The Baltimore Orioles managed just one run in two games of the AL Wild Card round against the Kansas City Royals. Luke Jones and Nestor discuss the woeful bats of the October Orioles and what happens next for Elias and roster after a summer where it wasn’t good enough – or healthy enough – to win postseason baseball games.
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
Maryland crab cake tour, postseason losses, fan disappointment, Adley Rutschman, Mike Elias, Brandon Hyde, roster changes, attendance issues, offseason plans, veteran players, right-handed bat, pitching needs, leadership gap, player development, future outlook
SPEAKERS
Nestor Aparicio, Luke Jones
Nestor Aparicio 00:01
Welcome home. We are W N, S T am 1570 Towson, Baltimore,
8
Luke Jones 00:06
Baltimore,
Nestor Aparicio 00:07
positive. We’re going to be doing the Maryland crab cake tour next Friday for Luke’s birthday. They were eliminated on his birthday. They didn’t hit the damn ball on his birthday, like Cedric Mullins exempted on that the 11th is the big date next Friday. Come on out get some pizza. When’s last time your pizza? John’s? You westsiders? I never been to Essex. Well, you know, I’ll bring you over to Thunder. We’ll get we’ll get a beer cost this afternoon. I’ll do the whole east side tour for all y’all over there. Come on down see us at Pete Johns. We’ll have a good time on Tuesday or Friday afternoon celebrating birthdays. I got great guests coming by. Luke’s gonna come by. I don’t know what he’s getting on his pizza. He’s gonna be powered up by friends, which, if you do multi care and royal farms, getting him down to Essex next week and Owings Mills, but one last clean out the lockers presser, and also, sort of the season ending. Mike Elias, Brandon Hyde, where do we go from here, Luke, we’ve done a lot on the fans and on attendance. Will continue to do that. I wrote a letter to David Rubenstein that 1000s of people have already read. Thank you very much. Please share our work. Share Luke’s work. Share that our tech service is alive and well. 410-821-9678, and better than ever. We’re working hard here. And I would just say this. We talked attendance. I got my thoughts in on rushman and injuries and the disappointment and the air out of the balloon. Katie Griggs is going to get hers from me. Rubenstein’s already got his for me off season. Where’s the money, like all, all of that stuff, um, I grabbed the coffee from Royal farms in between this last segment, and my wife said, How’s Luke holding up? And I’m like, wow, he’s working like a dog in the Ravens. And your I said, we’re not going to New York this weekend. We don’t have to worry about what bar we’re going to, by the way. She said there’s a raven fan bar in Manhattan. She’s right, right on Seventh Avenue. I figured you and I be watching the Bengals there and having some fun. And take you to Peter lugers, and, you know, have some fun. But I said, Luke’s cranky. They didn’t hit the ball. They got some pitching looks cranky. He wanted to go to like, you know, you were right, like you’re pissed, like you’re like, as a fan, you’re pissed as a media you’re disappointed, perplexed, maybe, but not so much based in the last 90 days, but the body of work on the field they had a chance to just, they’re the bases loaded. Nobody out, dude. Dude, they should have at least been playing on Thursday, man, right? I mean, come on. I mean, it really was a piss poor performance over 18 innings and really over 10 games in a row. I mean, this is, this is getting heavy on the fans even and more so even then on Adley rutschman or anybody who weren’t here for Delmon young. I mean, it’s, it’s been a stretch,
Luke Jones 02:55
right? I mean, for these guys, for this core, it’s five straight postseason losses, right? I mean, they have nothing to do with Delmon young. They have nothing to do with Zach Britton being left in the bullpen and a Baldo Jimenez giving up the home Ronda and carnacion. But for a fan base, yeah, that’s that’s quite a burden for for a fan base that hasn’t gotten to experience much, much postseason in general over the last 40 years. You know since the glory days of 66 through 83 that when you have those opportunities and you have a Delmon young moment, and again, for what it was, it was a great moment, but it was a Division Series moment, right? It wasn’t a game three of the World Series or anything like that. When you’ve now gone through this and you’re swept by Kansas City in the ALCS and 14, and you have the wild card game in 16. And then at that point, you see the end of the Duquette Showalter era play out in such awful fashion, in terms of how things just completely crashed and burned, really, at the very end of September of 17, but certainly in 2018 I mean, they said record number of losses in franchise history. But you go through the rebuild, and Mike Elias and one one picks, and rushman and gunner and everything that’s happened to the point where, you know, things started to turn around in 22 and there was so much excitement at the end of that season. Or, you know, probably, I don’t