The on-again, off-again bats of the young Baltimore Orioles lineup has been even more disappointing than the injured and patchwork pitching staff. After a bullpen meltdown against Toronto, Luke Jones and Nestor discuss the Orioles’ mostly youthful bats needing to save season with clutch hits to cover for the pitching that doesn’t figure to improve much in the coming weeks.
Nestor Aparicio and Luke Jones discussed the Baltimore Orioles’ need for their young bats to perform at a high level to save the season. They highlighted the encouraging signs from recent games, including home runs by Rutschman and Mullins, but noted the team’s inconsistent offense and the necessity of improving in situational hitting, reducing strikeouts, and playing better defense. They emphasized the importance of players like Gunnar Henderson and Jackson Holliday, who are still developing, and the impact of injuries to key players. The conversation also touched on the team’s pitching issues and the need for better performance from the bullpen.
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
Orioles, young bats, clutch hits, pitching, offense, injuries, rotation, defense, situational hitting, strikeouts, home runs, bench depth, lineup decisions, player development, playoffs.
SPEAKERS
Luke Jones, Nestor Aparicio
Nestor Aparicio 00:01
Welcome home. We are W, N, S, T am 1570 tasks of Baltimore. We are Baltimore positive. We will be giving away neither one of these actually the match gate ball, the monopolies. I think I’m going to actually have some back to the futures. I’ll be like Michael J Fox, and we’ll drive to DeLorean. I like to drive to DeLorean back to 1983 right now it’s 79 would be fine for me. We can lose the World Series in seven. I’d be okay with that. At this point. Luke Jones joins us now. He will not be joining me at the Beaumont this week or at Cooper’s North next week, or maybe co because I don’t know. You’ll be joining me at some point. You’re too busy as the only credentialed media member for both of these franchises. Big football week ahead, certainly big baseball week ahead. Here, with all of Ohio coming in and playing baseball here this week, we’ve talked a ton about the pitching, the pitching, the pitching, the pitching. At some point, you know, if they were scoring 11 runs a game, they win every night, right? Yeah. And look, I mean,
Luke Jones 01:03
it doesn’t have to be 11. It’s not going to be 11 runs a game. I mean, I’m not going to sit here and be completely unrealistic and delusional about it, but at the same time, you look at where their offense has been, it was that element was more encouraging over the weekend, especially on Saturday, you know, kerstadt hits the home run to breathe some life into the offense. Rushman’s home run, as I said to you in a previous segment, it felt cathartic. It felt meaningful, as meaningful as mid April can be. Let’s put it that way. It felt like that kind of a win for them. And you know, Mullins gets another big hit as he continues his fantastic start Sunday, they scored six runs, albeit aided by some defense wild pitches. You know, some shoddy play from the Blue Jays. But you know, again, six runs a game. You’d like to think you’re going to win that more often than not, but we know that this team as it’s presently constructed, especially now with the injuries and the rotation mounting, they’ve got to hit the ball and they’ve got to hit the ball at a high level. It can’t just be, oh well, you know, this is a top 10 in Major League Baseball kind of offense. Oh, it, it’s going to have to be top five or better, right? I mean, it’s going to have to be in that space if this team is going to do anything remotely meaningful, right? If this team’s going to make the playoffs, and have, you know, whatever the rotation, whatever the pitching staff, looks like come July and August and September, if they’re going to be in a position where they have a chance to be playing October baseball, it’s going to be on the backs of their offense. And you know, it’s, it’s been choppy to say the least. You know, it’s been up and down. When it’s been good, it’s been really good. But they’ve also had their share of games where they’ve been shut out a couple times. They’ve scored one run a couple times. They’ve scored two runs a couple times. I mean, it’s, you know, there have been quite a few games where, even if the pitching wasn’t great, it was at least mediocre enough where they still had a chance to win with the best version of their offense. And you know, they’re still chasing that right now.
Nestor Aparicio 03:11
Yeah, well, I was gonna say what is that? Is that runners in scoring position? Is that hitting with two outs? Is that hitting three run home runs? Is that drawing more walks? Is that striking out less is that hitting in the double plays left? Is that running the bases better? Like, yeah,
Luke Jones 03:26
yes. I mean yes, to some degree Yes, when you look at some of those elements, I mean, I’ll say this now, obviously, on Sunday, they struck out. What? 13 times their strikeout, their strikeout profile has been about middle of the pack in Major League Baseball. Right there. They haven’t struck out at an insane clip. They haven’t been, you know, the best in baseball at avoiding strikeouts. So you look at
Nestor Aparicio 03:47
that, well, those whatever double plays, according to your nerds,
Luke Jones 03:50
yeah. Well, they, yeah. Well, they grounded. They’ve grounded into a quite a few double plays, which is kind of odd, because you look at last year, they, they set a record for the fewest double plays they grounded into. It was kind of discovered it late in the in the off season that they set a record. You know, of course, it’s not, not exactly
Nestor Aparicio 04:08
Lauer here right now, and I beamed him in, he would talk about situational hitting,
Luke Jones 04:14
sure, and that’s one of their downfalls in the second half of last year, was runners in scoring position. They were not very good. But for me, what really stands out so far, and it can be explained somewhat because of, okay, they played three games in Kansas City. The weather in Baltimore has an exact you know, wasn’t great over the weekend. You know, was better on Sunday. But still, what’s a high of 62 degrees, whatever it was. But they haven’t really hit for much power. You know, as much as everyone bemoaned, oh, this team relies on the home run too much. This team relies on the home run too much the last couple years, which I’m sorry you look at most good offenses in baseball, they hit the home run in 2025 it’s. It’s how it is.
