With the recent death of Indianapolis Colts owner Jim Irsay, this is a never-released March 2010 chat with Nestor from an aborted 2010 book project on Baltimore sports leadership and influences.
Jim Irsay discussed his coaching and leadership influences, highlighting Ted Marchibroda’s simplistic principles of winning, discipline, and fundamentals. He emphasized the importance of being aware and seizing opportunities, citing the hiring of Tony Dungy and Bill Polian. Irsay stressed the need for bold, decisive leadership, drawing parallels from military and business strategies. He reflected on the evolution of NFL ownership, noting the changes in leadership styles and the importance of learning from both successes and failures. Irsay also shared personal anecdotes about mentors like Joe Thomas and the enduring impact of their guidance.
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
Leadership, coaching, Ted Marsha Broda, Joe Thomas, winning fundamentals, military influence, spirituality of winning, Tony Dungy, Bill Polian, conflict resolution, decision making, Winston Churchill, Ted Roosevelt, Frank Cush, Joe Thomas.
SPEAKERS
Nestor Aparicio, Jim Irsay
8Nestor Aparicio 00:00
To start by talking about coaching and leadership. Who is who coached you? When I say to you, who’s had the most impact in your life and teaching you about leadership and coaching, you know, I think Ted Marsha Broda certainly, you know, was a guy who had a huge influence on me, you know, back in the 70s and and he, you know, obviously, was our coach in 75 and spent a lot of time with him just as a teenager,
Jim Irsay 00:32
just asking him a million questions and just, you know, we really had a great relationship. Joe Thomas certainly was a guy who, you know, was there at a real early ages as well, when I was 12 years old, when we started in gold in Colorado, back in 72 But Ted, you know, was a guy who had a huge influence on me, just about the game and just about, you know, coaching and football in general. What
Nestor Aparicio 01:01
were his axiom? I haven’t talked to Ted yet for the book. I will, I’ll get out of Virginia and get with him a little bit. But what were the things he taught you at that time?
Jim Irsay 01:08
8You know, I think really just some of the real basic aspects of winning and what it takes to win. And, you know, really not easy, but simplistic principles. You know him going way back with George Allen and even competing with Johnny Unitas, with the Steelers, you know, for the quarterback job in the 50s. He, you know very much, was someone who was a guy who believes in the simplistic aspects of winning, about discipline, about not turning the ball over, about, you know, lack of penalties, not beating yourself, and really the fundamentals of the game, and just those simple beliefs that seem almost too simple to be true, but they’re hard to follow through on, you know, when it comes down to actual, you know, game time situations, but he those simple things, really old school stuff from Ted
Nestor Aparicio 02:18
leadership, from your perspective in ownership, not on the field, off the field. You grew up into this thing, obviously, with your father, you move over all the years. How did you pick up on how to do this the right way and how to win? Because obviously it wasn’t easy for you in the situation you were in. You inherited it, and yeah, and you had to learn it kind of on the streets, but maybe you learned it from some of your fellow owners, or even a David Modell type of guy who had the same sort of scenario you had in life?
Jim Irsay 02:46
Yeah, no doubt. I think, you know, I always pulled a lot from different sources. I think that it’s amazing, you know, how many influences that I know I’ve had and and pulling a little bit from each, you know, from military readings and studying of military aspects, the game of football is tied to the military in a lot of ways, and, and, you know, principles and Business and, and basically, all sorts of aspects, including, if you will, a spirituality of winning, a belief in karma, and a belief in how everything fits together, in terms of being a leader, in terms of trying to get things accomplished, and understanding that there’s that there’s forces bigger than you at work and and so, you know, to me, I think that aspect, you know, was always involving everyone, from Vince Lombardi to John Lennon. You know, it really was it. It was something where you pick up a little, at least I did from from everywhere in terms of, you know, winning and leadership.
