NBC Sports longtime horse racing analyst Randy Moss tells Nestor he is wistful about the end of Pimlico as we know it but the reality of horse racing, the Triple Crown and the future of the Preakness is at a mesh point with potential for better times ahead. And some journalism about Journalism.
Nestor Aparicio and Randy Moss discuss the future of the Preakness and the Triple Crown. Moss, a horse racing Hall of Famer, reflects on his 40 years at Pimlico, noting its deterioration and the need for modernization. They debate the impact of the two-week gap between the Kentucky Derby and Preakness, suggesting a more aligned schedule could revitalize the event. Moss emphasizes the importance of a strong commissioner in thoroughbred racing to address issues like race spacing. They also discuss the potential relocation of the Preakness to Laurel and the need for better facilities at Pimlico.
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
Preakness, Triple Crown, Pimlico, NBC Sports, Randy Moss, Maryland racing, Kentucky Derby, Belmont Stakes, horse racing, Pimlico renovation, Preakness calendar, horse training, racing industry, Maryland crab cake tour.
SPEAKERS
8
Nestor Aparicio, Randy Moss
Nestor Aparicio 00:01
Welcome home. We are W, N, S, T. Am 1570 Towson, Baltimore. We are Baltimore. Positive, positively celebrating another previous week here in the books. We’re going to get the Maryland crab cake tour back out on the road on the 28th we’re going to be down to fade Lee’s at Lexington market. I will have the Maryland lottery scratch offs the back to the futures to give away, as well as on June 7, when we return to Carroll County, we’ll be at Green Mountain station up in Hampstead, having that delicious crab cake and no doubt talking horse racing there is attached to an OTB. My man, David Richardson, will be around. Maybe we’ll grab Allen and some others once the race is over, because the race track is going to be over as we know it, Randy Moss, the man, the myth, the legend, not the wide receiver, the Hall of Famer. My Hall of Famer, horse racing. Hall of Famer is in town on all behalf of all things NBC. They’re going to be providing coverage. And Randy and I know each other a little bit in the real world. And before we even got this thing going, you know, I don’t green room around here, Randy, but you started to get me a little teared up about this. Took a grand tour of the grand old lady one last time. Do I am I missing out? Should I go out there one more time this
Randy Moss 01:11
week? Well, my first Preakness Nestor was 1981 my first Derby was 1980 but I came to the Preakness in 1981 pleasant colony beat bold ego that year in the Preakness. And I’ve been a denizen of the Pimlico press box ever since then. I mean, back in the old days with Dale Austin and Andy buyer and Clem Florio and guys like you
Nestor Aparicio 01:36
just said, Clem, hold on. Oh, you baby doll. Oh, he looks beautiful. Randy. He’s gonna run today. Randy, you know, like and Vinnie Peron and Charlie and Chris. Great. Jack man, turf legend, jack man sports,
8Randy Moss 01:59
all those guys I always look forward to seeing when I came to Baltimore, and so yesterday, I had to make one final trip up to the Pimlico press box. I actually took video on my iPhone for posterity. The elevator, of course, is broken, no surprise. So I had to climb about, you know what 1000 steps to get up to the press box, but it was worth it. Well, this thing here, I can
Nestor Aparicio 02:24
be really flippant say that thing should have been condemned. You know, if the fact that it ever carted Howard Cosell in 1980s like that, you know, there’s so many parts of the track they hear from the time that the paramutual ragering broke and all the electricity went out 25 years ago, and punching the horse, and the running, the urinals, and things that I may or may not have done in the infield that would not allow me to be elect. Maybe it could get elected these days, I don’t know, but the event itself and what it was in 1981 scaffolding, all of that in the infield to where it’s going to go. That’s the part for me, where I’m trying to see the success into the future here for it, because we don’t have the Kentucky Derby winner. That’s problematic. It’s and, you know, behind all of this, it’s sort of like saying goodbye to the track and all of this, I’m trying to sort out, like, how we make this great again, because we you and I think it’s so great, you know? Well,
Randy Moss 03:23
I mean to make it great again is really pretty simple Nestor. It all has to do with the calendar. And I know you and I have talked about this a lot, and it’s again, front and center for this year’s Preakness, just because sovereignty is not here, and that’s something that’s going to be increasingly prevalent, increasingly more likely, that the Kentucky Derby winners will wind up skipping the Preakness, maybe even more often than not, just because of the two week gap, which is now a complete anachronism in thoroughbred racing. So if you want to, if you want to really bring the Preakness and the entire triple crown back to where it used to be in the heyday and the good old days, then you’ve got to get modern with the way horses are trained nowadays, with the way horses are physically nowadays, and let’s say Derby first Saturday in May Preakness Memorial Day weekend, or even a week later than that, and the Belmont around the Fourth of July that they would do it
Nestor Aparicio 04:27