Nestor Aparicio 05:00
Well, I go back just a long, long two weeks ago to Toronto. My neck hurt. I was sitting as well from center field. Oh, and opening day, and the ball just kept going right. It was going left and and the one thing we said, this team’s gonna hit the ball. I believe that. I’m not down on the pitching, I’m not down on the hitting. I’m just down on the fact that you can hit your way to a championship, I don’t believe that. Do I believe that this can really equal out the five All Star great players. Big Red Machine, big, sorry, wrong week for that big orange machine this week. But, you know, I will buy westburg Holiday rushman Henderson and cows are that doesn’t even mean Mullins or mount castle. The guys had been hitting home runs, right like that. When I look at the young core, those five that I give you, I’ll give you that now put that up against the five from the Cubs 10 years ago. Or I was thinking about Fred Lynn and Jim rice the other day because they had a big thing there. But just like whatever that youth movement would be the Orioles in 79 when they kind of had Eddie Murray coming together, and even, you know, Cal and 8083 8283 but I’ll buy that. This thing, this dog, will hunt you for me, the offense, the players, position players, you can win a championship with them. So I’ll begin the second half here, where maybe I get my press credential back by saying nice things about the offense.
Luke Jones 06:29
Well, it’s going to have to do that, oh, or they’re not going to be very good. I mean, period, if they don’t hit and hit at a high level, then they’re going to be a team that, who knows, 500 sub 500 whatever. I mean, it’s they’ve got to hit at that kind of level. And, you know, so far, I mean, Mullins has been fantastic. You go up and down the names in their everyday lineup and acknowledging cowsers out for at least another month, you know, month plus. But they’ve, they’ve gotten mostly decent individual performances. I mean, some guys have been better than others. I mean, Gunner Henderson obviously missed the first week of the season. He didn’t get many spring training at bats. I had five games in a minor league rehab assignment. You’re hoping Sunday, you know, the three hits he had on Sunday, that’s a sign of more to come. And I will also say this is where you You do look at stat cast and some of the saber met. You know, not, not so much, even saber metrics, but battered batted ball data. Gunners been hitting the ball hard. I mean, he hasn’t gotten the results. He hasn’t hit the ball in the air a whole lot. He said a lot of very firm ground balls. So I don’t think necessarily, you look at his numbers, I think the it’s looked better than what the stats would reflect, you know, as far as his at bats. So you’re still waiting on him. You know, the guy that I was just looking at this as, you know, as we were getting ready to begin our segment, Jackson holiday had that three that three hit day in Kansas City, the game that they won. Think he’s over 17 since then. So, you know, he’s been, you know, he was off to a good start. He struggled. Well,
Nestor Aparicio 08:03
he’s not proven, right? I mean, this year, Henderson, we say proven. You know, cows are more proven because of last year, despite the holes in the streakiness, westburg, to me, might be the best of the pack and rushman. I don’t know. I don’t know. I mean, westburg
Luke Jones 08:18
hasn’t been very good since the first series, and, you know, he’s dealing with something. I mean, the Orioles have suddenly become a hockey team where Brandon Hyde referred to it as an upper body thing. I’m guessing it’s the back, you know, because he had a little bit of a
Nestor Aparicio 08:32
back issue. Well, back to a real problem as a back issue. But it
Luke Jones 08:36
depends what it is. I mean, if it’s something that, you know, that’s kind of lingering, that’s a muscular issue, then, okay, maybe you know at some point, maybe it’s right, but if you know, heaven forbid, if it’s a disc issue or something like that, then yeah, you start to worry about it. Not I’m not sounding the alarm. I’m just telling you, you know what, what he’s kind of been dealing with. Well,
Nestor Aparicio 08:53
that would be a hell if they’re going to lose more than cows, or that’s why that’s more on the last segment, I’m with Debbie Downer and whatever nasty Nestor, whatever you want to call them, they’ve got to stay healthy. I mean, there’s going to be more injuries. There just are. Well, if there are, but
Luke Jones 09:07
if they can’t stay healthy, I mean, if they can’t get healthier on the pitching side, and if they’re going to, then they’re not going to go anywhere. And I would say that about most teams. I think even teams that have insane money payrolls, you get to a certain threshold with injuries where you just say, What do you mean?
