, who’s going to be the baseball leader around there? Because this was 18 months ago he buys the team, or 14 months ago. Gosh, it hadn’t been that long. 18 months ago, Peter was alive and John was still learning the team to Nashville. 15 months ago, he gets involved in this. He’s got a baseball guy, he’s got a manager, he’s got all this young talent, he’s got arms, he’s got money now he spent the money. Guy ain’t got poop. You don’t have a manager. Got a dangling general manager who’s been hiding for 72 hours from what’s left of the media. He’s hiding as the owner the other owners, I shook hands with that that I gave that, that fishy handshake to that aragheti guy. I haven’t heard from him since, but they all are money bags, and they all want to be out in front of it and get their picture taken and say they’re the owners and have the jerseys and do the the first press conference doing this, patting themselves up in the back. Um, this really is a question about leadership. It always was Alan and all the fighting you and I’ve ever talked about, I know you work at a very high level, and you understand what Trump’s doing to the country of Rubenstein could do to a baseball team, what Angelo’s did to the Orioles, and also what good leadership can do for any organization. And I don’t know I I’m not sensing this is good leadership, just in a general sense of we’re going to AX hide. He didn’t even buy the groceries. He didn’t buy any of the pitching. He didn’t do any of that. We’re going to get rid of him. He won 91 games last year, 101 Manager of the Year. We’re gonna get rid of him. It’s his fault, or we need a different voice. That’s what Elias said on Tuesday. We just it was time for a different voice. Oh, really. Okay, he was your voice in spring training when you’re supposed to win 90 games six weeks ago. He’s also the voice that sends Charlie Morton out the post, who’s not a major league pitcher, as well as Chase McDermott and Povich, who’s figured it out, trying to figure it. But these guys are not they’re not part of a team that’s going to win 101 games. Nestor,
Allen McCallum 44:10
you know, as well as I do, that firing the manager is a typical baseball move when you have nothing else you when you don’t know what else to do, correct? That’s what you do, right? And let’s be clear, was it six years ago, you and I talked about michaelias, sigma doll, like there. These were the guys to get, young guys, smart guys who had who had sigma doll in particular, who had rebuilt the Houston Astros. These were the guys you wanted. And to their credit, they won 83 games in 22 when they had no business doing it. They won 101 games with this team in 23 so it’s hard to say they haven’t done it. And let me be clear about this, as hard as I’ve been on michaelias, all these people that talk about. And you know, they need to win more games in the postseason, and it’s complete and utter failure. There has never been a time in this sport when it has been harder to advance in the postseason. I’m going to say that a second time. It has never been harder in this sport to advance because there are more teams, there are shorter rounds, at least to start, and all you have to have is two bad days. That’s all you have to have. So to think I’m going to trade everything I’ve tried to build, I’ve, I have built a way so that I have maybe a chance to win one more game in the postseason, is short sighted to me. That doesn’t mean that you can’t do things to prepare a team for the postseason. That doesn’t mean that you can’t look at your roster and say, I don’t have enough pitching. That doesn’t mean you can’t look at your roster and say, You know what, there are big gaping holes in the middle of my lineup that teams can exploit. And if I don’t think my young guys are ready yet, and they shouldn’t think their young guys are ready yet beyond Richmond and Henderson, because they just haven’t played enough at the major league level, maybe I need to fill that with a guy who’s going to be healthy enough to be productive. Those are things as a manager you can look at and say, I need to do this better. I need to be. I need to fill this team with better depth. Those are things you can do. Don’t blame him for losing two games in a row, two Octobers in a row. I don’t know how you can do that, but
Nestor Aparicio 46:32
8just say, blame Brandon high for the fact they didn’t hit the ball in October period. Yeah,
Allen McCallum 46:37
