After halting the Orioles’ five-game skid with a quality start against the Cleveland Indians, Luke Jones and Nestor discuss the present and future of Grayson Rodriguez as the team’s best chance to win a World Series in this era.
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
orioles, year, talked, playing, pitching, rangers, week, rodriguez, veteran player, game, mullins, team, deal, grayson, hit, santander, clubhouse, backup catcher, win, number
SPEAKERS
Nestor J. Aparicio, Luke Jones
Nestor J. Aparicio 00:02
We are W and S t test the Baltimore Baltimore positive. We have put the crabcake tour respite because the Orioles are playing and the hotdogs and hamburgers are on the grill in my case wife’s got silver Queen corn I’m a pitcher because I only watermelon I gotta get over to wise markets get me some gold watermelon get that they do get gold watermelon and wise markets I do love that our friends at the Maryland lottery Gold Rush sevens doublers have put us out on the road we’re gonna be back at it it feels like a long time for now but I’m sure like when Luke and I get together on July 12 at fade Lee’s it’ll feel like it was just a moment ago and the Yankees would be in town and that that nasty nasty five game losing streak as has ended our friends at Liberty pure solutions will put us out on the road as well as Jiffy Lube. Multi care and liberty pure solutions brought by the the salty stuff that makes the water like work. I’m not a scientist Luke Jones knows this. He was once a school teacher. He actually met my science teacher and knows how little I know about science. He has the science of baseball he’s trying to school me up Hey, dude, I had a nerd on for you this week. dude named Lee Cluck. K L U C. K he wrote a book and you’re gonna love this. And I know how much you love Eisenberg. And everybody knows Eisenberg’s a mentor to me and you know, one of my soul brothers on Harry Dalton and Harry Dalton. Yeah, that the tape the bird tapes were released with Eisenberg last week and I haven’t had John on John’s been family being and summering and bass balling. I get John back on I thought of John the other day because I was over Pappas and he did the show. Last time I was over there. By the way, John, Paddy and I got together, Steve Eliot said it was the most enlightening hour of radio he’s ever been a part of. So you’ll want to hear that with John Patty and I getting together. I thought he was gonna be rougher on me than he was but he wasn’t. But Lee Clark did a book on Harry Dalton. And he’s beautiful dude. He’s a sabre dude. He’s from Stevens Point, Wisconsin. And, and he’s historys baseball nerd. And he was awesome. And he just gave me awesome stories about Harry Dalton in the 60s that are in the book. Of course, Harry, don’t don’t my cousin to Chicago, you know, left my dad my dad’s brother here back in the late 60s at the flaming pit that then became Pavonia station. So it’s crazy. I broadcast so much from a place that my uncle was the wine Psalm Ulay, but, but I had a baseball conversation with nerds this week. And I kept saying to him, like, I have my own nerd. You know, my dude here. So how are you man? I’m feeling a little better. You know, they don’t let me and they let you in. I’ll never stop pointing that out. But um, I remember going into clubhouses for 23 years and feeling that show music’s a little louder. Foods a little better clubhouse spread. I hope they still have a clubhouse. I hope it’s a little better than the ranks and beans they used to put out in the 90s that Johnny Oates once famously threw over when we came in to find it man, the books I could write Luke, how was it get good? I mean, let’s some it’s good that we’re not talking about them losing because it’s a lot more fun talking about a winning I’ll be honest, no question
8
Luke Jones 03:10
about it. Um, and as I wrote a Baltimore positive.com Earlier this week, the worst losing streak is always the most recent one, right? It’s always the one that is current. Because you, you just turn the page and you win a game. And that doesn’t mean everything’s fixed, as we said a few days ago. The Orioles needed pitching even when they were beating the Phillies and beating the Yankees. So nothing changes on that front. But it’s good to win. And I think the big takeaway from Wednesday night is Grayson Rodriguez being the stopper. I think you and I’ve talked a lot about the pitching. We’ll continue to talk a lot about the pitching. Corbin burns, are the Orioles going to resign him? Are they going to try to resign him? Who the heck knows right now,
Nestor J. Aparicio 03:50
if you’re going to try to win the World Series? Well, they haven’t. point that out.
Luke Jones 03:54
I hear you and Wolf have that conversation probably 10 more times and
Nestor J. Aparicio 03:59
8they are trying to win the World Series. For now. Let’s just see what you know, the places are right.
Luke Jones 04:04
But the point I’m trying to make isn’t about Corbin burns. It’s not about Kyle Bradish. It’s not about Kate Povich, Grayson Rodriguez is the most important pitcher in the organization right now. We’re in terms of the balance between the present and needing to be that legit, serious threat as the number two starter behind Corbin burns. And in terms of thinking of a postseason series, who knows who the number three is going to be right now. Most likely, it’s someone who’s not on the roster right now if we’re looking at it through that lens, but Grayson Rodriguez is going to need to factor in their big time because I don’t think they’re going out and getting a number two and a number three starter. So they need grace and Rodriguez to be that and if we’re going to work under the assumption for now. And I think it’s the most logical assumption until David Rubenstein and Mike Elias suggest otherwise that Corbin Burns is going to move on at the end of the year. Then Grayson we’re Rodriguez becomes even more important for next year. Because Kyle Bradish isn’t going to be around until later next year at best, and you don’t know who else is going to fill out that rotation. So long story short, he’s really important and I think and I just pulled this up right before we hopped on our chat here. Grayson Rodriguez going back to last July so remember he was called back called back up after the all star break, you know, the resuming the second half over his last 27 starts Nestor, I’m gonna throw in an old school stat for you. His win loss record since the all star break last year. He’s 14 and five. He’s gone 159 innings a 3.17. Era?