want to say overwhelming excitement, but a lot of optimism, let’s say, and then last year, things just came together the way they did, and things overall went so well last year, until the Felix Batista thing, and ever since, they played well in the first half of the season, but they dealt with injuries. Then you go through this kind of a season, you kind of have the final week where Westberg comes back, coulomb comes back, Jacob Webb comes back, Ryan mountcastle comes back, Heston kerstead comes back, Grayson Rodriguez doesn’t come back. You play well. Take two or three from the Yankees in the Bronx. You sweep the twins. Who you know had completely fallen apart and you’re feeling, hey, this is right here. We’re playing a team that was similar, similarly underwhelming, if not just playing bad in the month of September. I mean, again, they didn’t the Royals didn’t swing the bats at all. Go look at their offensive numbers in the month of September. So to just face plan again. That’s why I said to you that post game clubhouse, there was more pain in this one than last year. Again, I think there was a sense last year one, they had had such a great season. It was their first time, and the Royals or the Rangers, just flat out beat their bots. The Royals didn’t beat their butts. In these two games, they lost one to nothing in two to one. And that’s where it’s just excruciating. I mean, they had their chance. You know, we talked about this in game one. We don’t need to rehash game one. There’s not a bunch of rehash. It’s one nothing, right? I mean, again, you didn’t lose 10 to nothing in these games. But Game Two, they get Cedric Mullins, who, by the way, Cedric Mullins, he had a nice series, right? And he’s someone who was hurt and did nothing in last year’s Division Series. So if you’re looking for the tiniest example of someone rebounding from a bad postseason, I mean, Cedric Mullins did it. He had, you know, two games. It’s two games. I get it, but, you know, he did a nice job. Hit a home run. It ties it up for the people who were in the ballpark, it got loud, right? I mean, it wasn’t a terrible atmosphere in terms of the fans wanting to have something to cheer about. The Orioles didn’t give them anything to cheer about, but they load the bases. Nobody out. You’re saying, Okay, here’s their chance. They’re going to take the lead. And then at that point, the question was going to become, what had become a bullpen game, because they pulled zeflin After, or zeflin, I just put his first and last name together, Zach Eflin after, you know, twice through the order. They pulled him at that point, as I told you, they might do with anyone not named Corbin burns, and they went through the bullpen. And at that point, my question was, okay. Are these guys going to do it? Because I’ve been the one that’s been doubting the pen Well, in the midst of thinking about that and pondering that, Santander pops up. Colton cowser strikes out. Adley rutsman grounds out, which included taking, what a two Oh fastball right down the pipe. I mean, I know fans are mad, and I am not at all suggesting that Brandon Hyde is beyond reproach or beyond any criticism, or beyond any questioning of this move or that move. I mean, could they have walked rushman and left CNL Perez in to face pascantino, rather than bringing in Kano to face Bobby Witt Jr, I said, I think I said, Walk, Rush and walk when I’m sorry, you know, not much sleep the last few days. Point is, you know what happened this in the sixth inning. You could question the strategy. You could question which way direction they go there, but to sit here and just want to complete, want to execute the manager, when your 345, hitter. Hitters do that with the bases loaded and nobody out. I mean, at some point in time, you got to put something on the players, right and in this social media age, and I don’t mean this exclusively to the Orioles and the Ravens, because me having a brother in law who’s a die hard Philadelphia sports fan, I see enough Philadelphia sports media as well. We have such a tendency to and it feels like it’s only getting worse, that when teams win and succeed, it’s all about the players, the players, the players, the players, the players did it. When teams lose, it’s all about the coaching. The coaches stink, the manager’s dumb, the offensive coordinator sucks. What? And there’s just we’ve lost our ability to have any nuance and look at this so well, everybody’s
Nestor Aparicio 08:43