Nestor Aparicio 09:24
You’re doing the Birdland caravan speech for them to go out next year if it doesn’t go so well. Because all you have to do is frame up the injuries to the pitchers. That’s all you have to do. And now you take cows around if any other the legs on the table start to fall more. I don’t, yeah, I mean, and it’s terrible that we’re in the middle of April masters and you know all that happened and the draft next week, but then that we’re so sort of dour on this, but we’ve watched a lot of baseball, you and me, and if it’s going to happen, it’s going to happen because they hit the hell out of the ball,
Luke Jones 09:57
yeah. And look, it’s. Very early, right? We’re just at the point now where we’re hitting the 1/10 of the way through the season. That said, it’s just, it’s the eyeball test, it’s everything about it, right? I mean, before Saturday, you know, going into Saturday, where Saturday, I think, might have been their best game collectively, you know, where they you know, not that Sagano was great as the starter, but you know, he didn’t get, you know, he didn’t give up six runs or get chased in the third inning. You know, gave him a chance. It was competitive, right? It was good enough. The bullpen was good. The the offense came alive in the in the middle of the late innings. The defense was excellent. It was the best defense they’ve played all year. So, you know, but prior to Saturday’s game, I mean, that’s where you look at this thing and say, it’s not just that they lost, it’s the way that they’ve lost, and it’s looks sloppy, and, you know, they haven’t run the bases well, and they have weren’t playing very good defense on the last road trip and, and that’s where you say because the pitching is where it is right even, even if we talk in terms of trying to be more optimistic that they get some of these pitchers back and and I’ll I’ll throw out, I’ll give you, I’ll give you a positive on the pitching side. Kyle Bradish threw his first bullpen over the weekend. No, that doesn’t mean he’s doesn’t mean he’s back in the next month or two, but if you’re eyeing a pie in the sky, best case scenario for him to be back after the all star break, then there you go. He’s throwing bullpens now, but everything about the pitching that we acknowledge, the weakness, the injuries, the question marks, whether it has enough upside, whether they have enough arms in the bullpen, if Batista is going to be able to throw back to back games at some point later in the year, all those questions fully acknowledged that you look at where they stand, they have to do the other little things really well. This team has to play good defense, especially on the infield right now, because of the cows are injury and what that means for their outfield defense. They’re not going to necessarily be great on the corners. They have Mullins, and Mullins covers a lot of ground and plays Gold Glove caliber defense at center in center field at his best. But their their infield defense needs to be on point and needs to be playing at a high level. They have to run. They can’t run themselves into outs. They have to do the little things well on top of pounding the baseball. I mean, that’s how they basically
Nestor Aparicio 12:22
watching the Blue Jays on Sunday as a film, not to play the game, right,
Luke Jones 12:26
right? Well, I mean, the way that the way the blue jay now they won because Gregory Soto gives up three runs in the eighth inning, but the Blue Jays, the things that they did on Sunday, we’ve seen too much of the Orioles doing that over the first two and a half, three weeks of the season. There’s no question about that. They have to be sharper, and that’s where it’s funny to me. Because you may you may be aware, because you’re on social media like I am, Brandon heights detractors can be quite loud, and they’ll pick apart lineup decisions and bullpen decisions, even though I’ll, you know, say over and over, that’s a much more collaborative operation
Nestor Aparicio 13:02
than, apparently, some of these yo Yos out on the internet. I think it is, you know,
Luke Jones 13:06
I don’t, but I don’t look there’s, there’s legitimacy to to elements of the criticism. There is, I mean, you could second guess, as I said, you could second guess leaving kadepovich in a little bit longer,
Nestor Aparicio 13:17
or you can’t do that and get a press credential here, trust me, but the point I’m
Luke Jones 13:23
trying to make here is what I do think you can take Brandon Hyde and the coaching staff to task on has been some of the sloppy play that we’ve seen over the first two and a half weeks, and again, this weekend, they cleaned up some of those things. So that was good to see, even though you’re still talking about a split and you know, the six and nine through the first 15. But those are the things to me, especially coming out of spring training, when you’ve seen guys throw into the wrong base, or someone running into an out, those are the kind of things where I say, what is the coaching staff doing? What did you accomplish during the spring? If, if that’s sloppy the first and second week of April, let alone where it’s going to look come July. So I think that’s a very fair criticism. But you know, we tend to, because it’s easy to talk about, it tends to be low hanging fruit, you know, lineup decisions, things like that. And I’ll also point out Saturday and Sunday, the first time all year we’ve seen the same lineup in back to back games. So you know, they had a good, good offensive performance on Saturday, got off to a good start Sunday, you know, and they scored six runs. Ultimately, should be good enough. But, you know, you’re hoping maybe they’re settling into, you know that now that gunner Henderson’s back, he’s at the top of the order. You’re hoping that his three hits on Sunday is another sign that, you know, he’s going to start getting the results. I mean, of all the things to worry about, Gunner Henderson’s near the bottom of the list for me, because, like I said, he’s hit the ball hard, even if the the numbers, you know, the batting average and the power hasn’t come yet. But you just look at this thing top to bottom, you know, they’ve they’ve got to play sharp baseball. They’ve got to be a smart. A team, they can’t run into outs. They’ve got to play good defense. As I said, I really like the way that they’re in infield defense played on Saturday and Sunday overall. You know, they’ve got to turn double plays. I mean, pitchers best friend is a double play, right? I mean, this team, they need a lot of best friends on that front, you know, for this pitching staff to try to navigate 27 outs, but it’s all going to come back to they’ve got to hit, and they’ve got to hit at a high level. And it’s good to see Ryan mountcastle Take advantage of the new left field wall on Sunday. Finally hits home run. Fact, Mount Castle had gone I think, 41 games going back to last year without a home run.
