The Buffalo blow up and competition for ‘hottest’ head coach and QB widens

Sure, other teams are grabbing their leaders and preparing for the next phase of their lowly rebuilds in Tennessee, Atlanta and New York, but the Baltimore Ravens are taking their time in Owings Mills. Luke Jones and Nestor respond to Bills firing of Sean McDermott and who is next in line for Ravens search as the NFL prepares for Championship Weekend. Will Lamar be involved in the recruitment now that Josh Allen is coachless?

Nestor Aparicio and Luke Jones discussed the Baltimore Ravens’ head coach search, noting the team has interviewed 16 candidates, with five still playing in the conference championships. They compared the Ravens’ slow process to other teams’ quicker decisions. They debated the merits of candidates like Joe Brady and Brian Daboll, and questioned the Buffalo Bills’ decision to fire Sean McDermott. They highlighted the importance of finding the right coach to maximize Lamar Jackson’s potential and the challenges of hiring in a league with high expectations and frequent changes.

• [ ] @Nestor Aparicio – Prepare and have candy cane scratch-off tickets to give away on the show in two weeks; coordinate giveaway during the broadcast
• [ ] @Nestor Aparicio – Pull up the chart referenced during the discussion and read the relevant salary/chart details on-air
• [ ] @Nestor Aparicio – Plan and execute the Maryland crab cake tour and related Super Bowl cup segment for the show (schedule dates and promotions)

Outline

Ravens Head Coach Search and NFL Coaching Changes

• Nestor Aparicio introduces the topic of the Ravens head coach search and the end of college football season.
• Nestor mentions the recent coaching changes, including Stefanski to the Falcons and Dolphins, and John Harbaugh’s press conference.
• Luke Jones discusses the Ravens’ selective approach to hiring, mentioning the 16 candidates they have interviewed.
• Nestor and Luke discuss the Ravens’ lack of urgency compared to other teams and the reasons behind it.

Ravens’ Selective Approach and Candidate Availability

• Luke Jones explains that the Ravens have been very selective, interviewing 16 candidates and considering only the best.
• Nestor and Luke discuss the reasons behind the Ravens’ slow process, including the availability of top candidates like Kevin Stefanski and Robert Saleh.
• Nestor argues that the Ravens’ lack of urgency indicates they were not serious about these candidates.
• Luke Jones agrees, noting that the Ravens have been thorough and selective in their search.

Bill’s Firing of Sean McDermott

• Nestor and Luke discuss the Buffalo Bills’ decision to fire Sean McDermott, despite his success and popularity.
• Nestor expresses surprise and frustration over the Bills’ decision, questioning the team’s decision-making.
• Luke Jones explains the Bills’ perspective, highlighting their lack of success in January and the need for a fresh start.
• Nestor and Luke discuss the broader implications of coaching changes and the pressure on teams to win in January.

Personality and Leadership in Coaching

• Nestor and Luke discuss the importance of personality and leadership in coaching, using the example of Eric Bieniemy and Steve Belichick.
• Nestor argues that Belichick’s personality and leadership style may have contributed to his lack of job offers.
• Luke Jones agrees, noting that personality and leadership are crucial factors in coaching success.
• Nestor and Luke discuss the dynamics of the NFL coaching carousel and the challenges of finding the right fit for a team.

Ravens’ Coaching Preferences and Candidate Pool

• Nestor and Luke discuss the Ravens’ preferences for a new coach, including the importance of an offensive-minded head coach.
• Luke Jones mentions the candidates the Ravens are considering, including Joe Brady and Brian Daboll.
• Nestor and Luke discuss the potential impact of these candidates on the Ravens’ roster and future success.
• Nestor expresses skepticism about John Harbaugh’s long-term success, citing his age and recent struggles.

Historical Context and Coaching Dynamics

• Nestor and Luke discuss the historical context of coaching changes, including the impact of analytics and modern football strategies.
• Luke Jones highlights the importance of adapting to new trends and technologies in coaching.
• Nestor and Luke discuss the influence of ownership and general managers on coaching decisions.
• Nestor shares insights from his conversations with Eric Decosta and the importance of trust in the coaching process.

Comparing Coaching Talent and Potential

• Nestor and Luke compare the top coaching talent in the NFL, including Sean McVay, Kyle Shanahan, and Andy Reid.
• Luke Jones argues that McVay and Shanahan are currently the top coaches due to their success with different quarterbacks.
• Nestor and Luke discuss the challenges of finding the next great coach and the importance of identifying the right fit for a team.
• Nestor expresses his skepticism about John Harbaugh’s long-term success and the need for a fresh approach.

Ravens’ Coaching Search Strategy

• Nestor and Luke discuss the Ravens’ strategy for their coaching search, including the importance of thorough preparation and due diligence.
• Luke Jones highlights the role of Eric Decosta in leading the search and the importance of finding the right candidate.
• Nestor and Luke discuss the potential impact of the coaching search on the Ravens’ future success and the importance of making the right decision.
• Nestor expresses his excitement for the upcoming coaching announcements and the potential for a new era of success for the Ravens.

Impact of Coaching Changes on Teams

• Nestor and Luke discuss the broader implications of coaching changes on NFL teams, including the impact on player morale and team culture.
• Luke Jones highlights the importance of stability and continuity in coaching, especially for teams with talented rosters.
• Nestor and Luke discuss the challenges of transitioning to a new coaching staff and the need for a smooth and effective process.
• Nestor expresses his hope for a successful coaching search and the potential for a new era of success for the Ravens.

Final Thoughts and Predictions

• Nestor and Luke share their final thoughts on the Ravens’ coaching search and the potential candidates.
• Luke Jones predicts that the Ravens will take their time and make a thorough and thoughtful decision.
• Nestor expresses his skepticism about John Harbaugh’s long-term success and the need for a fresh approach.
• Nestor and Luke discuss the importance of finding the right fit for the Ravens and the potential impact on the team’s future success.

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

Ravens head coach search, Sean McDermott, John Harbaugh, Joe Brady, Brian Daboll, NFL coaching changes, Buffalo Bills, Lamar Jackson, offensive minded coach, defensive minded coach, Eric Decosta, Steve Bisciotti, coaching candidates, playoff success, quarterback influence.

8

SPEAKERS

Nestor Aparicio, Luke Jones

Nestor Aparicio  00:01

Welcome home. We are W, N, S, T, am 1570 Towson, Baltimore. We are Baltimore positive, positively into the snow season this week and into the Ravens head coach search, and we’re done with college football. Finally. So cheers to Indiana, and we got two football games this weekend. Luke Jones joins us now. It’s all brought to you by friends at the Maryland lottery. I’ll have candy cane scratches to give away two weeks from now. Hopefully the snow was cleared out by then, and we’re doing a cup of soup or a bowl all the brought to you by the Maryland lottery, in conjunction with our friends at GBMC. Also want to give some love to our friends at Coppin, who had me over on Sunday, Doctor Jenkins, the whole crew I saw former w NSD intern and delegate, Sean Stinnett, over there, I saw Calvin Ball Howard County Executive, as well as a whole bunch of old friends. So it was a great, great experience over cop and watching Don Staley come in. Meanwhile, we’ve been talking leadership here all week, and Stefanski to the Falcons the dolphins get their coach, John har ball’s having press conferences in the swamps of Jersey, holding his wife’s hand, because that’s what he always does. And we’re bringing in second interviews, I think, Luke, I’m gonna let you speak to this a little bit. You’re on the beat out there in Owings Mills for the purple plumes of smoke that will come on the wnst tech service brought to you by cold roofing and Gordian energy whenever the magic moment happens, some of these decisions are happening fast in other places, I think. And part of this was you and I discussing four teams left at least six candidates left in the pool who are playing football this week, that this thing’s not going to happen this week here, I don’t think. But it’s moving a little slower here than it is in

Luke Jones  01:43

other places. It is. And I think it just comes down to the fact that one the ravens are going to be really selective about this, the fact that we know they’ve talked to at least 16 candidates in the first round. Now a couple of those guys have since taken jobs elsewhere. Kevin Stefanski, as you mentioned, Robert Sala in the aftermath of everyone talking about Kurt Signet signetti in Indiana and that fantastic story, he agreed to become the head coach of the Tennessee Titans. So that’s another individual the Ravens had talked to. He’s someone that I had mentioned. Well, it’s it.