but I don’t, but I also, but I also hold him accountable for saying Trevor Rogers is the right guy to give away Kyle Stowers and Connor nor before that, those are that’s a question to not go out and say. What do I do to get Garrett crochet when the Red Sox didn’t even give up their their top talent, and they don’t, in theory, didn’t have as much top talent as the Orioles did, to get him. Those are things you can hold him accountable for, because building that kind of depth during the season, for the season will put you in a better position to be ready in October, knowing that you have to give Adley Richmond days off during the course of a season he can’t DH every day he doesn’t play behind the plate will will make him healthier and better for the post for October. Those are pieces that you have to think about and count on when you draft a catcher. One, one. Those are realities. So Mike Elias was, I believe he was the right guy. I still think he has a lot to learn about being a general manager of a major league baseball club, and I we know what kind of leadership he started out with under the Angelo’s family. I think it’s unfair and too early to label David Rubenstein as a failure of as an owner. I certainly say he’s, he has, he does not have enough experience as an owner to maybe lead this team at this moment, and he’s done some questionable things, but from top, what you are absolutely right about is from top to bottom, from the 26th man on the roster to the owner of the team, a whole lot of people need to do some soul searching about Why they are where they are at this moment, um, because what that
Nestor Aparicio 48:23
means to their growth and what that means to the city, and what that means to their stadium, and what that means to their fan base, and what that means
Allen McCallum 48:32
streaming services being people tuning them completely out,
8Nestor Aparicio 48:35
because it’s harder than ever to Get them to tune back in. And, you know, they built up a little bit of momentum here the last, you know, 24 months that they something was brewing for the city to get involved, for people to get involved. And it’s, as I said to Luke back in 88 it was all cute when they were oh and 15, as Phil Jackman told me. But once they’re, you know, 12 and 41 it’s not cute anymore. And we and this thing jumped the shark. Fast, fast, fast.
Allen McCallum 49:05
And let’s, let’s be clear, while 2025 is over and it’s clearly over, whether they want you to acknowledge that or not, 2026 is not over. But if you don’t prepare, start preparing for it today. It could be over by July. Oh,
Nestor Aparicio 49:24
here, here’s where, by the way, Alan McCallum is here. Here’s where the rubber meets the road on that. Because you went through this with Duquette. Right. Duquette was charged with giving away all the players at the end, when he wasn’t going to keep his job. Mike Elias, and you know, as Luke said, it would be baseball suicide to fire. Mike Elias couple of weeks before a draft, right? But all that being said now you’re going to let him pick the players. He alluded to this on the on the steps in Milwaukee on Tuesday, in regard to, you know, I need to do what’s best in the best interest of the Orioles every single day, I’m going to do what’s in the best interest of the Orioles, Oreos, or he and trader SIG. Are going to figure out every Mullins can know, piece by piece, Sugano wherever they can deal guys off to get another Colton cows or another bag of beans or another Connor Norby, or get Stowers back, or do whatever they’re going to do. They are going to clean house here before August 1 they’re gonna have to they’re back to rebuilding, uh, whatever they have left, and saying, what’s the value of these tradable commodities to bring other talent in here, even if it’s just a guy who becomes a relief pitcher, that’s the next Brian Baker, who can give us some innings, give us some sixth inning depth next year, or find the next Albert Suarez, I don’t know, but like they the activities that are going to happen here during the summer are going to be measurable, and they’re going to be made by Mike Elias in the near short term future. But I don’t even know that that’s good if you really think he’s not your guy, and if you’re David Rubenstein, you don’t know enough to know whether he’s your guy or not. And that’s really, that’s the part that scares me the most, because I’ve seen the act here out of the gate, Alan, I’m not impressed. I’m just not impressed about any sort of it.