8George Steinbrenner, right? That was the George Steinbrenner thing. And the let’s, let’s kill management. That’s not the Steve thing. Shotty thing is that, you know, we’re gonna let them sit here and hang out for the rest of their lives. I mean, there’s, there’s an in between, and I don’t know where Mr. Rubin sure is, and I wrote a note to him. And this is all new and fresh. But if Mr. Rubin said this, there is new ownership, right? So new owners come in and do you know, certainly in places that need to be fumigated, like Washington, where they now have a quarterback, and I promise you, they have a coach there, Dan Quinn’s a good, good man. I know Dan Quinn. You know what I mean. So like I you look at that and say, well, there’s a new thing, Magic Johnson and the drunk owner on ESPN the opening night, like all that. But there is new everything here, everything Katie Griggs, everything’s getting evaluated. To me, I’ve seen baseball operations here since Hank Peters and, you know, Earl Weaver and the Oriole way and Harry Dalton and I’ll go through all of it. Rolly HeMan, I knew Melvin Frank like just take, take them all, all the way. Mike Flanagan Beatty, all these guys, that’s not the part of the thing that’s broken. Mike Elias and Brandon Hyde and sigma Idell are not. Broken that Adley rutschman is not broken. I mean, you know, like, don’t, don’t, don’t, hopefully not the problems. Don’t mix the pro Well, Colton cows was broke, but don’t, don’t mix the problems with the result. You know what I mean? Like, I just, I have a problem with that and process level, to say the body of work. You know what I mean? The body of work is stop with this fire brand and hide nonsense. I mean, come on, you. When people say that, you know what it tells me. It tells me you’re an ignorant fan. I mean it really I mean in the hours after that, it tells me you’re the fan I that I ran away from phone calls from that. I run away from Twitter, I shake my head. I smack like I see it on my Facebook page. I see, you know, like I get it and I can’t at 56 I can’t deal with nonsense. Like, come on, man, you know, yeah, they’re issues, but the issues aren’t broken leadership or that the manager did a poor job. He was manager the year back in June, when he had pitching, and he had a healthy catcher, and he had westburg coming into his own. And, I mean, look, you can beat him up on that holiday in Mayo not making it, if you want to, like, I’ll beat Elias up for not doing enough for the bullpen, and I’ll hear you on the trade. I you know, come on, man, he’s a pretty standard work to be done. No, but, but if you ask him right now, how did he do with the trading deadline, he’d make some excuses for Rogers in the future, whatever he probably say, c minus, I failed us. You know, like maybe, maybe c plus, because effling got to the hill and gave him maybe b minus, because definitely got to the hill. Got a game of game two. You know what? I mean? I, I don’t know, but I’m trying to evaluate that body of work based on the two games we saw. And I’m not going to beat Brandon Hyde up, that’s all.
Luke Jones 11:51
Yeah, and look like I said, you can question moves. I mean, they could have walked wit and Perez faces pascantino, who hadn’t played, you know, I played two games in a month, right? So my general point was, when I look back to the series, they scored one run. I mean, okay, if you want to fire the hitting coaches and you want to start firing people left and right and all that, okay, but then I, I don’t trust your ability to replace necessary. If you’re going to be that rash, that hasty, that over the top and reacting about it, then those same people that are making those decisions, I’m also going to doubt their ability to to get people that are going to be better, because again, this offense worked very well for the first half of the season, some of the injuries and but I said, you do need to look at your process. They do need to be better situationally. There are, you know, even though you would look at this and say, well, Gunner Henderson, I mean, he was MVP of the league the first two months of the season. This guy was a top five to 10 player in Major League, in the American League this year, right? You know, Colton cows are maddening as it might be, that he’s inconsistent. Think about how we view him now compared to a year ago, when he wasn’t even on the postseason roster. Jordan westburg became an all star player who got hurt. The one guy that you look at is Adley rutschman, and you and I have both established that there’s very compelling evidence to suggest that he’s hurt, and maybe we’ll find out something definitive today, tomorrow, next week, or maybe it won’t be until spring training. But I think you have to very much consider that, because again, this guy went from all star to the profile of a replacement level player in Major League Baseball, right? I mean, that’s that doesn’t make any sense. That’s not a slump. That’s what the heck is going on? Like, what’s wrong with his health? What’s wrong with you know, did he get hurt, like all that?
Nestor Aparicio 13:46
So to your point, why is he playing, if he can’t play at that level? And so we did a half an hour on that,
Luke Jones 13:52
right? Exactly, so that, but at the same time. And this is where I am going to get a little step outside my comfort zone a little bit here, as I try to analyze things, you do have to look at this and say, Why have you gone over back to back postseasons? We’re not talking about like the ravens, for example, who were a zay flowers fumble across the goal line from maybe having a chance to knock off the chiefs. As much as everyone was frustrated, they did get to that moment.
