All is very quiet in Owings Mills and the aftermath of the NFL Owners Meetings in Florida but owner Steve Bisciotti (quietly) inked head coach John Harbaugh to a three-year extension and team president Sashi Brown defended keeping Justin Tucker on the roster. Luke Jones and Nestor turn their lonely eyes from lots of baseball to some spring attention onto Ravens’ talking points as “zero tolerance” continues to be a laughable concept within the franchise.
Nestor Aparicio and Luke Jones discussed the Baltimore Ravens’ recent developments, including the team’s quiet behavior at owners meetings and the controversial extension of John Harbaugh’s contract. They highlighted the ongoing investigation into Justin Tucker’s alleged misconduct, noting the team’s lack of public statements and the potential impact on Tucker’s future. They also mentioned the re-signing of Ben Cleveland despite his recent DUI, suggesting a lack of concern for off-field conduct. The conversation concluded with reflections on the Ravens’ overall integrity and the upcoming draft, which could signal the team’s stance on Tucker’s future.
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
Baltimore Ravens, Justin Tucker, John Harbaugh, zero tolerance, owners meetings, Ray Rice, Ben Cleveland, NFL investigation, kicker draft, team integrity, media ban, off-field issues, player discipline, football decisions, crab cake tour.
SPEAKERS
Luke Jones, Nestor Aparicio
Nestor Aparicio 00:01
Welcome home. We are W, N, S T am 1570 Towson, Baltimore. We are Baltimore positive. We are taking the Maryland crap cake tour on the roads, first at Faith Lee’s on Wednesday before the Red Sox Orioles game two. Luke and I will be there for that. If you are actually hearing this on the back end of that piece, we’re going to be discussing some Baltimore Ravens here. Do a little state of the Ravens as we get up on the liars luncheon in the draft. Take a little break from all things baseball. We’ve done a lot of baseball around here. I’m wearing my Costa shirt to honor the man, the myth, the legend, the late great Costas, who passed this week, very, very tragically. We mourned him on Sunday, and we’re going to be over there eating crab cakes, eating mushroom caps the way we want to do it, the way we’ve always done it. His family said this is going to be the new normal. Uh, we’ll be there next Friday, the 11th, April the 11th, at Costa sin, and we will have, I’ll probably have some monopoly scratch offs by then from Roz also on the 17th of April, will be at the Beaumont in Catonsville. On the 23rd Wednesday, the 23rd will be a Cooper’s pub up in Timonium. And then on the 30th of April, that is a Wednesday before the Orioles take on the Yankees, we’re going to be at Coco’s pub. We’re going to start things off at fates this week. If you hear Mark Viviano around here, he’s going to come down and join us. I have some special invites after some folks before the Red Sox game. Luke joins us now. Um, we’ve done pitching bullpen, me being the April Fool. Um, the Terp situation and everything’s going on there. Um, the Ravens very quiet. They’ve snuck out to these owners meetings, um, which I am banned from, and attended for almost two decades. You attended last year. Harbaugh and Bucha famously ran for me on the veranda this time last year, and they had it again. And the Justin Tucker thing, the winds blow on that. The har ball contract thing happens as a Friday afternoon, 6pm news dump. I you know, I don’t know man dogs and cats. I never thought there come a point where I would be saying the Baltimore Ravens would ban me from being a media member, or the way they operate, or the zero tolerance policy, or what Ray Rice did, the Steve Bucha his head through all of this, but Justin Tucker’s employed. I’m still not a media member. John harbald has got a three year extension. They decided to announce it. Instead of celebrating like their Hall of Fame coach and all of that stuff, they news dumping it six o’clock on a Friday. It’s just, it’s almost like Chad Steele runs their communications. Well,
Luke Jones 02:40
as I said to you, I guess it was probably Saturday morning, Friday night later, you know, hours after they had announced it, this puts John Harbaugh in very unique territory. I mean, you think about the history of the National Football League, even going back to the days of Papa Bear and, you know, Benson Tom
Nestor Aparicio 03:00
Landry last how you know that Shula let I mean, it feels like we’re getting there.
Luke Jones 03:04
You’re talking about someone who is now going to be entering so 2008 it’s 2015 I mean, he’s entering year 18. This contract will take him, contractually speaking, assuming he plays it out over the 20 year threshold and in the history of the National Football League. I mean, how many coaches can you talk about that had a 20 year tenure somewhere? I mean, that’s a short list. I mean, it’s happened, not saying it’s unprecedented, but when you consider where we are, what coaching, what the coaching shelf like, has become, shelf life has become in the last 25 years. Let’s say, you know the 21st century, you don’t see very much of that, so it’s a big deal. And regardless of anyone’s individual feelings on John Harbaugh, and you know, their lack of playoff success in recent years, they won a lot of football games, and he’s been very successful, and he’s been here a long time, and you would think that’s something that should be celebrated in the way that not to say that they need to call a big press conference and make it a huge deal. But there was no press release, no statement from the coach, no statement from the owner, no statement from
Nestor Aparicio 04:16
the gentleman. If you wanted to talk to John, you had to get on a plane and fly to Florida unless sure me, and then they wouldn’t let you in. I want to make sure we’re clear on how they communicate. Because I’m not. I’m not just going to let it fly. Oh, shut up about your press pass. No. Fu, you call them and ask them why they would do that to a local organ that that’s really the question, because I’m not just going to let that go this time of year, because they do act in bizarre fashion. Sashi brown about the Justin Tucker thing, I mean, Royal farms, you’ll never see Justin Tucker on a billboard again. I promise you that, because that’s how they feel about their brand, right? Like, I don’t that part of this dude, we should all be holding our nose. We really. Really should be about this zero tolerance thing that he crows about selling cars down here on York Road, nothing, Owings, Mills, two locations. Hope you’re doing well, Barry. I don’t know what to say, but like they act, it’s bizarre, that’s all. That’s it not bizarre that they would give hardball money, or he’d have low integrity, or he would lie about injuries, or whatever, whatever his thing is, or mention God right away when he gets his money, which great, all good, but just the behavior of all of it, right? The what Tucker could get away with here for a decade, right? Just all of it. All of it is just, it’s just weird. That’s all I mean. And to portray as anything else, when you have a this is Fit contract,
