After a 24-2 beat down in his latest start, Luke Jones and Nestor wonder what happens next for Charlie Morton and the Baltimore Orioles’ beleaguered starting rotation with the season teetering in the wrong direction (already). Bad times in Birdland and no answers for the injured and American League’s worst rotation. Up next: the Washington Nationals.
Nestor Aparicio and Luke Jones discussed the Orioles’ disastrous 24-2 loss and Charlie Morton’s poor performance, with an ERA over 10. They criticized the team’s pitching strategy, highlighting the high costs of short-term signings like Morton and Kimbrel. They questioned the management’s ability to build a sustainable winning team, noting the lack of long-term planning and effective player development. The conversation also touched on the broader issues of team performance, including the young core’s inconsistency and the impact of injuries. They emphasized the need for significant changes in both management and player performance to improve the team’s prospects.
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
Orioles starting pitching, Charlie Morton, WrestleMania, baseball season, football draft, LLS event, press box, religious holidays, NFL draft, pitching philosophy, young core, player performance, bullpen, injuries.
SPEAKERS
Nestor Aparicio, Speaker 1, Luke Jones
8
Nestor Aparicio 00:00
Music. Welcome home. We are W, N, S, T, am 1570 Towson, Baltimore. We call it Baltimore positive. You can find us ad in podcast Landia. We’re out on the video channels, the socials, and of course, at am 1570 here in Baltimore, please set a spot on your dial. As we get through baseball season. We’re going to get through this football draft this week. Luke Jones going to join us now. We’re going to be on Wednesday, doing a really nice turn for LLS over Coopers north, one of my favorite places. Uh, Terry the the manager there two time leukemia survivor. Uh, we’re going to talk to him. We’re going to have Nick Schultz come out and join us. Bill Cole is going to be there. My buddy Pete ramondi is going to be with us Wednesday. It’s all brought to you by our friends at the Maryland lottery. I swear I have Back to the Future. I have my scratch offs beginning of the week. If the Orioles couldn’t get themselves together on Sunday, why should I own Monday morning? Back to the Future is the the way to do it. I’ll be giving these out. Had a lucky little batch last week as we spent some time at Beaumont with Chad weaseling and John Allen. It was a mix of strange mix of rock and roll, football, baseball and tariffs. We did it all last week. You’ll be hearing that here. Luca Orioles had a game on Easter I you know, I know you’re with your nieces, and you’re worshiping, and you’re the deacon at your church and all that. And then you thought, I’m going to get the family together. We’ll have Easter baseball today. Whoa, boy, it’d be a little while washing that one out, won’t it? Yeah,
Luke Jones 01:27
it’s funny. I was kind of wondering, what was I going to say and and then I watched night two of WrestleMania, and the main event of that was a dumpster compared to how epic it was a year ago. So I figured out, well, my lead so WrestleMania was a thumbs down too. The main event was, it absolutely was. But so I figured out my lead statement is, I’m not sure what was worse, the Orioles losing 24 to two, or whatever the heck that main event was for night two of WrestleMania. But we’ll stick to the more popular subject on these airwaves. No, no, no. Who wrestled? It was John it was John Cena against Cody Rhodes. Cody Rhodes, last year, won the title. It was this epic multi year story that had been told with Roman Reigns and the bloodline, and they had all these different run ins of wrestlers, you know, from the undertaker to John Cena and all these different guys. It you’re see this, this reference won’t make any won’t have any meaning for you because you’re not a Marvel Cinematic Universe guy like The Avengers and end game and all that, which was so huge over the last 15 years, where last year felt like Avengers end game as it pertains to the WWE Universe. And last night, they had John Cena win his 17th world title, which was fine, except seven weeks ago, you had him turn heel, and it looked like it was going to be this epic, very much layered kind of story. And
Nestor Aparicio 02:54
it wasn’t right the scripts, that’s what they needed. It wasn’t they hired Kevin again. I’ll
Luke Jones 02:59
8leave you with this, Travis Scott. I don’t know if you’ve heard of him. He’s a famous rapper, you know, famous music act.
Nestor Aparicio 03:06
He was in Houston tonight, all hell broke, yes, yeah,
Luke Jones 03:09
but they had him come down and interfere on John cena’s behalf. No other wrestler, no other so not my cup of tea was they, they’ve lost they’ve lost the ball. They kind of lost me. Yeah. I mean, it’s one of those deals where all I saw
Nestor Aparicio 03:24
about the WrestleMania over the weekend, just so everybody knows, because I don’t really want to talk about this baseball game, but we will pleasant to talk about. I have a dear Katie Griggs letter coming this week that Katie’s going to want to read and Mark fine and the Whistler. All of them are going to want to read it as we were unrepresented in the press box on Sunday because you were worshiping. Is sec, second biggest holiday, maybe the first in the Christian religion on Sunday, and Stadium was empty, and our, our press box seat was empty for the third time that week. So I’m, I’m getting, I’m getting a little nap the holidays over, religious holidays over, it’s time for me to get we have the real religious holiday of NFL draft coming this Thursday as well. But the wrestling thing for me, it came to me on my timeline in only one way, and this is this speaks to politics in the country and sports, and why nothing lacrosse ever shows up on my timeline. My timeline gives me what I want, right? So WrestleMania happen, right? And, you know, I’m a Dusty Rhodes guy, so, like, last year might have been some Dustin Rhodes. And because you goof around on our Facebook and our YouTube, clicking on things, all sorts of wrestling stuff shows up. I have more Bob Backlund and Ken Patera and Ivan put on my YouTube than I think I should have. But the only thing they posted on my entire timeline about WrestleMania was Vernon Reid and living color. Look in my eyes. What do you see? So I’m like, Yeah, living colors playing at WrestleMania, right? Yeah, that was Saturday night. Yeah, they, they, well, cult of personality is CM Punk, who was in WWE for years, left in 2014 on. Of terrible terms. You know, there are lawsuits, all kinds of bitter feelings. For the better, better part of close to a decade, he came back well, the McMahons escaped. They’re now running education in America. So yes, but he came back in November of 23
8Luke Jones 05:16
however, he got hurt at the Royal Rumble last year, and that kept him out of WrestleMania. So this was cm punk’s First WrestleMania that he had taken part in since 2013 but yeah, they played live. That was cool. I mean, the rest of the card wasn’t terrible for me. It wasn’t like the great, greatest ever, or anything like that, but it was fine. The main event was just a colossal miss for me, especially on the heels of how great last year was.