Nestor Aparicio 15:38
That’d be a weird thing in that guy’s head, you know, back and forth of the years of being here and him being who he is and the way he profiles,
Luke Jones 15:45
yeah. I mean, let’s face it, for as much as the pitchers love the wall being moved back the way it was three years ago. I mean, he was, he was numero uno in terms of guys that hated it. I mean, Trey Mancini was basically out the door when they did that. I mean, Trey didn’t like it either. Obviously, these guys are pros, right? I mean, they’re not, they’re not being malcontents over it. Let me be very clear. But I’m sorry if you’re a right handed hitter and you are looking at that, you just made my job harder in my home. I mean, it’s even if you have the best growth mindset you can find. And you say, You know what? I’m going to play, hit to all fields. I’m going to be, you know, I’m going to value doubles and all that. It’s still going to mess with your mind. It’s still going to hurt you. I don’t, I wouldn’t dispute the very distinct possibility that that hasn’t harmed him, not just in terms of what Statcast would tell you, in terms of, he lost more home runs than anyone over the last three years hitting, you know, playing half his games at Camden Yards, but also just the psychological element to that, you know, where you might develop some bad habits, or you might change your approach. You know, he’s become more of a hit to all fields guy, which might sound good at face value, but it doesn’t anymore value in its contract. Well, it’s not just but it’s not just that, but it’s also okay. There’s hitting the other way and there’s hitting the other way with authority. I mentioned to you in a recent conversation that we had, talking about Heston kerstad And so far this season. And finally, you know, he hit a home run on Saturday, hold a double on Sunday. That was good to see. So you know, maybe some signs there that he’s going to get going hitting the ball with more power, but what we’ve seen from Heston kerstadt The first couple weeks was a lot of weak contact to the opposite field. You know, Heston kerstad wasn’t drafted second overall to be, you know, a guy that is a contact hitter.
Nestor Aparicio 17:34
If you’re behind in the count, you’re playing defense. If you’re, you know, ahead in the count, you’re whacking right. And there’s nuance.
Luke Jones 17:41
Let me be clear, there’s nuance to that. I’m not saying that. I’m not saying pull it 100% of the time, but my point with someone like Heston kerstad, if he’s going to max out his value, it’s going to hit the long ball and hit for power, because he’s not a great defender. He’s not a guy that’s going to steal a ton of bases. So what is he going to do if he’s going to be a valuable commodity for you, he’s gonna have to hit for power. So good to see that from him, you know, over the weekend. But you know, you just look at this group right now, and you know, they’re waiting for gunner, right? I mean, holiday has, you know, got off to a good start, has struggled the last week. You know, Mullins has been their MVP so far. I mean, he’s been fantastic. You know, O’Neill hit a home run, hit his first home run since opening day on Sunday. That was good to see. You know, offensively, he’s been fine. Been a little disappointed in O’Neill’s defense, you know, especially a guy that’s a former Gold Glove winner. At the same time, he’s also had a ton of injuries. And at some point it’s like, okay, those injuries take a toll in terms of a player, maybe not moving quite as well. But also, do you want him diving all over the place for balls, knowing that that could end up landing him on the IL so, you know, there’s some of that. So
Nestor Aparicio 18:55
it’s a little bit of, don’t run on him, that maybe they’re running on him a little bit too. So, yeah, yeah.
Luke Jones 18:59
So, I mean, it’s, that’s why I kind of said their their infield defense needs to be great, because that’s where I said, on the corners, they’re outfield defense without cows or, you know,
Nestor Aparicio 19:09
reaching too is the guys put the ball in play. You got to catch it sure
Luke Jones 19:13
8that. That’s why, that’s why everyone’s chasing strikeouts in the modern game, right? I mean, you don’t have to defend the strikeout. And that’s where, you know, the Orioles don’t have a whole lot,
Nestor Aparicio 19:23
oh, and that’s why they come for this kind of wisdom on the internet. Luke Jones is here. He’s Baltimore, Luke, we’re doing some baseball here on the the hitting side of this, and on the pitchers they’re seeing. And one of the things for me with this, whatever the platoon system that they have in mind, to give Richmond days off, to let Sanchez play, to have luriano be a feel like he’s a part of the team, except when he’s got the bat on his into 10th inning and he’s and the games on the line. And do you really want him in there against Hoffman? Right? Like I. I I don’t know around the fringes where they have picked the other players, and I mean not the starting eight, 910, 11, I’m talking about 1213, and what they want out of Mateo, what they’re looking for from ureas, um, which is not to play every day because West Berks hurt last year, or even the outfield situation now, where you lose cows or and you’re like, Well, I mean, Mullins has been better than cows, or would have been like, there’s a point of no,
Luke Jones 20:31
you want both of them out there. That’s, that’s the problem ideally, or,
Nestor Aparicio 20:34
or you want curse that to emerge and and be that guy. None of that’s happening right now, and the Henderson part, for me, of him missing the first week leads me to be a little bit more reserved in my judgment, because I am convinced the pitching is never going to be any good at this. With this group,
21:01
I am going to argue with you.