Nestor Aparicio  02:17

8

What it means is the Ravens were not serious about him. Because the Ravens were serious, they’d say, Hey, come on in here. Let’s get you a little bit more money. Let’s, let’s give it a minute. Like, tell the Titans to powder out a minute. You know what I mean? Like, that’s kind of how it works. When these guys wind up in other seats, it means the Ravens really didn’t want them. Because if the Ravens were serious about it, they would put, put the brakes on it for the Titans. I as I see it, yes

Luke Jones  02:40

and no, I think it certainly speaks to the fact that he wasn’t their number one choice by any stretch of the imagination. I do think you have to recognize that there are even this year where there are 10 openings, right, which is the most we’ve seen in four years, and ties a record, I believe,

Nestor Aparicio  02:57

and all the Titans they get it get back just by the end of the day. And that’s that it

Luke Jones  03:01

just comes down to it you, I’ve equated it to a game of musical chairs, like you can want the best job, and certainly the Ravens job, and now the bills job, with Sean McDermott being let go, and how that

8

Nestor Aparicio  03:14

kind of threw a league didn’t want Bill Belichick. Belichick thought he was going to get a gig somewhere. The Arizona Cardinals would hire somebody, would hire him and give him $100 million he didn’t get that gig. Greatest coach in the history of the game ever didn’t get a gig. So he didn’t find a seat. Billick didn’t find a seat again. That agreed with him. He thought he was going to coach when he got fired. Here just never happened. It never the right seat, never because he didn’t, wasn’t going to go coach the Cardinals. He just wasn’t well and but that’s kind of the point I’m making, though, that you never make assumptions.

Luke Jones  03:48

And yes, even if the Ravens really liked Kevin Stefanski or they really liked Robert Sala, they weren’t just going to hire them on the spot. They weren’t going to have them pass others in the line that they really want to talk to. And if you’re them, you’re saying, well, even if the Ravens like me that doesn’t get the job, that I’m gonna get the job, and these guys are offering me a job. So that’s why, and I’d said that all along. And look, this is where you have to have discipline as an organization, as an owner, as a general manager, and look at it. If you’re the ravens, I mean, the bills. Think about the bills now. They’re two weeks behind most of these others.

Nestor Aparicio  04:22

Let’s talk about this for a minute, because that’s the craziest of all the ones that of all the NFL firings in this league. I didn’t necessarily think that bashadi Do the red did the right thing with Billick when he fired him 819, years ago, eight to whenever, it was like, at that moment is like, Hold on here. You got a Super Bowl winning coach. He was 13 to three last year. He’s calling the offense. He had a 38 year old quarterback, like, you know, you just he didn’t like Brian. And now, the more that I see Steve on display, he and Brian would never get along. He’s not sensible enough for Brian. He’s not he’s not me. Yellow enough for Brian to like it’s true out here for him. So I could see why that didn’t work, but McDermott’s been working there 10 years. Won big games. Loves the city. City loves him. Players are upset. I am really, it really. You know what I said to my wife? I said to my wife, it shows that pago’s don’t know what they’re doing. That’s where, if I’m a Bills fan, that’s what I’m saying. Like, come on, dude, it’s one thing to get rid of horrible after 18 years, after a bad year when he doesn’t like the quarterback and the quarterback doesn’t like him. And I’ll say that out loud. I don’t care who this was about Lamar and John, for me, as much as it was about losing and as much as was he wasn’t the right guy for Lamar moving forward. And I don’t know that the bills would feel that way about McDermott, but I I’m stunned, of all the firings that don’t make any sense in the league. I mean, Tomlin never got fired. Peyton never got, like a bunch of those guys never got fired. I thought, after the Eagles won the Super Bowl, I thought it was kind of quick what they did with Peterson. You know, I thought that, but they the Eagles are clearly a banana republic. They’re gonna, they’re gonna change coaches the way hockey teams can’t change coaches. They’re just, that’s their methodology. I think this guy’s fighting fans in the stands, and he can’t get fired, and McDermott’s done everything to help them build their stadium. I’m, I’m it pu on the bills ownership for me, that’s how I feel about it.

Luke Jones  06:19

8

They haven’t won. I mean, they haven’t won in January, right? I mean, it’s the same story. We have

Nestor Aparicio  06:24

a good enough team this year, dude. They didn’t have a good enough let me be clear.

Luke Jones  06:28

I If it were me, I would have been looking much more at the General Manager than the head coach, when you look at that roster. And Brandon bean got a got a promotion. So yeah, look, not being able to win in January takes a toll. It absolutely does, and whose fault it is, right, right? And the fact of the matter is, you have Kansas City who has dominated for the better part of the last eight years. This was the year they were down and buffalo didn’t get it done, the Ravens didn’t get it done. And even though Mike Tomlin stepped down, all the chatter and all the shortcomings in Pittsburgh as far as their ability to win a playoff game, you know, by extension. So I think it’s a little bit, you know, where you look at this, that one team does it and then another team does it again, you know, based on what the what Rooney said, it sounded like they weren’t going to fire Tomlin, but that’s that was coming at some point, right? It was either Mike stepping down this year or it was going to be next year, you know, assuming that they weren’t going to break through next year and win in January. But when you see other teams do it, it empowers you a little bit to do it yourself, right? And look, I’m not going to sit here and say that I have full confidence that the Buffalo Bills are making the right decision here, or that they’re going to hire someone who’s better than McDermott. At the same time, McDermott hasn’t broken through their defenses. Have failed in their January losses, and he’s a defensive guy, so you know, I at least see it. I’m not saying I necessarily agree with it, but it’s a very similar story to what we’ve been talking about here in Baltimore, where you’ve got to win in January when you have an MVP quarterback. And I think that also is very much a question of Who do you pair with Josh Allen, in the same way of Who do you pair with? Lamar Jackson? And that’s why I think so many of us have been talking about an offensive minded head coach, and you know whether it’s going to be them promoting Joe Brady. I mean, Joe Brady’s going to reports. He’s going to get a second interview with the Ravens here. So maybe Joe Brady ends up being the Ravens guy, you know, maybe, maybe it’s a Brian Dabel going back to Buffalo. Maybe they fired McDermott because they want to keep Brady. It might be, might be, ultimately, it might be. Or they might say, You know what, Brian dables, the guy that did the lion’s share of the work for really making Josh Allen, the quarterback that he is today. Maybe they bring him back, right? So look, I’m not saying it’s right or wrong.