Nestor Aparicio 05:39
Well, wrestling never takes a month off, but baseball does when you lose 24 to two.
Luke Jones 05:43
Well, yeah, and that’s where we can’t delay, uh, talking about it any further. I mean, full disclosure, as you know. I mean, I had family over. I had 17 people miles family and some friends from church and things of that nature, or people of that nature. So I had it on in the background, and it was one of those deals where I looked at, you know, first inning Charlie Morton, okay, good. You know, scoreless first inning. And then every time I’d look up, there was traffic on the bases, and then he was not even getting out of the third innings. So, I mean, disastrous, embarrassing. There’s no sugar coating that whatsoever. The guy has an era over 10. They’re not going to cut them right now. I don’t really know what the alternative is. I mean, they, you know, Brandon young made his major league debut on Saturday. It wasn’t good, wasn’t it wasn’t so awful that he didn’t give them a chance to stay in the game, and they won the game. I mean, kind of a reverse lock scenario. After I was singing the praises of hunter green, they got to him pretty, pretty good. But, I mean, that was just so below the bar. I mean, it’s awful. Charlie Morton’s either washed up or so lost right now that you’ve, I mean, I don’t know how you I know how they do and they probably will. But I don’t know how you have a make his next start. That’s how horrendous he’s been. I don’t know how you don’t at least try to pivot to skipping him, putting him in the bullpen for a week. I don’t know. And again, what are the alternatives? Right? I mean,
Nestor Aparicio 07:16
8in the Norfolk the pitch and he doesn’t, right?
Luke Jones 07:19
He’s Yeah, so, I mean, maybe we see the Baldo Jimenez pothole scenario, but again, who? Who, right? I mean that, but it’s so bad that this isn’t a pitcher with a five and a half era where you say, Well, you could replace he’s been that horrendous. And guys like me can try to keep diving deeper and looking at the, you know that the curveball that I taught you, I talked about that last week, but what we saw on Sunday, I mean, there’s nothing competitive about that. He’s not commanding his pitches and he’s getting hit. This is a reds lineup that’s not, this isn’t the Yankees. Yeah, this is, let’s,
Nestor Aparicio 07:57
let’s talk about the philosophy of this, because it is NFL draft week this week, and give everyone Ozzy Newsome philosophy on football players better to get rid of them a year too early than a year too late. You know the lace Campbell a couple of years ago, whether you know any of the departing 30 something free agents who wanted to continue to play Ed Reed being one of them, right, who wanted to go elsewhere and do their thing now, Joe Flacco still got work, right? Yeah, you know, but I, but I would say the notion that the Orioles in this modern era are going to have to sign one year pictures and take their chances on guys who might not have as much as they used to have signing guys for a lot of money that you know can’t possibly be as good as you remember them being same thing with Joe Flacco, that the Brown signed him. They don’t think they’re getting 2012 Joe Flacco. They know that, right? And knowing that you’ve already lowered your bar, you’ve already said the really good Charlie Morton, we can’t afford him. So, you know, he’s sort of like vintage wine. It’s going a little bad, but, you know, we won’t really tell the guests, but it used to be $100 bottle of wine, but we got it for 20 bucks, even though it’s undrinkable, we’re still gonna, you know, instead of just buying a $20 bottle of wine, I don’t understand their philosophy on Kimbrel, and I would go back to the bigger picture of your philosophy, which is, hey, Blackjack guy, Sig says, Don’t bet on pitchers. Don’t bet on young pitchers. Don’t bet on development pitchers. We need here and now for pitching. And use all of our Tarik cards, our draft picks, on bats, bats that can get to the big leagues, bats that are five tool, have a have a little speed. Don’t care where they play. We’ll, we’ll give them a glove. You know, we could. We could turn Mateo into a center fielder, and that spin their philosophy. And then you need pitching, and when you need pitching, it’s, well, let’s go deal the second baseman in the outfield. There aren’t really any. And we’ll deal them down to Florida, and we’ll get something, we’ll get a picture, and, you know, a guy we could put in a rotation, and then Mister Money Bags will come along with money. Now, I don’t know that Elias ever knew that a Money Bags was coming along because he was in business with the Angelos family, and that was a whole different way to run the place than whatever this is, I don’t know what this is. I mean, I haven’t had a chance to talk to the owner about it. I’ll be talking to his president this week, whether she talks to me or not. So philosophically. Kimbrel Chicano, Morton Gibson, the one year signings. This isn’t a cheap way to do business. It really isn’t to spend $20 million a year on a pitcher that can’t pitch. That’s, that’s not a cheat. That’s, they’re really not saving money.
