Going Beyond Words to Scratch n’ Sniff and history of Gina Schock in Dundalk

Screen Shot 2022 12 21 at 10.45.00 AM 1
Screen Shot 2022 12 21 at 10.45.00 AM 1
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The Maryland Crab Cake Tour final stop of the year brought old friends together for the holidays at Costas Inn. John Allen joined Nestor in welcoming their old Dundalk High art teacher Joyce Bucci on to discuss her role with the band Beyond Words (and the Child’s Play logo) and how it tied back to the first punk rock band of Gina Schock before The Go-Go’s.


band, gina, john, stories, words, shock, music, joyce, friends, bar, costas, milkshake, lisa, marble, george, art, blondie, logo, play, baltimore


John Allen, George Kondylas, Nestor Aparicio, Joyce Bucci

Nestor Aparicio  00:00

Hello America wn S T, Towson, Baltimore and Baltimore positive we are positively at Costas the short says so they usually put me against the wall here, but it’s holiday time. And it’s kind of special. It’s my 31st anniversary. I am truly amongst friends. This is going to be great, great segments all brought to you by the Maryland lottery. I’m giving away holiday cash drops. If these guys win, it’s not because they’re my friends because there’s no fixing. I’ve got tickets here. John, did you win or $10,000? I didn’t get you didn’t get it all I gotta get your your coin. John Allen is here from the stone horses from Childsplay sr 71, with Panama leaving out Trump’s the devil. And we’re gonna have gene shock from the Go Go’s here. And about an hour, this hour, we just didn’t hammer jacks for an hour. This is an hour of friendship and a 40 year friendship that I’ve had with my high school art teacher. Choice then Phelps now. Buchi, always buchi and I’ve been married to George, since beyond words, since you were teaching me punch realism and to God and Monet, and all of those things that you taught me in high school to culturally enriched me so that I could go on and do great things in life. But you also were students of choices where you know, I was

John Allen  01:15

it was maybe art in business, probably right?

Nestor Aparicio  01:19

Art in business. Yeah. What was that course? How did I miss that? And what type writing class was I in that day?

John Allen  01:27

It was like commercial art kind of thing, right? We learned how to

Joyce Bucci  01:30

John came to me one day and he said, Hey, I have a band. Like you have a band, okay. And I want to do something special. I want to make this logo. And I was like, okay, he said, I want to do it backwards and like crayons with children’s play, because it’s called child’s play. I’m like, Oh, good. Oh, so

Nestor Aparicio  01:47

you were behind the logo?

Joyce Bucci  01:49

Oh my God. He made it in class. Yeah, he made it and thank God, I knew this

Nestor Aparicio  01:54

was gonna be a good segue. Give me a beard. Pete Come on. Now it’s getting good. Now we’re gonna say fortunate for a yoga class tonight,

Joyce Bucci  02:02

unfortunately, was a printmaker. And I said you want to do a resist method. So he’s like, learned how to do the resist method. himself train and there’s your logo. John did it. Great. And class. Well,

Nestor Aparicio  02:13

you were Craig, our teachers. I’m here to smooch on you and everyone else for all the love and so this thing came together really naturally right? Choice and I have been friends on Facebook and I love Joyce as a teacher and I love her as a human and we’ve known each other forever. And before um nasty nasty children any that you remember me as the music critic and running around the hallways at Dundalk high. You remember John is rock star and his tuxedo and senior year and all that. And I remember George from my youth then that you had a band you were spokesperson ng managing marketing, hanging up the placards for a band called beyond words, right? So wrap this story up as to who this guy is, because I want to piece all this together to fever in a car. Or if you’re following along or you just like me and when I hear these old stories that this is literally going to be narrative from this moment forward about Gina shock because she’s involved in all of this. But the six of us spouses, John’s wife, Erin, my wife, Jan, we were all out eating Indian food before the plague in 2018 19. Just as friends. I didn’t know that. I knew you knew each other. But I didn’t know you were suited. No, no, I mean, I and we were all connected. So we all wind up having dinner, and Gina’s shocks name came up at this. So that’s the genesis of how we got to Dundalk. But when I met you, you had a band called beyond words.