Nestor Aparicio 21:03
I am convinced the hitting can be very good. I’m convinced the defense can be good enough. But I’m also convinced that, and I’ll go with John Harbaugh’s, you know, biblical phrase of best version of themselves on any given day, best version of all of these guys for where their ceilings are. Holiday rushman, you’re down on westburg after the weekend, and he’s got to back this and that and so but whatever, the All Star version of all of those, the potential of all that is really the potential of the franchise. Now that the pitching is gone, the potential to the franchise is we’ve got three guys we can put on the wall that look like rooks, Frank and Boog and or Luis in this case, but that doesn’t do me any good, um, that they have those kinds of foundational players. And the disappointment that I see, and I saw a big soliloquy up on the baseball factory page that looked like it might have been written by Rick Dempsey. I have no idea. In regard to you have this young talent. You surrounded him with Charlie Morton, Kyle Gibson, Sagano, like that was that disappointed Dave shining a month ago, that disappointed. John Eisenberg, a month ago, all of you memo, I’m just begging to get my press pass back. Oh, pretty please. I feel like Jon Stewart at this point. It’s like I just these pregnant pauses and these funny looks. I feel like I should, should bring graphics in, but, but nonetheless, the pitching side and bringing the graphics in of their age, of what you expect them to be, and that there’s no cavalry coming. The hitting part of this gets dissected even more when Henderson misses a week and Westbrook’s got a back ache, and rushman last year, whatever that was, and cows are not coming back. So for me, it really is like, you love loriano. He’s gotta get a big hit in the big situation late in the game, because that’s what his role is going to be. You know, you don’t want to ride rushman like the Orioles road Matt weeders, right? He’s not going to catch 146 games this year. So what do those situations look like? What do the pitching matchups look like? And I, you know, they ran into a little bit of a buzz saw out in Arizona. I thought they ran into tougher pitching, and they didn’t even see burns. So, you know, like the Yankees are in in two weeks, they’re not going to see Gerri Cole, right? They’re not going to see those kinds of imbalances that you don’t want to see when you don’t have Bradish and you don’t have burns, and you don’t have effluent at this point, right? I mean, you don’t have any, you don’t have anything. You would go to a playoff game and say, I like, I like my picture tonight. And they don’t have, they don’t have anything like that in their arsenal. So this really has to be situationally, that they’re putting the right hitters on the field. And these guys, to your point, are getting the job done. And whether that’s Kobe Mayo coming up because he does well, or whether that’s Messiah, I don’t know, but at some point, cursed that is going to be on a rope, I don’t know, with holiday. I mean, you know that’s going to be part of him being so young, is on off again. Let him just freaking play. Let’s not be cleaning out his locker and threatened to send him to Norfolk. Well, Johnny, he is hitting 212 you know what I mean? Like, there’s going to be a little bit of that going on to because I don’t think he’s at a point where he’s going to fly like a big bird right now. I don’t think he’s going to look the part of consistently hit 282, 90 every week. You know what I mean? Like, it’s it’s going to be choppy as it is for young players, and that’s a tougher thing to do when you feel like I got to get two hits every night, because, like, the team needs me to get two hits every night, because we got to get 12 hits every night, because we got to score six runs every night. Because 234, runs. Solo home runs, drawing a walk and a getting it done.
Luke Jones 25:02
Yeah, I mean, a couple things. One, I want to clarify what I’m not down on westburg. I’m just, I was just pointing out that he’s, you know, since hitting three home runs the first three games, he’s six for 39 without an extra base hit.
Nestor Aparicio 25:15
And you’re lowering your expectation under the guys that he’s he might be playing with something. And again, it’s not we witnessed this with rutschman into a dark hole, sure. I mean, really, you know what guys do this, right? So we’re evaluating them based on what we see, but not on what we know. And right? And
Luke Jones 25:33
again, I’m just, I’m just pointing out what’s happened the last two weeks. You and I are going to talk so much about two week segments over the course of a six month season, and certain guys are going to look like Babe Ruth, and other times they’re going to look like Manny Alexander, right? I mean, it’s, you know, that that’s just the natural
Nestor Aparicio 25:50
way they talk about it when they get together after you said, say, this guy’s swinging it, well, then I don’t like what’s going on. You got to work with him in a cage. We’re going to give him a day down, right? I mean, you, yeah,
Luke Jones 25:59
you said something there that resonated with me, and I think it really speaks to where they are, especially now with cows are out of the picture for the time being, and knowing that, that has made Heston kerstadt basically an everyday player, which is fine. I mean that you have them in your system still, and he’s done everything he can do a triple A fine, but I think they’re really at a place now with their bench, you look at where their bench is with kerstadt not coming off the bench, right, and he’s in the lineup every day, which also factors into Mount castle and O’Hearn as the first baseman and designated hitter, where, whereas if you had a healthy cowser, you probably are giving Oh Hearn and mount Castle a couple more days here and there, because then you’re going to DH curse that in those spots. But, you know, with cows are out of the picture. It is what it is. But I think right now, fully acknowledging, yeah, Adley rodsman, just like any catcher can’t catch every single day, you’re going to have to give guy days off, and the backup catcher is going to play a little bit. So you have that, but beyond arias and maybe the formula for him, and you mentioned Jackson holiday. And look, if you’re going up against a Garrett crochet or a Tariq school, or really tough left handed pitch, I mean, they’re going to face, you know, on Tuesday night, they’re going to face Logan Allen, you know, I don’t know if that’s the, you know, that that’s the threshold, per se, but they’re facing a lefty. Is that a way to give holiday a blow, and it gets Arias into the lineup who has hit, I mean, for as much as guys like me have tried to jettison the Ramon aureuses of this roster over the last three years in in favor of the young guys coming up, Maria says a useful player. He’s a productive player. So, so I would say, of all their bench options right now, he’s the guy that you still want to keep in the mix a little bit here and there, but it’s not going to be a lot, because if everything’s going well, you’ve got you have gunner Anderson at short, you have Westberg at third, and you have Jackson holiday at second last week aside. I mean, big picture. It’s a one one. It was the best prospect in baseball, like you, you you have every bit of confidence that he’s going to do the job long term.