Luke Jones 10:46
I mean, they’re saving money in the sense that you’re not locking in a long term commitments. You know, in the scenario that you have a pitcher who has a 41 year old pitcher, what, right? I mean, it’s one thing to say, Oh, we’re going to sign Charlie Morton to a $4 million deal, and if he’s awful six weeks into the season, Kyle
8Nestor Aparicio 11:08
Gibson, we’re waiting on him. I mean, think too, right? It’s about that time for him, sure. I mean, he’s certainly not going to look like Grayson Rodriguez in his prime. You know, no, no, but
Luke Jones 11:19
you’re right. I mean, from the standpoint of, you can talk all you want about the whole notion, and you hear this across sports. You hear this in multiple sports. There’s no such there’s no such thing as a bad one year contract, right? How many times have you heard that over the years? But that’s not true. I mean, Charlie Morton’s making $15 million this isn’t five. He’s making real money now, it’s not real money that’s going to cripple cripples, the wrong word is going to really hamstring your payroll in the way that you know the Chris Davis deal did, for example, or the way that the Rangers you know, if Jacob deGrom never comes back from Tommy John surgery and looks the same. And obviously he’s back this year. But, I mean, it’s just, you look at that the last two years alone, two signings, Craig Kimbrel, $13 million for the bullpen, and $15 million for Charlie Morton. I mean, that’s $28 million I know that’s not spread out over. You know, you’re not talking $28 million over the next four years, or something crazy like that for a pitcher, but that’s real money that looks like you’re just completely flushed down the drain the last two years. I mean, at least Kimbrel was good for half a season. Ish, you know? I mean, he had his, he had his slip up in late May and or late April and early May, but he at least gave them a half of mostly competent pitching. I mean, Morton,
Nestor Aparicio 12:57
you are hoping Morton could give you Suarez kind of production, right? At
Luke Jones 13:02
8a minimum, sure, because you paid $17 million
Nestor Aparicio 13:05
for us. You signed, you know, an international signing, of a veteran guy that you invited the camp, right? I mean, there was no, there was no downside to that whatsoever, other than some space crazy you got some rookie pitcher making nothing, and you’re expecting him to do this, and you pay some guy $17 million and you’re expecting him to do that, it just, it’s all out of whack. I mean, and especially they work together. I’ve run offices where people make different amounts of money, and heard all about it. You know, it’s a whole different thing. When the guy’s making $17 million can’t get anybody out like I don’t that never went well. That never smelled well, even if the guy was a good guy, I go back to Glenn Davis. That’s how far back I go to when somebody’s making a lot of money and not being productive. It’s it’s all out of whack in baseball. I haven’t had a locker room pass in 20 years, so I don’t know, but there is a workplace thing where it’s like, my god, they wasted all that money on that guy, and I’m making nothing, and I’m going out there and doing it, there’s a lot of that in baseball. There really just isn’t this seems like such wasted money. It’s, you know, as frugal as they want to be, and as limited as their payroll is, and as limited as their money is, and I’ll be pointing that out to Katie Griggs this week. This is tough to swallow, in the same way that the Kimbrel thing last year, before we knew about Mr. Rubenstein and his money, and like all of that, just was a lot of money to spend on a relief pitcher last year, that was like cautionary tale, that it’s the most money the franchise has ever spent on a relief pitcher anyone, and he didn’t even make it to the Fourth of July, really. Oh
Luke Jones 14:38
no. I mean, he made it into the second half of the second half of the season. He didn’t make it through the season,
Nestor Aparicio 14:42
though, but, I mean, by the end of May, you were like, he can’t be our closer. No, it wasn’t that
8Luke Jones 14:46
early. I mean, because he had gotten back on track. I mean, it was, it was the second half. I mean, he had his bad stretch in late April and early May, and then he was good, pretty, pretty darn good until early July, and then. It fell apart. We’re
Nestor Aparicio 15:00
waiting for pretty darn good the Morton, and I don’t know, they haven’t even gotten that show that he’s pretty darn good. They haven’t
Luke Jones 15:05
gotten that. But you know something you said, I don’t think it’s just baseball. I mean, the Ravens dealt with something very similar to this. I mean, Marcus Williams had the third highest cap number on the team this past year, and yet the formally undrafted, making somewhere around the league minimum. Our Darius Washington was the guy who had to replace him, and played quite well. And what did he get rewarded with this off season? Oh, you got a restricted free agent tender, which look, he’ll end up getting a decent contract. I get, I suppose, at some point. But, you know,
Nestor Aparicio 15:36
8it’s your point. You’re paying a guy 17 million the kids in there playing well enough he played that well, you’d say, okay, you know, we pay a little bit too much money. The guy on the field, there’s productivity, and it’s plus productivity, not minus productivity. The
Luke Jones 15:51
