Coming home to find the new look of the Orioles

Sports media executive David Katz comes home to Baltimore to find a different Orioles team and Ravens stability

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

game, lamar, baltimore, years, orioles, ravens, baseball, win, people, run, good, week, talk, team, football, david katz, franchise, ball, move, players

SPEAKERS

Nestor Aparicio, David Katz

Nestor Aparicio  00:01

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What about w n s t, Towson, Baltimore, Baltimore positive I have a change the screenshot for everybody sun’s out guns out Orioles are playing great baseball. We’re gonna be doing the Maryland crabcake Tour presented by the Maryland lottery at a bunch of places. So I have like a whole schedule that I’m putting together for the next couple of weeks, a couple of months. But first things first, we’re going to begin June. On the second inhale Thorpe Janet’s pub. Looking forward to getting over to a place I’ve heard a lot about the crabcake. So brought to you by our friends at the barrel lottery conjunction with friends and window nation. Somewhere around here I have the floppy hat. Here. Oh, there we go. 8669 donation is the way to get in touch with our friends at when donation if it’s still May, which is only a couple of days you get 0% financing for the next five years by to get to free. If it’s June. There’ll be a new offer next week, but it’s not going to be 0% financing. This guy knows about a financing and about sports and about business and a little bit about media as well. He is one of our defending champions. Always a proud Baltimorean Baltimore on sometimes when things aren’t going well. He makes his hometown of Miami now he spent a long, long time at Los Angeles as well as New York and other places running Yahoo. As well as Fox Sports. He is the curate curator of the postgame and founder of the postgame. He is Baltimore zone. David Katz. We welcome him back on to the program, too. Last time I had you on Lamar was like there were memes of him and dolphins jerseys and you’re down there in Miami. They were all lubed up about that he was gonna get a better tax situation and he then he demands a trade and then they run the Preakness the Orioles are fighting for first place and it’s Memorial Day, David. I mean it is it’s been a hell of a ride here. The last 90 Sports don’t tell anybody. It’s relevant again.

David Katz  01:52

Oh, yeah. It’s big in Baltimore. I think back to that last conversation, we had Nestor and Baltimore Ravens. Lamar was on every lower third on every telecast in America for a period of three or four months. I called it the Lamar Athan. It was a Lamar Athan. And as Baltimoreans we do have a little bit of an inferiority complex when it comes to New York, and Boston, and Philly and some of these bigger markets that surround us. That seemed to suck a lot of the oxygen out of the room. And for the first time, Baltimore was really the center of attention on all media all the time, nationally. And I don’t know about

Nestor Aparicio  02:39

when Aaron Rodgers wasn’t on the guy with the blue light. Yeah,

David Katz  02:42

right away. There was a little bit of that. But I’ll tell you there was, it was all the more all the time. And I don’t know I think we love, we feel like we never get enough attention. No one’s ever talking about our franchise enough. We’re always being disrespected. Well, guess what? We got plenty of attention, plenty of analysis, plenty of talk. And I don’t know about you, but I was exhausted. I don’t know that I liked that much attention. I think I like it when Baltimore has everything nice and tidy, and packaged up and is slightly underrepresented in the media and slightly underestimated in the standings. And that’s when Baltimore does its best work because I was just completely exhausted. And when the Lamar news, announcing his signature on that document was done. I don’t know about you, but it’s kind of how I feel sometimes after certain presidential elections happen. When the transfer of power is happening, I take a deep breath. And I’m like, Okay, you

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Nestor Aparicio  03:42

did live to January 6. Now, we, we did have reason to wonder if there was going to be the thing that we’ve had for 200.

David Katz  03:48

I’m not saying what side of this Nestor, I’m just saying, it’s sometimes nice to have the oxygen taken out of the room to take a deep breath, and say, Okay, we’re back to normalcy, whatever that means. And in this case, we’re back. The regular the birds are chirping, I turn on my TV, and they’re having to talk about something else. And Baltimore sports can return to candidly a lot of really fun on the field conversation now as opposed to all the off the field conversation. So I cannot wait for the summer. And what we’re gonna I’m sure talk about with the Orioles and the expectations and the anticipation of what the Ravens season is going to mean this year. Because I’m all in and super excited. Let the mungkin era begin. Can’t wait to see what’s going to happen. So it’s a great time to be a Baltimore sports fan.