Nestor Aparicio  09:01

I What is about personalities? Let’s let’s be really clear about this. And watching Eric serve in fealty to to bishati on that dace last week, that was weird. Seeing Eric on the dace with Steve and looking diminished next to Steve, when you know what I mean, it’s like, Steve’s God and Eric’s just the guy that went at nine and eight or eight and nine, and the ball went through and, you know, like it didn’t. Last week’s optics was weird for me. And I know how Steve feels about Eric, and I know how Eric feels about Steve, and I don’t know to my way of thinking Eric and Steve. Eric can make Steve believe in him more than John Cook, because John would bur up and say, f you Steve. And Eric’s not an F you, Steve guy, Eric’s of whatever you say. Steve guy, thank you for thank you for the privilege of allowing me to breathe and be the general manager of the ravens and I. I think in other organizations, Brandon bean with the bills people or him saying to them, don’t fire me. Fire him. It’s his fault, not my fault, because that’s really the way this works with the Holy Trinity, right? Like, like, when there’s general manager, coach and owner, it worked this way with Marvin in Cincinnati, right? Like, Marvin had the confidence of the Brown family. That’s all that mattered. Mike and Katie liked him, and they trusted him. And it wasn’t about him blowing smoke up their backside or that, you know, but there is that relationship side of Do you trust him more than me, or me more than him? Because at some point we’re both going to be gone and you’re going to own the team, but one of us is going to be gone and one of us is going to be picking the other person. So if John had survived here and the players weren’t good enough, if that were the perception that the players had under delivered, and Eric would have been the odd guy out. John would have been the part of picking his football picker. He would have been the grocery picker. And I think that that’s an issue that Parcells understood early on. By the way. We talked about coaches. We talked about belt check. He was the coach of the jets for 30 seconds. Remember, I mean, there have been some weird seats that happened this time of the year to think that Joe Brady is going to wind up in Buffalo, or that there was an insurrection there, and Josh Allen like Brady the whole time, or table the whole time, because those were his guys. And when you’re paying the quarterback, 5060, $70 million and his face is the first thing you see when you land at the airport. He’s going to survive the coach. It happened here, even though the coach was super strong here, it happened here, right?

8

Luke Jones  11:34

Well, I mean, that’s, that’s the reality. There are only so many quarterbacks like that, right? And two thirds of the league at a minimum. I mean, they’re

Nestor Aparicio  11:42

only like that for a minute. They’re only like that for three to five years. They’re really not. There aren’t a whole lot of Aaron Rodgers that hang around 15 years. If you think Lamar is going to be running the franchise in 2030 you’re further along than you think I am at 32 or 33 because he won’t be. This is a temporary right? Lamar is running, running this hiring cycle, not the next one.

Luke Jones  12:03

That’s, that’s fair, yeah, I mean, I think it’s longer than three to five years, but, but your point is well taken. It’s, you know, kind of a five to seven year, five to eight years,

Nestor Aparicio  12:12

8

Lake McCarthy lasted a lot longer, just because Aaron Rodgers did.

Luke Jones  12:16

Sure, sure, sure. So, I mean, it’s, you’ve got to but you’ve got to win, and you’ve got to at least get to Super Bowls, right? And if you don’t, we’re seeing what’s happening here. And I think this is only going to become more extreme. I think we’re seeing it before it’s hockey.

Nestor Aparicio  12:34

Yeah, we’re going to have three year five, four year runs, not 18 year run. So that’s why most of the league is when you lose, the Ravens haven’t been that way, because they haven’t lost. If this coach fails and Lamar turns an ankle, and there’s a couple of five and somethings and six and somethings and whatever, this is going to be quicker and that’s and that’s when Steve’s going to sell the franchise. Steve wants that. Steve liked an 18 year coach. Not every owner is going to like that. I don’t know if David Rubenstein cares who the Orioles manager is, and if this doesn’t work out, three years from now, it’ll be gone. And that really is sports, right? The NBA and the NHL, they change leaders like socks. Baseball has been a little different, because baseball, just in a general sense, has had la ruses and Tories and bucks and, you know, guys that last a little longer. But even with hockey, the greatest hockey coaches of my lifetime have coached four or five teams. Trots being one of them is now on back on his fourth team.

Luke Jones  13:29

Well, I made the point of a couple minutes ago, and you know, people were talking about it in the aftermath of McDermott getting fired on Monday, but this is the first time since 2022 that there have been 10 openings of those. We’re four years ago. We’re not talking like 15 years ago. Four years ago. Of those 10, two were left, and one of those two Todd Bowles just basically fired his entire coaching staff. So it speaks to what the turnover is, and

8

Nestor Aparicio  14:01

they stink. A different owner would have fired him. To your point, the Glazers must really like him. There must be a bond of, we’re not doing this again. We’re not bringing in table. And you know, we’re not giving a horrible 100 million like there is a resignation. And the Miami guy’s been through this five times this year, right? He was going to fire his coach in week 10. He fired his general manager. He’s going to keep his coach. He was going to keep his coach. He was gonna keep his coach. Gonna keep it that he fired his coach, that like these guys, they’re billionaires. You saw bashati Zach last week, next week, he might not like Chad steel. You know, who knows?

Luke Jones  14:32

I mean, they’re billionaires, and as Steve bashati said, they have the power, right? I mean, so but, but it’s it speaks to one how demanding the job is and how high expectations are, even in places where, frankly, the expectation shouldn’t be that high. Because you look at some of these guys, I mean, you know, you go back to that hiring cycle four years ago, and you know, Chicago, with Matt aberfloose, Nathaniel Hackett in Denver, right? Right? Lovey Smith in Houston, which, you know, was kind of, I mean, lovey was disrespected through that. I mean, that was kind of a charade. And he was the pawn that that the Texans, you know. I mean, he had one year. There were no, no reason to think they were going to be any good. They weren’t any good. And then he was fired, right? I mean, but you go down that list, and you kind of see some of those jobs and and you and you say, well, that individual got a year, that individual got two years, and they were bad when he took over. So what was the expectation that he was going to suddenly make them good? Yeah, that’s where this ravens job and this bill’s job are so unique. I mean, even the Pittsburgh job for as much as we say, well, it’s the Steelers and the stability, and they’ve had three coaches since 1969 they’ve got an old roster, and they have no quarterback. That Pittsburgh job is not like, step in here and you’re going to win, and

Nestor Aparicio  15:49

they just won the Division. So whatever you do isn’t winning the division.

Luke Jones  15:54

8

Well, I mean, it just, it just comes down to, like, the expectations. They they want a lousy division, but they sure they want a division. But, you know, Rooney can say all he wants that they’re not going to rebuild. They need to rebuild. I mean, they do, like, the best thing Pittsburgh could do would be to go five and 12 next year and get a get a franchise quarterback. I mean, they need to do that. Whereas the difference with the ravens and the bills, whoever is hired, and you talked about this a little bit the other day, the expectations are very high. I mean, the expectation is going to be high for whoever is coaching those two teams, because they have an MVP quarterback, because they have rosters that have been really close. You know, whether you thought the roster was good enough or a little overrated or needs to be better in this spot or that spot, they’ve been teams that have been right there. But it is still funny. And I think I said this to you and Jess via text the other day, where all these teams, you know, and especially like in the AFC right now, where you look at the ravens, you look at the bills, to a lesser extent, the Steelers, but still, you could put the Steelers in there that they’re going to hire these new coaches, just to have Kansas City come back and be really good next year. Because, well, that, you know, it feels like that’s what the Chiefs could do. So I say that partially in jest, but it just speaks to, you know, not getting over the hump is a heck of a thing, right? It’s, it’s great to be there, it’s great to get in, it’s great to play in the playoffs. But when you do that, the expectations rise overall. And when you don’t meet those expectations, or you don’t keep going and you don’t break through, eventually there are going to be consequences for that, as we’re seeing right now. So I’m fascinated to see who the ravens are going to hire. I’m fascinated to see who the bills are going to hire. You know, Pittsburgh, I think that jobs should have way more patience attached to it, because I just, I just don’t think they’re in a position to win at a high level up going forward until they get a quarterback and not to mention their defense is expensive and old at this point in time. But it is. I mean, this is rare territory. I think I saw, can’t remember who put it out there, but they were talking about the number of times that an MVP quarterback has been available, you know, or not, available, a head coach job with an MVP quarterback attached to it has been available. And, I mean, it’s we got two of them, right? The list is wild. I mean, you go back to Brett Favre in the late 90s. And you go back to trying to, I mean, Johnny Unitas in the early 60s, you know, I suppose post we Eubank at that point. And I mean Bert Jones. And I guess 1980 I guess it was, I mean, just crazy. I mean, I, I saw it on pub, took the Broncos, he had Peyton Manning too recently, right? Like, I’m just thinking of some people that, yeah. Like, let me be clear, it’s happened. I’m not, I’m not saying that it’s this is completely unprecedented, but to have two at the same time, that’s kind of bonkers. I mean, that really is so

Nestor Aparicio  18:56

well, these are elite. These are considered elite teams. These were the teams are supposed to win the division. There was eight months ago, we these were 12 and 13 win teams, and neither one of them made it there, and both of their coaches got fired, both of them in the Andy Reid tree, um, and we’re going to see what they come up with. And I just found the bills thing to be a little i I’m taken aback by that. I thought it was unfair, and I think, and I don’t know if McDermott becomes a candidate here, and I don’t think, I guess not, right? Like he’s damaged goods. All he did was win 13 games every year. I mean, come on, yeah. I mean, it’s like Marty Schottenheimer or something like that.