8well, I mean, for the track this time, and for where racing is in the state I’ve been through all of its slots. I’ve been at this forever. Um, what do you expect to find when you come back for the Preakness at Pimlico in that space in your mind to know it’s not going to look anything like the way it looks now. It’s not going to look like Churchill. It’s not going to look like Delmar keen like I don’t in my mind, I don’t even know what they’re trying to construct here for a modern race track in. Urban environment, primarily to host the Preakness, right? Like not to really be more of a racetrack. I don’t understand that I’ve had explained to me five different ways. I can’t imagine for people in the industry, because this race is really important. It’s important to you, it’s important that it’s a track. It’s important to the state, it’s important to NBC. And I don’t have a clear picture. I don’t sit down with anyone that gives me any clarity on this. And I’m wondering if you’re around it a little bit more that, you know, this is the last time, and you’re emotional about it. I’m emotional about it, but I don’t know what they’re trying to do. As I look at Camden Yards behind me and think of 33rd street, you know, yeah,
Randy Moss 05:37
well, I mean, let’s, let’s inject some realism here. Okay, it has to be better than it is now, as much as I love coming here for the Preakness and have been coming here now for what is it 4044 years, the fact of the matter is, and I’m sorry if Maryland people really don’t like to hear this, but the Pimlico facility is the worst venue for a major sporting event in all of American sports. It’s worse than the Oakland Alameda County Coliseum, for crying out loud. And you know, I came across Nestor daily racing forum column that that that said that Pimlico was beyond repair and that the Preakness needed to be moved to Laurel. It was 1948, was the article. So, you know Pimlico, it has been as a facility on life support for a long time. So whatever they build here in place of Pimlico is it’s, you know, it’s not going to have the same history, obviously, that that old hilltop has right now, but as a facility, it will be infinitely better than what the fans experience now when they come to the Preakness. So I think that’s a positive. Churchill Downs has been remodeled. Belmont Park is being remodeled right now as we speak, and the Preakness is next, and I’m looking forward to
Nestor Aparicio 07:07
it. Uh, Randy Moss is our guest. We always love having Randy on, uh, talking racing here, uh, we we like it a lot more when the derby winners here, um, for the neophytes, for folks who only dive into this once a year. And I asked Donna to do the same thing. Dick Girardi, all of my horse racing, all my mafia who talk about this and know it so well, the notion that this race will be moved affects, Belmont, effects, Fox Television, NBC, the industry, the industry, gods, all of that. Then there is no commissioner on all of this, to decree like Rob Manford putting Pete Rose into the I don’t know what that was all about, but, but there’s no voice for horse racing other than people like you and to Rico on TV this weekend and people that speak up and out and the horsemen themselves, and because the Horses don’t talk right, what, what’s going to be perfect, what’s going to be palatable for the people in New York and Belmont, what’s, I mean, what’s ideal for the industry and what’s palatable for the people that are the stakeholders. That’s never seemed to align. And I talked to Dick Girardi, and you’re an old school or spend a buck, you know, 1985 was the beginning of all this 40 years later, it was a million dollars back then, and a person a prize or whatever, and all these years later, we can’t even get the Triple Crown right as an industry around horse racing, yeah,
Randy Moss 08:32
well, the fact that there’s no commissioner in thoroughbred racing is the major problem right now. If the sport had a Roger Goodell or silver or rob Manfred, or, you know, anything similar to what the NFL and the NBA, Major League Baseball have, this problem of the spacing of the races would have been fixed 20 years ago. It’s been about 20 years when you first started seeing also RANS in the in the Kentucky Derby, some of the best three year olds in the country skip the Preakness and be withheld for the Belmont Stakes. That was a that was an indication right there that there was trouble down the road, and it’s gotten worse and worse and worse. The problem right now, because there’s no Commissioner, and because every state, every track looks after its own selfish self interests is that New York, right now, is the beneficiary of the current spacing the Belmont Stakes has actually been strengthened because at the expense of the Preakness, quite frankly, it’s not good for the sport. It’s not good for the Triple Crown, which is the number one thing that horse racing has going for it right now, right? And New York has been steadfastly refusing to go along with changing the spacing of the Triple Crown so far now, we may be getting to the point now, as you see this year, where more often than not. That when the Derby winner skips the Preakness that then robs the Belmont Stakes of a chance to have a horse going for the Triple Crown, which creates 90,000 or 100,000 fans, and is a huge money maker for New York, that might finally Nestor be the impetus for New York to come to the table and agree to move the Belmont Stakes and change their whole stake schedule and everything else that would go along with that. It desperately needs to be done.