8Nestor Aparicio 14:24
I mean, this team hasn’t, they haven’t lined up to shake hands in a postseason game yet in five tries. So struck out with the bases loaded, nobody out. And so you have, like, literally, right, like, right. So you do have to look at nobody out. That’s the best scenario you can have in life. You got to squeeze something out of that. And if you don’t, the next day, you clean your locker out. You just say, we didn’t perform so when the lights were bright. So
Luke Jones 14:50
you do have to look at that. And you know, let me use some local sports memories and examples. You know, does this team need it? Frank. Robinson. And what I mean by that is, I’m not necessarily saying you’re going to bring in somebody who’s going to hit, what, 586 career home runs, and be a Hall of Famer and one of the, you know, top 20 players in the history of the game. But Jim Palmer, to this day, has talked about, we were a pretty good team, you know, and you could go and look at the Orioles from about 1960 on. They had some, some good teams. And, you know, in 64 really good team, you know, 61 I mean, they’re stuck behind the Yankees. I mean, you know, Jim Gentile had an amazing year about his man Owen mares, but they got to 66 or the winner of 65
Nestor Aparicio 15:34
and they said, Jim Palmer said, Frank Robinson was brought in. We make the trade. He taught us how to win. Do they need a Frank Robinson? Do they need a Shannon sharp and a rod Woodson to add to this mix? And look, it’s October 3, as you and I are sitting here having this conversation, I don’t know who that player is. 25 years later, you just said something. I don’t, because I know both of those guys real well, and I don’t think they’re, you know, I know they’re special and like all that, but 25 years later, think about that man and and throw goose in there and throw, you know, whatever the heart transmit. But I was in Marvin’s office. He’s like, we’re gonna bring Rob Woodson in here. And that was the 90s. He was here two years for they won. We’re Rob Woodson and make him a safety. And I’m like, You’re gonna what to do, what you know, like, no, no. Rod’s gonna change things. Leadership’s gonna change things around here. And then, you know, Ray had his issues, and Shannon Sharpe, and Shannon was here five minutes. All they, all they did was win, win, win. You know what I mean, like so, but that’s a real that’s a hell of a point you’re making. I don’t think we, I don’t think I’ve ever heard you make it, or me make it about
Luke Jones 16:39
8what do they need a grown up? Do they need a grown up? And look, I don’t say that to be disparaging to the veterans that they have had here. I mean, Aaron Hicks did a nice job for them last year, right? And I mean, obviously the Yankees paid him money to go away. I mean, that’s how bad things were for him at the end in New York, but he had been on some winning teams. Now, let’s be clear, the Yankees of the last 15 years are not the Yankees that we talked about in the 90s, and 2000s that were winning pennants and World Series on the regular, right? So that’s why I even said trying to stack up this postseason field. I wasn’t viewing the Yankees it as any anything more special than the Orioles. Because why they haven’t won anything in a long time? None of those guys have won anything that they have right now, but that’s where I look at this thing and say, Is there a player? And I don’t know who that is right now, and I don’t know if it’d be a trade, I don’t know if it’d be free agency, right? Free
Nestor Aparicio 17:30
agency. James McCann is that kind of guy, but not enough. It’s got to be someone more. It’s
Luke Jones 17:34
got it, right? It’s got to be a higher profile. Yeah, it’s gonna be a starter. It’s gotta be a starter. At least doesn’t have to be your best player, but it’s gotta be a starter. And again, I’m looking at this, I’m
Nestor Aparicio 17:43
special, and gunner Henderson are that, when they’re right, that that’s what they’re gonna that’s what they’re
8Luke Jones 17:48
gonna be thinking about here, though, that’s not what I’m talking about here, though, Frank Robin or, you know, Frank Robinson came in and was this guy who’d been MVP, and look, the Orioles had Brooks, the Orioles had boogp Pal, the Orioles had homegrown players, and they brought in someone who taught them how to win. And I’m not saying it needs to be that dramatic here, right? I’m not saying that the Orioles, first of all, they’re not going to go outside Juan Soto for example.