Luke Jones 05:52
Rob, I’d have to so he got one,
Nestor Aparicio 05:58
eight more in 25 Yeah, right around the Super Bowl for your deals, right? I mean, it’s gonna be 20 years. It’s got to be five, five deals, something like that. Yeah. I mean, it’s been, I mean, like, this is a big deal, and I don’t know why they wouldn’t run at it instead of away from it. I don’t know why they operate like the Wizard of Oz in a general sense. Where’s bashati This week, right? Where’s bashati In general, right? Is he? I know enough to know Steve’s never going to hire another coach like anybody that knows Steve knows he thinks of John as a son like and that’s a fact. That’s just the way it is. So that’s why they’re all in on things like going after me. That’s why they’re all in on things like protecting Tucker, if that’s what they feel like they’re doing, because they’re, they’re all in, you know, they really are and and they’re good at what they do, right? I mean, they’re, you know, this is a but they’re also awful at other things that they do, and this Tucker thing and the emotional intelligence and the human touch, and the way they handle the Wembley knee, just and just all of the Johnny Bravo in they do with the guys that they hire in suits and put out in front of all of this. It. It’s really weird that Har ball is the executive of executive CEO, the guy who had no responsibility at all for my press credential, but runs the entire place. And you and I have been told face to face by everybody who’s ever worked for him, that’s John’s building. Steve doesn’t even come in the building, and Sashi Brown is just the the you know, counting the beans and moving in the tickets and moving out the sponsorships. And they make billions of dollars, and it doesn’t even matter what he or anybody there does or what sweet sales. Yeah, they all get their bonuses, like Glengarry, Glen Ross and all that, but like they’re making so much money that it doesn’t matter what they pay Lamar or what happens to mark Andrews. But the thing is that it looks good and feels good, and John allegedly does that for them, and then they dump a 6pm It’s just weird. I mean, they should be proud of all of this. He should be on billboards all over the city if they’re really proud of him. Feels like they always run from their lack of playoff success when they don’t have it anytime. When Harbaugh used to speak to me the first 15 years this time of year, I would see him six times at the hotel, breakfast, lunch, dinner, out, drinks, Mike Tomlin, and after they would lose like this, every time he would see me, he would talk ball with me like he does with you, in the way that if we just could have done this, if we just would have done that, or, you know, what do you think of my team, my team, my team, like they’re an all in thing. But there is this part where the tail goes between the legs when they piss away an AFC Championship game at home. And now they come back this year and they they mark Andrews and the ball. I mean, so bad that Mark Andrews didn’t even stand up, and he still isn’t, still he still hasn’t spoken to the meet. Not nothing, right, like so it just they don’t operate in a way. And I mean this from my heart, it’s not an April Fool’s thing. They don’t operate in a way that I’m proud of. As a guy who was a PSL holder who pimped them for 30 years, they they don’t act in a way that they’re even proud of. What they do accomplish, and I’ll give them all the credit in the world that they accomplish things, but they do things that they they’re poorly run in that way. They’re poorly run in a communications way. They’re well run as a reality TV show on ravens.com you know, they’re really that, that they’re really good at that part of the reality, part the rest of it. Justin Tucker, making announcements. Accountability when they’re tight end, drops the ball at the end. Accountability for the owner, accountability for the team president, holding midnight press conferences in Florida for the three people that get. On the plane that are funded by the New York Times and and Disney to do that kind of work at the breakers or wherever they are this week, that’s $800 a night. I witnessed it all, and this, they should be proud of John Harbaugh signing this deal, right? I mean, I and they just, they Zig instead of zagging in certain ways, that is, it’s peculiar, but they’re hiding from Justin Tucker right now, and they’re doing everything they can do to hide from Justin Tucker. And I swear to god, dude, I swear to you. And this is not an April Fool’s joke, even though I it’s April Fools, it feels like they might bring him back and kick, you know, like, I swear to God, it feels like they may just pretend this didn’t happen. Say he’s innocent, innocent, innocent, isn’t it? You can’t prove it, and that’s that. And go boom and yell at him if all you want, but he’s going to be our kicker. I swear, if it feels maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe.
Luke Jones 11:02
I mean, that’s why I’ve said to you all along. I mean, nothing would truly surprise me. I mean, look, we’ve been over a lot of this. There’s an investigation going on. I’ve continued to say that I would not be surprised if you know this comes to a head draft weekend, if there’s the kicker that they like that’s there when they want to pick a kicker, and you do it, and, you know, you kind of, you lean on whatever the investigation is going to say, and understanding it’s done by the NFL. And there’s, you know, that’s problematic in the way that we’ve talked about those types of instances for years in the National Football League. But you can also lean on the fact that he just he’s coming off the worst year of his career performance wise, and you can talk about it in those terms as well. So look, we’re 11 years removed from Ray Rice.