Nestor Aparicio 04:05
It’s funny you would say that about music, because I know music is a pretty instrumental thing. I’ve done some reading on you. Where do you pick that up? To go from a football team that’s not doing well, doesn’t have a lot of fans, isn’t at the top of the heap, to getting to the top of the heat and you find good people. Clearly, you can’t do it without good people. But what empowered you to look at a bill Polian and say, That’s my guy, or look at a Tony Dungy and say, That’s my guy. I mean, those might not have been decisions you would have made in 1989 but in 1999 you did. Yeah, I
8Jim Irsay 04:36
think really being aware and awake of what’s going on around you at all times, 24/7, so you can seize the opportunity when it presents itself, because then I think you have to act boldly and act swiftly, and when you see a chance to get key people that are. Improving winners. You have to go out and get them. I think many times, you know, you I look back and there was just good fortune that came along in terms of who was available. I know, you know, when we let Jim Moore go, who was a great coach, you know, we just were going in different directions. We were going in a different direction, but didn’t have our eyes set on someone in particular. And then Tony Dungy appeared all of a sudden. It wasn’t planned that he was going to be let go in Tampa as soon as he appeared, you know, I got him on the phone immediately and offered him the job, you know, and going after that situation. And, you know, the same thing with Bill Polian in terms of really being aggressive, giving up a third round pick in compensation to the Carolina Panthers, and going out and getting him. And so I think that’s really critical when you can find Proven Winners, you know, in their position, and you can hire them, it doesn’t leave a lot to chance. You know, when you’ve seen people at a high level win in this league, and you’re going to put them in a position to do that for your organization. So when you
Nestor Aparicio 06:15
interview them, what do they say? That strikes you is, that’s my guy, in the case of the guys who’ve been successful versus other coaches and people you had who weren’t successful, but I’m sure you asked the same questions, and you’ve probably gotten better at what questions you ask and more detail on exactly what you’re looking
Jim Irsay 06:31
for. Well, no doubt. And I think it’s also, how do you blend different leaders in your organization? You know, I really liked what Tony Dungy was going to bring in to Bill pulling and Peyton Manning. Peyton’s very high strung and so is Bill and and I really thought that that Tony would bring in a calmness to both of them and, and I like the mix aspect, the mix and match aspect of the energies, of what they what the organization at the top of the organizational tree would have in terms of leadership, I think I look at that as well, and in terms of the interviews and questions and those things, you know, I over a period of time, You develop through experience, certain principles that you look to ask and and to observe more than anything, I think,
Nestor Aparicio 07:28
8what are they just I’m trying to get to the core, you know, I
Jim Irsay 07:30
think, you know, the key thing is, is leadership, you know, when it comes to, certainly, a head coach, you know is You have to be a great leader of men. And I think when you look at that, one of the key things when it comes to leadership and being a great leader of men is really trying to say, at least in a head coaching position, you know, is this person ready to deal with difficult situations, difficult conflict and tough situations and conflict resolution, and resolving it in that way, as well as having that certain sort of magical spark to the individual. I mean, you know, Bill Polian really, is that guy out at the racetrack who’s dressed in a shabby raincoat and a ruffled hat with the newspaper underneath his arm who looks at all the horses and says, that’s the one that’s going to run well today. I mean, it’s just a God given gift, you know? And it’s that sort of magic, and that sort of sixth sense, so to speak, that you look for and different people. Because, you know, there’s, there’s several different ways to go in terms of being successful and hiring people. And I think that’s one thing that that’s interesting to me, is you have to get the right person in place, but it’s following it up with the support to give it a chance to work. And I think, you know, you can hire the right person, but if, if, as an owner, you’re not going to be there to support that person and nurture the growth of your organization, the right people always don’t succeed, you know. So it’s, it’s, it’s it’s something you know, and you learn it through experience of, you know, failing. And I remember I hired a key person, a key football person, once, and you know, it just turned out that, you know, when the pressure came, and from a leadership standpoint, you know, he just didn’t have the tools to really get it done and and instead of dealing with players and looking what buttons to push in the locker room, you know, he would lock himself behind doors and watch more film, you know, so, so in other words, you know, you learn from these experiences. I remember in 85 I entered. You 12 different head coaches offer the job to George Seaford, and he wouldn’t take it back then, I think, with my dad and things like that, he he was a little leery of the organization at that point, maybe, but, and I was only 2425 years old, but, um, you know, so those experiences serve you well later, you know. And a lot of times, no matter how smart and how hard you work, you have to accumulate that those experiences. And oftentimes it’s from mistakes that you you know you learn the most and compile in your own mind the wisdom you know to make the right choices. Do you
Nestor Aparicio 10:38
learn more from failure than you do from success? I,
Jim Irsay 10:40
you know, I if you live long, but I think from both, you know, I think from both, I think that you know, if you can’t learn from failure, you are going to be limited in terms of how far you can succeed in life, in all facets of life and business, etc, sports, you have to have the humility. You have to be able to learn from failure and deal with that to really, you know, get to the point of greatness and wisdom and those sorts of things. Success teaches you too, but, but, but failure teaches you even more. You know what books
8Nestor Aparicio 11:24
you said you’ve read up on war books and that sort of thing, not, not shocking to me, but inspiration. You talk about John Lennon even. But what are the books and things like that that have inspired you in leading that when you win a championship? They they built into that? Well,
Jim Irsay 11:39
I think certainly, you know, Winston Churchill is a figure, and Ted Roosevelt, those are, those are a couple guys that I look at in terms of just leadership, wisdom and and also having that ability to, you know, be direct, be bold and be able to make decisions. You know, you have to be able to be a decision maker. There’s a saying sometimes that that, you know, the only thing better than a yes is a quick No, you know, and and you know that that’s true in a lot of aspects, where, to me, it’s a blending of both. I think, when you’re younger, you sometimes go in there and you know, you’re a little bit maybe too bold and and you learn, you know, over a period of time, that it’s a that it’s a blending of both being bold, being aggressive, and also pulling back and being patient and being wise, you know. And I think that’s, that’s the thing that age teaches you as you go along, and makes you a better leader. And you know, like I said, through mistakes, sometimes that’s how you have to learn it. Let’s
Nestor Aparicio 13:01
talk about some people just names. I spent some time with Frank Cush, and his wisdom at 82 was they have to fear you. They have to that’s his. Now Tony Dungy probably would be polar opposite, but both had incredible successes. I mean, Frank cush has a statue built in Arizona State. Are you amazed at how many different styles of leadership and coaching can be successful?