Nestor Aparicio 28:11
Well, you keep Mateo around and run the bases, right? Well, and that’s but, that’s but that’s where I
Luke Jones 28:15
look at this thing. And I just say where it stands right now. I mean, Mateo is really only good for that job right now. I mean, still doesn’t have a hit yet this year, right? And we’ve seen what it’s become for as good as he was in 2022 where he looked and he actually hit and looked like the kind of guy that, who knows, maybe could be a starting caliber shortstop. Since then, I think we’ve seen what he is. You know he’ll he’ll have six or seven weeks over the course of a full season where he hits the ball, and you know he’s going to defend and not in the outfield, talking shortstop, in second base, let’s say, and you know he’s going to be able to run. But you know how much, when you look at the makeup of the Orioles current lineup, are there really that many spots for him to play? You know, that’s where I said, Okay, Urias, you know, to give holiday a day off every now and then against a tough left, deep fine, or to give westburg a blow, because he’s not 100% fine, but otherwise, you want those guys in there. And Mateo is on the bench. Loriano, you know, they signed him, you know, for some more depth, and then someone who can hit left handed pitching, but, you know, he’s got to do it. I mean, it’s how much, you know, how much value is there to that when, at this point, Mullins is playing at a very high level, okay, you can set curse, dad, fine. Tyler O’Neal needs some days off here and there. But again, it’s kind of a limited profile. That’s why I kind of liked what we saw Saturday and Sunday, from the standpoint of, you use the same lineup, and it was basically your nine best regulars. And I want to see more of that for right now. You know, once cows are comes back, and assuming you don’t. Obviously, the caveat is someone else could get hurt, and that’s that’s why you have a bench, and that’s why you have depth. But where things stand? I don’t see much of a place to give Jorge Mateo starts. I don’t see a place for loriano to get very many starts. Like I said, Arias is kind of the one guy on the bench where I say, okay, you know, try to see if you can get him a couple starts a week, you know.
Nestor Aparicio 30:22
But, and when he plays, you want Richmond at the age, right?
Luke Jones 30:26
Yeah, sure, sure. And, but even then, I don’t want it to be, you know, it’s not a 5050, times share, you know. I it’s going to be once, maybe twice a week, you know, beyond that, I mean, you want Richmond in there. So you said it, though, really, with these young guys, and holiday is probably the best example of this, and it’s good example, even now, as he’s scuffling over the last week and you’ve seen the average drop, I still want them to play, because I kind of look at this and say, you know, long term, what’s the real benefit to him? You’re sitting him, if the alternative is Jorge Mateo playing second base that night, right? I mean, I mean, it just, it’s not like it’s another competitor. It
Nestor Aparicio 31:12
became his job. But Norby went away, right? Just in a general sense, right? Norby would be a guy that they would sandwich in here.
Luke Jones 31:17
I mean, maybe, right, maybe. But, well, if he couldn’t do it, if he could, sure, sure they were hurt. But, you know, clear, but, but you at some point in time, you’re just like, you’ve got to sink or swim with these young guys. And there’s no reason to think that Jackson holiday can’t do the job and and I’ll point out, even as he has struggled over the last week, we’re not seeing the strikeout rate be insane, like it was last year. You know, it’s still high. He still strikes out a lot, too much, but it hasn’t been, you know, where, I mean, like early last year he was striking out in half of his at bats, right? I mean, it was extreme. I’d like to see him walking a little bit more. I i do think I’ve seen some numbers. And, you know, obviously we have, we can keep track of umpire grades and things of that nature. He’s gotten rung up on some tough calls. I’ll say that and that, you know, in two weeks that that’s more meaningful than it is over the course of a whole season. But, you know, I just play them. You know, play these guys. Heston kerstead, play them. But because, okay,
Nestor Aparicio 32:22
finish your thought to Brandon Hyde. But it
Luke Jones 32:26
just comes down to, you know, what is Ramon lauriana like? What are you getting out of that?