Nestor Aparicio 11:55
They were fully aware of what
Luke Jones 11:56
happened in that elevator in that casino in Atlantic City, and they were going to bring them back so until TMZ, no,
Nestor Aparicio 12:04
they were going to put, they put him in his wife out in front of it, the lie about what happened. Well, I just, but I, but my point is, they knew what happened, and they orchestrated getting him back onto the field with a serious six months worth of lies like, you know, it wasn’t one little thing, it wasn’t one little detour, and that’s the thing that all these years later, that I’m not proud of this. I mean, they behave in a disgraceful on behalf of me and my family and anyone listening to my voice, disgraceful is the way I was. It was disgraceful. And then these things continue to happen, and it’s very clear why they have press conferences with Sashi brown in the middle of nowhere in the middle of the night in Florida, and why the owners never available. And I guess, I guess that paranoia leads to John Harbaugh getting knighted at six o’clock on a Friday night on opening day weekend, you know, I mean, in the middle of March mad, you know, like it, I, I it’s, it’s peculiar, bizarre, if not,
Luke Jones 13:11
yeah. I mean, I don’t know if there’s any tie in with the timing of the John Harbaugh announcement with that, other than just, it just felt just weird like that. They didn’t make a little more of a thing about it, because, you know, you’re talking about a coach is going to be with one team for 20 years again. That wasn’t that common 50 years ago, let alone today. So, you know, as far as tying those two,
Nestor Aparicio 13:34
but I think Tucker’s the background on this. They don’t want to touch anything, because the first questions about Justin Tucker, and that’s the one that they’re gonna they’ve got, you Chad’s got them all coached up with his little script that he was taught and, you know, his little military thing, you know? And it feels, it feels like trumpology To me, that the press conferences take on whoever that woman is, whatever her name is, that fronts for Trump and carries his dirty water. It’s just they don’t want to talk about Justin Tucker. And I swear to you, I’m starting to think that they think he can kick for them again. And that’s like, I can’t believe, why that is of April Fool’s joke, right? Like, why, you know, why aren’t they just conducting normal business? Because they can’t, because they’re in the middle of a ridiculous scandal, ridiculous scandal that no one acknowledges, but everybody acknowledged to me, with my hair out on opening day, the city knows what’s going on, but they’re behind a moat, living at the breakers at 1000 bucks a night. So they I just think that there’s a real sensibility and out of touch part of their and I would say that to anybody, anywhere, the arrogance, the wealth, the made men, the you can’t touch us, though we can have anybody kick we want. He’s employed by them today, and they’re defending it the. President of the team stepped up in front of what’s left of the media that hasn’t been exterminated me who would have asked real questions, and that’s why they don’t want me there. Dick Cass Preston desashi, get Nestor out of here. He knows what’s going on, that when they have a scandal. I’m not there to ask questions, and nobody’s really there to ask questions, and I guess they don’t feel any heat in the building about it, right? I mean, I or they feel so much heat that they can’t operate normally. And I don’t know what normal is, because normal for them is a deep, deep, deep sense of paranoia. That’s normal that baseline for John Harbaugh is paranoia, and everything that goes below that is probably explained by whoever his shrink would be. To be honest with you, you know what I mean, whatever’s in his head about what makes him paranoid about information, real, true information, because they’ll, they’ll lead you in a popcorn trail in the wrong direction, plenty. And this is one of those cases where defending Tucker is leading me in the popcorn trail of dude. He might kick for them again. They’re leading on that. He’s their kicker right now. The team president did that the other day. Who, by the way, ran the Browns into the ground. Are they already in
Luke Jones 16:15
the ground? Well, he was running football. I mean, I don’t want to he was actually involved with their football decision. So I that point is a little bit different, but
Nestor Aparicio 16:24
which makes him eminently qualified to run. I mean,
Luke Jones 16:30
what do you want me to say? He’s part of their team until he’s not anymore? And as I said from the beginning of this, I think they’re trying to, and again, this is how I’m interpreting what they’re trying to do here. Think they’re trying to give him some semblance of, you know, it’s not due process, because, you know, the statute of limitations, you know, there is no legal investigation for this, but there’s an investigation being conducted, legitimate or as illegitimate, legitimate as people want to judge it. I think they’re trying to just let it blow over. Um, I mean, maybe. But at the same time, they also talked at length, you know, he Harbaugh was asked down at the owners meetings about drafting a kicker, and they, they talked a lot about that. And it sounds like Randy Brown’s doing a lot of homework on that, and now, if they don’t draft a kicker, and we get through rookie mini camp and there’s not the next Justin Tucker trying out in the way that Justin Tucker did 13 years ago, and ultimately unseated Billy Cundiff then, yeah, then, I guess they’re keeping them, I suppose, but at the same time, we’re still in a position where they’re five months away from playing a meaningful game. And, you know, I kind of said to you from jump straight if they’re going to replace him there, you know, it still felt to me like draft weekend would be one of the more likely times where, you know, the shoe would drop and some kind of finality would come out of this. And we’re not, you know, we’re not quite there yet. So at the same time, you know, you were, when we talked about this, the first week or two after the the banners, original report came out, you were convinced that he was definitely gone. And I
Nestor Aparicio 18:16
just figured that’d be clean and nice for them, and they’d say he, he’s sort of, you know, time has come and he didn’t kick well, and that would have made it so they didn’t have the questions. Now, instead, he’s venerable Hall of Fame. We’re going to stand by him. Stand by look. Art modell flew down to Atlanta for Ray Lewis and went into a courtroom, right? So I don’t know how far Steve Bucha or Shashi Brown went so far as to go out and say, Never met those massage therapists. Didn’t talk to them, didn’t the due process. Roger Rogers down the hall. Go talk to him. He’ll be here with his phony ass press conference tomorrow, and Rogers in charge of the investigation now, though it’s not, I mean, that’s, that’s what they do, man. I mean, I danced that dance for years and years, until they threw me out for calling them out on it after Ray Rice, right? So while I own season tickets and PSLs and bought tickets and ran road, I mean, like, you know, I’m a flag waiver for football and for community, and especially on the my feet still hurt from walking around the ballpark on Monday. I love the city. I love the teams. I love what they’re supposed to stand for, and then what they really stand for, egotistical billionaire guys who run and hide when it’s convenient for them show up at the to hold the trophy up like, you know, I had an April Fool’s gig in me Why does quit sports, for all these reasons, for all the things we sit here and say, been want, if I had to come back and explain this to my dad or your dad in the middle of all of this, especially