Luke Jones  19:30

I think, I think what’s, what’s fascinating about this is what I just cited, where four years ago, you had 10 openings, 1010, guys come in, and four years later, two of them are left, and only one of them is really perceived favorably at this point, and it’s Kevin O’Connell. By the way, there’s pub, there’s he hasn’t won, and there’s questions about his quarterback situation.

Nestor Aparicio  19:56

By the way, I looked at money with these guys, he’s making $13 million A year he got paid like an established head coach when he came in and Zach Taylor still only making four and a half million dollars in Cincinnati from his first contract, and he may have gotten the bonus for the Super Bowl or whatever when he got there, but the Bengals are cheap, notoriously, notoriously cheap, and you see this, why they haven’t fired them yet, probably how they Well, exactly, right, exactly, exactly. So you get what you pay for to some degree. And I’m not saying the ravens are going to be cheap at all, but they’re not going to have to pay Nathan shield house, 20 million, 12 million a year. They’re going to pay him 7 million a year, 6 million a year. Bottom, you know you’re a, you’re a 34 year old head coach in the league. I’m not paying you $14 million a year. I’m giving you five years and 6 million a year. I’m giving you $30 million it’s more than you’ve ever had in your life. You want to coach Lamar Jackson and come in here and win? I’m Steve a I just paid my last guy 20 million. I’ll pay you 20 million. But that’s not so there is a point where you hire that guy, and I know we talked about this earlier in the week, and then you pay Jim Schwartz 5 million to be your defensive guy, or you pay Brian table 4 million to be your offensive coordinator, or whatever it would be that those are. That’s the way this would be. And with table, his money’s probably garnished. McDermott. McDermott had to have three years left on a deal at 15 million a year, right?

8

Luke Jones  21:25

I would think so. I mean, I haven’t looked at it right, yeah. I would assume it’s at least, you know, at least had a couple years left, right,

Nestor Aparicio  21:32

yeah, but, but the amount of money these guys make, it’s as wild as saying, What does Adley rutchman make and what did Buster Posey make on his way out? It’s that, I mean, 345, million for the bottom. And, you know, Cliff Kingsbury gets the job in Arizona. He was making 4 million, 3 million bucks, you know, while John and and and Tomlin were making 18 million. It that that’s the weird I didn’t, because you don’t see salaries of the coaches much. We don’t talk about it much during the year, and most of it’s very private. It’s not like the the Players Association. Now that the Green Bay Packers make everything public, they pay Lafleur 5 million a year. So John was making almost John is making four times the amount of money that Matt Lafleur is making. It’s crazy, but

Luke Jones  22:20

it’s true. I’m don’t quote me on this as gospel, because I just did a Google search, but same McDermott was only making about 8 million per season that

Nestor Aparicio  22:32

8

nine years into it. Yeah, I found a chart a couple of days ago that really felt accurate. It did not feel like internet. And I’ll pull it up in a minute, and I’ll read it off to you, because I just got to find it.

Luke Jones  22:44

But I’d also say with some of that, I mean, it’s not subject to a salary cap, right? And your points, well, taken that said, if so, if another team needs wants to hire Nate shiel house, then you’re gonna have to pony up a little bit more, right? I mean, not 20 million a year, but you might have to give him rather than six. It might be that you give him eight or nine right, which, relative to John Harbaugh or or Andy Reid, that’s still, you know, a fraction of like, I’m gonna do

Nestor Aparicio  23:13

something I never do. And this will be for people out watching us, on the on the, on on, on the on the web, because I can pull up this chart, and I’m not 100% it’s 100% accurate, but look pretty damn accurate to me, and this is what I saw. O’Connell at 13 million la floor at five, Dan Campbell at 11. Ben Johnson got 13 because he was the hot coordinator, the hottest coordinator, the guy you can’t live without. The way you get him is you overpay him. Nick Sirianni is at 15 million. Dan Quinn, eight and a half in Washington. Brian Schottenheimer in Dallas, four and a half million because Jerry’s cheap and he couldn’t get a job any other where, any other place, nobody was willing to pay Brian Schottenheimer 10 million to be the Browns coach or whatever. So the Browns coach. Stefanski was making three and a half million. He got a major raise, leaving there, right like, literally, the Falcons are probably giving him eight, because the Falcons, the Falcons were already given. Rahim are Todd Bowles was undisclosed. Let’s see here. Canal is undisclosed. I’m just looking through other places. You know, Raheem Morris was allegedly making four, so maybe Stefanski got four or five then, I don’t know, but Brian Callahan was getting 3 million, and they just got rid of him and they hired salah. Salah’s defensive coordinator. They didn’t have to pay him 8 million to get him right. They’re paying him five six. He’s happy to have a job. So part of this is there’s some guys that are happy to have a job. And then there’s John Harbaugh or Mike Tomlin who say, if you’re not paying me 20 million, I’m not coming in. And that’s where Brian was 20 years ago. Brian’s like, I’m a $6 million coach. I’m not working for a million and a half. I’m not taking the lions job. And that’s where it was.

Luke Jones  24:54

That’s fair, that’s fair. And I mean, that’s part of this. And I I’ll always. Say, though, that because there’s no salary cap to me, if, if you go cheap on a coach, or if you go cheap on your coaching staff, or you go cheap on your weight room or your strength coaches and your trainers, that’s just a sign that you’re not a good organ, you’re not a serious organization.

8

Nestor Aparicio  25:16

It’s also a negotiation for your agent, leader, Cohen got 10 million last year. Ben Johnson got 13 million last year. Mike McDonald only got nine and a half two

Luke Jones  25:25

years ago. Yeah, which he’ll be getting more here very soon. Especially Kevin

Nestor Aparicio  25:30

O’Connell got 13 million. And Dan Quinn, who went to a Super Bowl and should have won it, only got eight and a half million from the commanders because he was just happy to have a chair. Rainbow got 14 million from the Patriots.