Nestor Aparicio 18:12
How about this? I’ll use an example. How about a Kevin Millar, kind of guy, you know, of that era. I’ll give you a guy that they pissed away. And this would speak to the old man, and it, you know, Nelson Cruz, you know. And Nelson Cruz was a guy that they completely screwed up, that Adam Jones had played in the World Series. Like, like they had dudes here, Marques, they let a lot of good humans walk, you know, way after Messina in that era. I’m talking about just that 12 to 14 to 16 people. Buck wanted around that. Buck felt like we’re Buck guys and leadership Buck guys and pile diver Buck guys. Buck had a sense about all that and all that being said, Buck never climbed the mountain, but I’d still go to war with buck. I mean, you know, if, if all they get, if they don’t win a World Series here, and they get three or four more years out of these, and they’re kind of, I mean, look, Henderson rod, forget, forget our feelings good to be the guys in the lineup next year. Cows are hands going to be fixed. Westbrook’s going to come back a year more pissed off, and a year more, you know, Texas tough, and Westbrook might be that guy like I, I keep thinking to you, want to import heart that’s like when the Ravens went and got Earl Thomas to fix things, or roquan Smith. I mean, had to import roquan Smith. Is exactly what you’re talking about for the Ravens two years ago, to say Patrick, Queen Marlon, Humphrey, leader, stop. You know we need and I’ve said that about Lamar having a grown up around me, maybe King Emory Zak guy. I felt that way about Mark Ingram a couple of years ago. So we could use the football, baseball side of this to say, I mean, you brought up Shannon sharp and Rob Woodson and like, I mean, like, that’s why you’re the best at what you do. I’ll kiss your ass right now, because I’m thought about that in 25 years of comparing that to Frank Robinson. I wrote a book on I wrote two books on it, and I. Don’t think I ever use that. That’s really that’s some deep issue. Came up with this morning, Lucas for your birthday, your year wiser. I, you know, compare comparing Shannon sharp and Rob Woodson. That’s great, because they had rate. They had great players, but,
Luke Jones 20:15
but this is why I’m spitballing here, because I’m TR, I don’t want to be the guy that overreacts to two games or three games. Now this year, like I said, my point, my greater point, has been it wasn’t two games. It was two months, right? I mean, I wrote, I could have just copy and pasted my game one column for reflecting on Game Two, because I said the October Orioles look too much like the second half Orioles, and it’s kind of what we saw, right? But, you know, that’s where I look at that and say, Look, they’ve got so much talent, and these are not like, I don’t think that they were good players, and now suddenly I think they’re bad players, right? I think there’s a lot of tendency to feel that way. There’s, I can think of how many people, over the years, you know, even good old school baseball people, who, completely, you know, wanted all over the Oakland A’s for their process of Moneyball and the fact that they win 100 games in the regular season, and then they couldn’t win a playoff series. And I think there was more nuance than that, right? I think there’s, there’s always an in between, right? It’s, and that’s where I look at this and say, I do think the Orioles need to take a long look at some of their process and how they evaluate and how they teach and and something about their hitting that just broke in the second half of the season, beyond some health problems that absolutely factored into that. So I look at that and say, What do I do? That doesn’t mean I start trading guys left and right or cutting guys left and right. No, no. But is there a way to supplement what you have with maybe an established, established right handed bat who might also have some leadership qualities, or maybe won a World Series five years ago or eight years ago? That might be that for you. And that doesn’t mean that’s the end all be all either. Let’s be clear, there is no such thing as that in baseball. There is no franchise quarterback, because you have to wait your turn. The other eight guys have to bat, the other four starters have to take their turn in the rotation. So you don’t have that franchise quarterback. Or LeBron James can touch the ball every time down the floor if he wants to. So you know, but is there something like that that they need to look at? I mean, they absolutely need to add a right handed bat. I think as much as, yeah, Jordan westburg is going to take the next step, and I love him as a player, as much as you know, you still might believe in Kobe mayo and not might should believe in Kobe mayo. I mean, that’s such a small sample that it would be hasty to suddenly say, well, but that said, Are you putting all your eggs in that basket? Do you need to start hedging your bets a little bit here? And I’ll use Kansas City as a great example, without trying to use hyperbole, because the Royals won 86 games. They they weren’t a juggernaut this year, let’s be clear. But go look at their off season. They added Seth Lugo, they added Michael waka. They added some veteran position players, and you know, guys that are role players and things of that nature, but they had a young court to your point, who’s one of the right they added, well, I mean, but Kyle Gibson was along the right. I mean, I guess, I mean, my point here is they had a young core, but they, to me, they recognize, hey, we love Cole Reagan’s, but let’s not, let’s not make it out to be that he has to be the undisputed ace, even though he still was the ace. But we’re going to add Seth Lugo and we’re going to add Michael Walker, and these guys are end up being really good. I mean, Seth Lugo was an all star, right? I mean, Michael Walker was an above average starting pitcher this year, and we’re going to see them, see how they fare against the Yankees in the Division Series. But I guess the overall point here in the Orioles have done some of this to your point, Kyle Gibson, and obviously they brought in Corbin burns to be the ace, right? I mean, that that wasn’t as much about leadership, as much as you just wanted an ace and you had an opportunity to bring in an ace. But the other leadership, they don’t draft pitchers, so they’re they’re going to have to buy pictures. Their pitching doesn’t suck. Let’s let, amazingly go look at their numbers this year and compare them to last year, when they had a healthy they had a healthy Kyle Bradish all year, and they had a healthier, you know, at least in the second half, Grayson Rodriguez. And their pitching doesn’t suck. I mean that that’s, that’s the wrong word to use. Pitching certainly was injured this year. They could certainly augment. They could certainly add they’re going to have to assuming Corbin burns walks out the door, their bullpen is going to be in way better shape if Felix Bautista is healthy. But I’d still look at that, you know, I think you still need to look at start, you know, another starter, right? But it doesn’t stay i No, no, no. But
Nestor Aparicio 24:57
8let me, let me clarify that the. Their system. Okay, I’m talking about, I’m talking about their system and the way they dress the let in the Elias era. I’ll give you the quiz in the Elias era, every player that you’ve ever named, when you come on. And I’m going back to 2019 20 was, I mean, the obvious were the obvious were the one ones. I mean, the cows are in the rutchmans and the Hendersons that were on a faster track, and they were younger and bisayo and westburg and mayo and holiday there was Grayson Rodriguez, and that’s it. Maybe Keegan Aiken for a minute or three, right? Like
Luke Jones 25:36
they acquired Kyle Bradish as a prospect, though, fair enough.