Joyce Bucci  03:39

That’s right. That’s right. Actually, George and I’m probably coves co-managed, because he was really good with them.

George Kondylas  03:45

Manage the band or be the girlfriend don’t do but here we are. 40 years later. Screw that.

Joyce Bucci  03:52

Yeah. So he basically he had the band first and he’s got great stories about that, which I’m sure he shared with you later. But you know, what we did? We divvied up things when when we had agents that were men, I took them and we had agents that were women. George took them so we figured out how to work the new music seminars in New York and all that stuff. We were

Nestor Aparicio  04:11

doing all of that when I was in music when I remember you CBGBs Ronnie Right? Yeah, showcase right showcases right

Joyce Bucci  04:16

yeah, go ahead.

George Kondylas  04:18

I was just gonna Sorry to interrupt. I was just gonna say the genesis of that was that Charles the bass player in Scratch and sniff and Joyce always kept in touch. So when Gina joined the band

Joyce Bucci  04:28

from Dundalk, Charleston, Dundalk High School, one of my students is well

George Kondylas  04:32

known him since the first grade and he said to Joyce we have a band and Joyce came to see the band and so Joyce

Joyce Bucci  04:41

let’s see was that the scratches, scratches and

Nestor Aparicio  04:44

scratches sniff was your band with Gina shock. That is right.

George Kondylas  04:48

But Joyce was in graduate school and said to a photographer there, hey, if this band will play your show, your graduate show will you do pictures of them? And those are the pictures that are in June. his book Oh, wow. So that’s the genesis of how all that happened

John Allen  05:03

and you played guitar in that band right That was genius playing drums. Yeah. And then eventually with beyond words you wound up playing goodbye good. Yeah,

Joyce Bucci  05:12

for some reason Gina left left town

Nestor Aparicio  05:18

Regina later on because that’s kind of the reason we’re bringing everything right but you came into my life I guess in 8283 84 I started writing into paper and 8485 86 and then the evening sun right beyond words was like child’s play different genre. I would always sound was when my car’s belt for you today, because I would sort of put you into your new wave. Pop right rock band in that genre of somewhere between Blondie you had a female singer right. Lisa is here. We’re gonna welcome her up if you’re familiar with milkshake, and every kid, and I think here grew up in milkshakes, music and comedy, probably John’s kids, right? So there’s been 35 years of this but beyond words was your dream to make it big, right? Literally.

George Kondylas  06:01

Yeah, we were a lot like the motels. Yeah. Had a sax player and keyboard player, guitar, drums, bass and Lisa. So do the harmonies write the songs. And we were never really a cover band. We did a few here and there. But in general, that was the deal. Tried to get a deal. Right your material. That was

Nestor Aparicio  06:21

sounds familiar to you? Right? Yeah.

John Allen  06:22

That was played in Baltimore. We’re like, like Gerards and right different. Eight by 10

Nestor Aparicio  06:31

Marble bars gone at this bar before there was a second marble bar upstairs. Okay, Galaxy ballroom,

Joyce Bucci  06:36

Galaxy ballroom

Nestor Aparicio  06:37

that. I saw you there that night. And I was like, 16 there to review it. And choice had to like, get me. You know, I haven’t checked out a special deal with Louie and but you know, I could go, but that was a bar where I’m like, Hey, I’m 18 I can’t you know, get in there. But I remember being at your showcase that night. There’s the only night ever went to the bar in my life.

George Kondylas  06:58

Once Was it? Well, I

Nestor Aparicio  07:00

think it was kind of just gone after that. Right? It had the legend of the talking heads and Blondie and YouTube and all those. Where was that located? That was

Joyce Bucci  07:10

in Franklin, Franklin and Mulberry. Right, Franklin then Howard

John Allen  07:14

condos now, but it had been the Congress hotel right when it started. And a lot of the vaudeville stars used to stay in the hotel. And there was actually apparently from the marble bar what became marble bar, there was a tunnel that went to the the Mayfair theatre that that was on Howard. And that way they could go back and forth without going out.