Jim Irsay 13:25
8I do and both men can be feared, you know, because I guarantee the player that gets in trouble has the same amount of fear going to see Tony dunge As he does Frank Cush, because they respect each man the same and and they’re just different in their presentation. But there’s no doubt, Frank Cush was a guy I took a lot from and was a very bold leader. And, you know, he was so much different than Tony Dungy, but also the same in a lot of different ways, you know. And Frank, you know, was more out of the real military style in a lot of ways. And and, you know, boy, the experiences with Frank, he was a great influence on this young guy when I was, you know, 2223 years old, and just just loved it. I mean, just just really the toughness and the way he was. He was a very inspirational guy talking about Joe Armen,
Nestor Aparicio 14:29
your relationship with Joe, because Joe’s been a guy who’s affected me anytime I’ve ever heard him speak. He was the first player to ever sign an autograph for me at East Point Mall. JC, Penney in Dundalk, back in 1975
Jim Irsay 14:39
you know, Joe is like a big brother. You know, ever since that we met, and you know, I was 15 years old, and just his family and his influence, you know, the charisma and just, you know, as a young guy, you just looked up to Joe and you wanted to be. Like him, you know, you wanted to, you know, just have the swagger and just, you know, he just had a tremendous personality. And was, was really a tough guy, but also a teddy bear of a guy. And he was, he was a huge influence on me and remains today, you know, like a big brother, I mean, one of my dearest friends. And we’ve remained close through the years. You know, from from going all the way back to the mid 70s, you have any axioms, things,
Nestor Aparicio 15:29
the words that you live by, things that you say, phrases or quotes that you use often, that maybe people in your life get tired of hearing them, but they they work for you.
8Jim Irsay 15:40
You know, some things you know, go go around in your head. I, I’m not, you know, too huge of a guy on, you know, on having a ton of stuff around. But one that always seems to come back is, if you want a job done, right, you got to do it yourself. You know, not that you don’t delegate, and, you know, turn things over to people in your organization, but at the same time, there’s an aspect of where, you know, when it’s a really important decision, you know, I want to make sure I have my fingerprints on it and that sort of thing. And I think, you know, the aspect of it’s simple, but it’s not easy. You know, is one too, because I think that some of the simplest things in life are the hardest things to adhere to and learn. And we forget. You know, we’re forgetful people, in the sense that as much as we try to stay awake, we forget the most simplest things. And I think you know, having techniques to remind yourself on how not to forget is important, because you can just get to the point where sometimes you cannot overcome the ability to fall asleep and forget certain things, but you can have systems that wake you up, you know? I mean, in a real basic example, you know, I remember one time I kept taking a turn out of my house, and I’d be so busy in the morning focusing on other things, I’d forget that this construction was going on. And I always told myself the next day, don’t turn left. And every day I turn left. So finally, you put a post it pad in your car and say, you know, don’t turn left, you know. But those simple things are really important when it comes down to, you know, trying to deal with yourself and your humanness.
Nestor Aparicio 17:38
Last thing for you, I’m sorry. Oh, you gotta go. You’re gonna be late. Well, since 1981 all the years, through this and the management, how much has it changed being an owner in this league, through the internet, television, Super Bowls, the growth of the game, and the people that been in that room with you, you know that have changed as well. You
Jim Irsay 17:57
know, it’s changed in an amazing way. And it hasn’t changed. I mean, the literal faces have changed. I was, you know, just looking the other day. And, you know, besides Mike Brown of the Bengals and Billy Bidwell and Bud Adams. I mean, those really are the only three guys. You know, Ralph isn’t coming to meetings anymore. Ralph Wilson, and he’s 9991 and it’s amazing, you know, and it’s good to know Roger Goodell was there with me from the beginning too, in 1981 basically similar times that we were in there. But it’s amazing to see all those guys not there anymore, but some of the style has changed. I’d say we maybe had a few more colorful characters back then you could, you know, let your hair down. A little bit more back than it seems. And the composition of some of the owners have changed a little bit from the Jack Kent cooks and those sorts that I remember. But you know, there’s a lot that does stay the same. But you’re right. It’s amazing to sit here at 50 years old, and really to literally see, you know that there’s almost no one left from 8182 when I first started strolling into those rooms, and to still be so young, but to still realize how much change, and there’s a desire again, to, you know, be like Wellington mayor and Lamar Hunt, and be able to stay in that thing and look back, you know, when you’re 7080, 90 years old, and say, You know, hey, I’ve been around this thing for 70 years. You know, that’s a great part about it. It’s so much in my blood. It’s like growing up in the circus, you know, they say the sawdust is in your blood and so, so it’s a great, it’s great. And I still feel, you know, like some. Of it’s just beginning so well, thank
Nestor Aparicio 20:02
you. I know your time shortly, man, very, very much. One day we’ll talk rocket Good luck with the book. Oh, thanks, man. I really appreciate.