the behavior of the Ravens. The owners meetings weren’t moved on purpose to to opening day weekend for the ravens, but it is, it’s given them. A good chance to just slide this part of it away this year. It’s never a great thing, but sometimes hardballs Use this period of time to jump on the table for special teams, for rules, for rules changes, for whatever it would be. But there, I’ve also been there. I mean, I’ve done a couple dozen of these owners meetings. It’s a big deal because all the owners, all the wives, all the general I mean, it’s all in one room. You witnessed it last year. It’s pretty impressive thing. It was more impressive when you know Mr. Benson. You know when the old line owners would wheel in 25 years ago. Now it’s too much corporate people and a bunch of really young Gen really, really young executive people, and much more colorful than it used to be, too. But this is a time where you crow about things and springs eternal and all of that. But if you have a scandal, and I was down there when Belichick had his multiple scandals on, you know, football pressure. I was down there when the Ben Roethlisberger hit the fan with Mike Conlon, it’s a very uncomfortable table to be at if you got a Hall of Fame kicker that’s been accused of what Justin Tucker has been accused of, because the national media does get their one crack at horrible one time every reporter in the lead Is there, and if the scandal is big enough, it’s a big setup, and they want to run from Tucker, so I guess whatever I can see har ball. I mean, look, he and John. He and Steve shook hands on this years ago. I mean, I can see Steve, how long you want to coach the team, John, let me know. Just let me know. And that that would be how they would that that’s how that would negotiation would go. And John would be, as long as you want to be the coach, you’re going to be the coach, John, and that that really is the case. I mean, I’m not that’s my reporting on this. That’s not my opinion. Um, so John gets to three years. That puts him into you can’t ask questions about his job security, no matter what start season one and two, Lamar gets hurt. He’s safe, right? He was safe anyway. I mean, there’s been one or two times maybe he felt unsafe. He was never unsafe. Steve was never firing him. But Steve doesn’t want to hire a coach. Steve does not want his hands dirty. Steve never wants to answer a question clearly from me or anyone like me ever again. Steve never wants to sit with the media ever again to talk about any facet of the money he got the stadium. It’s very, very clear, right? So John can move into that place for the next couple of years to protect Steve until whatever point he wants to sell the team and get rid of it or he wins again, which would help his ego and justify all of the bloody deeds of everything, and say, state delivered 600 million for me. I delivered another championship. It nights John into the Hall of Fame. John’s got Hall of Fame in his eyes. That’s all he’s got left. He’s got $150 million he just got $40 million more. Lord knows what this Len Stoller is paying him to do the ads, probably a few bucks too. So and John will probably have a career in broadcasting, if he wants it. Whatever he’s done, he’s young, he’s good looking, he’s well spoken. He plays that game well, little weird, kind of like Sterling sharp on media. It’s like, wow, really. Um, but they, they’re about winning and they’re about distractions, not being distractions, and this has been a tough off season for not having distractions. And I can see John saying, Chad, put that out at six o’clock Friday night. We don’t need to crow about me. I don’t want questions about me or my money or my job or my security or my faith or my I don’t want any questions about the like, let’s just get it out. Move on. You know, I’m gonna have to deal with the Tucker thing on Monday morning. We’ve scripted that out, you know, liar’s luncheon. We’ll have something for that. And are they doing a liar’s lunch? And by the way, they they’re required to, by the League, okay? So there will be questions, but then the next two weeks. So I’m soliloqueen here, and I’m going to because I got into ravens in weeks, but, but I’m trying to get my head around what’s going on in that building right now, above and beyond who we’re drafting, how we’re making I mean, all of that happens. They’re really, really good at that. They’re really, really bad at the optics of all of the rest of this, and I think they think Michelle Andrews will solve it on video. But I do think this Tucker thing, it’s starting to get the feeling like they think it might be able to blow over in some way and not blow up. And I promise you, for the folks at Royal farms, and I might wear the rubber chicken suit and run for the mayor of ROFO town before the summer’s over, you know, his reputation is damaged. And the longer they hang on to this, I guess they’re so Teflon that their reputation can’t be damaged. And that’s the part of it that kind of sickens me, that that really does, because after Ray Rice and zero tolerance and all of this that it’s lingered now into all of. This to the point where it’s lingered, and that’s unfortunate.
Luke Jones 25:08
Yeah. I mean, I’ve said this, they were never, even if they said they were, they were never zero tolerance, because that would have required players that were already on the roster at the time. Look, I’ve said this, I think zero tolerances thing is something that teams talk about when it’s convenient to talk about it, because it’s a way to pat yourself on the back and to show that you’re virtuous and that, yeah, but as is the case with many things in life, these are complicated situations. And when I say these, I don’t mean Justin Tucker specifically. I mean when you have accusations that come out, because there are times where it isn’t true, and there are times where it is, and if you are going to just cut a player on any whim of any whisper of any wrongdoing that might not even be legitimate, then I don’t think that’s good, right, either. So I personally don’t really subscribe to the idea of a zero tolerance policy, in the sense of, I still don’t under, I’ve still never heard anyone actually clearly define what that would mean for the Ravens or for anyone else. Now, that being said, it’s critical to make sure you are showing the utmost sincerity and evidence that you’re taking something as seriously as it warrants. And clearly, when you’re talking about a story like this, regardless of the fact that it happened a decade ago or not, it’s very serious, and it’s something that affected as documented by the banner at least 16 women now, are there more? Are there less? What? I don’t know, but it’s important. I
Nestor Aparicio 26:49
was told there were more by by the banner, people that that said, I don’t, I don’t want to talk about it, but one of them, and whether that checks out or not, that is what it is. And that’s
Luke Jones 26:59
where I look at this and say, Yeah, you even if you are in a position where you have someone in your organization that you are trying to and let’s be clear, no one from the Ravens wrote something on Baltimore ravens.com saying I like Justin Tucker and the way that Kevin Byrne did about Ray Rice a decade ago. So I’ll push back a little bit in the sense that they’re showing this. You know,
Nestor Aparicio 27:25
the WBA l hasn’t had it on their website, period. What hasn’t had? What on their website hasn’t had Justin Tucker? Oh, the news of Justin Tucker is not on WBA else website in regard to second and third ally. Listen, I followed it, and that’s how much power they had. Wasn’t on Jay Z’s website either, and it’s kind of a weak ass website anyway, but corporate website. But it wasn’t it was on Fox and it was on WMAR. I’m just calling it the way I see it.