Allen McCallum 51:16
8I’m talking about as much as Michael ice was the guy, what, six or seven years ago, and I think we all believed that I had, I had a boss who ran a department who really liked projects. That’s what he was good at, planning a project. But in terms of leading people and taking helping people excel to the next level, that wasn’t his strength, didn’t mean he wasn’t a good employee, but he wasn’t good at leading. Mike Elias looks like guys really likes a project, and the Orioles have been a great project. And as much as I don’t believe that you make every like Dave Dombrowski, you make every move to win one extra game in October, you want to build a team from top to bottom. That makes sense. And one of the most interesting things I’ve ever heard about the postseason and winning is a veteran who said teams win when veterans play like rookies and rookies play like veterans, it means young guys are wiser and smarter than their years, and veterans find that extra gear during a season to stay healthy and and play well and and both piece both elements help each other with energy, with enthusiasm, with days off. What have you. Michaelia doesn’t seem like he’s figured that part out yet that there are two elements on a team besides offense, pitching, but sort of veteran, a mix of veterans and young guys that help each other along. If his, if what he’s, what he really enjoys most, is the project, then he should be a farm system guy or a draft specialist, and let the general let somebody else be the general manager. Because you do have to understand that that mix exists, and that leadership is not just about putting it’s not just about drafting the pieces. You have to put the pieces of the puzzle together to make them make sense. And there were a lot of things about this team that didn’t make sense coming out of spring training. And I think I said to you when we spoke last The thing about the way they came out of spring training was that he was banking on everything needed having to go right, and it needed to go right, and it hasn’t. And now it’s, it is not just even knock on. It’s just flat out collapsed. They’ve collapsed, and this team, whatever that
Nestor Aparicio 53:48
collapses, usually cost that guy his job. Yeah, anywhere else. It wasn’t new ownership that there. And I’m not saying that it should be here and now, as the Brewers just did another two run home run. I don’t, I don’t know it should be here and now, but you are allowing him to make another season’s worth of picks, to deal away all this talent in the summer, to do his job. And if you’re going to fire him on October the fourth anyway, because they’re going to go 6890, whatever, right? I mean, that’s what they’re going to do. They’re going to win 73 games, if they’re lucky, if they if they get if they catch fire, they’re going to win in the 70s at this point, with the pitching they have and the fact that they’re going to tear it apart. Then that being said, cows are might come back. Westbrook might come back. They might hit it a 300 clip. Holiday may have an incredible second half and show himself to be an MVP caliber player that a lot of people believe he can be, right, and maybe Richmond and Henderson will figure it out by the end, by September, they got Bradish back, and they they go, you know, 18 and seven in in September, or something like that, and you can vibe that out, but they’re going to be a different team at the. End of this year, based on this and based on how many movable Ryan o’hern mount, Castle, Mullins, pitchers, pieces, that this thing is going to be decimated by the end of July, and then the young guys are going to have to go do it. Look,
Allen McCallum 55:14
Gunner I mean, Richmond’s have been awful. Gunners been okay. I mean, he was hurt. He’s been okay. The analysts refer them as aircraft carriers. And from the for the first three months of 24 gunner Henderson looked like an aircraft carrier. And the thing that nobody wants to talk about is that Anthony Santander, maybe not from April to September, but for three months of every year he’s an aircraft carrier because he hits 3530 to 35 home runs. Last year, he had 44 and can carry a team for a week at a time. And I
Nestor Aparicio 55:49
really want a light guy and a good clubhouse guy too. Not not Nelson Cruz, but a half level below that.