Nestor J. Aparicio 05:43
Did you just did not win loss record, you know better than that?
05:46
I did. And you know, I’m not you barely even hear me cite win loss record anymore, let alone actually be the one to bring it up or to dwell on it. But it sounds good. It sounds good. The point is 14 to five makes him sound like Don Sutton which is great.
8Luke Jones 06:00
Okay, now, and at this time last year, no one would have thought he would start game two against the Rangers in the postseason last October. Now I understand it didn’t go well. Right. But at the same time, we have seen this maturation for Grayson Rodriguez, going back to him being sent down last May and the early struggles he had last year. But by and large, he’s pitched really, really well. Now does that mean he’s going to become a bonafide ace for the next 10 years? Who knows, but at a time where the Orioles needed to stop her with a five game losing streak, and no one’s feeling very good about the pitching. No one’s feeling good about the team. In that moment. He went out there and he gave the Orioles seven innings. It wasn’t his most dominant performance in terms of swing and miss. And we know Cleveland is a very difficult offense to strike out. In fact, Rodriguez even talked about it after the game that he kind of went into that game knowing that probably wasn’t gonna be the night where I strike out 10. But he gave him seven innings. And he finished off his night with four straight strikeouts. So you want to talk about a young pitcher finishing off an outing strong and getting better as the night goes on. That was Rodriguez on Wednesday night. So it’s great to see and I will point this out in addition to what I just cited in terms of what his numbers have been since last July when he was recalled from Norfolk, that he’s actually he’s done this before. I mean, keep in mind, he was the one who threw the massive, absolutely huge start last September against the rays on that Saturday night and mid September when the Orioles had dropped four straight at that point. I mean, you want to talk about a losing streak that meant a lot more than this current one. It was that one and he went out there and he shoved and did a great job just a couple of weeks ago on the heels of Kyle Bradish. Leaving the game against the Phillies and the Orioles losing an extra innings and going through so many bullpen arms. He taught seven innings against the Phillies. So just good to see. Good to see doesn’t mean that he’s arrived as a number one or anything like that. And again, time will tell but the Orioles needed that start on Wednesday night and he gave it to him. And obviously Cedric Mullins hits the big homerun in the bottom of the seventh O’Hearn with the tackle on home run that, as I’ve kind of pointed out with Craig Kimbrel. He’s been way better with a two run lead than a one run lead in same situation. So Goodwin doesn’t fix everything in the same way that the sky wasn’t completely falling just because they were in the midst of a losing streak. But oh, by the way, the Yankees lost again and the Yankees have now lost eight of 10 and the Orioles through this really difficult week. They go into this Texas series now, one game out of first place. So they’re fine in the short term in the sense of the day to day of the season. Certainly the trade deadline is crucial for this team to make upgrades but they’re on on pace to win 100 games 50 and 30. And when you can say that after a five game losing streak, you know that you’re still living really well, even with some of the pitching injuries that they’ve obviously endured over the last month.
Nestor J. Aparicio 09:09
Yeah, I’m at Texas on my mind whether it’s the border and washing what’s going on there. And I actually talked about that several times this week. And my cousin said Houston Yes, she went to the game last week and I remember being down in Arlington with you and touring the star with Gera and having pretty good barbecue as well. It feels like a minute ago but it and I would think for Adley rutschman and for Gunnar Henderson to see the Rangers walk out at the ballpark this weekend Joan Jett is going to be down might have a couple of rain delays for Tahoe with based on the forecast but they don’t remember the fancy or hated the royals for a couple of years after the Royals embarrassed this back and 14 or whatever. I don’t know there’s any angst on the Ranger side but they certainly took care of business last year won the World Series. Yeah, back in the day my dad I would say you’re rooting for the team to beat you. You refer to the American League team, let’s it’s the ACE Reggie Jackson, you don’t do that. You know, I don’t know that there’s animosity with the Rangers, but certainly the Rangers came and took something from them last year, and you don’t get a lot of opportunities to see them. Whether it’s heating up. Literally, it’s been a bad week, right? I mean, you know, Cleveland, you’re gonna see Cleveland again in October, if you’re good, and they’re good, right? I mean, you and I started laying out our birthday plans in October and football season, and I’m doing this crazy oyster tour in