Luke Jones 27:55
Okay. I mean, I wasn’t talking about other stations in town. I was talking about the Ravens specifically, but,
Nestor Aparicio 28:01
but they have the power in the media to power play, who reports what? I mean, I don’t know about ESPN these days, and I don’t even know how that works. And I mean, network like NFL, network, when I put it on, was it even on? Was there even a blessed
Luke Jones 28:16
or full disclosure? I just did a Google W, B, A L, T, V, has written about Justin Tucker and WBL radio, I went
Nestor Aparicio 28:22
to the front of the website after the third set of allegations for three days. I’m looking at an article from january 30. It says, Okay, that was at the beginning. Okay, I’m talking about the follow up. Okay, but
Luke Jones 28:33
I’m just okay. If we’re gonna, you know, if you’re gonna attack other outlets, we need to be accurate. So I want to be accurate here. So,
Nestor Aparicio 28:39
but there were allegations as they came out, that it was not it was buried in, as we call it, the news buried is what it was, because I watched it in real time, and I’m like being there, really have a lot of power to because It’s all over, Shannon sharp and right and Stephen a I mean, all in that world, I would actually say it was talked about
Luke Jones 29:10
not as much as I thought it would be fair enough, you know. And now Deshaun Watson, superstar quarterback. Quarterbacks are more popular than kickers, even if you’re talking about the best kicker in the league. So there’s some of that at work, but Justin Tucker had national ad deals and saying, and, you know, like, Yeah, I mean, but again, her name, it’s, you know, Justin Tucker’s not was never as big of a star as just Shawn Watson at his best. Is the point I’m making. But I was, I’ve been a little surprised by that. So again, I don’t
Nestor Aparicio 29:40
even saying is it’s not an April Fool’s joke. We’re sitting here and he’s still employed, and it feels like they might keep him and that’s that, to me, is the lead like that, beyond everything I said about John and their integrity and the way they have behaved all along through this and the fact that hardball just. Got this extension. Decision making is coming. I mean, I’ve always said people come to me this time of year, hey, ness who’s Ozzy draft? And I’m like, you’ll know on draft night who he likes. They’re gonna lie to you and me and everybody else between now and then you’ll find out what the big reveal happens. You know, draft weekend for all of this, I think, but we’re getting up on that now. It is April, and I think, dude, you and I spent five days together in Toronto, and this and that, here and there, we haven’t talked a lot of I mean, it’s been, it’s because the Orioles are interesting. The Terps were interesting. You know, there’s been other things to talk about. And they playing games right now, and they’re not picking players. And this is the time where it’s a little quiet and the owners meetings bubbles up some rules changes and some this, and some that, a little bit of scuttlebutt news to keep it, keep their flare going through the year. So there’s never an off season. But we’re getting into the on season again here next couple weeks, right? I mean, this is we haven’t ragged on Justin Tucker in at least a month.
Luke Jones 31:01
I don’t know if it’s been a month, but it’s been a little while. But I said to you at the time, though, if they weren’t going to cut him in the first week after the initial reporting came out, I think I even said to you, then to me, start a free agency and the draft were going to be the next major checkpoints, because they’re going to make football decisions. We haven’t even mentioned the fact that they resigned Ben Cleveland, literally weeks after he was twice the legal limit in DUI in Georgia, and he’s a backup offensive lineman. So football decisions drive drive the bus here. I’m not saying that’s right, but I think it’s evident at this point, and it was evident with Ray Rice. I mean, you know, Ray Rice had been the third string running back, and that happened, he would have been cut right away, but they signed a reserved offensive lineman who literally had just been pop for DUI, what, less than a month earlier. So I don’t again, I if they weren’t going to cut them the first week after the banner, you know, the initial reporting came out, and then the follow up report was, like, three days later, you know, with additional allegations. Then I’m, I’m not shocked by the timeline that we’re seeing now, because it’s in line with football decisions. It’s in line with drafting a kicker. I’m not saying that’s right. Well, I said
Nestor Aparicio 32:19
all along that he’ll kick for somebody else. He’s going to kick in this league again for a long time, probably for years. And whether they suspend them or don’t, based on whether they can prove this or that, whether he would even he has offered zero contrition on any of this, I don’t think he would offer any guilt no matter what. So if they came in said, We’re suspending you for four games, he’d say for what his lawyers would say for what? So there is that part of the legal you can’t prove it. You can’t prove it. And there is going to be that part of the pushback of this guy’s employees making millions of dollars. He’s got millions of dollars of fight in him legally. So there is all of that, that even if the Ravens washed their hands, Packard, somebody’s going to sign him, and he’s just going to be another guy there who denies this and denied that, and that was so yesterday, and it didn’t really happen. And I I talked to, I’m not here to talk about the past, no speaking, Justin’s not available today to talk to the media, you know, like he’s gonna kick again in the league, dude, I predicted that from minute one. This is he’s not going to jail for this. He’s not paying any fines. I don’t think there’s going to be any civil this or civil that. And therefore, I think, as we sit here in April, time heals all wounds, he’s gonna have to blow over for somebody because he’s going to kick I believe that. I don’t know how or why, but I’ve watched this for 30 years. I’ve watched all sorts of criminals get back into the league in all sorts of ways. Um, other than Ray Rice, they made they made it. Oh, and that other criminal, Colin Kaepernick, who, that’s right, he didn’t really committing crimes that is blackballed him. Um, I’ve seen it all right. I mean, so this could go a lot of directions. I thought in the beginning it would go very badly for him. But to your point, when the media doesn’t talk about it, and, um, the black sports media talks about it as a white black issue, which is clearly, if you take the Sean Watson and Justin Tucker and saying, are they getting equal this or equal that, or who did what, or where’s the evidence the NFL is investigate. I mean, that’s right out of the playbook. We’re sending the NFL investigate all quiet. If they ask Sashi, ask Roger, you can’t find Roger. Where’s the kicker? I don’t know, he gets booed a little bit until he kicks the field goals he needs to kick. I mean, Michael Vick played again, dude, right? I mean, like he’s going to kick again. I mean, that’s the long and the short is he’s going to kick again. And I can see Bucha, he sitting down on his boat saying, well, then let him kick for us. He’s our guy. They can’t prove it, Let him, let him. Boom, Screw him. You know, like, I, I guess if he they feel like he’s the best kicker, somebody’s gonna feel like he’s their best chance to kick field goals with two minutes left to go in the game in Pittsburgh, in the win that’s gonna have, he’s one of the best 30 kickers in the world. He’s gonna get a job. You
Luke Jones 35:23
I don’t know what you want me to say, like, you know, you’ve went into a lot there, and
Nestor Aparicio 35:31
I’m thinking about it differently eight weeks now, because maybe they’re thinking about it differently eight weeks now. I don’t well, but the initial, initial crisis management of it is different. Ask Al Franken,
Luke Jones 35:44
yeah, well, but this is why I also, you know, you were 100% convinced that he was going to be cut, that definitely wouldn’t be a raven. I
Nestor Aparicio 35:53
thought they they would want to smell better than this. And then I recalibrated who they are.