8Nestor Aparicio 10:30
You know, I guess, for this race and for having and by the way, I know you’ll be happy to hear, journalism is alive. We get to say that this week, journalism’s a contender, as Clem Florio would say, I don’t the short fields, when that became the problem, and then the fact that the persons in the state were a mess, the slots thing never happened in the arts, the strong acts took it over. They were more interested turning it into some sort of Miami fashion show or whatever like, just from us a locals perspective here, of what it was, and the school busses bring in, the college kids in, and me being a part of that 30 years ago, to what they’re trying to make, the Preakness, what Maryland racing needs to be, what LAUREL I mean, you mentioned the things about Pimlico laurels, you know, a step ahead. Maybe it’s up to Tropicana Field or something like that. We could throw that in, but with the roof, of course. But for me, with with what’s happened here, with the Preakness and the industry itself and everything that’s going on around it, I just don’t understand how there hasn’t been more influence in some way to make this happen, because all of these signs of problems here, and especially for the state, when it affects the persons in the whole weekend and none of the horses want to come, it’s affected the black guy. It just affected everything, not to mention bad leadership here on Baltimore positive. We can talk about mayors and governors in the state of gambling. In our state that I talk about so much, there’s been a lot of things here to steal the Preakness away, to move it to Florida, all of the rumors that I’ve had to deal with for 20 years. It does feel safe in here, and there’s a plan, and they’re going to do something. There’s money allocated, but the sport has to kind of come and rescue itself as well so that it can benefit Baltimore and Maryland and Maryland racing and all that, because the timing of all of this is designed to kind of screw us and and the evidence in that is is witnessed here when it’s a racing week and not enough people are as excited about it as they ought to be. Yeah.
Randy Moss 12:44
I mean, right? The Kentucky Derby is the Kentucky Derby, and it always will be. It’s arguably the greatest horse race in the world. So the Kentucky Derby is fine. I think 21 million people tuned in to watch the Kentucky Derby segment of the NBC telecast two weeks ago. Right? The Belmont Stakes, right? Now, is going to have a brand new belmont park when they get it fixed and they move the Belmont from Saratoga back to Belmont Park. You know, theoretically, the Belmont is going to be, you know, always in good shape. It’s a classic right now, the Preakness is in the middle and is in a compromised position, as you pointed out, not just for the Preakness Stakes itself, but for the undercard races. Churchill Downs gets a load of the best horses in the world, dirt horses in the world, and grass horses to run on Derby weekend. They don’t want to come back in two weeks to run in the Preakness so once you get all that fixed, and I do think I am optimistic that it will get fixed, then I think you’re going to see Nestor a pretty immediate Renaissance, and not just the Preakness Stakes itself, and get it back to where it used to be, where all the best horses in the derby come back and run in the Preakness. That’s what the Triple Crown is supposed to be. It’s the oldest tradition in the book, as far as the Triple Crown is concerned, but the undercard races as well are going to really benefit from that extra time. And you might even, you might even have a situation where you’ll not only have the Triple Crown for three year olds on the line. You might see a triple crown for three year old Phillies. That actually means something Kentucky oaks, the Black Eyed Susan. And let’s say the acorn is the final egg of the Triple Crown, triple crown for turf males, triple crown for turf sprinters, for dirt, you name it. It really could benefit Maryland racing in a lot of different ways than just helping the preak mistakes. And I think it, I think it will be done. It, it may be a little blood on the floor, but I think it’ll happen.