Nestor Aparicio 32:31
Well, that’s on Elias, right? And that’s on, if cows are goes down, this is what it’s going to look like. You got to play that game, right? If this guy gets hurt. What’s this going to look like
Luke Jones 32:41
you do? You do but, but at the same time? I mean, I want to find out about Heston kerstat. He’s 26 you know, he’s
Nestor Aparicio 32:49
just giving you that opportunity. It may cost you half a season if he hits 212 but
Luke Jones 32:54
what’s rammel Laureano going to do? I got you. You know what I mean? Like, that’s what I mean. It’s not like you have an all star sitting on the bench, right? So, so,
Nestor Aparicio 33:04
and I’m with you. Two years ago, you felt differently about Mateo and Urias as a backdrop to this, you know, Hearn coming into this and you know, more bats. I don’t feel like you feel that way right now about Mayo this minute, that he’s going to be a real contributor here this year. He’s got, I mean, he’s got to give. And the jury’s out of whether cursed, that could be a contributor here, yeah. I
Luke Jones 33:26
mean, especially if he’s going to be anything resembling a starting caliber contributor, or is he, you know, if cows are were healthy right now, curse, that would have been the guy that maybe comes off the bench and gives you an at bat late in the game, you know, pinch hitting for, I don’t know. I mean,
Nestor Aparicio 33:41
and he’s got to succeed at that, that’s a completely different job. Sure, sure.
Luke Jones 33:45
And that’s why, that’s why, for me, the silver lining to cows are being out. And believe me, cows are being out hurts. I mean, he’s the defense alone and the flexibility it gives your outfield to rest to Cedric Mullins against some lefty starters, which ideally you’d like to do, but they’re not really in a position where they can do that. Because what are you going to put lauriano in center I mean, I don’t think that’s I I don’t think that’s a great defensive fit at this point in lauriano’s career, three, four or five years ago, sure, you know, but I don’t think he’s really a guy that you want to start in center field very often. And that’s where I kind of beg the question right now, if you get to a point where you have a run of left handed starters that you’re facing, you know, is Dylan Carlson a better fit for that bench? You know, to come off the bench and, you know, start occasionally for Mullins. I mean, I’m not saying that’s ideal, either, but, you know, the Mateo specialized pinch runner role, it’s fine for right now, because of cows are being out, but once he’s back, you know, is that really a big enough role for for what you’d like to have on your bench? I mean, I don’t know. You know, I’m just begging the question. I’m asking a question. That’s it. But. But you know, for me, it really comes down to they’ve got a starting nine at this point that kind of what you want to trot out there just about every single day, acknowledging that, yeah, rutchman needs it a couple more days off as a catcher than your typical, than your other position players. But and guys are gonna need a blow every now and then. But, you know, just, they gotta play these guys and and they’ve gotta perform, and they’ve gotta perform at a high level. I mean, it’s just kind of, is, you know, it’s what they it’s why they drafted these guys, right? It’s why they made holiday one, one, and these other guys are first round picks or second round picks. I mean, it’s, it’s what they’ve their entire rebuild was based on that, you know, because it certainly wasn’t drafting pitching early. So that’s what they need, and that’s what they need these guys to do. And it is tough, you know, you made the point about, you know, it’s kind of the, you know, heavy is the crown, so to speak, when you’re someone like Jackson holiday, where you’re 21 years old, and not that they’re asking you to bat clean up, but you need to be consistent. You need to play like a one one. You need to play like the top prospect.
Nestor Aparicio 36:09
So for me, with Him, if we had talked about this with shining, if he hits 260 and 12 home runs and drives in 58 runs and gets on base a little bit and draw some walks and has that’s an average profile second baseman, and you know, whatever, as a 2122 year old, to say that the next step is, we’re going to get you up to 278, and you’re going to hit 19 home runs the next year. And by the time you’re 25 you’re going to be a guy that can hit 300 you can hit 30 home runs. You understand the game better. And you’re 25 you know, and they expect everybody to be gunner Henderson or Bobby Witt or whatever that that is the next level down is not bad.
Luke Jones 36:55
Oh, no question. And look, if that’s what he does this year, that’s still better than what Jorge Mateo would do playing every day at second base. So, so there’s there. Look, I’m not saying he needs to be an all star, but you know, he does need to be a positive for this team and and let me be clear, I think even that with the last week, fully acknowledging he’s scuffled over the last week. I think his defense has looked better at second base than it did last year. I think that’s been good to see. So I think he’s finding ways to contribute. I think he’s fine. I’m not going to sit here and say that the numbers look great right now because they don’t, but I’m also I’m not even considering where we were a year ago at this time, where he came up and looked
Nestor Aparicio 37:43
so far, dude, I’m in a different place with him than I am Charlie Morton with an ad RA or what I mean, of course, because
Luke Jones 37:49
there’s upside there. You’d like to think he’s ascending where, whereas Charlie Morton, the best case scenario is to hold on for one more year. I mean, that’s just especially someone who’s 41 let alone talking about some of the other guys they have that are older, but not that old. But that’s where you just look at this team’s upside and their path to being an 88 win team, a 90 win team, a wild card team, a team that maybe wins the division, because the Al East isn’t, you know, no one’s that complete of a roster. Any of those scenarios involve this offense being one of the very best in baseball. Anything short of that, they’re not going to be good enough then, I mean, they’re just, they’re not, I don’t see enough of a path for even the best case scenario with your various pitchers. You know, whether you’re talking about the rotation or the pen, their offense needs to be an elite offense. I mean, this is kind of like in
Nestor Aparicio 38:48
high it’s going to look like the village idiot every time loriano comes up and, you know, 11th inning and has to win the game for him, you know. I mean, I promise.