point that you’re making, though, whether it’s baseball, whether it’s football, whatever the sport may be, if you have a high price player, and look, Charlie Morton is not a high price pitcher in the way that Corbin Burns is, or in the way that you think of Garrett Cole or some of the very best, of the best in baseball, the highest paid in baseball, but he is relatively high paid, certainly compared to the rest of the Orioles, right? And, you know, again, $15 million that’s not nothing either, right there. There’s a middle ground here where we acknowledge, okay, it’s not a long term deal. It’s not going to be something that hamstrings your payroll over the next four or five years, if it doesn’t work out, but it’s still $15 million that’s not nothing, right? To your point, Albert Suarez was making nothing last year, and was at for a bulk, a large portion of the season, was arguably their second best starting pitcher. So it’s just, it’s an absolute disaster. It’s an absolute disaster because of, you know, the runs leaving, because of Grayson Rodriguez, now wondering if he’s even going to pitch in 2025, I mean, there’s nothing official, but I don’t need to tell you when someone shut down then, because they had some kind of an elbow issue, even if it wasn’t pertaining to the UCL ligament itself. And now you’re saying he has shoulder issues. There’s something wrong with his arm. There’s something wrong with that, whatever that chain is, right? You know that that chain of the body parts and muscles and structure and all that, there’s something wrong here, whether it’s going to lead to a serious surgery or whether it’s just he’s going to have to be shut down for an extended period of time, and maybe he’ll have a chance to pitch in August, maybe not. Who knows. It’s bad. So right off the bat, there, you lost your ace from last year. You look like you’ve lost your ace, or the guy that you’re hoping to be your ace in 2025 Eflin is on the shelf, even though it sounds like it’s not a overly serious lad issue. But I don’t think his return is just imminent, meaning like he’s returning later this week. That’s not happening. So that said, that said, this is where I come to the point where we need to start looking at this differently in terms of everything that’s happening right now. It’s one thing to have the second half that the Orioles had last year. And want to give Mike Elias a pass. Want to give Brandon Hyde a pass. Want to give the coaching staff a pass, and also, yes, wanting to give the players a pass. Because let’s not completely like this. Young core isn’t made of 21 year olds exclusively, like Jackson holidays 21 rest of these guys have been around a little bit at this point in time when you’re in your third and fourth season. In the beginning, exactly, exactly. So all of that. When I see what happens on Sunday, it’s feeling more and more like it’s time to start putting everyone on notice. Like this is below the bar. This is unacceptable. And look like Elias did a phenomenal job building this thing to the point where it was in 2023 when, clearly, they became not just a contender, but they had the best record in the American League that year. But getting them to that point, and then knowing how to get them over the hump, I don’t know if Mike Elias has the the ability to do that. And look, the payroll is part of that, and ownership is part of that. And you know, I’m not, this isn’t me saying fire him the third week of April, but at the same time, I don’t who deserves a free pass at this point in time, Brandon Hyde and his coaching staff look people talk about the lineups, and you know, who’s who’s playing against which pitcher. What about the sloppiness that we continue to see. What about some of the Little League s defense that we’ve seen at times? You know, we saw it Friday night, you know, in another game that wasn’t 24 to two, but was ugly when you had a 40 plus 1000 people at the ballpark and you played a pretty listless brand of baseball. And that’s probably the nicest way I could characterize. Their performance on Friday night. So at some point in time, you look at this thing and say, Michael is doesn’t what has he done to earn a lifetime pass? What has Brandon Hyde done to earn a lifetime pass? What have these young players done to be absolved from criticism, right? It’s go time. I mean this, this is not a good baseball team right now, I can’t figure out if it’s closer to mediocre or just playing bad.
Nestor Aparicio 20:25
Well, it’s not going to be a good baseball team based on the pitching that I and that’s the thing, right? I mean, it can’t be good with this pitching. It can’t be this bad, right? And this is where I go, okay? I mean, you’re gonna go the other way. No, no, no. I lose five out of seven every week with this pitching. I mean, you know, I mean you’re you misunderstand
Luke Jones 20:43
what when I say it can’t be this bad, meaning it is not acceptable for be it to be this bad, regardless of the fact that Zach Eflin and Grayson Rodriguez are not in the rotation. You have three other guys in the rotation who were projected to be in the rotation. You can’t have far and away the absolute worst starter era in baseball, other than you’re comparing notes with the Rockies, who aren’t even trying to win right now, you’re getting
8Nestor Aparicio 21:08
that kind of pitching to your point, you’re there’s no way you could be a 500 team. Sure if it’s bad pitching, you can’t do it’s not going to be
Luke Jones 21:17
any better than this. And yeah, it’s hard for, you know, as much as I’ve been hard on the hitting, I don’t mean it on a day when you give up 24 runs and you have two position players pitching, dude,
Nestor Aparicio 21:27
they’re gonna lose games 10 to eight. You know what? I mean, they’re gonna score eight runs and lose games they are. I mean,
Luke Jones 21:36