8Allen McCallum 55:55
And don’t think that doesn’t matter. They missed. Always matters. They missed that and that presence in the middle of lineup that makes pitchers saying hey, and
Nestor Aparicio 56:04
by the way, they gave Stowers away. He was one of their buddies. All of them love Stowers. He was one of their guys. They gave him away and didn’t and they haven’t seen this guy pitch so that you gave away, my dude, he’s you got home runs in Miami. Even he didn’t have the home runs in Miami, there was still a little bit of you’re giving them away for a guy who who can’t help you, you know, and that’s the real case against Elias. Is clarity, Fuji, off season, signings, all of that, not he identified Corbin burns as being good, that that seems to be easy enough, right? I’m
Allen McCallum 56:36
not going to tell you I spent a ton of time watching minor league baseball, because I haven’t, not in the last couple of years. But what I everything that I heard about Jordan westburg Is that Westberg is a gamer. You know all about the game. He’s been hurt. Connor Norby, grit guy, everything. He just a gritty player that that fights for every piece. And the thing about Stowers that you heard all through the minor leagues, like he’s the guy that drives in the runs. He’s the RBI guy, and cows are great hitter, Gunner Henderson, superstar. You heard that stuff
Nestor Aparicio 57:14
8that’s gonna hit 30 on runs in the big league. So it’s Kobe mayo. We haven’t brought Kobe mayo. I mean, all of these names are like Paul buny around chat and Camden this and barstool idiots and orange fabrication magic society club. I mean, all of these guys are going to the hall. They’re all Jeffrey Hammonds and Alex Ochoa and Jim Fuller and drunko Hayes wood and Ken Gerhard. But these kids don’t know, and they’re, they’re all of that Craig Worthington until they become Cal Ripken and on a bad day, they might become Nick Mark ACUs or Matt weiders, who are pretty good ball players. That’s pretty good but, but that if gunner Henderson turns out to be Nick Marques, that just won’t be good enough here,
Allen McCallum 57:59
not by itself, maybe not by
Nestor Aparicio 58:01
itself. You’re not going to buy one Soto. I know that if donor Henderson
Allen McCallum 58:05
turns out to be Nick Marques and Jackson holiday turns out to be gunner Henderson, Henderson, then maybe that’s okay, right, right. But if, if Sam bisail comes up and ends up being what Ali ruchman, what they want them to be maybe, maybe that’s okay, but, but we don’t know what Kobe Mayo is, because he hasn’t had a chance to play. I know he’s not a good third baseman, and I know right now castles disappear. They’re flying the missing man formation from Ryan mountcastle. So when you’re in this situation and you need to find out what you got right now, maybe Kobe Mayo should be up here playing first base so we can figure out what the heck he
8Nestor Aparicio 58:43
is, Castle. He’s like Dave Kingman without the home runs right now. I mean literally.
Allen McCallum 58:48
I do know that Connor Norby was a great player. I know that Jordan Westberg was a great player. And I think this team is missing some guys with who, who, who’s to get in the dirt and and fight to the to the last last bit pitching there at bats. And I think that matters. You got anything
Nestor Aparicio 59:06
else? I mean, we’ve been at this a while. I mean, you and I could do 10 minutes and turn it into an hour anytime. Al McCallum is here. He hit me on Saturday. He’s pissed. I’m pissed. We’re all pissed. We’re all question this. We’re all want to, like, just talk and vomit. Everybody vomited all over me in Vegas or at the pool at the Maryland party. What do you think we like? They scapegoated the manager. It’s as old as baseball, right? And it didn’t change anything. And it’s not going to change anything. And to our point, the thing that’s going to change things are the players need to play better, and the management needs the management better, and the leadership needs the leadership better. And none of that’s happening right now, and I’m questioning all of it as everyone else has been. I mean, all of you were far more reactionary in the off season about the pitching than I was. I was much more wait and see, wait and see. I feel like an idiot for not being a bigger jerk, and I keep saying to Luke, Luke, I’m supposed to be the prick around. You’re not you. I mean, Luke’s on fire. Luke’s lost his mind about this. And I know every Oriole fan has as well. I’ve, you know, the beat writers are all up in arms and calling out Elias and calling at everybody. I just don’t know where the where this is going to be three, four years from now, with Rubenstein and whomever the baseball operations person is going to be whomever the manager is going to be. You might be three baseball operations. He might be George Steinbrenner. Before this is all over with, I have no idea. Mike Elias may put his resignation in a week from Monday. I mean, I have no idea what’s going on behind the scenes. I know this. The owner doesn’t know what he’s doing. The general manager might not know what he’s doing. I know
Allen McCallum 1:00:43
8the one thing that I mean, I can you can look at this season and analyze what’s gone wrong, the one thing that, the part that that is constantly scratching at the back of my brain, is that this team, through June of 24 was one of the best teams in baseball, coming off 101 win season, and like they flipped a switch, like the moment the Orioles went bad, the Detroit Tigers got good and stayed good, like they flipped a switch, it went away. And I’m trying to figure out what that
Nestor Aparicio 1:01:22
is. Well, this is the Yogi Bear for you, dude, once you think you’ve seen everything in baseball, here you go.