September, but October. I don’t know if they’ll see the Texas Rangers Right. Like this is been a case study in winning the World Series. And then like what happens the next year? What happens before you brought up the Diamondbacks a lot about being an engineer could Hey, dude, look up at the Astros. They’re ahead of the Rangers all of a sudden after being awful, in April, beat our asses last weekend, I don’t know who to worry about. But I started to look and say, they’re gonna see Cleveland, they’re going to see New York Red Sox haven’t been bad. The Red Sox have sort of put themselves in a position to maybe even be in the tournament at this point. So we’re starting to see this. And as I looked at the calendar into the fall in my own personal way, because Fourth of July weekend, heritage fairs this weekend, and we’re going to see hooting the blowfish and have some fun. By the way, plug for everybody. If you haven’t heard the Greg hawks interview this week, if you haven’t heard the mark Bryan interview I’ve been re airing that I think I’m gonna bust Joan Jett out because I have several interviews with Joe Jett. So I’m probably going to pop that out of Baltimore positive for the holidays as well. But there’s only a couple series up for the all star game. You and I are getting together on the 12th which will be man we’re right up on the All Star game. It’s Orioles Yankees before the all star game. It’s sort of like reminds me of my conversation with very sticks this week for my little league where we had two halves in the Little League season. He was on the rival team and is sort of like a Jenkees Orioles. He was a Yankee, I was an Oreo. So we’re gonna play those games and they’re just gonna be an all star break. And they’re all gonna fly down to Texas, and it’s gonna be 158 degrees. Got a soak? You mentioned Gaylord Perry yesterday, I thought I was gonna see him die in the first base dugout at the at the old timers game. Dude, he had that jersey on with all the patches with all the logos. Dude, it was 120 degrees on the field that day in Orleans it was it was 1995 unbelievably hot. So they’re gonna get down there, but they got air conditioning now it’s nice. So they’re gonna go down there and then they have to play them again. So this next couple of weeks, the Rangers feel like, Let’s go beat their ass this weekend. Let’s get three you know what I mean? Like it doesn’t. And it feels like it would feel real good for the players. And I don’t know if that there’s animosity or any of that. But man, you remember the Alamo when they came in, took it away from you. And you mentioned Grayson Rodriguez in the start against the Rangers. Anyway, he’s gonna look at he playing this weekend, right and pitching against these guys, but you’re gonna look out there and say, look at the ball. I’m gonna I’m gonna be the starter for the first weekend burns and we’re gonna go down there two weeks and make things right and beaten up. The rangers would feel fun, based on what happened last year.
Luke Jones 13:05
Yeah, I mean, I’ll be totally honest with you, Nestor. I’m not sure this is a series that the Orioles have circled. These are such young guys, we talked about this last year, right? When you’re so young, and frankly, you’re so good. I don’t know if you think about things in those terms in the way that maybe a veteran player would where they say Oh, I don’t know how many more chances I’m gonna get in October and these guys beat us and and that animosity like you said, I mean, it wasn’t like there was those that
Nestor J. Aparicio 13:30
8feel that you were in that locker room at least for 40 years when you lose and get knocked out of the playoffs you never forget who won it’s everything’s amplified. I really in
Luke Jones 13:42
a pinch it is it is but again, it’s it also and you also know this from having been in baseball clubhouses for years and years and years. Baseball players don’t think about these things in the in the way that media and fans do. I did not see a single instance as a single example of any angst any unnerving feeling any player that looked distressed over this five game losing streak. And when you ask them about it, the players were polite and addressing the question and answering the question, but you could tell there was almost this amusement about it of like, Guys, guys, you know, we play 162 games, right? So, so there’s some of that, but
Nestor J. Aparicio 14:20
and there’s, like, horrible. There’s no time for that. It’s the linemen assignment technique. It’s just like getting the cage I get who’s pitching tonight, right? That’s literally who’s pitching the night? How can I hit him? Where do I need to be? Where am I in the lineup? What’s my role tonight? How’s my body feel? What am I what did I eat something funny for lunch? Like that’s literally what music we put on is my girlfriend, you know, am I going how’s that gonna go tonight? And you know, like I these are young guys i and they’ve almost five games in a row. And they do this every day of their lives. And by and large in the modern society. They don’t read the papers, much football players way more. But but not the baseball players.