Luke Jones  25:42

8

I mean, it comes down to leverage. You know, how much? What’s your demand? Do you have other teams that are trying to buy for your services? That’s why I said, like, I agree with your general point about Nate shield house, and I know you’re just using him as an example in this exercise, but if two other teams want to hire him, then that price is going to go up. You know, even for the ravens, right? The Ravens might not have to offer quite as much as the other teams, but it’s got to be close, right? I mean, it’s not going to be like they’re offering eight and the Ravens are going to offer three, and he’s going to take the Ravens gig, right? Well, Jason Garrett turned down bashati money, so yeah. I mean, it’s, and there’s, there are always different reasons that are going to be at work here. So I think you know, to bring it back to just the discussion with the ravens and where they are. I mean, they’ve hired or not hired. They’ve interviewed 16 guys. I mean, the most recent camp and I’ll the defensive coordinator for the Jaguars. We know Anthony Weaver is going to get a second interview. We know Joe Brady. You know reporting from NFL networks as Joe Brady, we but we also know Vance, Joseph Davis, Webb, Clint, Kubiak and Chris Shula and Nate sheilhaus. Five of the 16 candidates they talk to are guys that are playing in their teams are playing in conference championship games. So you can’t bring them in for a second interview until next week. So if I’m not saying all five of those guys are finalists, of course, but let’s say at least a couple of them are, then that’s that’s reason to believe that unless the Ravens fall in love with Anthony Weaver, they fall in love with Joe Brady or whoever else they might bring in for a second interview this week, and they just say, You know what? This is, our guy. We don’t need to talk to anyone else, which I’d be a little surprised, you know, with I’d be surprised if Eric Decosta would feel that way. Now maybe Steve Basti would feel that way, talking to meeting with one of these guys for eight hours at some point this week in Owings Mills. But you know that leads you to believe that this hiring probably not going to come till next week, so we’ll see again, as we’ve seen with a couple of these teams, if you identify someone and and you want to make sure they don’t leave the building and you just say, Hey, he’s our guy, because at the end of the day, you can try to make it as more of an exact science as much as you can. It’s it. There’s still art involved with this. I mean, there’s still the unknown, there’s still the human element. There’s still, you know, I made the point a couple days ago where there’s, there’s this fixation on the Ravens hiring an X’s and O’s guy, an offensive or a defensive minded coach, you know, to kind of move away from the CEO model, which I hear, and I’m fine with that position. That said there’s still the CEO element of a head coach that any head coach, whether you’re a defensive genius or an offensive genius, you still have to run the football team. You’re still representing the football team. There are still administrative tasks and responsibilities that you have as a head coach that is wildly different from being a coordinator, that you have to consider. That’s why you can’t just say, Well, I really like that offense, that that so and so ran in with this team. I’m I think he’s going to make a great head coach. That’s only part of it right. There’s way more involved to this. So that’s where, you know, I, I said, I made the comment that, you know, the idea of a CEO, head coach has almost become a four letter word to some Ravens fans that were fatigued with John Harbaugh and that model, but that those elements still have to be there. Like you can’t just hire an offensive minded coach who who has no ability whatsoever to lead a football team, you know, in the way that a head coach needs to, we’ve seen that. How many great coordinators have we seen over the decades that you thought, man, that guy’s going to be a great head coach, and doesn’t work out, and not just because of that, but because of the team he’s joining, because of the the general manager because of he doesn’t hire good assistants. I mean, there are all kinds of different factors at work here. That’s why it is wild.

Nestor Aparicio  29:47

They give me money to hire the assistants I need. Exactly.

Luke Jones  29:50

I mean, there’s just, there’s a lot to it, and that’s why it is crazy from that standpoint. And again, this is not me saying the Ravens made the wrong decision. This isn’t even me saying the bill. Bills made the wrong decision, or or that Pittsburgh, you know, if they had fired Tomlin and he hadn’t stepped down, if they were making the wrong decision. But history tells us that, especially looking at those three teams and how they’re perceived, and obviously the Steelers have been a notch, at least a notch below the ravens and the bills in recent years, I think we’d all agree with that, regardless of what head to heads look like for Baltimore and Pittsburgh, the overall level of success in the regular season and all that, but history would tell us that at least one of those three teams, and quite possibly two of those three teams are not going to end up making a great hire here, because it’s just that difficult to do. And that’s where you do look at this thing and say, You know what? Fortunes favor the bold. And I hear all that, but, man, there’s just there’s a lot at work here. And bishati alluded to it. And we’ve heard other owners and other people that hire managers or head coaches to talk about this, that you end up hiring someone that you don’t know all of that well. I mean, maybe, like Anthony Weaver, would be an exception, like, you know, when you promote from within, that’s different, but when you hire someone that’s an outsider, so to speak, or maybe has been in your building, you know, a year and then, but then he goes somewhere else, and he coaches, you know, elsewhere for years and years. You know, you’re, you have a first round interview that’s over video in this day and age, generally speaking. I mean, the Ravens did a few of their first round interviews.

Nestor Aparicio  31:29

And how long do they last? Two hours.

8

Luke Jones  31:32

I think, I think they can last up to three hours for the first round. I believe that’s why I asked you, I could be, I could be wrong on that. I think that’s for the video. And you know what that might be for those that are still under contract elsewhere, I think, and their team’s still playing, you know, like, what? Like, somebody’s unemployed, you can do whatever you want, right? Yeah, sure, sure, so. But I think there’s a time limit on those but, but the second round, I mean, these guys are going to come in, and they might spend 10 hours in the building on, you know, a given Tuesday or a Wednesday or a Thursday.

Nestor Aparicio  32:05

Well, they better go for the snow gets here, right, right. Yeah, sounds like a could be, a could be, I don’t want the Monday interview.

Luke Jones  32:13

Yeah, some of the early forecasting on that, but, but, yeah. I mean but, but that said, How well do you really get to know someone in eight hours? Oh, it’s speed 10 hours. No doubt about it. There’s definitely that. I mean, that’s why it’s so important. Like what Eric Decosta and and Sashi Brown and Ozzie Newsome and probably others. You know, they probably delegate some of that heavy lifting to others. I mean, that’s why you’re making calls. You’re calling everyone that you know, and a lot of this is even the scouts you know, connections that they’ve had that you know, maybe you might have someone who worked you know, you’re interviewing someone who worked in college not that long ago. And you’re, you’re calling people that you know at some of these schools and rival schools, and you know, what do you know about this guy? What did you know about this guy when you know from a recruiting standpoint, right? I mean, there’s, there’s a lot to it, and the teams that can can, one, collect as much information as possible, and two, filter that in a constructive way to try to come up with the most accurate composite you can of someone, and then to sit down and to narrow in and try and drill down on what’s going to be important as far as what you’re talking about in an interview. I mean, the teams that do that, they have the best chance of hiring the right person or a right person, but there’s still going to be some unknown there. I mean, there’s, there just is. And I think that’s what’s fascinating, especially for the ravens and the Steelers here, who had the same coach for roughly two decades. I mean, that’s think how much the world has changed since 2007 when, when the Steelers hired Tomlin to replace Bill cower and 2008 when the Ravens hired John Harbaugh to replace Brian Billick. I mean, think about social media alone and and that impact on the world and young people and football players, right? I mean, just that, let alone so many other things. That’s not to say that you can’t make a good hire, but you’re certainly not doing things exactly like you did 20 years ago when you hired a coach. I mean, it’s,

Nestor Aparicio  34:21

8

comes in as the analytics guy, and that’s he’s speaking Eric’s language, because John didn’t care about analytics. It was Eric’s thing. So John’s first word in New York was analytics. And that makes him sound smart in

Luke Jones  34:33

New York, sure, and I mean things that he asked for in New York that they’re going to, apparently, give him, as far as staffing and analytics department and all those types of things. Those were things John Harbaugh was talking to the Ravens about back in in 2008 I don’t think I mean, if they were, it was on a very rudimentary level in terms of, hey, baseball has analytics. Now, maybe these are some things we need to be doing as an organization to try to gain an edge. But. Now, you know, all these years later, things like that are commonplace. I mean, if, if you’re an organization that’s not doing those things, you’re behind. Well, I