Nestor Aparicio 25:40
Okay, fair enough.
25:41
So, you know, so,
8Nestor Aparicio 25:43
I guess is what I’m saying. They’ve been way, way more about their emphasis, yeah. So then they have to go buy Zach Eflin if they want anything at the top of the rotation, because I’m looking at McDermott Povich now and saying, I don’t think those kids are ever going to be ones or twos. I think they may have thought Kramer. I mean, Kramer came into Machado deal. I
Luke Jones 26:03
mean, you know, like, but he was, but he they still had to develop him. Like, I understand they’re not drafting,
Nestor Aparicio 26:09
but beginning to be a four or five, not to be court you need, okay, you still, but, but
Luke Jones 26:15
8you need that. Like, we can’t just talk about it in terms of corporate, okay, Corbin burns, pitches, game one, you still have game two, three and four, you still have four other spots in the rotation. So I hear what you’re saying. We’re, you know, we’re
Nestor Aparicio 26:26
getting a little too far. But all star talent, the kind of talent that you need to win a three game series. Where, to your point, the Royals had a dude. They went, signed another dude. They were ready to come back with another decent guy in three and we have to be ready for that. And the Orioles have had to run over glass to make that happen. Once bradishes arm fell apart, means arms fell like all the guys they had in line, I consider Elias a miracle worker for getting two starters to the mound in game one and two in this organization, paying him over $40 million trading Ortiz and at the deadline, taking on the money for next year that Angelo’s never would have done in 30 years, not 30, but the last 20 years never would have done. And got them a one run and a two run ball game in the playoffs, in the wild card, did everything they needed to do, pitching wise, and they’d hit the ball.
Luke Jones 27:26
Yeah, and look, when I brought up the I wasn’t necessarily talking about veteran pitchers. I was talking about veterans in general. That’s really the point I’m trying to make here that I think. And I’ve talked about this a lot. I mentioned this in our previous segment. So, you know, I’ll give this a couple minutes here, but I really felt the Orioles this year. And I mean, we talked about this back in spring training, this wasn’t something that I was shocked by. But, you know, you had had Hayes Mullins, Mount Castle, you know, that group of, you know, kind of the first wave of the new guys, right? I mean, Mullins made his debut when Adam Jones was still here, right? Mount Castle came in. Austin Hayes made his debut late in 17, you know, because he had kind of blown his way through the system in such impressive fashion. So you had these guys, and they got you to this point. They were the ones who took all the bullets for all the lousy teams. I mean, they were the the few guys that you could actually watch back in 2019 and 20 and 21 and say, okay, man, this guy, this guy, this guy, that guy over there, that guy. I don’t even know who that guy is. Those guys are unwatchable. But, you know, Hayes is good. I mean, he’s low, inconsistent, but he’s good. Cedric Mullins, mean, my goodness, he had a 3030, year and 21 and mount Castle, you know, did what he did. And Santander, I’d be remiss if I didn’t mention him. You know, the guy that was a Rule five pick for Dan Duquette and and how he developed. So you had that wave that got the Orioles to the point where they were in 22 and last year, and we started talking about that. I started talking about that this spring. I wrote about the outfield, right? I mean, the outfield was the really interesting, you know, kind of inflection point where Santander was entering a contract year. Hayes was entering the next to last year of arbitration. Mullins, same thing for him. You had Colton kauser, who it kind of felt like he had done everything he could at Norfolk. So it’s like, where do you what do you do with him? Same with Heston kerstad at the at that point, they still had Kyle Stowers in the system. And we kind of looked at this and said, Okay, how’s this going to go? Because I don’t know if it’s the right approach to just say, Okay, well, the vets are just going to play out their contracts or their club control, and then you just hand jobs to the young guys. So there’s always that awkward. And we talked about this a little bit a couple months ago. I’m not at all suggesting there was division over this or anything like that, but there’s just competition, right? And I think there was. Always that, how do you transition from the old guard? And I say old in quotes, because they’re not old, but guys in their late 20s at this point, compared to all these guys that they had, you know, drafted and developed. So there was always kind of that awkward phase there. And I think if Mike Elias made a misstep as it pertains to that, it’s maybe needing to have someone that ready to bridge the gap if someone struggles, you know, if the younger guys aren’t quite ready. And I think, you know, you kind of look at it right now. That’s why I’ve said, like a right handed bat, you know, in a perfect world, Kobe Mayo would have come up in August when they had a time of need, and Kobe Mayo would have absolutely raked. And we might be having a different conversation right now. And that’s not to say he won’t be really good next year, even, but when you rely on young players, I’ve said this to you over and over, and I’m going to cite it again, and I’ve been a broken record for anyone who’s listening to us regularly about this, it’s not all linear. If this all doesn’t go perfectly, and I’ll again cite to you the Houston