Luke Jones 14:59
I mean, maybe maybe they see some social media, but that’s probably about it. Right. So or MLB Network being on in the clubhouse, you know what with the bank of TVs they have, but I think more than anything else, maybe? I certainly don’t think it’s revenge. And I certainly don’t think it’s any animosity. I mean, there wasn’t anything that really happened in that, you know, there wasn’t benches clearing incident or anything like that. I think more than anything, though Nestor it might just be a reminder of nothing’s guaranteed here. And look, the the Rangers were the kings of the of the baseball world last October, and they deserved it. Right. They won the World Series good for them. And they come in to the series six games under 500. And it’s got a minus eight run differential. They looked for a while, like they might be doing what the Astros are now in the midst of doing which was they were playing better and and then they’ve come back to Earth, and they’re on a three game losing streak coming to Baltimore. So I think if nothing else, it’s a reminder of hey, none of this is a short and just because you were really good last year, or just because you were really good in April and May. Or you know in the Orioles case, just because you beat the Phillies and the Yankees in a best to three the previous week doesn’t mean that you’re immune to having struggles and the rangers have certainly had that now, you know, they’ve gotten Max Scherzer back, we’re gonna see him in this series. Jacob deGrom is getting closer to going on a rehab assignment. And you know, it sounds like he could be back come August. I think that’s kind of in the the indication for that the rangers have given out over the last recent weeks. But you know, that’s a team that just they haven’t played very well. And they haven’t, even last year when they had some stretches where they were up and down. And we talked about that going into October. Yeah. And I even said to you probably at some point in September that the Rangers were still the team that when they were right and on fire, they scared you with that lineup and everything and obviously, last October ivaldi and Jordan Montgomery was so big for them. But you know, you’re waiting for them to get going as the defending champs but you just look at it. And Seattle has been the class of that division. Houston is really, really heating up where the Orioles clearly had a hand in helping the Astros do that last weekend, but they’ve won seven in a row. And then you have the rangers who are still seven and a half back and they’re six under and the peripherals don’t look great. You know, they haven’t swung the bats all that well. They haven’t pitched all that. Well. I mean it’s just a at some point. It’s go time and I’m not saying that they’re not going to get it going and that’s where the Orioles want to keep the foot on the gas this week in terms of okay, the losing streaks over you beat Cleveland. I agree with you, by the way, Guardians really impressed with them. They’re a really good baseball team period. I don’t think this was all. Oh, the Orioles really stunk the last five days. They did. But it was also Houston red hot
8Nestor J. Aparicio 18:01
Christmas dude swatting the ball. Like Yogi Berra, like
Luke Jones 18:07
not just wanted the ball breezy, like
Nestor J. Aparicio 18:09
Toronto, dude, I swear to God.
Luke Jones 18:14
8Not only hitting that pitch where it was located, but I mean, that’s Grayson Rodriguez. Grace Rodriguez has a heck of a fastball. So to get on top of that and hit it the way he did. That was impressive. Did you happen to see you know, obviously for anyone listening who didn’t? didn’t watch the game on Wednesday night we’re talking about McKenzie Noel and his first major league bat at bat first major league Homer. Did you happen to see the clip of their triple A team watching? They’re watching it on a laptop? And their reaction to him hitting Oh, no, they all went nuts. Check it out. I think I believe Sarah Lang’s you know, who obviously is, beloved around baseball, you know, she tweeted it out or retweeted it, whatever it was. But that was cool to see. But yeah, that was a that was an impressive blow. So maybe another big bat that they’re adding to the mix for that lineup. That’s already formidable, but But you know, bringing it back to the Rangers, I mean, you’re waiting for them. And I don’t think anyone expected them to have this major drop off this year. But again, it’s a reminder and, you know, it’s definitely an example of having that urgency and not resting on your laurels and not getting complacent. So this is obviously a big, big series and in terms of the Orioles truly wanting to write to ship, you know, you don’t want to just break the five game losing streak and then lose three out of four to the Rangers. But you know, it’s also a reminder of just because what you did last year, that doesn’t mean that that’s going to translate. And we talked about that with Arizona earlier this year when they came to town and certainly the Rangers are in that position where they’re not out of it, but at some point, start playing some good baseball or it’s going to get late early. You know, especially now with The way the Astros have heated up so it’ll be interesting to see. Certainly you’ve got Corbin burns going in the opener so you want to start the series off on a high note but then we’ll see how to Albert Suarez and Cade Povich and Corbin do and we’ll be talking about that, you know, Grayson Rodriguez you feel good about Corbin burns, you feel great about every time he takes the ball. Those other three guys obviously, of late, not so much Povich because he’s a rookie and just inexperienced. But the other two guys need to see them get back on track. But it’s definitely a an interesting series in terms of what happened last year and last October and all those feelings but you know, fast forward to this year. I mean, the Orioles continue to roll five game losing streak aside, in 2024. While as you know, it’s been a really difficult goal of it for the rangers and, you know, at some point in time,
Nestor J. Aparicio 20:53
you think you’re gonna get going,
Luke Jones 20:55
I mean, I don’t think they’re gonna be this bad all year. But we’re approaching we’re just about at the midway point in the schedule, right. I mean, we’re there. So you know, they’ve, they’ve been very underwhelming and, you know, it’s easier when you have a World Series ring, but at the same time, you don’t want that to cause you to completely fall off the following year. So it’ll definitely be interesting to see how this plays out over the weekend.
Nestor J. Aparicio 21:18
Luke Jones is here he is Baltimore, Luke. You know, I had Seth Alcon from the Maryland lottery on the other day, we were actually talking a lot of old school baseball. So I always like doing that. And we’re gonna get the Maryland crabcakes. We’re back out on the road, we’re going to be fadeless on the 12th. We would highly encourage anybody this weekend. If you’re downtown, go into the games, stop by fake news. Get a beer, get that mac and cheese. Just go see the new market. It’s beautiful. The new Lexington market. I talked to the folks earlier this week that you’ve been down there yet. Now I gotta get down there. I’m like, get down there this weekend. If you’re going down to the Rangers game, and Joan Jett and all that going on you and I’ve talked a lot about Cedric Mullins. Anything you have on him now that it’s kind of gotten going again and I know you love Austin A’s and you can’t get going if you don’t get at bats, right. So you, you know, curse that would be a great example of like in another place. And we always think they’re showcasing these guys when they bring them up here. And they hit a double and the helmet goes flying off. But Cedric Mullins still looks like he surrounding back into being Cedric Mullins and that would be good news in August and September.