Nestor Aparicio  35:07

know what Marvin came here. He was saying. You know, Ted had no idea, because Buffalo was run by Marv Levy and at the and cower was a forward thinking guy, right? So Marvin brought things seriously. We’re doing things here that they were not doing in Pittsburgh. Now we’re bringing them here. And then Marvin, when he got hired in Cincinnati, he brought Brian Ozzy’s way, because the Bengals didn’t know what they were doing. And he’s like, No, we this is how we won. We changed a lot when I I brought some Pittsburgh, Rex brought some, some buddy, and Brian brought some Denny green, and, you know, Ozzie brought some Brian, and we this is how we decide to do football, and that was all part of Phil savage and Eric dicostia and early scouting and Ozzy and the process, trusting the process, we’re gonna have a process, and this is what we’re going to do with every kid that’s baseball’s changed dramatically, right? I mean, in your time and Moneyball and analytics. Totally different game. Totally different game, right? Like, even just the way pitching is the way all of it’s done. You know, football was way behind in that category. And Eric brought that up to me a decade ago when he started befriending sigma Idell and Mike Elias. I mean, I’ll say this out loud. It’s true. Mike Elias can agree to it one day or not. Eric Decosta got Mike Elias hired from the Orioles because Eric da Costa went to dinner with John Angelos to talk analytics and recommended SIG maj Dahl, who was doing the saber this Monday here in town. And Eric got into analytics through his love of baseball. So that’s where it came in the side door a decade ago with the Ravens. I don’t know what the Arizona Cardinals do. I don’t know what the Miami Dolphins do. Anthony Weaver would be a great guy to say, Hey, how did they do it in Texas? How did they do it in Miami? What? What goes building to building at this point? And I don’t know enough people in the game to know that. And Harbaugh wouldn’t know either, because he hasn’t been in other buildings. He’s only been he’s only been in his own building. So, you know, guys that have been in three or four buildings would have a much better especially when guys come here, right? Guys come to Baltimore, they’re like, Trevor price came here. So this is way better than the way they did in Denver. I mean, I remember hearing that, and that’s part of how the Ravens have this reputation of being forward thinking, right?

Luke Jones  37:22

Yeah, but that’s all that also goes back to why you’re talking to 16 candidates in the first round. Because you get to hear about Denver and Sean Payton and what they’re doing there. You get to hear about Seattle and what, even though the ravens are very familiar with Mike McDonald, still, you get an idea of what they’re doing. You know Clint Kubiak, their offensive coordinator. I can’t I mentioned Matt Nagy, right? At no point did I actually want Matt NAT you know, was I ever saying I want the ravens to hire Matt Nagy? But to me, it was an opportunity to pull back the curtain a little bit on Kansas City and how they view the ravens, and how they do some things, and what do they do with Patrick mahomes, or some little tidbits, or little ideas of what they think about Lamar Jackson that you might implement, regardless of whether you hire the guy, but you might just take that idea you’re trying to get the job so you’re not holding back. I mean, yeah, I mean, there’s a little bit of gamesmanship at work on both sides with that. But you go down that list and I mean Mike McDaniel, say what you want about how his tenure ended with the dolphins, but he’s a genius. They had some really explosive offenses where you look at that and say, Hey, as our head coach, or maybe as our offensive coordinator, depending on who we hire, right? I mean, but you go down that list and you just, you’re finding out about these candidates, but you’re also picking brains. I mean, shame on the Ravens if they weren’t going to talk to someone connected to Sean McVay, right? And with how good the rams have been, whether Nate, she’ll house, is a very serious candidate for the head coach opening, or someone that they say, Man, that kid’s really smart. I mean, maybe we could hire him to be our offense coordinator, if, even if we don’t hire them as our head coach. So but point is, you want to talk to as many individuals from as many organizations that you perceive to be good organizations, to find out about them as candidates. But you also learn. You also learn. You learn about yourselves. You learn about other teams.

8

Nestor Aparicio  39:19

Who’s the best coach in the league? Can I just ask you that? Because, like, you started mentioning McVay, and I’m thinking, Shanahan, or whatever. If you could hire anyone to come in and pay him $25 million right now, you make him the high who is your guy? Because that’s really like, Yeah, we haven’t ever discussed that in all of these years. And oh, John Harbaugh, he’s great. Dwight Tomlin, he’s great. But Andy Reid, He’s great. He’s my guy. I thought Sean Payton was a turd. Like, you know, I thought like him coming back. My God, he might win with a backup quarterback this week. He looks like he’s a Yoda at this point. Like, literally, after all he’s been through, he seems to be a. A grown up all of I mean, I mean, he was a wild guy. He was a drinker, party guy, you know, head cut, you know, like all of that back in the day. He’s like, grown up and mellowed out to be the CEO kind of coach where you’ll and I wouldn’t have thought that a year or two ago, but I think differently about him now. But I think Shanahan McVay, I think McDonald has a star on him right now. I’ve always liked Kevin O’Connell because I spent time with him. I would hire him. Ben Johnson has a little juice about him, right? Liam Cohn went down to Jacksonville, and he’s smart for a minute or whatever. Tamika Ryan smells good. He’s only making $4 million a year. He made more as a player. So fascinating. But who, what are we looking for? I would have said Sean McDermott’s a top five coach yesterday before we get fired.

Luke Jones  40:49

I would have disagreed with that, although I would have said top 10 coach. I I probably if we’re going to take in because we need to take into account age, right? I mean, Andy Reid’s not going to be doing it much longer.

Nestor Aparicio  41:02

I mean, Dan Quinn’s a hell of a coach, hell of a he coached my team, you know? I mean, I

Luke Jones  41:06

8

mean, he’s nowhere near my top five, though. Look, there’s plenty, and some of the names you

Nestor Aparicio  41:11

mentioned who’s in the NFC Championship game last year with a rookie. Just so you know, he was really smart this time last year, yeah.

Luke Jones  41:19

But at the same time. I think that’s where you need to look at the sample size. And I think McVeigh would be the guy for me.

Nestor Aparicio  41:26

I agree with that. I think that’s universal, by the way.

8

Luke Jones  41:30

And people will say, Okay, well, he had Matthew Stafford. He took the Rams to a Super Bowl with Jared golf as their quarterback also. So I think you look at that, I think Shanahan deserves, and this sounds kind of weird, because I think he gets plenty of credit, but when you look at what he’s done with Brock Purdy, what he had done with Jimmy Garoppolo, and we saw Jimmy Garoppolo go elsewhere, and who’s Jimmy Garoppolo starting for right now? No one, right? So, so you kind of look at that, you say, Man, he’s been someone who’s made it work with different quarterbacks? I mean, that to me, is a big thing. I mean, can you make it work with different guys? Right? I mean, Andy Reid had a great run in Philadelphia. He had a real, really good run in Philadelphia, despite not winning a Super Bowl, but he didn’t become this guy that we perceive him to be now, until Patrick mahomes arrived, right? And that’s not, let me be clear. I’m not saying that to pick on him or to diminish him. It speaks to so many of these coaches become Hall of Fame coaches because they’re then joined at the hip with the Hall of Fame quarterback. I mean, Bill Walsh would tell you that Joe Montana, and you know, to a lesser extent, Steve Young, even you know Steve Young, that was more, more George seiferts guy. But the point is, they make you look really smart. They make your system looks look better than it even is. So that’s where it to me. It’s a little more impressive what Shanahan’s done, what Sean McVay has done. You know, I mean, think about what Sean McVay, that Sean McVay, Matthew Stafford pairing. And obviously that’s going to be pending what they do on Sunday. And, you know, I’m picking the Seahawks in that game, but man, if they get to, if they get to the Super Bowl, having won three straight road games, and Matthew Stafford could be the MVP and and all that, you think about what the perception was of Matthew Stafford seven or eight years ago. What? What came to mind when you someone said him losing, right? The lions, they didn’t win anything, right? And everyone thought he was a loser. Well, he gets to LA and you realize this guy’s a heck of a quarterback, right? And, but that right there reminds that you still, for as great as a quarterback can be that he still has to have the right structure around him, and that’s why it kind of brings it back to where the ravens and the bills are right now, where you have organizations that fired longtime coaches who had success. You know, 2025 aside for John Harbaugh. Ravens had had plenty of success in the regular season with Lamar Jackson. The bills have had plenty of six regular season success in January, success until they run into Kansas City with Josh Allen. But when you have that kind of quarterback, you’re asking, am I maximizing it? Am I getting the absolute most I can get out of it? And both those teams are taking some risk here. There’s no question about that. But at the same time, if you’re not breaking through, you need to go out there and see find someone that you think can help you break through, right? I mean, some, some, I’ve seen a couple people make the comparison to whether we’re talking hardball or McDermott. I’ve seen people making the comparison of Tony Dungy in Tampa Bay, right? They bring in Gruden, and they broke through, and they won in grudens first year now with dungey’s team. Yeah, right. I mean, so it just speaks to But Joe out to belly with Earl Weaver’s team. But you question about it, but you can also find. An example. As much as you find those examples, you’ll, you’ll, you can go find examples where it doesn’t work. So there is some risk involved, involved there, but, but, yeah, to answer your question, I think because McVay and Shanahan have now been doing it as long as they have, but are still young enough, where you say those guys could coach another 20 years if they wanted to. I mean, I don’t think they will, like, especially McVeigh, he’s already, he already said he wouldn’t want to do this. But if we’re in a vacuum, just looking at his age compared to Andy Reid, where Andy Reid is not going to be doing this much longer than, I don’t know, maybe another four or five years at the most, right? I think those are the guys that I would really look at. But that said Mike McDonald, two or three years might be on that list, right? I mean, any code, you know what, lots of coaches can have great years, right? Lots of coaches can have a really good two or three year stretch. I mean, John Harbaugh, really, when we look back at his tenure, what are we going to really view as truly being great for him? It was his first five years, you know, his first seven years where they made the playoff six, six times, right?