8my point through all of that, when we were kind of sparring over that, over the first three weeks of the season was you need to at least make that an option for me, right? Like the offense has to at least show me that. Then fine, then I will blame the pitching. But if you’re only scoring two runs, and Sunday is a bad example, right? I mean, you know not that they swung the bats worth anything on Sunday, but, yeah, you can’t have these games where, if you lose five to four, or if you lose four to three, then, yeah, I am going to blame the offense, because only given up three or four or five runs for this pitching staff at this point is a win the hitters last week, when the pitching was good enough, right? They just look and this is where I keep going back to at some point in time, like, Michael is, this is an Ozzie Newsome who’s won multiple Super Bowls. Brandon Hyde hasn’t won, you know, he’s not a World Series winning manager. Like, yeah, what a playoff game, dude. So and again, obviously, I’m talking about management there. But the same goes for these players. I mean, at some point in time, like you got to perform. And, you know, the young core doesn’t deserve a free pass. What have they done to deserve a free pass? And so this is, I mean, this is bad this is bad baseball. Very bad baseball. I mean, you know, it’s the captain obvious statement. On the heels of a 24 to two game that, I mean, you’re starting to wonder if they’re going to approach the 30 to three from 2007 you know, the day that trembly got his extension as manager. But, I mean, but the Charlie Morton thing, and I like to think that I’ve tried to be measured in how I’ve talked about this, but Brandon Hyde talked about it on Saturday after they won on Saturday and and obviously it was a grind getting through 27 outs, because, you know, Brandon young, he competed, but, I mean, this isn’t a pro. This is not even a real pitching prospect. He’s minor league inventory. He’s one of the better pitching prospects they have, which is part of the problem with this organizational philosophy that, okay, you can keep drafting backs bats, but if you’re pitching, is this terrible? What good is it going to do? But he gave them a chance, at the very least, like it, they were in the game, and they were able to win the ball game, but Brandon Hyde talked about it in the post game. He kind of, you know, not in a combative way, but in an encouraging way. He kind of said, Hey, Charlie Morton, we need him on Sunday to give us length. We need him to give us innings. Our bullpen had to work really hard the last couple nights. Yeah, we’re asking a guy, we’re paying $17 million to the 20 year veteran to step up, right? You know, a guy, a guy making $15 million and he couldn’t even get out of the third inning. I mean, he walked four guys in two and a third innings. I mean, it’s, it’s to say it’s below the bar. I mean, there is no bar at this point for Charlie Morton. I mean, that’s how horrendous he’s been. I mean, he has an era that’s almost 11. There hasn’t been a start yet where you can really, I mean, the closest you would come to would be he the afternoon start he made against the Red Sox when he struck out 10, but he gave up those two, two run Homers. I mean, gave up what, four or five runs in that outing, if that’s the high water mark, oh my goodness. I mean, well, and
Nestor Aparicio 24:55
should not, came out, made it look, you know, legitimate last week. You know, we’re looking forward to him getting the ball. Always say, well, at least, you know, pretty nice job. I mean, I’m trying to figure out where the hope is, because I don’t think the hope is in Charlie Morton. I think we beat him up all day. But I, you know, I don’t think he’s capable. I mean, he might just get, he just might be completely washed. I mean, it might be that simple. I mean, look, I don’t care if you’re 4131 or 21 you can’t have a 10.89
Luke Jones 25:19
era, five starts in the season and not have people asking questions about whether you should be keeping your job or not. I mean, that’s just, that’s not being mean, that’s reality and and he’d be the first to
Nestor Aparicio 25:31
tell you, in a season, you know, it’s one thing for the 2018
8Luke Jones 25:35
Orioles. This is a whole different place. This is franchise. This is Dan strailey. Like pitching. I mean, I actually made the joke. I saw the I saw the jersey in the crowd during this home stand. There was someone that was sporting a Dan strailey Orioles jersey. And, okay, it’s not Dan strailey level, because, by the way, go back and look at those numbers, man. It’s, it’s still, I think a lot of Orioles fans blocked that out. It was 2019 they had no chance. They weren’t trying to win anyway, but, but this is, this is awful. He’s been absolutely horrendous. And I don’t other than that Boston game, like I said, where he struck out 10, he’s not missing bats. I mean, in his other starts, he’s, he has 11 strikeouts total. So, like, you can’t even look at that and say, Oh well, the peripherals don’t look as bad. I mean, he’s been a disaster. You know, even from a metric standpoint, his fielding into fielding independent pitching at FIP. You know, anyone that’s in the sabermetrics, oh, here we go. Here he goes, no doubt, but I’m telling you, it’s a peripheral. It’s, it’s something that kind of tries to measure someone’s stuff, and it tries to be predictive, knowing that batted ball luck can be very unlucky, or you can be very fortunate with batted ball luck. We’ve also seen starts where a pitcher goes six innings and gives up one run yet loud contact throughout the outing, and you say, man, his defense really backed him up. Man, he was really fortunate. But BIP measures, it takes out all the batted ball scenarios, so it evaluates a pitcher based on basically strikeouts, walks, hit by pitch, and it kind of gives you a number that contact pitch, yeah, okay, it’s supposed to basically give you a number that replicates era to try to be predictive. Well, if you’re trying to be more positive, Charlie Morton’s FIP is better, you want to know what it is, 6.47 I mean, that’s not you know what I mean. So there’s nothing to point to right now with him that is encouraging. I can keep talking until I’m blue in the face about, well, this guy’s lost his curveball. His curveball used to be elite. I mean, this is a 10.89 pitcher right now. And I assume, I assume, because the options are very are so limited, I assume he’s probably going to make the next start. But I don’t know how, I don’t know how
Speaker 1 28:02
you can do that. Well, then who are you going to put in for that? And that’s the problem.