Luke Jones 35:58
I mean, okay, you know, just because you think they could bring them back doesn’t mean they’re going to they’ve gone
Nestor Aparicio 36:04
a long way with this so far. Well, but, but
Luke Jones 36:07
if you weren’t going to cut them in the first week, then what’s like? What was waiting three more weeks going to do again? You get to a point now where, even if you have, they may have made up their mind on February 3, that he’s going to be gone, but we’ve got football games to win, and we got to figure out who our kicker is going to be. And it doesn’t behoove us to not let this play out. See what is uncovered. Maybe the league does uncover more damning evidence. Maybe they do. I don’t know. I’m not saying it’s impossible. I don’t know
Nestor Aparicio 36:43
that would really be something if the NFL comes out with further nations that would, that would, and if they do, then move me in a direction that they might have some integrity, and which I right now I think they lack, I mean, and I think every investigation they’ve ever had would allow me to think that they lack, but,
Luke Jones 36:59
but this is, you know, part of what you brought up, though, is part of what does make this a difficult situation. Because what can you prove? You know what I mean, like, what actually can be and look, that is not me saying this is not Luke Jones saying Justin Tucker is innocent. Let’s be clear. I am not saying that. But when you run into these scenarios where it isn’t as cut and dry as literally having a video of the elevator incident with Ray Rice hitting his wife, you know, his then fiance and now wife. When you don’t have evidence that is as clear cut as that, then it does is opened up to trying to investigate, trying to find out more, trying to figure out what’s heads from tails, not sitting here and saying that he’s 100% innocent, but also, at the same time, not just automatically convicting someone of something right, trying to have some semblance of due process, even if it’s not in The legal sense, because we’re talking about things that happened 13 to eight years ago. So there is challenge. There is some a challenge to that. And then when you consider who it is, it is someone who is a very decorated player, it is someone who has been one of the faces of your franchise. It is someone that you have an affinity for in the way that you’re going to for someone who’s been with you for over a decade that I’m trying to put myself in the shoes of not the ravens, but any team, any organization, any business, dealing with something of that nature. And I think that is challenging Now that said, that doesn’t mean you just say, Oh, we like Justin Tucker. Everything’s going to be okay. We’ll just wait it out. It’s fine. We’ll let it blow over. But that
Nestor Aparicio 38:49
is a strategy. It can be. I saw their strategy with Ray Rice, it can be. And your strategy with Ray Rice, which can be dastardly and filthy and shameful, that their strategy with Ray Rice was shameful. I would think this time around, it would be different than that. This time around, the strategy has been no speaky. NFL is on it. Roger will handle it. And that’s that should be a laugh out loud situation for any any investigation The NFL has ever done. See Dan Snyder, see Jon Gruden. Just see all of it, right? See the Bill Belichick. See any of these invested? See Ben Roethlisberger, so see Ray Rice. They can’t be trusted to investigate themselves, and that’s pretty much they can’t be trusted to report on themselves, and that’s why I’m not a reporter in Florida this week doing my job the way other reporters in other places, and there aren’t any other people have owned a radio station for 30 years that have done sports radio in any other market for them to ban so I don’t have a comparable in their world to ban me. But you could have gone and asked Sasha brown questions, and I couldn’t. So they make their own rules, dude. They. Know, and that’s part of the arrogance that’s baked into this that I am perfectly entitled On April 1 to be questioning why he’s still on the team and they’re still defending it, and perfectly within my he’s still employed. He’s still on the rock like he still works there. And for all of us looking at it, I have to look at it now and go back to my wife when she laughed at me six weeks ago. I remember we were getting up having coffee in the morning after the second allegations. I think what even the third? It’s the second round. And this is when I said they’re going to they’re going to have to move on, right? They’re going to cut him. And I said to my wife, they’re going to cut him. She looked at me in the mirror. She’s like, brushing her teeth. She’s like, she stopped. She’s like, he is a really good kicker, you know? And I’m like, wow, you know they got, yeah, they got, you carrying the water forward if you if they needed to, if they needed to. So Dale cuts, carrying that front of this and have him go kick and to say he was innocent and busy. I I don’t think he’s going to say he’s sorry. He’s going to say sorry if this bet I don’t remember it, but he’s going to kick somewhere, man. And if he’s going to kick somewhere, and they feel like he’s their kicker, you know, I mean, nobody’s canceled their season tickets because Justin Tucker is coming back on the team they’re not. And well,
Luke Jones 41:16
then what does that say about all of this? Then are we or do Murray, it just doesn’t matter. It just doesn’t matter when you you just said that, and I don’t disagree with you, I but knowing what that would potentially the message that would potentially send to half of your fan base. But if no one cares, I mean, it’s, it’s what I always say about Thursday night football. Everyone says how terrible it is, yet they watch it. You know what I mean, like, so what does it say about us as a society? What does that say about us as consumers?