George Kondylas  07:36

Frederick Fred Astaire danced on that bar. On the more

Nestor Aparicio  07:39

on the marble, marble Morphe This is why I bring you guys I just wanna stay the hell out of the way because he’s got like, more ish in his head. And this head is Rockstar head of history and useless knowledge. Yes, totally as well. I wouldn’t have you around me. Your life documentarian in some ways, right? Yeah,

Joyce Bucci  07:55

that’s a great place to have a swimming pool as on the way in there. So you, you saw that

John Allen  08:02

underneath. So So Steve kitchens told me the story years ago. So this pulling it back to the hammer Jack’s discussion we were having earlier, Steve kitchens was a manager at hammer Jack’s Well, after the bars would close. He was wide awake, you know, after 2am. He would go basically, like spelunking in these old buildings. In Baltimore City. He’d have rope. He’d have flashlights. He had a video camera. He told me he got into the basement of the May fair theater. And he said there was a there was a pool under there. He found a tunnel. And he said there was a pool under the theater. I’m like, Get out of here. I’m like, What are you talking about? Right, right, exactly. So apparently, that theater was built by an ex Civil War general or Colonel as a health spa. So that thing under there was it was a Turkish pool or something in the basement of the Mayfair theatre. And then

Nestor Aparicio  08:59

it sounds like the Playboy Mansion in Chicago. Well, it failed.

John Allen  09:03

So they built they made it a movie theater, or probably a vaudeville theater first and then you know, movie theater.

Joyce Bucci  09:09

Right. And Leslie and Roger lived there. And they owned the marble bar and they brought all those bands in. Leslie still around today. She hasn’t banned bottle rockets you have to find her because she’s history Um, oh my god, she’s Baltimore history.

Nestor Aparicio  09:24

Well, music brings people together. I mean, we’re talking all we got five six different kinds of genres of music that we’ve already talked about 30 minutes into this thing, but for the beyond word story from where you come from, from your art background and music. How did you guys meet what is give me the connection here to spend a life together here because I know of you through you and you know of Gina shock and it’s it. It’s small to mourn. It really is right?

Joyce Bucci  09:49

Look at the Art connection. It’s the art connection. I was teaching a Dundalk and I kept saying who’s whose paintings are these incredible paintings of Alaska gorgeous paintings, these watercolors Oh, that’s Miss Kinneil is his son. And I knew his mother before I knew him because she was a linguist and substituted language there. Do you remember that? I

John Allen  10:07

remember her as a substitute. Yeah. Wonderful lady.

Joyce Bucci  10:10

And so we were gonna get deals with your mother. Yeah, yeah.

Nestor Aparicio  10:16

2023 almost before I have to do a radio show with Costas and have an anniversary to learn stuff. I did not know that. So okay, well, I knew your mother too, then how about that? Yeah.

Joyce Bucci  10:27

So that’s how we kind of like met each other. And then a lot of a lot of my students were his friends. And then we became friends. But we both met, you know, left there. And we both married other people. And then we came back together and after our divorces, and we got in touch again through music this time. And we married so yeah,

Nestor Aparicio  10:46

well, I’ve only known you two as an item but I also the band itself and beyond words, and the 40 fives and all that talk about the band’s a little bit before I bring Elise and Michael because I’m, I’m going to give John a recipe to go eat crab cakes because Pete’s bringing holiday crab cakes out for everybody.

Joyce Bucci  11:01

And I wanted to just one connection here beyond words, hit play hammer, Jack’s. We did a video there and did a video there too. And we have some pictures to share with not often I think just woman.

Nestor Aparicio  11:14

Well, the documentary incredibly drummed out


George Kondylas  11:17

of the community. I think the flyer for it actually said Yeah, it’s true.

Joyce Bucci  11:25

We did. We did all the artwork, mostly George had all the artwork for the for the band. Like I was switching sides until we until we eventually hired somebody to do some of them. What did you

Nestor Aparicio  11:34

feel like that at that time? From a music standpoint?