Nestor Aparicio 14:42
Well, hang on here, you three times now I wrote down optimistic. I think it will happen. I haven’t gotten a lot of that recent, yeah. Where’s the movement in all of this? And I guess, you know, I smell money as much as anybody in saying there’s no question this. Is depressed everything about the Preakness, and there’s no question if there’s no triple crown that that can’t really help the Belmont. Now, Belmont smelling nice because Saratoga is beautiful, and people want to go there and run, and the jockey, no one wants to come here because of the deterioration of the track, because the deterioration of the purses, because there’s nowhere to put their horses when they bring them in here for a grand event that the Preakness used to be. But if we can build that back, where is the optimism? Who are? Where are the leaderships that you know? Who are these humans that are going to decide what the horses are going to do and certainly, where the money is going to flow in the industry? Unfortunately,
Randy Moss 15:36
8right now, well, the industry as a whole is not in fantastic shape. I mean, with the exception of a few pockets around the country, major races like the Kentucky Derby, the Breeders Cup, is doing well. But you know, as a whole, the thoroughbred racing industry is not nearly as strong as it used to be, and Maryland is unfortunately suffering from that as well. The optimism that I have for the Triple Crown and for Maryland racing in general comes from what the proposals are to revitalize Pimlico, which was desperately in need of that, and what I believe is going to be the New York Racing Association, which holds all the cards in the Triple Crown. Spacing the Kentucky Derby is like, it’s not our we don’t have a dog in the sun. They really do, but they act like they don’t. It’s going to be all up to Maryland and New York to come together and to make this happen. And you know, I’ve been told Nestor that New York has has told the Maryland racing authorities now it’s going to be the state of Maryland and not the strongest group that they will consider, which they’ve never said before that they will consider moving the Belmont Stakes once they get past the Belmont at Saratoga phase that they’re in right now. And what
Nestor Aparicio 16:59
does that end? By the way, because I’m not, I’m not, I’m a little unclear. Is that two years, three, how many more are we going to run at
Randy Moss 17:06
Saratoga? I that is a little fuzzy. I think the plans are to run this year at Saratoga and then next year, even if the Belmont grandstand is not completely finished, to run the Belmont Stakes at Belmont Park with tents and things like that. Now, whether that will actually come to fruition, I don’t know,
Nestor Aparicio 17:26
but we might have one more, but not two more. It’s possible that they’ll have two. That’s what I’ve been told. No two more, but not after this year. I’m talking about, okay, right? And then and then Laurel will be where the Preakness is next year, correct?
8Randy Moss 17:38
Laurel will be where the Preakness is next year, and there’s supposedly a commitment as well in Maryland, a strong desire to run the Preakness Stakes at Pimlico in 2027 again, just like New York, even if the facility is not 100% complete. So things are moving in the right direction, and I do believe that you’re going to see the New York Racing Association agree to move the Belmont Stakes, which will help revitalize the Preakness and the new facility I think will help revitalize Maryland racing in general. Maybe I’m being naive, maybe I’m being a little pollyannish and overly optimistic. But, you know, that’s, that’s what I am expecting to have
Nestor Aparicio 18:27
Randy. I will shed my last cheer on Pimlico, on you on this, and say that, you know, I remember the first time i i saw a thoroughbred horse. Was Ferdinand, this beautiful chestnut Gary winning him out there was about 85 years old at time, and I saw Howard Cosell walk through in the in the you just a huge man in the gold, wide world of sports jacket, you know, walking through on a Preakness back in the mid 80s. And think at the end of this that I’m, I’m always, I’m the old newspaper guy. So I’m thinking of the Sunday headline. And I want to see journalism prevails, journalism wins, I don’t know. Give me I got a great, I got
Randy Moss 19:08
a great Howard Cosell story for you. Oh, please, do please. Howard Cosell story. All right, I have virtual nouns. This is when ABC was doing the Kentucky Derby. And this is probably, I want to guess, late 1980s or so, and there is a gaggle, a circle of people crowded around a particular barn, and it’s because Howard Cosell was doing an interview with the trainer, and everybody wanted to watch Howard Cosell, right? There’s this young guy standing next to me. I had no idea who he was to this day. I don’t know, I don’t know his name, and we’re both watching the interview. So the interview is completed, and cosell looks over toward me and sees the young guy next to me and says, young man, young man, I need a word with you. And I thought, Whoa. Okay. So I got out. He was talking to the guy next to me. So a little bit later, hour or so later. I run into this guy, the young guy, who’s standing next to me, and I said, I had a curiosity. What the hell was Howard Cosell so upset with you about wanting to talk to you? And he said, You won’t believe it. He said, two years ago, I was at Churchill Downs the same exact scenario. I’m watching Howard Cosell do an interview. It’s a cold morning. Howard Cosell takes off his beautiful ABC windbreaker and hands it to me, and he said, I’m holding Howard cosell’s ABC jacket. I’m never going to have this opportunity again. And he said, I took off with it. He remembered my face two years later, and and and and got in my face about stealing his ABC jacket. Said, can you believe that?