Nestor Aparicio 41:56
You know, we voted for dude. There was an insurrection. There was an insurrection, and people didn’t see it. So like, like, just it was broadcast a live TV and no one saw it and and one network didn’t really report on it, and reported that, you know, might have been Nancy’s fault that they were in her office. So, like, I, like, from that point down, I can’t look at this and say, thinking away with whatever they want to get away with. They’re the NFL and they have forever, and now that April 1 is here and it’s April Fool’s Day, I’m looking for the fool, and it might be the people who thought that allegations of 16 women in this city would get him off the chicken billboards at Royal farms, but would probably make him less than attractive as the kicker of the Baltimore Ravens moving forward well,
Luke Jones 42:44
and that doesn’t mean that that’s not still not true. As I said to you, if they weren’t going to cut them in the first week, I don’t see what doing it February 15 meant, or doing it March 1 meant, once they went through that initial period where it wasn’t done right there. And then I’m not surprised that this is going to go out to the draft, because then you get into a position where Randy Brown’s evaluating kickers. John Harbaugh talked at length about that. You know, he didn’t sit there at the breakfast table and bang the table and say, Justin Tucker’s our guy. We love tuck we’re supporting him. So, you know, their support, their degree of support has been he’s still employed by them right now. You know they haven’t, you know it’s not like they’ve had him going out and doing public appearances, or you know that he’s on their season ticket advertisements or anything like that. But by not cutting him to this point, that’s a level of support I can’t say. You know, again, once we got through that initial first wave, if he was still employed at that point, I expected this to to play out in the way of there being an investigation, whether we label that investigation as kosher, legitimate or not, it would be done and they were going to go through a process of then figuring out who potentially replaces him, if they indeed decide to do that, and that would most likely come at, you know, draft time. So if we get through the draft and they don’t draft a kicker, and they don’t have some undrafted kicker that they love in the way that they really like, Justin Tucker in 2012 as an undrafted rookie free agent out of Texas, then we might have our answer by that point in time. But by the way, one of
Nestor Aparicio 44:27
the more bizarre things they’ve done, we’re 45 minutes into this. I’m reading the script that Harbaugh had at the press conference. I used to go to and sit next to him at breakfast and do all of that. And Ben Cleveland, I mean, Duke got popped doing double DUI. I mentioned that 10 minutes ago, but okay, but I’m like, I’m Wait, okay, you did. I’m sorry. I didn’t know. I’m just, I I’m just, I’m still it. Yeah, that happened, and I. Didn’t even mention that when I went to bizarre to so I apologize for you know, your mention of it, but I haven’t thought of it in a week. I’m sorry because I haven’t thought of Ben Cleveland in four years, quite frankly. But the script and saying, like they do, they’re they’re very unorthodox, that’s
Luke Jones 45:18
all well, and to me that I almost found that more illuminating than how anything they’ve handled, but Tucker, because to me, you can lean on the fact that Justin Tucker’s helped you win a heck of a lot of football games for a long time. And ultimately, your business is driven by success and people wanting to watch your brand and all that different, right? It’s on field. It’s the product, right? For as much as these teams do things business wise, and they try to make money, and they sell sweets and sponsorships and do things in the community and all that, it’s still back. Comes back to they’re an entertainment business, and if you have a player that’s going to help win, which is entertaining and be successful, then that player is going to have a longer ramp than someone who is a backup offensive lineman who barely played it all this year. So I found that to be illuminating, not that I changed my mind to say, Okay, well, if you brought back Ben clip, and you know, he’s getting a league minimum year, whatever the league’s you know, discipline is going to be for him, whatever discipline he’s going to have from a legal standpoint, you know, with his DUI, then you know, he’ll have a game suspension, two game suspension, whatever it might end up being. But I found that to be illuminating from a standpoint of that kind of came across to me more than anything, is they don’t care at all about appearances. So
Nestor Aparicio 46:42
I would think, behind closed doors, when a guy when that happens, and I don’t know enough, and I’ll talk to some agents about this, they probably have to put him in a program, have HR, all of the privacy and this and that, but like, but he was a free agent, like you could have just when that happened, it was as simple as, see right? I mean, a lot of people didn’t even back to the they certainly are bizarre. So in everything bizarre off season, you know, how do I sit next to John over over pancakes on Monday in Florida, and he’s talking about Ben Cleveland, being asked about Justin Tucker and say, What about your zero tolerance policy, John? What would he say about that? You know what? I mean, like, I, yeah, okay, keep going. I mind. It must be April Fool’s Day, right? Trump’s president, right? I mean, we have a new Orioles out. Like, I, yeah. But
Luke Jones 47:33
I just found that, yeah. I found the Cleveland thing to be a little more illuminating from the standpoint of, you know, they don’t really come across is caring about appearances at all. You know, I mean, again, the Tucker thing you’re that’s someone you have a long term relationship with who’s won you a lot of games. You’re talking about someone who, at least prior to this, was on a Hall of Fame path. And again, you’re talking about something that happened a long time ago. Doesn’t mean it didn’t happen again. Let me be clear. I’m not implying anything suggesting the contrary, but there is a sense of trying to find out as much as you can about it, trying to have some semblance of due process, you know, even if there’s not going to be anything from a legality standpoint. But yeah, in the wake of all that, you resign a lineman who, let’s face it, Ben Cleveland, was a disappointing third round pick, like, like, let’s call it what it was, and you brought him right back less than a month after he was popped for DUI. And, you know, I’ve seen some people mention, you know, because TMZ put out that, you know, he and his wife were going through a divorce. His wife had been unfaithful to him. It’s like that doesn’t give you license to get behind the wheel when you’re twice the legal limit. Like,
Nestor Aparicio 48:48
oh, can I can I read harbors quote while you’re talking about this, nobody talks about that, but he’s great at that. So he’s a good guy as far as the situation he had that’s to be determined what the punishment will be for that. He understands that we understand that as well. But that was a good, solid football move for our team. Yeah, that’s all that matters, right? I mean, like, let like, that is, that’s the crux of John Harbaugh and Eric the cost is saying to me, they’re not all choir boys. It was a good, solid football move for our team. Yeah, that literally was his quote,
Luke Jones 49:21