Luke Jones 28:07
But that said, that’s you. You saying that is completely valid, and I agree 100% however, there’s too much of that going on right now with with this organization. It is really easy to look at something and say it’s bad, or look at something and say it’s it’s leaving you wanting, but you can also point to something else, and I feel like and I don’t, I’m not saying it’s deliberate. I’m not calling people out in terms of, you know, that anyone’s, you know, overly complacent, or anything like that. But, you know, good’s been good enough around here, yeah, but, but there. But there’s also a certain element to everything that’s going on where you can point it’s very easy to point to something else, right? If you’re Mike Elias, you well, you know, look at our injuries. If you’re Brandon Hyde, look at our injuries. Or are you seeing who we’re starting, you know, every five days. You know, for the hitters, well, are you seeing the pitching, even, but even the pitchers? Well, Luke, you know, Luke from WSD, was pointing out how bad that, how bad the hitting was, or how inconsistent the hitting was. The defense has been not good. There’s just a lot of not good going on right now and again. This doesn’t mean fire everyone on april 21 you know, but there are plenty of people that are calling for things of that nature right now, and believe me, this fan base has every right to be frustrated. They sat through a lot five years of terrible baseball, and we’re talking about, okay, they made the playoffs the last two years. That’s great. That’s not the end that’s not the end game, that’s not the high water mark. So for them to have to see the kind of backslide that we’ve seen since the second half of last year, fans have every right to be ticked off right now. So problem is, I don’t really know. What the solution is at the moment, you know, I mean, if this team loses, loses, you know, stays on the pace they’re on right now, which is right around a 9091, lost pace. I think it is off the top of my head, Brandon, I could lose his job at some point. Of the way, you could argue should lose his job at some point. However, that doesn’t mean that you just fire Brandon Hyde and replace them with whoever. And everything’s fine. They’ve got issues all over the place here. And
Nestor Aparicio 30:26
8well, Brandon, I would say, who bought the groceries? Dog, sure, sure, no question
Luke Jones 30:30
So, but, but we also know, you know, you can’t fire all the players or, or, yeah. I mean, you can fire the general manager. But again, my overall prevailing point here is, we’re very much entering a territory where everyone needs to be put on notice that this is unacceptable what we’re seeing now. Yeah, I get it. The pitcher injuries have, it’s really stunk, and they’ve had some bad fortune in that way. However, you still have three fifths of your starting rotation that you went into spring training expecting to be your starting rotation. It shouldn’t be this bad. It shouldn’t be this bad. Bottom 10 in the league, below average. Yeah. What did you really expect? Right? But when you’re talking about something that is the absolute worst of the worst in Major League Baseball, I’m sorry, two pitcher injuries should not lead to that. Yeah, meaning for the rotation, and I get it, some of their depth pieces are unavailable
Nestor Aparicio 31:25
as well. Well, they, you know, basketball, when they have five players this year, right? Like you only have so much depth with pitching, so you just like two starting pitchers should, shouldn’t rock their world. Well, they’re thin enough that it has, right? And they’re thin enough that they had to go out and spend $17 million on a Japanese guy that had never pitched in the big leagues, and crossed their fingers, which is pretty good right now, it’s okay, but they they knew all along, and they knew before the season began. No, Brad, no, you know none of that was coming back, that this was the best they could do. And and listen, I defended it. All of you hated it. I was trying to kiss all their asses to get my press pass back, honestly, but you never liked any of this. Dave shining didn’t like it. Messina McCallum, all of my baseball guys were like, This isn’t good enough. 4041 year old pitchers and 35 year old Japanese guys and remnant Kyle is their best
Luke Jones 32:22
picture right now. Though, that what that? And what’s crazy about that? I mean, you just mentioned Sagano. He’s one of the, might be the only guy, maybe Kramer, that I have any hope in right now. I mean, that’s as far as guys that are available. So I again, what do you expect? In terms of no one’s expecting this to be good, the way it looks right now, but it can’t be 6.11 starter era, worst in baseball, worst in the Rockies, worse than the Miami Marlins, horrendous. If it were bottom 10, I’d say, yeah. What do you what do you expect? They got a hit, and they need their bullpen to be going. Their bullpen has been good, although I’m starting to, you know, at some point, Don the bullpen is just going to completely wear out, you know, because, I mean, this is not tenable. It’s one thing to talk about a not so good era, but you’re not getting out of the third inning the way. I’m
8Nestor Aparicio 33:16
not convinced the bullpens any good either. You know, they’ve at
Luke Jones 33:19
least performed at a much higher level, is my point. The bullpen statistically has performed well.
Nestor Aparicio 33:25
That always feels fleeting, though, by the way, with bullpen, you know what I mean, there’s good they’re going to be bad spots for the bullpen. We just have an as
Luke Jones 33:31
8it is, I’m not but, but my point is, they have been a positive contributor in wins this year, whereas the starting pitching, save for effluents three starts. What we saw from Sagano, you know, Sagano, for the most part. I mean, even, even his other starts that weren’t that great, he’s been competitive. You know, we haven’t seen him give up seven runs in a in an outing, right? Uh, Kramer this last time out. But man, when you talk about these other guys, you know what you’re getting from from Morton. I mean, Kate povidge was bad on Friday night. I mean, okay, Kyle Gibson’s going to be joining the fold. You know, he pitched Sunday. His pitch count. I expect the next turn through, he’s going to be in the rotation. I mean, think that’s why they sent Brandon young back down after Saturday’s start, because, you know, they’re, they’re going to have Gibson, you know, taking their taking his place when you need a fifth starter. But, I mean, this is just, this is just absolutely horrendous what we’re seeing now, and that’s where I look at this thing and say it’s regardless of effin and Grayson. And I’m not diminishing that those are made massive, massive, massive, massive losses, but you still have three fifths of your projected opening day rotation that Charlie Martin’s making $15 million I mean, if you wanted a 41 year old who couldn’t pitch, you could have paid me 100 grand, and I would have gone out there. I mean, seriously. I mean, this is just, it’s painful watching, watching whatever. Uh, Charlie Morton is at this point in time. And to your point, though, what is the alternative right now? I mean, like I said, you can try to put them in the bullpen. You can, you know, do the obalo Jimenez pothole scenario, and put them on the Il. You can try to skip them, something like that. But, I mean, you just don’t have options right now. And
Nestor Aparicio 35:20
I mean, although Jimenez pothole, that’s a great, you know, that’s how in the lying they were that we, you know, a decade later, we still remember their ridiculousness and just trying to soothe the egos of these guys that they bench. I don’t, you know, I I’m with you, though. I don’t know how you continue to give the ball to Charlie Morton tell me to come out and buy tickets this week while they’re on the road this week. What? But? But? I mean, even that part have a chance to win. I