8Luke Jones 22:22
No question about it. I mean, he hits the big homerun had a single and you know, even before Wednesday night’s game over his last 44 plate appearances going into Wednesday’s game 15 for 42 with six extra base hits. I mean, he’s, he’s hit much better. I think where the Orioles outfield picture is right now is so interesting. Ai, not necessarily a positive but it’s interesting nonetheless, is other than Santander and right field or the occasional night where he’s going to be ah, no one has really played to a level where Brandon Hyde is just going to pencil their name in there every night. You mentioned Austin Hayes. Hayes is looking at the offensive numbers. He’s been pretty good since being activated from the IOL back in May. Now that said, he’s mostly playing against left handed starters, right? He’s become a platoon player, a Colton Couser got every opportunity to be that everyday guy and was an everyday guy for a long stretch there. But Let’s call a spade a spade go look at his splits since early May. He hasn’t been very good even if some of the batted ball data and you know guys like me pointing out some of the stats that you consider to be lock based, right and you know, your batting average for balls in play, etc. But at the same time, you got to get results. So we’ve seen him kind of slide back into a little more of a part time platoon role. And obviously now you add s Heston curse that to the mix. And I’d like to see curse dad get some extensive bats at bats here. That doesn’t mean he plays every single day. But you’d like to see what you have with him to see if he can get going. So it’s it’s both a good problem to have in the sense that you do have options that you have some conviction about whether you’re talking about veteran players like Mullins and Hayes or top prospects like Colton Couser and Heston Karstadt. and to a lesser degree, but still Kyle’s towers when he was up here, but you’re looking for guys to step forward. And yeah, let’s face it, if you want to break down their offensive production by position, left field and center field have left something to be desired. Now, Santander having the white hot June that he’s had has certainly stabilized his numbers and you feel really good about him, although he’s gonna be a free agent. So that there’s also that piece of the conversation but I’m I’m fascinated to see what the outfield is going to look like, say, Come September, when we’re on the other side of the trade deadline. And the Orioles have presumably made moves to get pitching, have they, you know, in the midst of making those trades? Is there a veteran player that’s moved to kind of We are the deck so to speak. I mean, we’ve talked about it in passing. I’d love to see this team get Coby Mayo back up to the major leagues at some point. He’s not an outfielder, but that’s a right handed bat that really I know I think there’s a lot of confidence and excitement that how he’s going to play as a major league hitter. But you know, when you have Oh, Hearn, mountcastle Santander as guys that use that D eight spot on occasion. rutschman, we’ve talked about yo, we talked about that a couple days ago, at length about him being the DHL knights that he doesn’t catch. You know, it’s tough to look at the roster right now and say, okay, where does Kobe Mayo fit in here? And even if you get Amir, when does he play? So when he fetch? Yeah, so Well, look, I I don’t think they really want to trade him. But at the same time, you’ve got to give up something to get something, but but the point I was making is in the midst of looking for pitching, I would not at all be shocked to see them move a veteran player to in want to sweeten the pot for one of those deals, but to to clear the deck a little bit in terms of this major log jam that you have. But it’s great to say you want to clear the log jam, but you want to see more consistency, then from the guys that are left. So I’m like I said, I
Nestor J. Aparicio 26:15
don’t know you’re the White Sox want to pay Mullins or Hayes next year, right? Or sometimes. But,
Luke Jones 26:19
but it all depends. But But remember, I mean, it all depends. And in any, you know, you see this a lot in the NBA as well. Anytime you have deals that involve some veteran player, or even if we’re not talking about a veteran, but let’s say someone that’s in their second year of arbitration and making more money, you’ll, you’ll see pieces thrown in there to offset the cash, you know, and you’ll and you’ll see some of that so, but you just you know, we’ve talked about it, at least might
Nestor J. Aparicio 26:43
8be we’re gonna pay him 12 million next year, you got to have mayo in the deal. You know what I mean? Like, and if we’re giving you a deal and CeCe are not hit, but I’m thinking like last year, a guy that’s controllable, a pitch a really good pitcher that’s controllable at the bottom of the food chain with bad teams, and you you guarantee yourself another starter for the third game of the year next year. And you get it you get 30 starts out of that picture next year that are going to be number two, number three, quality. Eye all of these guys at Norfolk, I mean, it’s such a tree, that we’ve not been on the radio for 32 years do we never had anybody we could deal at trading deadline, and certainly nobody, we always had that one. Rocky cop ninja, you can’t have him. You can’t have this guy. You can’t have holiday. I mean, look, you couldn’t have Dylan. You couldn’t have Akin, all those guys. Right? Bundy, all of those guys were the guy for a minute and a double a ball, that the other teams coveted enough to send you something decent. We have. We have a treasure chest to that, and a real chance to win. So therefore, I’m with you. I don’t think anything’s out of, but I’m wondering how you would possibly deal with sounds out there out or a Mullins or a haze out or mountcastle out? How that would make sense to the other team if the team is bad in August?