George Kondylas  11:36

In a sense? Yeah. I mean, you know, we were just

Nestor Aparicio  11:39

in a hammer jazz kind of band. Right? We

George Kondylas  11:41

were in it differently. We were an eight by 10. Band. Gerards band. We did a lot of stuff in DC

Joyce Bucci  11:47

930 clubs by you. Yeah, the by the Ritz bottom line. CBGBs. Those are all you know, places we played. Yeah. So China club.

John Allen  11:58

It seemed like you concentrate from my memory. You telling me about going to New York playing up there.

Joyce Bucci  12:04

And even Yeah, like college is like that. Because yeah. Did all the signing signing. Right.

George Kondylas  12:10

Then that was that was interesting experience. Lisa should be in on that.

Nestor Aparicio  12:13

But well, you guys were a great band and I want to pay homage and milkshake and love right and everything. And more than that the links? How can I bring Gina shock out here today and be part of this for the second time. We tried to get you guys a month and a half ago and you were in like Austin, Austin, Texas. And you guys called in on the phone and I’m holding the phone up and you add stories and I’m like, well, let’s convene and bring these things together. So the plane is going to take off John Allen’s gonna come back a little later on, which he does shock is here as well. I’m gonna be only because I only have so many microphones. I could probably put a fifth microphone in here. We’re gonna have Michael and Lisa and George beyond words. Come on. Tell some old stories and hey, you played Amberjacks really? Start the party with that. We’re gonna start with that and the sign language. Thank you love you. Joyce is Joyce Bucha teacher. Thank you. So most significant art thing you ever taught me? Yeah. Anything that you want to? Well, you

John Allen  13:05

just mentioned a bunch of stuff. Yeah. What

Nestor Aparicio  13:07

did you do your class was art appreciation.

Joyce Bucci  13:09

Appreciation. Yeah, just to open up and look in on and value it he was

Nestor Aparicio  13:15

a real artist though.

Joyce Bucci  13:16

It was a real it still is. Yeah, I’m

Nestor Aparicio  13:17

not. You’re like very artistic. I didn’t know you did the Childsplay logo like this. Yeah,

Joyce Bucci  13:25


that’s a classic. And when my one more story of John,

Nestor Aparicio  13:30

which I have time

Joyce Bucci  13:32

stories just like he would do that in between falling asleep in my class because if Kevin can get away with it because I knew what he was doing. And I was a band manager so hey, you

John Allen  13:46

know what happened with me was if I fell asleep in first period, the rest of the day was shot I would I would fall asleep and second and third and fourth leg all the way up to lunch like I couldn’t handle it but if I made it through first period and it was really tough because I had wildlife biology first and no it was it was Mr. Hall. He would put on a film I was done you know those lights would go off and I’d be like

Nestor Aparicio  14:13

Oh, phone begins

John Allen  14:18

Thank you Nestor fight song. I don’t know it.

Nestor Aparicio  14:23

You don’t know what each fellow joiner course Aquafarm ready?

John Allen  14:26

I only know what we did. ever

Nestor Aparicio  14:28

seeing and try.

John Allen  14:34

You don’t know. But I was just by there and I was looking over and you know, the stadium is now where the old school was. I was like,

Nestor Aparicio  14:40

Oh wow, they did they moved it all around. Right? It looks like a museum dude. If you go in there, you’ll cry. I know. I did. All right, John. Alex taken out to get some crab cakes. We’ll be back a little later on. His band is playing a child’s play the original band that my wife has seen they’re playing at three on May 6. That’s no matter where the post people Alright Giorgio is gonna stay we’re gonna get him a beverage. Joyce is going to leave we’re gonna bring Lisa and Michael up you may know them as milkshake. You may know them as love right I know them is beyond words. We’re Costas. We are doing the Maryland crab cake tour. It is all brought to you by our friends at the Maryland lottery, Lennar sales play as well as our friends at Goodwill and window nation back for more from Dundalk at Costas right after this on Baltimore positive

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