Luke Jones 35:44
mean, even the ticket part aside, how do you look at the rest of the guys in your clubhouse? Seriously? I mean, and this goes back to your one of your points at the very beginning. Look, it’s nothing personal. Yeah, my few interactions with Charlie Morton, he seems like a perfectly decent enough guy, right? I mean, I don’t think you know he doesn’t want to go out and pitch poorly. But, I mean, how do you look at the rest of your clubhouse? I mean, and this is where I will stick up for the young core a little bit, even though, again, I’m not going to give the continue giving these guys passes when they’re the individuals who aren’t performing. But how do you look them in the eye and say that, man, we built this thing up and, man, we won 101 games last or two years ago. And, you know, even with our injuries, we still won 91 last year and made the playoffs. And, you know, this is what you give them, this is how you augment the rest of the roster. I mean, this is where I look at this thing. And I start to question more and more. I mean, Mike Elias built something into a contender, but there’s also general managers, and I’ll use this example. I’ve talked about this for years. You know, I don’t know how often it’s come up between you and me, but me having a brother in law who’s a big Philadelphia Phillies fan, Dave Dombrowski, to me, you know, even though you can go back earlier in his career, but over the last 15 years, 20 years as a general manager, to me, has really struck me as much more of a general manager that you want to have in place when you already have a core in place. And he’s the guy that, albeit, spends money, you know, has has been a general manager for big market teams over the last, you know, 15 years or so, but strikes me more as the General Manager that isn’t the guy that you you get if you’re rebuilding. He’s the guy that you get when you’re ready to win. I’m starting to wonder if Mike Elias is the rebuilding General Manager, but I don’t know if he
Nestor Aparicio 37:37
the scout guy, but not the guy that’s going to make deals, that’s going to make a deal to get you
8Luke Jones 37:42
over the hump. I mean, you have to start asking that over over the last couple years. I mean, going back to the 2023 trade deadline, when they absolutely needed a legit, serious reliever, and they got Fuji, who wasn’t even on the postseason roster, despite the fact that they lost Felix Batista along the way down the stretch. So, you
Nestor Aparicio 38:02
know, the weird thing about two years ago, when I look back on it, is I don’t know that they were really ready to win, or even thinking about winning at that point. You know what I mean. And I think at that point it struck all of them as a surprise. Yeah, I think they could have it should have been more serious. Keep in mind, who owned the team two summers ago. No question. John boys still running around. They’re not buying $15 million relief pitchers two years ago. John boys trying to convince everybody he’s a land developer, including the governor. I mean, we’re not even a year and a half out on the path of state. Dude. You know what? I mean, like, all this issues happen real, real fast, that this expectation that they’re going to go win the World Series with a new owner, with a great bobble head on Saturday, by the way, um, owners got a bobble head. I don’t when I tell people from out of town that
Luke Jones 38:51
I don’t believe it’s weird, they think it’s weird. Anyway, here’s, there’s
Nestor Aparicio 38:55
8so much I don’t know. I’ll get this clownish. Clownish was the word a former executive, high level executive in baseball used for me, clownish. This was somebody from out of town that says, I don’t know what’s going send me one sentence, I don’t know what’s going on there, but it looks clownish from here. Is what the person wrote to me. And I thought that’s a hell of an observation for somebody that’s been in professional sports for 40 years. I mean,
Luke Jones 39:25
I just think, and I don’t want to dwell on this, because there’s so many other much more pressing who
Nestor Aparicio 39:30
owns the team. There’s nothing more pressing than that and how. But
Luke Jones 39:33
the bobblehead doesn’t that. You know, the bobblehead who cares at the end of the day, who really cares? But I’m if they were, if they were 14 and seven right now, no one would give a crap about the bobblehead right now. And that’s the problem. But, but the problem is that, you know that they’re not right. They’re, you know. So now I lost my train of
8Nestor Aparicio 39:58
thought, you know, it’s, it’s. It’ll all come back to you. Luke James is here. He’s but no, just go ahead. Just
Luke Jones 40:03
to finish my thought, there on Elias and again, this is not me saying Mike Elias should be fired today. This is not me saying Brandon Hyde should be fired today. This is me saying everyone needs to be on notice right now, because this across the board is not good enough, and we’re still seeing core position players on this team not really performing. I mean, look, it was great to see Jordan West bird snap snap out of it over the weekend, but he was in an O for 30 I’ve talked about this, you know. Go look at what Adley rutschman numbers are since opening day. And I get it, the batted ball looks weight data looks way better. I do think he’s hitting in the worst luck. I don’t think it’s been truly as bad as last year, but go look at his numbers since opening it. You take opening day out, and it was a great performance. It’s part of the but since then, go look at the numbers and tell me they don’t look familiar to what we were seeing the second half of last year. My point is with that, I’m not picking on any one entity. I’m saying all of it, all of it across the board. This is not good enough. This is way below the bar, and the pitching is the the monster headliner right now. But we’re seeing too many other cracks elsewhere defense. Can
Nestor Aparicio 41:09
I say something else out loud here, just like as a, as a, as an aside on this, because you’re saying it’s not good enough, and I’m like, You know what? It’s not good enough. I’m pissed. Mr. Rubenstein needs to do something about this. And you know what, when it comes time to him to replace the baseball people here, and Bucha is qualified to do this, but would never do this with Ozzy and Eric. And we could talk about that this week, because he doesn’t want to do it. He doesn’t want to replace anybody, not Sashi. He didn’t even hire Sashi. Brown they cast it right. So, like, the interviewing process of all right, we’re throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Elias was John’s guy. He’s the builder. He’s not the right guy. Who’s going to be the one doing the interviewing? I have no idea. And again, it’s not David Rubenstein, because he doesn’t know anything about baseball. Like, literally, is it going to be Cal Ripken doing the interviewing? Then are they gonna put Cal cows too smart? Cal is way, way, way too smart to say, I’ll fix it, and they’re gonna hire him, because Cal is like Dan Marino. He doesn’t want that job. You know, they that that current job, you could talk like Johnny United is being the offensive coordinator back when I got on the radio 3030, years ago. Like, but somebody’s gonna have to have to hire that person? Yeah, they don’t have any baseball people in their organization. Real baseball people. Katie Griggs has been in sports seven years. She worked in a soccer team, a minor league soccer team in Atlanta, like, generally, that baseball, hey, you know, like, real baseball they, they don’t have that in the organization. They haven’t had that since Sid thrift but I now I’m being wrong. Do Cal be nice to do cat on that and and McPhail, but that’s the kind of human they’re gonna need around here if they’re gonna replace Mike Elias, and they don’t have an owner that knows anything about it or cares enough about it, you know, yeah.