Nestor Aparicio  46:05

Well, he’s just hitched his wagon to a quarterback up there. He’s going to get his 100 million dollars, but he might get some four and 13 sandwiches too, if they don’t go well, maybe,

Luke Jones  46:14

maybe, I mean, but if you’re them, you’re saying, well, but John Harbaugh hasn’t been that at the worst thing you could say about John Harbaugh is that he still had a really high floor, like he hasn’t had these three and four.

Nestor Aparicio  46:27

8

You know what? He’s had a really good core. He’s had a top five quarterback most years. In 18 seasons, he had a top five, top seven quarterback, certainly top five in his own conference, quarterback all of the time, other than when Joe got turned sideways in 15 and was no good in 17, and Lamar has been hurt three out of the last five years. So yeah, and won MVPs in the years when he’s healthy. But, yeah, sure, sure,

Luke Jones  46:54

but at the same time, I mean, it goes back to what I said about Andy Reid, right? I mean, Andy

Nestor Aparicio  46:58

Tomlin has been winning divisions with 42 year old quarterbacks, and, you know, goes to pub, Eb, Brister. So, you know, there have been some guys that don’t have the talent, or don’t have the quarterbacks. You know,

Luke Jones  47:10

that said some of those head coaches, as time goes on. You know, John had influence on the roster, Mike Tomlins had influence on the roster, right? So, so I agree with you, but also you have to point at that and say, well, doesn’t he have to own some of that inability to find make it work at the quarterback position too. So, you know, it’s a catch 22 I mean, you know, they’re all the sports are tricky. And I mean winning in the playoffs tricky, right? How many times have we talked about the two Raven Super Bowl teams, and the luck and bounces that went their way along the way. And you can look at some other teams, like the 2011 ravens, where it didn’t go their way, with Lee Evans and Billy Cundiff, right? And so, I mean, it’s just, it’s tough, it’s really hard to do, and that’s why it is, you know, to go back to your original point about McDermott, where you look at it and say, Man, it can be harsh, it can be hasty, but at the same time, if you don’t have the belief that you’re breaking through, you do kind of owe it to yourselves, to your fan base, to try something different. Maybe it works. Maybe it doesn’t. We could be talking about the Ravens hiring another coach three or four years from now, the bills could crash and burn and trade Josh Allen because he wants out, because they hired the wrong guy and or, you know, Pittsburgh could hire the next coach that they’re gonna have for 20 years, and in the next year or two, they draft a franchise quarterback, and they’re back to being

8

Nestor Aparicio  48:37

the Steelers of old. I don’t know silly season right now. It is it is, it

Luke Jones  48:40

is. It’s so funny. I mean, and

Nestor Aparicio  48:42

the games are getting played this weekend, and it’s going to snow like hell here, and there’s going to be a Super Bowl, and we’re not going to care much, and the Ravens are going to put their purple plumes of smoke out next week. But, I mean, these next 10 days for the ravens, this directs the franchise for the next five years in so many ways.

Luke Jones  48:56

8

Does? It does, but the but the crazy thing about it is no one’s really going to know for a while whether it really works or not. What’s crazy.

Nestor Aparicio  49:06

Sean McDermott is so much more advanced and further along than any of these cats. We’re talking about, any of the Salas, any of the Vance Joe’s, any any of the HLS. Is any of that, and I don’t know that he they’re even going to look at him, yeah, which is crazy.

Luke Jones  49:22

That said you could say the same thing about John Harbaugh, right? I mean, John Harbaugh has way better credentials than most of the 16 guys. The fact

Nestor Aparicio  49:29

that he walks through that parking lot where they’ve done nothing but lose for 15 years, and they stink and they’re not the Jets, but only because of their helmets, literally only because they’ve been lousy for a decade. I mean, there’s no doubt they’re they’re horrible, and that he is going to be the thing that deodorizes it. I call bullshit on that all because I’ve met John. I like John. I respect John, and all that John had great football players here, and that’s that’s a testament to Eric Ozzie, drafting, well, scouting, well, how much money they spent the. Mark azevedos, the Joe Ortiz’s, the George kuquinis. It’s not about one person, or any one person. John came into a situation that Ozzy had laid and did well with all of it, one but he had won anything in 12 years. And John’s demeanor, John’s smallness, John’s dishonesty. And look, I can beat John up all day, and I’m watching it. I want to see John Harbaugh playing this time, 234, years from now, with the Giants, tap on, hat on, hosting NFC Championship games at the medal edge. I’ll bet whatever’s in my wallet, that’s not going to happen. Okay, you might be right. I don’t think John’s a better man. I don’t necessarily think he’s a better coach. I don’t think he’s a better leader. I think he’s more fraudulent. As time has gone on for me, the longer I’ve been exposed to John arbaugh, he gets an F for me for a fraud. That’s what he that when I think of John Harbaugh for the rest of my life, knowing what I know about him, knowing the text I have in my phone that are lies, I think of him as a fraud. So when I see him get the most money, go to New York, do all of that. God bless him. He might win. I don’t think I wouldn’t hire him. I wouldn’t hire him because I, I don’t trust John. If John arbaugh texted me right now and said, Hey, I don’t work there anymore, let’s get let’s really sit down, and I’d say, John, you’re just a liar, dude. You had all that opportunity to do that with me. Yeah, you love my wife. You want to get, like, all the stuff with John. I’m not a John guy. So that being said, the fact that he’s perceived as being the guy who’s going to completely go in there and change everything and fix everything. If he does, he’s to Bill Belichick. What the modells felt about Belichick when they said, Get out of here. We don’t want you. We don’t need you. Take your hoodie, take your your profanity, take your nastiness, and just get out of here. We don’t want you around here anymore, and belichick’s going to the hall. But nobody wanted to hire Belichick two years ago either. So part of this is, you know, it’s a solitary job to some degree for being such a public job. Because, ask Sean McDermott, I don’t think he deserved to get fired this week. And he got fired by the nice people, the pago’s, who have done nothing with a franchise that was complete dog shit before he got there, right? Like you talk about deodorant, Sean McDermott did everything to the bills that the giants are hoping John arboll does. I mean, the Ravens didn’t need to get fixed when they hired John Harbaugh, they were pretty decent shape. They won 30, you know, they had Ray Lewis. They had something as prime. They had breed in his prime. They, you know, going up there with, and I saw the roster of people he had good luck with Cam scatterboat And, you know, okay, go get them. But I’ll, you know, I’ll be shocked if John wins 13 games, four out of the next five years, and host the championship game and goes to a Super Bowl. Count me as shocked for that 100 million if that happens. Because I don’t think he’s the best coach in the league. I don’t think, I don’t think he’s the best in game coach, review coach. I think he he’s a good CEO. I think he’s hired decent coordinators, but I think he’s had great talent, and I think the talent, and he would agree with that, the talents, everything he had, the Arizona Cardinals, talent, the last he wouldn’t be John Harbaugh.