and that’s why I said it. I found that to be more illuminating about where they are as an organization with player discipline off the field, more than anything we found out to this point with Justin Tucker, because if you recall, in the wake of Ray Rice, the ravens, the next off season or two, they had quite a few players who had run ins with the law, and they were they kind of ruled with a heavy hand, with some guys that that they were pretty clear about that they cut and didn’t even waste time. There were one or two guys that were scheduled to be free agents, and they could have just not said anything, and they just said, Nope. We’re releasing you right now. You know, you can go get a head start on free agency. You’re gone. And instead, you know, we saw the opposite with Ben Cleveland, where not only did they not put anything out about it, which I wasn’t necessarily expecting that, but they resigned them and look league minimum deal, yeah, sure, from a football standpoint, you know, it’s a sound decision, but, you know, comes across as, you know, it’s hard to talk about having any, you know, having any sense of caring about character and things like that, if
Nestor Aparicio 50:35
integrity is the word, but that’s okay, I’ll use that one you can so, so, you know, I mean, I, I was surprised by that, you know, because I wouldn’t have expected Ben Cleveland back anyway, you know, let alone, I guess I’m not surprised by anything anymore, so, and that’s that, that’s a part that I, that I, if I, if I can’t get anything else across. This is like when you make judgments in February based on integrity in the team, and then we move forward into all of this, and Ben Cleveland’s on the team, and Justin Tucker still on the team, and it feels like he still could be on the team. And you know, another thing I would have said to HAR ball and to Costa over um palm tree drinks would have been, are you really okay with your tight end dropping the ball and not coming to the podium? Is that really the way your organization runs? Like, like, is that they don’t
Luke Jones 51:22
care about that. I don’t say that to mean that that that he shouldn’t have. They don’t care about that. I mean, well,
Nestor Aparicio 51:30
if they don’t care about optics, and if they don’t care about accountability, if the owner doesn’t speak, the tight end doesn’t speak, the head coach lies, the general manager runs, the communication. Guy doesn’t communicate, you know, like they say zero tolerance. They don’t mean it. They signed Ben Cleveland the day after he gets popped, like the day after the three, three weeks after. Yeah, whatever. I mean,
Luke Jones 51:53
if you’re gonna attack, we need to be accurate, man, I’m not gonna say what? Fair enough. Fair enough, just like we were talking about with the other outlets, with the Tucker coverage. Go ahead, sorry,
Nestor Aparicio 52:03
you’ll free. I, you know, I love having you here, believe me, yeah, okay, it’s draft season, right? They’re gonna, they’re gonna draft some players too. We’re gonna get to that. Yeah, we should talk more about torpedo bats. Luke Jones and I are gonna get together with fade leads. If you hear us carrying on over crab cakes and trips salad sandwiches. We’re gonna be doing the Maryland crab cake tour. Crab cake tour. Dude, I’ve been doing this 34 years. They’re almost 35 years, right? Do you think I want, like, want to be talking about this? You think I beg to get a football team here to spend the off season talking about jurisprudence and what just unconscionable lack of integrity they all really have shown me in recent years after I wrote a book about their integrity. So I really would rather be talking about who they’re drafting their team. We could talk about all of that. They’re a really good football team, but we talk about all of that, but it really is gooped up and oiled up and greased up by the sleaziness of it. And I can’t call it anything other than that, after all of these years and and I it’s just unfortunate, you know, because I I’d like to stick to football, you know? I mean, I like football, I love football. You have dedicated my life to it. You’ve dedicated more of your life doing, especially recent times. It is unfortunate that we’ve sucked up this amount of time, but we will talk about the team. We will talk about the roster. We always do. I saw Derek Henry running in chains up the hill, and you know, they’re a good football team. We should say that too, right? That’s fair, no question.
Luke Jones 53:37
Although if we weren’t talking about all this, we’d still be talking about what happened in Buffalo. So, hey, good football team. You know that certainly the draft is a few weeks away. One thing John Harbaugh said, which you’ve heard me say this over the last few weeks, talking about the state of the roster. You know, they’re kind of in a position where, if they had to go play a football game this week, you’d you’d still feel way better about them than most teams around the league. You know, they still got some they got some positions to address. But, you know, they’re, they’re certain, what do you want me to say? I mean, they’re a fumble and a catch and a drop away from going to the AFC title game for the second straight year, two years. You know, Kansas City came in two years ago and beat them and they could have gone to the Super Bowl then. I mean, you know that what’s frustrating about the football part of it is how good they have been, but how much they’ve left you wanting in January. And you know, that’s That’s why some fans weren’t happy about John Harbaugh getting a three year contract extension. But you know, they’re really in a position where you just you run it back and try to figure out a way to not shoot yourself in the foot in January. But they got a long way to go to get back to that stage to have an opportunity. So we’re counting down to the draft, and certainly we’ll be waiting with bated breath to see what happens with other positions. But. Certainly, if we see them on day three, if they’re taking a kicker, that could very much be a sign of where they’re heading with Justin Tucker or maybe not so well, we’ll still have plenty to talk about, one way or the other. On that front, it is. It’s
Nestor Aparicio 55:17
baseball season here too. We had a great time on opening day. We’re going to be down at fadelies on Wednesday. We’re going to be doing the Maryland doing the Maryland crab cake tour, all over the place. I’m wearing my Costas shirt to honor mister Costas, who we lost very tragically last week. And we’re going to talk about carbon monoxide and leaving the car on and not hearing it. I just didn’t amazing thing to happen, because it happens to me all the time. I don’t have a carport, so I love to cost us and everybody there. We’re going to be at fade leads later on this week. Cost us next week. We’re going to be at Cooper’s. We’re going to be at Cocos. We’re going to be at the Beaumont on the 17th. We have great guests. Mark Viviano is going to be down with fade leads with us this week. Luke and I are taking in the baseball thing, talking about the football thing, thinking about the Terps thing, and Spring has sprung. I even I didn’t realize there were such beautiful cherry blossoms right in front of Camden Yards. So I got some great pictures. Everybody had a great day on Monday. Thanks to everybody who was kind to me. Ran into tons and tons and tons of people. It’s going to be a good month here ahead, baseball, football, democracy on the on the plate. We’re Baltimore positive. Stay with us. You.