Luke Jones 42:55
8And again, this isn’t me saying that I would fire him, but this how this all looks, and how we’re perceiving this, and how we’re viewing this, and how we’re judging this, like I’m tired of talking about, oh, well, look at all these first round picks. Okay, look at what they did two years ago. Okay, look at what their record is since late June of last year. Right at some point in time, it’s like, this isn’t good enough. I mean, this is, this is moving in the wrong direction, you know. And you made an interesting point, because you talked about 2023 and you talked about, you know, the idea that that may have just surprised everyone that it got it was that good that quickly. I do think there’s something to that. I do think there’s something to the idea that maybe it was a little bit too fast, too soon, as far as how good they got, that maybe Elias thought it would be more of a linear progression, you know, more of a gradual progression. Well, they
Nestor Aparicio 43:55
can look back and say their best chance to win the World Series was two years ago. I mean, I look back on the Orioles and I in my mind’s eye there, when they were up in New York, you and I were up in New York when Angelos came into the locker room, that was their best chance. The 14 year was their best chance.
Luke Jones 44:11
2014 was, I mean, 12 was so surprising. And but you you even looked at that roster until, I mean, they had Joe Saunders starting, you know, starting the wild card game, right? I mean, but 2014 was the year and, but what stunk about that? And, you know, when you look at it, 11 years later, they lost Machado and they lost weeders, you know, I mean, I mean, they didn’t have those guys late in the season. But, you know, they it was sitting up for them. They had
Nestor Aparicio 44:37
more children got hurt that time before that, right? But 12 is their better pathway to winning, and when you look back, because 14, they ran into the Royals, and they could have played, they could still be playing the Royals and get their ass kicked. So they weren’t getting their butt. They didn’t lose. You know, they weren’t 10 to nothing. The Royals were better than them. Ah, I don’t know about that. Okay? They were that week. I know that. Okay? But you could say that about anyone. I’m saying, if they would have gotten past the Yankees that night 12, looking back on it, that might have been a better pathway for them. I mean, the tie the Tigers beat the Yankees, but it was very early on. Machado was still a puppy, like all, you know, all of that was going on at that point. I would hate to look back on this and say two years ago was as best as it’s going to get, because right now, you know, and they could have done more, and you’re like, they’ve brought Fuji, and we could have, and should have done more. The whole idea is to build it as crescendo and to think of it linear, like we’re going to be better next year. We’re going to build, we’re going to build, we’re going to build, then we’re going to get there, build and build and build with Charlie Morton and and Chicano, and thinking Suarez is coming back. And just, I It’s been flawed thinking, you know, from a pitching perspective, I would agree with that all the
8Luke Jones 45:47
way. I mean, I just, you know what the you’re just counting on so many things to go well. And I think what we’re seeing, and this is where it’s it’s a part criticism, but it’s also just being realistic, where you’re when you do that, you’re counting on your young core to just overcome all of that, and some guys are able to, but you also have other guys who aren’t able to do that. And I mean Tyler O’Neal replacing and look, I want to make clear, Santander is not an MVP of the league kind of player either, right? This isn’t Eddie Murray that they let walk. This isn’t Cal Ripken that they let walk. But you know who’s their veteran core right now? You know who are the who are the true vets that you’re really leaning on right now? You know we talked about that last year, and the same holds true. Now, I mean that, you know, heavy is the crown, right? I mean talking about these young guys, these stud one ones and first round picks and top 100 prospects and all that. But, man, it just feels like across the board, everyone with their individual role, other than a few Mullins and a few other you know, gunners started hitting, but, man, it just feels like it’s a heavy. Heavy is the crown scenario for all of these guys, management and on field, personnel and man, it just doesn’t feel like nearly enough people are handling it. But then that’s where you go back to the lead, which is you have the worst starting pitching in baseball by a pretty distinct margin. I mean, everything else has to be so, so good to overcome that, that that’s not realistic. At
Nestor Aparicio 47:27
least the ravens are going to win the Super Bowl on Thursday night. The draft. Luke is here all week. We’re getting ready for the draft on Thursday. We’re getting ready on Wednesday. We’re going to be giving me back to the future scratch offs out. I now have them in my hot little hands. We’ll be at Cooper’s north in Timonium on Wednesday afternoon. It’s all brought to you by the Maryland lottery, as well as our friends at curio wellness, liberty, pure solutions, powering us up, keeping us moving here into spring. Quick break. We’ll come back. We’ll talk some more baseball. We’ll talk some more football. We’re going to talk about a lot of stuff. He’s Luke, I’m Nestor. We are W, N, S T am 1570 Towson, Baltimore, and we never stop talking Baltimore. Positive. You.