Luke Jones 28:12
Well, I mean, some of the, the names you just mentioned. I mean, they’re all at different places. And, you know, in some cases that ability. I mean, I think at this point, Austin Hays is looking more and more like a platoon kind of guy more like the the right handed bat and the platoon and a fourth outfielder. So is there value to that to a team that might be dealing a pitcher but isn’t necessarily entering a five year rebuild like the Orioles were five years ago, right? You know, they’re not so bad, where they’re, they’re stripping it down to the screws and completely starting the entire organization over. And again, part of this is the financing involved if you’re taking on X amount of money, and hey, you know, take a take on this guy. And this also clears up the logjam, to help get more at bats for this guy or gives us more bats to give Kobe Mayo as a DH, you know what that however it plays out. I mean, there are lots of different ways that you’re going to approach this and obviously the focus is going to be on the prospects. But my point again, and a lot of this goes back to where and I am not at all suggesting they’re going to move Santander I mean that’s that would be completely different. But in the right deal. Would you move? Austin Hays you know, would you you know, I don’t think you’d move Cedric Mullins because of the defensive aspect in centerfield. But you know what happened last year with Aaron Hill? Is that move or you’d like one of
Nestor J. Aparicio 29:40
the Orioles took him last year? Right? And because I’d have to pay him and like all of that. I almost equate him to Austin Hays right now except you’d have to pay him he take him a little bit or do deal with the financial part of that, but I’m looking at sort of like we needed that kind of player last year. Maybe another team needs that kind of player in a specific way. Right.
Luke Jones 30:04
Right, exactly. And that’s why I just said, be open for any possibility here. They’re obviously not. They’re not trading Gunnar Henderson, they’re not trading Adley rutschman. They’re not trading Grayson Rodriguez, you know, and there’s some obvious other names that you would say, yeah, they’re not moving that guy, Jordan Westberg would be a big one. But in terms of traits, yes. The the big focus is going to be on the prospects. That’s obvious. You know, that statement, the captain obvious statement. But like I said, if there is a potential fit with another team, where maybe you do move a veteran player that’s not playing as much anymore like Austin, Hays, and I’m just using him more as an example than anything. It could be Jorge Mateo, it could be Ramona Yes. You know, and again, these aren’t the set. We’re not I’m not saying that’s the centerpiece of a trade by any means. It might just be that’s part of a bigger trade. I don’t know. It might be something where the Orioles trade for a pitcher, but they might get, I don’t know, there might be a position player that fills out a certain skill that they feel they’re kind of lacking right now. And, and that guy’s thrown in. And, you know, ya know, that’s, you took the words out of my mouth. I mean, for all the talk that we, you know, we had that long discussion the other day about playing time for Adley rutschman. And they’re catching him less, because they want to keep his bat in the lineup on an everyday basis. And, yeah, I’ve said, yeah, you can catch him more, but then you probably need to give him more complete days off where he’s not in the lineup at all. So is there a move that you could make where maybe you’d have to include an Austin Hays kind of veteran, obviously, the prospects that are going to require getting a starting pitcher, but maybe that team has a backup catcher that you really liked their pitch framing, and some of their defensive metrics and you say, Okay, well, maybe he’s not going to hit much better than James McCann. But we like him more as a pitch framer point is expect anything because I think
8Nestor J. Aparicio 31:57
the catchy things interesting to me because I was a catcher and catchers become managers and they’re the interesting guys. I don’t miss it again. This speaks to me not having a press credential. I don’t know McCann. I see him he seems like a be loved or be liked guy on their team. I remember every backup catcher i Every Greg’s on every mark parent through the Elrod Hendricks was a backup catcher. Like all of these people that were that stuck around all hit a buck 98 You know that none of them were great parents and a couple of homeruns. Maybe you want them on your strat thematic card or whatever. But I don’t know what that role is. And I’m only laughing because when your starters Adley rutschman. It’s not like Greg Maddux having his preferred catcher who might hit 110. And now all of a sudden, when pitchers are hitting at the bottom, the lineup, you’re like, Greg, we’re giving away eight, nine. Greg’s like yeah, I’m gonna strike out seven the game’s gonna get over and an hour and 51 minutes, I’m gonna have, you know, I’m gonna walk one, they’re gonna get three hits off me and we’re gonna win three nothing. And we’re all gonna be hanging out at the cheetah club. But do as you know, so like, Atlanta had that. And unless McCann becomes Grayson Rodriguez guy or Corbett. And I’m thinking that’s not possible. It’s Adley rutschman. Like, who doesn’t want Adley rutschman? So this is the issue with how much can rutschman Catch. We talked about that before. And who’s the backup? Happy love this McCann you’re there. You tell me.