Astros in 2015 they were a wild card. They won the wild card game. They took the Kansas City Royals, who won the World Series that October to five games in the divisional round and the Division Series. So they look like, oh my gosh, the Astros are about to take off. You know what they did? The next year, they went 84 and 78 missed the playoffs entirely. Yeah, go back and look. I don’t know all that. I’m not intimate with all the details of the 2016 Astros, but the point was, they look like a team that was ready to explode after 15 and that didn’t happen. You know what happened the year after that? Trash Cans aside, you know they’ll save that for another day. I know you like to call them the cheatstros. They won the World Series and 101 games that year. So I’m not suggesting that means the Orioles are guaranteed and destined to win the World Series next year. But you got to remember all this stuff as much as it feels like, okay, incremental improvement. And you won 90 games this year, and then 95 the year after that, and then you’re ready to win the World Series after that, and then you’re ready to repeat and win 107 games. I don’t know. Don’t work like that. It rarely works like that. So that’s where I do look at this and say, Okay, you look at the types of moves the Astros made, you know, they brought in Justin Verlander at the trade deadline, and we kind of used the Corbin burns comparison there right back in February. You know, they added someone like a Carlos Beltran. And again, I know there’s a cheating element to this and the trash cans and all that, but just trying to look at it for what it was, because that was, no one would deny that was an immensely talented team, regardless of whether it was on the up and up entirely or not, which it wasn’t. But do they need a Carlos Beltran tight move in terms of, like, adding someone like that to their lineup, adding someone, I mean, I look at some of these guys and I just say, you know, I mean, we talked about this with Austin Hayes, Ryan mountcastle, and I’m not talking about the wrist specifically at the present, you know, over, over the last month of the season, but look at his numbers the last three or four years. Offensively, he kind of peaked early in his career. He’s kind of, if anything, just tried to match that. You know, he’s fallen back a little bit in terms of, like, ops. I mean, he doesn’t draw walks, if you want my honest opinion on Ryan mountcastle. And look, I love the guy. He’s a good dude. I even saw a, you know, I saw someone took a photo. He it was two hours after the game last on Wednesday night, after they had just gotten eliminated. He got out of his car and signed autographs for the handful of fans who were just there. He’s a good dude. Do I think he’s a everyday first baseman for a really great lineup, or a lineup that wants to be great and wants to be a World Series team, especially as he’s getting more expensive in arbitration. Now, I don’t know if he’s that player i I almost feel and I this sounds really backhanded, and I don’t mean to make it sound that way, because he’s a major league player, I think he’s more of a starting first baseman for a second division team, if you want. I feel like the Orioles, if they want to grow and improve their offense, he’s someone I feel like that’s a spot they need to upgrade, right? And maybe Kobe Mayo is going to be that guy, but they need a Glenn Davis type and I’m just, and let me be clear, I’m using that as an example here, because this is not just like I’ve talked about with Corbin burns like it. It’s not Corbin burns or bust. It’s okay if you don’t, if cord Corbin burns walks out the door, what are you doing there? There are lots of different things you can do, I mean, and I mentioned the Royals, they signed Seth Lugo on Michael waka and that worked out really well for them. Nathan of Aldi and Jordan Montgomery won the rangers of world series last year. I mean, these weren’t $200 million contracts. There are ways to do this, but you’ve got to have your wherewithal to recognize and project and have the good models to say, hey, this guy’s going to be really good for this year. And that. First, let’s give them a three year deal that isn’t going to be Corbin burns money, but it’s real money. I mean, Zach Evelyn’s making real money in 25 and I think they feel good about where Zach effin is going to be for them, and he’s going to be the top half of the rotation guy for them, if not their opening day starter. When it’s all said and done, and you
Nestor Aparicio 35:17
feel like you’re going to get 32 starts, and you’re going to get 184 innings, that’s a really high you’re going to be a 3.6 era, and that’s what you’re going to be. Okay? That’s
8Luke Jones 35:26
a high floor. Yeah. I mean, is it Corbin burns? No. But again, you kind of look at this and say, there are many ways to do this. There are many ways to approach this. And I was just using mount castle as an example there. You know, is there a right handed bat in some shape or form, whether it’s the first baseman or someone who DHS and plays the outfield, some whatever, you know, someone like Nelson Cruz a decade ago, you know. How about that? You know, as you mentioned, Nelson Cruz a few minutes ago, you know, is there a move out there to be made that could give you something like that, where you need another right handed bat and maybe has a little bit of pedigree that these young guys could benefit from a little bit more, I don’t know. Again, this is so raw. It’s so frustrating. No one wants to be oh and five in two years in the postseason. I mean, it’s embarrassing, quite frankly. I mean, they this was a face plant.