Nestor Aparicio 20:41
8Boy, stone hours jacket. I mean, come on. I mean, that’s not right, yeah, you know, it’s like something out of one of those commercials where they steal the stuff in the locker room. Randy Moss is here. He’s been in locker rooms in the NFL. I’m not going to bother him about Justin Tucker or Lamar Jackson or any of that, because he’s here for the race. Um, will anyone beat journalism? Or can journalism be beat? I hope journalism is unbeaten and unchallenged. I
Randy Moss 21:05
think the only thing that can beat him, Nestor, is the two week turnaround. You know, the last four winners of the Preakness Stakes did not run in the Kentucky Derby and had more than that two week turnaround. So the refresher coming into the Preakness that’s increasingly becoming an issue, the spacing. Again, we’re talking about that. But he is clearly the best horse in the race. And I actually like a journalism clever again, exact. Clever again. Does have more time than two weeks, so he’ll probably set the pace. Not much speed in the race. Those are the two I like.
Nestor Aparicio 21:41
Well, you know one thing about this race this week, all aside for the last time at the track, and the other story lines, if you’re a bleeding heart like I am, who’s still upset that they’ve pulled the charts down in the press box that you have to walk six floors up to get to where it would be 148 degrees if it were, you know, 80 outside. Um, just the fact that Dwayne Lucas is here, Bob Baffert is here, right? Complex. I mean, the stars of the sport, jockeys, horses, but trainers and and having sort of legendary trainers here that always that adds more cachet to the race. For me, even more so than social influencers I’ve never heard of who apparently affected the odds a couple of weeks ago.
Randy Moss 22:23
Oh yeah, Griffin Johnson, the the influencer, had a huge impact, huge impact on the betting on Sandman in the Kentucky Derby, and he’ll be back. He’s, I haven’t seen him yet, but he’s in town since Sandman is running in this race, but you’re right
8Nestor Aparicio 22:38
about bring metallic in or so be even they’ve already posted a video Metallica
Randy Moss 22:43
in support of Sandman. Oh yeah, but yeah, you’re right about the big names. And with anytime you get, you know, you get Bob Baffert and Wayne Lucas, Steve Asmussen, who’s won more races than any trainer in history. You know, when you get guys a Todd Pletcher who’s never won the Preakness, but he’s going to give it a shot this year with River Thames, anytime you get a big four like that, it it helps a lot. Well,
Nestor Aparicio 23:11
I appreciate you all the years of horse racing. Hope we’re here to tell the tale in a new place. I’ll dress up, look real nice, put my Ascot on if they’re and get my ass in gear if they bring a new track here. I’ve lived long enough I, you know, I want to see it. I’m here. I’ve watched us lose our football team and get a football team back. I’ve watched us build a new stadium that’s, you know, still one of the really cool places to watch a baseball game. I want to see what horse racing can be and how it can have new life injected in in our city and for the community, and something that’s just a beautiful historical part of our it’s our Super Bowl, Randy. You know that?
Randy Moss 23:49
8There you go. And by the way, I’m a native of Arkansas. My all time favorite, Brooks, professional athlete, Brooks, Robinson.
Nestor Aparicio 23:58
How could it be anybody else? Is there a number two in Arkansas, or am I? Am I missing something? Who’s number two? Number two
Randy Moss 24:04
also, God, I don’t know. I mean, there’s been a lot, as with any state, there’s been a lot of old time famous athletes that have come dizzy, Dean, you can go way back to guys like that. You know that have been that have been famous. So you’re from a whole state but John Bailey,
Nestor Aparicio 24:22
there you go. It depends. Yeah, you go. It depends on your sport. But you’re from like a whole state. You claim Brooks. Our city claims Brooks, right? You can’t have him. He’s ours. You know, we have two statues for Brooks within a block of each other, Randy Moss. NBC, and I said this to Donna, your coverage is always just so spot on. I know you’re broadcasting from a trailer in the rain, out of the rain, all that stuff I saw what happened down at Churchill two weeks ago. But just it’s, you know, I’ll be watching. Everyone watches, and you guys just set the race up so beautifully to make it about more than, you know, a minute and 45 seconds of a race. And I appreciate it every year. I’m always educated by watching you guys, and it helps me interview you every year. So I appreciate it.
8Randy Moss 25:05
Thank you, Nestor, it’s always good to catch up with you. Hope you’re well, it’s always
Nestor Aparicio 25:09
football season, and Randy Moss is here. He is from NBC. Watch the races this weekend. I’ll be watching the races. We’ll be broadcasting from the Maryland party at Steve wins little Palace out at the Encore bull this weekend. It’s a huge networking event for Maryland executives, politicians, community leaders. You’ll be hearing it all next week as we get up on Memorial Day. Looks at the ballpark all week. I don’t know if the Orioles are going to work. Maybe if we can find some pitching, we’ll be better off. I am Nestor. We are W, N, S T. Am 1570 Towson, Baltimore. We never stop talking Baltimore, positive, happy Preakness.