Luke Jones 33:24
I mean, he’s really well liked. But Robinson Marino’s was really well liked a couple years ago, right? I mean, you always have a type as a backup catcher. Right, a veteran catcher who’s been been through it all. I’m not at all suggesting that they will do that. But you brought it up. And look, I’ve seen the same numbers. And if you if you go on James McCann Statcast page. It’s pitch framing metrics and some of the other defensive metrics don’t look great. That’s not everything. That’s not the end all be all. There’s, in fact, there’s lots of discourse in terms of the reliability of defensive metrics, right beyond looking at fielding percentage and errors, and what’s your percentage of caught stealing all that. So I just to get something to throw out there. But I’ll also say this, there aren’t 30, high quality starting catchers in Major League Baseball. So it’s great to say, oh, we need a better backup catcher. How exactly are you going to go about doing that? And you know, who is that guy? So, look, that’s one of many possibilities, I think, again, expect just about anything with this trade deadline in terms of how the Orioles might proceed to to get better. And yeah, like I said, it’s not impossible to me to think that they might give up something from their major league roster. Not one of their best players, but someone that maybe has been around a few years and you can make because we’ve talked about it with the outfield. Santander is going to be a free agent. Hasan Marlins are going to be free agents next year and are entering the last year of arbitration eligibility and they’re gonna be making pretty good money.
Nestor J. Aparicio 34:56
So it’s pretty good money and a year when they’ve been on I mean, I’d have Well,
Luke Jones 35:03
8I mean, in the case of Austin, he’s probably making more than you’d want to pay him, quite frankly. So again, so whether that comes to pass this offseason, or and again, I’m not trying to pick on Austin Hays, but I’m just looking here killing
Nestor J. Aparicio 35:19
a deal with another team when you’re trying to get their stuff to some degree. I mean, it’s, I mean, the poison pill always go into the deal, or like you put somebody in the deal you didn’t want to, but that’s the way the poker games play. Right.
Luke Jones 35:33
Right. Right. And, again, we’re just we’re throwing out hypotheticals. My point is, don’t just think about this in terms of their prospects and only their prospects. Yes, the prospects are going to be the center pieces. But in these deals, you’ll often see a couple of veteran players swapped, you know, one position for another, you know, adding some depth at one spot and trading from a surplus somewhere else. I mean, we’ve talked about it. We started talking about the outfielders, because you had brought up Cedric Mullins, I mean, they’re trying to figure out what this outfield picture is going to look like. I think that’s a big reason why Mike Elias hasn’t traded anyone from that outfield to date. But at the same time, it’s great to say that and great to say you want to clear the deck, but Colton Couser needs to be more consistent, and Heston crosstab when he’s caught up needs to take care of take advantage of opportunities. They
Nestor J. Aparicio 36:20
need to be more like Jordan Westberg. Sure. Yeah, exactly. I
8Luke Jones 36:23
mean, Jordan Westbrook was a platoon guy with Adam Frazier last year when he was called up. And what did he do? He’s become an everyday player and their third best position player this year behind to Henderson and rutschman.
Nestor J. Aparicio 36:34
I mean, I must say I was not impressed with him last summer in any way that I thought we’d be this impressed with him this year. Right. And this is probably the magic trick of Mike Elias in that way. Well, and
Luke Jones 36:45
part of it is also I mean, and if you remember, I can even remember us saying you brought up Westbrook quite a bit more as an example than anything else. But you brought him up quite a bit around the trade deadline last year thinking oh, he might be a guy that they would trade. And I was a little more bullish on him from the sense of all he did was hit at every level in the minor leagues and hit for power. And no, he wasn’t showing that same power last summer. But I saw someone who at least acquitted himself well enough to say, hey, this guy’s a solid major leaguer. I don’t know if he’s gonna become an all star. But he looks like he belongs. He didn’t have that stretch, where, like Hauser did last summer, for example, or like Jackson holiday did lb it as a 20 year old, or Couser
Nestor J. Aparicio 37:29
8is having right now. Well, we’re like, what are you going to be?
Luke Jones 37:32
Yeah, exactly. I mean, are you are you You know, I mentioned Austin Hayes’s become a platoon guy. I mean, Colton Couser Are you going to become a bonafide every day above average starting outfielder for the next 10 years? Or are you going to be he’s a major leaguer? Let’s be clear on that. But or are you going to be more of a platoon kind of guy where maybe you’re not playing every day and, and you’re kind of matchup, dependent in terms of when you play so, but Jordan Westberg has ended all that talk. And he’s been one of their three best players. I mean, he’s someone who has absolutely garnered some All Star consideration probably won’t be the all star third baseman, but he’s at least been in that conversation. And he’s been a big reason why this team is on 100 Win pace, as we’re right at the midway point on the 2024 schedules. So I mean, it’s with young players and prospects. It’s great, you know, and there’s excitement and optimism and we’ve some of these guys we’ve talked about for three or four years now, and some of them have become superstars already, like Gunnar Henderson and Adley rutschman. A summit become, at the very least a fringe All Star caliber player like Jordan Westberg. And then other guys are still kind of waiting and seeing, you know, Couser has done some great things and he’s had some stretches where you say, Ooh, you know, he needs to be better. Huston curse dad, Kyle sours. You know, Jackson Holliday, who’s back in the lineup at Norfolk and, you know, kind of going through up
Nestor J. Aparicio 38:58
but as high as we are on Couser versus like Westberg. And I don’t want to belabor it, but had Couser been in the deal for burns. And we still had Ortiz or tz be hidden to 94 in Norfolk and Couser would be in there doing whatever he’s doing in Milwaukee, right, like doing what he’s doing here. Maybe we’d say, you know, it’s never it’s never that way really. But, you know, Ortiz has gone and I bring it up once a week. You bring it up once a week because there is a cost. That’s all there is cost. That’s no doubt.