Nestor Aparicio 36:14
Well, that’s the same thing about the organization that I’ll get into about how the with leadership, sure they need to be marketing the team. The players are embarrassed. The players are hurt. The, you know, like, does Adley rutsman Want to go show his face the next three months? Do any of these guys want to show their faces? They’re going to, they’re going to take egg in their face when burn signs for under $94 million somewhere? Because that’s probably, you know, I mean, they’re like Santander. They probably don’t want him. The people they don’t want to let them walk whatever, um, it’s tough. The offseason stuff. I want to break Lucas here. He’s Baltimore, Luke. We’ll get back together. It’s his birthday. I’m letting them towel off, letting them get all that frustration out that you’re an old guy now, man, I mean, you keep getting up. More birthdays. I got to take you out get some pizza. Next Friday, the 11th. We’re going to be celebrating both of our birthdays. I’m getting a year older too, but I’m going to shave and look sexy, let my hair out on the 11. Will be at Pizza John’s in Essex. Dundalk. Guys don’t go to Essex for much, but we go for pizza. I promise you. We’re going to be down to back River, neck road. Our friends at also at Jiffy Lube MultiCare, take us out on the road. Luke is going to be doing a lot with football team. You’ll be out knowing mills. I am doing a lot with oysters. Did 26 oysters in 26 days for the oyster recovery partnership, and put a word up on the website about it, because we’re kind of saving it now, like it was, like stuff was going on in September. Things happen on the field, off the field, the Orioles, all that stuff. It’s all brought to you by friends at curio wellness and foreign daughters, as well as our friends at Liberty. Pure solution. Somewhere around here, I have a bottle of, yeah, my cat and I were drinking this liberty, pure solutions, one 800 clean water. It’s so clean I feed my cat the water. Doug workman and his folks do a great job with well water, and they’re also just great plumbers. Man, I mean, I had a plumbing issue. I had a drain leak thing going on, corrosion. They came out hour later. Boom, I got fresh water. So our friends at Liberty, pure solutions, as well as curio wellness and foreign daughter and Wendy joined us this week to talk about maritime magic and the living classrooms Foundation, big event on Friday night, maybe I’ll meet Mr. Rubenstein or miss Griggs there. There is a letter to David Rubenstein that is extensive in a long time coming. I said I was going to write it once, I was mistreated in May, and sat around in June and July and August and September, I was rejected for playoff credentials throughout even the World Series that they didn’t get to. I got, I have rejection note for is that like a phantom ticket? Maybe it is, I’m not sure. For my collectors out there, lots into it. Speaking of collectors out there, please get a look at the video if you get anything. Or the time for the capital center retrospective that we did on the Maryland crabgate tour last week at Costas. It was just good fun. So I know it’s tough right now. Football games. We’re good man. If Cincinnati thing feels distant and we’re like, oh, kickoffs on Sunday one o’clock, let’s get it going. So crab cake doors. Next Friday, Luke and I are hanging out. I’m giving Luke some oxygen because he’s been at it. We thought we were headed to New York this weekend. Instead, we’re headed to Dear David Rubenstein and the off season and management. I want to talk about shorter strokes and hitting home runs, and Joe Flacco and whole bunch of things. We get back in, Luke and I are going to continue on one more second. One more segment on baseball as we clean out the lockers, as they say, down to Camden Yards. We’re talking baseball. I’m Nestor. He’s Luke. We are wnst. Am 1570 Towson, Baltimore, and we never stop talking Baltimore. Positive. You.