Luke Jones 38:55
And to be clear, that’s that’s going to be most teams, right? I mean, most teams aren’t going to have a bench that, you know, you might have one guy on your bench that you really like in that kind of spot, you know, like Terry Crowley, you know,
Nestor Aparicio 39:07
I was gonna say the professional Jim Dwyers and Terry Crowley, yeah. I mean, I
Luke Jones 39:11
might have one guy, domin Young was that guy a decade ago for the Orioles, right? You might have one guy that does that, you know, do the Orioles have that right now? No, it doesn’t really feel like it. I mean, maybe Urias could be that guy, you know, give you a professional at bat. But at the same time, this goes back to what I said, ideally with these young position players, they’re not in too many spots where you want to pinch hit for them, right? I mean, that’s kind of the, you know, that’s kind of the point of what I said, and, and I get it, oh, Hearn’s not going to play against left handed starters, for example. So that opens up a spot for someone. Well,
Nestor Aparicio 39:45
8you got five guys that are one, one potential All Star guys,
Luke Jones 39:50
right? Yeah, you hope they’re everyday players and and even Mateo is a like Mount, even someone like Mount Castle, I’m not saying he’s stealing bases, but for a first baseman, he runs. Well, yep. Gunner Anderson runs well. Westburg runs well. You know, Mullins obviously runs well. Holiday steals bases. So it even that. I mean, you only have so many guys, okay? Rutschman in the ninth inning, yeah. Mateo run for him sure. You know, I’m not, there are some spots, but you don’t have seven plotters in your lineup, where you’re saying, oh my gosh, I need to get someone in there to run for them in the eighth inning. I mean, they have a couple guys like that. So really, I mean, it comes back to your starting nine and go out and play, go, go, do it. I mean, whatever you get from the bench. I mean, yeah, you hope, if someone has to play, that they can be serviceable. But for the most part, I mean, I want those their best nine right now without cows or and taking, you know, throwing possibilities like mayo and beside out of the equation for Now go play. I mean, it’s just it. It sounds very simplistic. It’s a captain obvious kind of thing to say, but it’s just kind of where I am right now. I mean, I want Jackson holiday to play every day, and I get it. He’s going to have some ups and downs, but I think in the big picture sense, and as 2025 continues, you’re going to be better for it, rather than being in a position where, oh, he’s, he’s really scuffled the last four or five games, we need to sit him down. And, you know, I don’t think they’re going to do that this year with him. I last year, sure, you know, because it was pretty extreme what we saw. But you just they’re gonna have to sit, you’re gonna have to sink or swim with these guys. I mean, this is everything your franchise was built around. And, you know, go, go play. And you need those guys to hit, and I think they will, but they need to hit at a higher level than they have over the first two and a half weeks. I mean, that’s just just reality with the state of where they’re pitching is right now. And you know, whether that’s fair or not,
Nestor Aparicio 41:50
where they are, Luke and I have made it through a whole segment of that calling the Cleveland team by their old nickname. We’ll see if that holds up all week, the Guardians, the guard, the mighty guard, coming in this week, as well as some of my Cleveland mafia. I’ll be checking in my whole Ohio mafia. I got the Cincinnati people coming in too. It almost feels like an old school AFC North matchup NFL drafters next week, Luke is monitoring that we got Mike tenier on for all you old timers, I think Jordan westburg is going to be my favorite artist who wears number 11. No particular reason, but I did have a Doug desensees, my other favorite number 11 on last week as well. I hope you find all of this cool stuff that we’ve been doing on the baseball side. Barry bloom joined me last week from sportico talking about the business of the team. I also have some other business folks this week is Mr. Rubenstein gives away bobble heads on Saturday night, because we all need a owner bobblehead and a hat. All I’m looking for is my legitimate press credential, Mr. Rubenstein, that’s all my dear. Katie Griggs letter is coming this week as well, and the emergence of the Reds coming to Baltimore. I can’t think of the Reds coming to Baltimore without thinking of Sparky Anderson and Earl Weaver. So, you know, I hung out with Sparky once Luke It was, it was life altering when he managed the Detroit Tigers. I I use my press pass every time the Tigers came to town. I would make sure I was there at the end of the game so I could be at sparkies post game, where he would sit there in his jock and eat food off the plate and spittle at you and talk to you and stuff like that. And all I could think about, you know, 1970 and the Big Red Machine being a kid, so the reds and the Orioles playing baseball. It still screws up an old guy like me, but we’re going to get to it later in the week, big week draft baseball. We even had a little golf tournament over the weekend. I might talk about before it’s all over with here Maryland, crab cake Tori is moving to Beaumont this week. We’ll see you out there on Wednesday, next Thursday, we will be, excuse me, Thursday next Wednesday, we will be at Cooper’s north and then we’ll be at Coco’s pub on the 30th as well. I’m getting my Wednesdays and Thursdays all screwed up. Please refer to the Baltimore positive for all the official details. You.