8

Luke Jones  53:11

That’s fair. Who’s winning with that? With lack of talent, a lot of talent, this year didn’t win. So, I mean, who really but who really wins with

Nestor Aparicio  53:21

I’m just saying that him is a $20 million coach, and Damico Ryan’s is a $4 million coach. And the 20 years of age difference in them, I I’m fascinated to see who the ravens are going to hire like, because it’s going to be about Steve, and Steve’s going to have to fall in love with whoever he falls in love. It’s very obvious last week. I mean, Eric’s gonna bring some people to the king, and the king, I have the power. Steve’s gonna pick the coach, and it’s gonna be a coach that Steve loves. And I think Steve would look at Sean McDermott, think he’s wimpy. You know what? I mean, like, just based on the god the good fellows guy I saw last week, I think he’s gonna, he’s gonna need that chin and that Jill cower that tough guy you like, because that’s who you know, Mike McDaniels too. You know earthy for him,

Luke Jones  54:09

I mean, so he’s only hired one coach. So, I mean, well,

Nestor Aparicio  54:12

8

that’s why I’m interested to see where this is going to go, whether this is going to be a young African American Coach who’s got a defensive background, or an old sage, you know guy, he wants to pay $15 million to there aren’t it? There’s not a lot. I mean, McDermott’s the most McDermott’s now the guy, if you’re looking for somebody who’s done it, who knows what he’s doing, I know he knows what he’s doing. I don’t know anything about Nate shieldhouse or any of the rest of these guys who might become the next Robert Soller, the next retread

Luke Jones  54:42

that said, What is McDermott? I mean, the reason you brought got rid of John Harbaugh is because he wasn’t winning in January. McDermott hasn’t won in January. You know what? I mean, you better hope you can

Nestor Aparicio  54:52

win in September, October, November, too.

Luke Jones  54:55

That that that applies. John did a lot of that. Sure, that’s why. Said, I mean, like, look, I’m, I think it was time for John. I support the Ravens going in a different direction. But you’ve got to, got to make sure you hire the right guy. And that’s

8

Nestor Aparicio  55:10

just fascinated how he is, God, he’s the Wizard of New York now, like he shows up and we brought credibility. Get some players, because here they’re the coach they hire here. Might not bring that credibility to your point. It might be like hiring John Harbaugh, who had nothing. He was Jim’s brother. He was a special teams coach, like, if they hire that sort of unproven person here, really say that that person really won the interviewing process, and that would speak to me. That would lighten Steve for me to say Steve looked at all of this and wound up being the Steve Yoda guy, to say that’s the next thing. The way I looked at Kevin O’Connell when I met him, spent time with him, and thought I’d hire that guy. I met a lot of coaches. You know, I had, I had one meal with Kevin O’Connell. I hire him. I mean, that’s I would hire Dan Quinn. I’ve spent a lot of time with Dan Quinn. I would hire Dan Quinn. Mike McDonald, I told you how I felt about him. I’ve spent 45 minutes with him ever everything about him said authenticity and genuine in a way that if you spend five minutes with John, it’s a different vibe. It’s a different vibe. I’ll be honest with you, spend a lot of time with John. So um, and the way to Nico Ryan’s comes across too. You know, there’s some of these young guys that have this calmness about them. Steve didn’t have any calm in the press conference last week. I I’m interested in he’s only picked one guy. He didn’t even pick Ozzy or Eric. He just kept them on. He didn’t even pick Chad steel. Chad steel was working for the company before he and he didn’t really even pick Sashi. Dick Cass picked Sashi. So Steve picking people. And I think it’s about Steve in the end, Steve picking people. This is a big week, man. We fun?

Luke Jones  56:51

Yeah, I mean, we’re gonna find out. I i still think Eric dicostia, who is running the show for this, you know, ran the show for this first round. I think he wants to find the next Sean McVay, not saying that any of these 16 guys are even going to be that. Or they might come to the conclusion that none of these 16 are that, and they might have to go in a different direction than that. But Eric, being the intellectual that he is, and that, you know, just the guy that is going to look at things, look for an edge. Look for someone who’s cutting edge. Look for someone who’s innovating. I think he wants the next Sean McVay. I don’t know if any of these 16 guys actually are the next Sean McVay, right? I mean, John mcvays aren’t Hall of Fame coaches. Don’t grow on trees, right? That that, you just find new ones every year, so that that’s the that’s the question here. That’s why I go back to how I felt in December. I mean, you know when we talked in passing about John Harbaugh and John McCain’s 39

Nestor Aparicio  57:51

now, well, that’s why a different level of energy when you’re 35 than when you’re Pete Carroll at this point, even if you’re Pete Carroll, you got a lot of energy. Why people are

Luke Jones  57:59

8

talking about Davis Webb right now, whether he’s ready right now, or whether he’s another year or two away. I mean, you know, I didn’t

Nestor Aparicio  58:07

realize McVeigh went to Miami of Ohio, same as a bar ball, right? Yeah, a

Luke Jones  58:11

lot of coaches that have gone there, yeah, they had, like, what the coaching cradle there? Whatever it’s called Cradle coaches. But, yeah. I mean, we’re gonna find out. But it’s, it’s fascinating, because you can try to make this as as much of a science as you can. But how are these guys going to handle your your football team, your players, whatever happens in the course of a 60 minute game week after week after week? I mean, there’s just a lot of unknown, and that’s what makes it fun. They could hire the next Vince Lombardi, or they could hire a total dud, and we’re Sean McVay.

Nestor Aparicio  58:46

Was born in January of 86 I remember January 86 so little challenger, you know, explosion. So, hey, you know, 40 years ago today, he is a Luke. He’s over 40. I’m well over 40 at this point, we’re gonna have a coaching search, and you’re gonna get the little wnst tech service out the purple plumes. I’m not worried about it right this minute. I’m thinking, well, after the snow, we’re on red alert around here to get coaches in here and all that stuff. We’re gonna play football this weekend. We’re gonna be doing the Maryland crab cake tour and a cup of Super Bowl with our friends at the Maryland lottery, Candy Cane cash giveaways, also our friends at GBMC, bringing that on at Coppin State University. Hey, copping, we were making it happen. Fun over there. Poor Gary wing is before the game, he said, I hope we only lose by 50 and not 80. Is the South Carolina ladies get down over the weekend. And was a lot of gamecock’s gear over in West Baltimore over the weekend too. Forgot how many people I know that went to South Carolina. So a big week around here. Football. We’re going to do some baseball at some point, because spring training is around the corner, maybe the Orioles will sign a pitcher here this week and blow us up. But we are Baltimore positive. We’re waiting for the next coach of the Baltimore Ravens, and just talking a lot between now and then.