Allen McCallum 1:01:29
Here you go. It scratches up my brain, in a way I can’t quite describe, one big fat
Nestor Aparicio 1:01:34
manure ball. Is what this has been for all of us, a manure burger. Alan McCallum is here, you know, you’ll come back, right? We’re not done talking baseball. It’s only been 30 years, you and me, right? I think
8Allen McCallum 1:01:45
this is the first time I’ve said to you, like, I want to come on and talk ever Yeah. And I felt like I had some things to say, maybe, maybe other people have said them, but I
Nestor Aparicio 1:01:57
need to get a collar here and be in am I? Am I your, you know, am I the person you’ve come to to try to soothe you a little bit, and my father
Allen McCallum 1:02:06
confessional? Now, what? I’m certainly not a person that you know crushed Brandon Hyde on any given basis, or michaelias, for that matter, or even the owners, but, you can look at everything and say, Man, there’s stuff missing everywhere, and everyone needs to be accountable. And you talk about leadership, and the way, maybe the most important element of leadership is accountability and integrity. Integrity, absolutely and wisdom. Gotta have wisdom. Gotta have some wisdom. And I have to say I didn’t. I’m not sure I heard enough of that from the players either
Nestor Aparicio 1:02:44
8confidence, competence and confidence, confidence, competence, let’s keep going on the you and I could play. Told Tony Robbins game here, what makes a good leader, but all of the above. And when you fire your manager on Saturday, your last place, and everybody hides for days at a time, I learned so much more about players and teams and sports when, when they lose, everybody’s a great winner, everybody. And that goes to the Ravens. And, you know, I’ll drop the mic on this with you Allen and say the big winner in all of this, Justin Tucker in the Baltimore Ravens whole you know, the conversation just moved away from Royal farms fried chicken and Justin Tucker to how are we going to fix the Orioles now and the Ravens couldn’t be any happier. Chad still. Thanks. You.
Allen McCallum 1:03:30
My first full year with you. In 96 the Orioles had Kent mercker, and Kent mercker was a guy who was supposed to be a star with the Atlanta Braves. It didn’t really work out. And he, I mean, they won that year, but he was bad. And to his credit, he was at his locker every time after a game, without fail, except one time, and it was sort of right before you got dropped in the rotation. And he left a piece of paper on his on his chair, those like didn’t have good stuff. I’m doing the best I can. Three I suck. I suck. I suck. You know, like even, even in the moment that he wasn’t there, he was acknowledging his own accountability for what was going on. And I’m still waiting
Nestor Aparicio 1:04:13
for Mark Andrews. I keep seeing his USAA commercial, but I haven’t seen any accountability after the I mean, literally, still is not really spoken on walking away from the podium in Buffalo after dropping with the season line, like, if your organization is going to tolerate that, you’re going to get Justin Tucker, you know, you’re going to get Chad stealing John our ball. And if your organization is going to tolerate we’re going to fire the manager on Saturday, and everybody’s going to answer for it, except for ownership and leadership. Boy, you suck, you suck, you suck. In the words of,
Allen McCallum 1:04:45
it’s time. It’s time for a lot of people in this organization to step up. I don’t think
8Nestor Aparicio 1:04:49
that’s No. I mean, that was Saturday. Was the time to step up. I don’t, I don’t think, you know, like the stepping up part for the players, fine. I mean, they’re all playing for their livelihoods. But I know we’re. With the owner. I realized that we’ll see who comes in. Adam McCallum is here. I He’s there. He’s everywhere. Um, you know, I’d say, Let’s get go to a ball game or something. Let’s go to a concert, you and me, man, let’s go see Simple Minds or something in a couple
1:05:13
weeks. Rethink, huh? I’m all in. All
Nestor Aparicio 1:05:16
right. All alive and kicking.
1:05:19
8Yeah. Sing it to you. Love babe.
Nestor Aparicio 1:05:21
Yeah, there you go. Let’s go. Let’s go. You turn me on. All right. I am Nestor. He’s Allen. We are wnst. Am 1570 Towson, Baltimore, the Orioles will still be in last place, and we’ll probably still be here talking about at least, I hope so. Yeah.