Luke Jones 39:30
Hey, Joe, you’re cheap. By the way. Have you seen his numbers?
8Nestor J. Aparicio 39:32
He’s playing really, really well. I keep frowns on these cats. I kept tabs on Eduardo Rodriguez for years, you know? And
Luke Jones 39:39
keep in mind this is this is how it was supposed to go now not not with Kyle Bradish and John means and Tyler wells getting hurt. But we saw the Orioles for five straight years four straight years draft college hitters, college hitters college hitters and not draft much pitching and we set it at the time when they got to this point, ideally, in their long term rebuild and transforming into a contender that they would have a surplus of positional player talent. And they would use some of that to go out and get pitching or go out and get whatever specific need, you might have to fortify your chances to compete and contend and win a World Series. So part of that is that was always going to be inevitable. Mike Elias, for the most part has held on to all of it and people have varying opinions about that. But yeah, the time is coming. I think it’s very obvious now. Albert Suarez is not gonna be part of a postseason rotation. Cole Irvin very likely is not going to be Cade Povich I look. He’s done some good, some bad, he’s a rookie, right now it’s tough for me to pencil him in for any more than the number four number five starter spots. So they have a clear need, whether it’s a number three behind burns, and Rodriguez or a number two that slots between those guys, they have a clear need. So go out and use some of that prospect talent that you have to go out and get it. My only point in bringing up the veterans was there could be other pieces involved in such a deal. And it might be hey, you need a starting pitcher. But oh, yeah. Look, Joe, you know, as I’ve been saying since February or March, they need bullpen help too. So it might be that you go out and and acquire some teams, number two or number three starter and you also get a bullpen arm in that deal. And yeah, that’s when you might be including a veteran peace or whatever to it’s a time of
Nestor J. Aparicio 41:32
season for feelings to get hurt. Let’s just say that that’s it. Yeah, period. Yeah. And it’s yeah, we’ve
Luke Jones 41:37
8said this for years. Now what especially for some of the guys who’ve been here and who were here when this team was awful four years, four or five years ago, we knew that not all those guys were going to be there. If the Orioles were gonna get to a point where they’re raising a pennant or raising a World Series trophy in the future. We knew that not all those guys. Were going to be there. You know, Trey, Manzini was the first one, you know, when they traded him two years ago. But you know, that’s inevitable. Change is inevitable. And these guys understand that, but at the same time when you’re in the moment, it is challenging, and it is something that it’s why the trade deadline is always a real easily the most difficult time of the season inside a clubhouse. I mean, five game losing streaks you know, winning streaks a that’s great, but there’s a lot there’s gonna be a lot of angst in that Orioles clubhouse. Come mid mid to late July until the trade deadline and yeah, it’ll probably be mostly prospects dealt with whatever deals they make, but
Nestor J. Aparicio 42:36
somebody’s gonna get a little so come see me, Mike. Nice to see you. Yeah, I
Luke Jones 42:41
would not be surprised if you saw a veteran player to move just because of the log jam. So we’ll see how it plays out. Big
Nestor J. Aparicio 42:47
Weekend. Texas Rangers, Joan Jett, sinks and Crimson and Clover a love Joan Jett. So let me put my Joan Jett stuff out at Baltimore positive this weekend. I don’t know that I need to we’ve had such great great stuff this week. I love to have them very stiff. So my old friend from Little League and the blast in the spirit and Archbishop Curley we talked old school soccer we talked neighborhoods and little flower and Eastwood and Highland town and we both say it the right way. So great soccer chatted like liberal join us to talk at some soccer this week had COPPA going on Messi playing off the road. Soccer on televisions everywhere over Pappas the other day. Mariela crabcake tours back out on the road on the 12th at Bally’s in Lexington market. It’s all brought to you by friends at the Maryland lottery Gold Rush sevens doublers making it happen our friends at Liberty pure solutions. Lucca I haven’t broken the news to Bill Cole but I broke his mug yesterday all over the floor. It took me a half an hour to clean it up. I am distraught about it. But the good news is I do have this this is the this is the poop tower from Colgate the original one where they have the Twin Towers now. But this is my neighborhood mug that was given to me so cold lanes to guys is on there the old East Point mall logo on there. The roll arena where I met my my child’s mother, as as a kid she grew up in that neighborhood NorthPoint village right by Costas. There’s a Northpointe plaza where I went to my first movie. So this is my Dundalk mug. So I just want to give Cole roofing some love and Gordian energy Billy came on this week. I have all sorts of editing issues with it because we talked for like an hour and a half. It’s been it’s been something it’s Fourth of July week. Conversations are gonna be thick next week around here. Baseball is going to be thick as the Orioles go to the West Coast next week as well. And Luke will be celebrating on his vacation in a few weeks. I’m not vacationing anywhere. I’m vacationing and Dundalk like a like a good Baltimorean here watching baseball all weekend. So hang in there. Hold on. We got a great summer had a great pennant race ahead on Nestor. He’s Luke we are wn St. am 1570, Towson Baltimore. And we never stop talking Baltimore positive. Gotta call Bill Cole and get a new mug.