Nestor Aparicio  04:40

Far be it for me to steer a conversation between you and I away from football. Because like there’s really never been any reason to drive it away from football. Although I happen to know that you spent many early afternoon out there in Manhattan Beach, watching some really bad baseball and your satellite dish for many, many years. that in your family, the Orioles lead the party back home in our childhood, you know our mutual child. And I would say when there were no colts there was no football any of that for the Ravens existed. And I still think the amazing part is the young whippersnappers that come up now that I’ve been thrown out by the Ravens after 27 years and writing the book that don’t realize I was you’re fighting to get the franchise you’re like, and what a miracle that the Ravens even exist is in this Lamar Athan era, you know, all these years later, we’re talking about $250 million contracts. That just the fact that we even have a football team, for guys our age, baseball used to be the whole conversation and then it went away. This has been a fascinating six to eight weeks and not withstanding last year and rutschman coming up and how it was and Luke even coming on our airwaves, the you know, the down the center, Luke Jones in March, saying the Orioles could have done more, they should have done more in the offseason. And yet here they are, after beating the Yankees up this week. homestand people are going to the gate. I mean, there are people who swore they would never go back into city of Baltimore, I have friends in Forest Hill, who are going down to games this week, parking the car, doing all the things they said they were never going to do, because they’re engaged with the baseball team. And do not leave this in your feet. And you could say what because you and I’ve never really talked a whole lot of baseball, because what has ever been talked about, but the thing that I have fought for all of my professional life, it is rich with irony, brother, that you would come in here when you’re running Yahoo and put my station on and hear me and my host talking about how they should put Baltimore back on the road jerseys. And having the team throw us out because of it. And now they’re all selling Baltimore on the home jerseys in black, to make money, but to somehow try to connect with a community that the ownership forgot about for 30 years, mistreated for 30 years. And now they have a really good team. I mean, it’s no one should deny this is a really good team, a compelling team. Great. But now they have almost instant prosperity from a business standpoint, on the field. It’s going to be fun. Now it’s everything else. It’s experiential. And you live in that space and Fox and other places to say, how can we take a good product on the field and make everything around it? Make people want to come through it and compel and engage with it?

David Katz  07:35

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Well, I’ll tell you. I was supposed to fly into Baltimore next week. And the first thing I did, because I was I was set on certain dates. The first thing I did was check the Orioles schedule. I cannot tell you the last time I did this coming into Baltimore, to visit family. And it looks like hey, the Orioles are going on a long road, Stan. And if I come in two days earlier than I was planning on doing, I can catch that last afternoon game The Getaway game before they go on the road. And guess what? I’m coming in two days earlier. So I can go on the 305 start and catch that Oriole game. So yes, what’s happening on the field incredibly exciting. All my friends who are back in Baltimore say there’s a renewed energy and enthusiasm in and around the Orioles. And I think this is also the difference in sports. It’s been a while since we’ve had this kind of success on the field and how it then bleeds out into the community. But when you’re talking 162 games instead of 17 games, we get up for ravens games, we will always get up for ravens games, there are only a few. And in the world of supply and demand. There’s there’s there’s high demand on that low supply. In the baseball’s the auto baseball, there’s so many games, how do you keep that energy level up? How does the city care about that kind of stuff. And you’re starting to see the effort that the team is taking both on the field and off the field to stoke that. I’ll give you one one little example. And I you’ve been critical of the Orioles for a very long time, deservedly so they’ve abandoned a lot of their local responsibilities to the community, to the fan base and others. But I like

Nestor Aparicio  09:19

how you put responsibility in there. I just want to I want to stop you just for a second and say they have an obligation and a responsibility to be better stewards of all of it than they’ve been. I think I’ve highlighted that now. Here it is they deliver what they’ve been promising, right like this is the baby we want to say right?

David Katz  09:39

Look, there’s a civic trust that a team and ownership needs to have with its community. And we can say for a while has been lessened or abandoned or whatever words you want to use but we are where we are now. For me it’s about today and forward because you can’t change the past. And a friend of mine was out at this Real Estate convention in Vegas the other week, and I don’t know what event he was at or whether it was in his hotel, but he posted on our Baltimore Sports Group Chat that all of our high school friends still have a picture. And it was a signed, autographed note thanking him for attending on behalf of the Maryland group at this real estate national real estate convention signed by John Angeles on behalf of the Orioles. So when you think about these things, that that thought meant a lot to me because a personal sign note from John Angelo’s to a Baltimore Real Estate Group meeting in a national convention in Las Vegas means a lot these little touches touching into the community saying this real estate community is important part of Baltimore helps drive Baltimore commercial, real estate’s important to the to the community. Well, look, those types of touches. That’s a small note. But those types of touches, you’re going to need a lot more of them are a way to come back in and on. Look, I study this the way you do Nestor, and we all have our theories. To me, a lot of this was not that the team did not want to do more in the community and did not want to, you know, invest more. They were playing a legal game with Masson and the Orioles were the pawn in the legal game with between Masson and the league. And until

Nestor Aparicio  11:39

that you don’t use the kids as a pawn.

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David Katz  11:42

I know you don’t and you shouldn’t, etc, etc. I’m just saying that’s what this was. And is. And as more and more recently,

Nestor Aparicio  11:50

Peter admitted that to me in 1997. Dave, right. Like I’m re releasing the Peter principles right now, just so people can see where it was I wrote it. It’s all factual, it’s accurate. This is why the stadium is empty. When you seen pictures of Rick Sutcliffe pitching 30 years ago, and it was packed. This is why it was empty for 20 years when you see Cal Ripken running around 2131. I was just with Ryan Ripken last week. And he’s a grown ass man. Now he was so little that he barely remembers it. By his own admission. That’s how long ago it was that the place was vibrant. And you could say, but what happened. And it’s been the story of my life, the Chronicle every single day, and you know, the sun comes up, you measure it as to what has happened here. And the notion that Peter would tear it down in this way, and that it could come back to life in an instant. Like in one summer. It can all come back. I mean, I had Dennis I’m wearing my goons Baltimore for that. It’s just like goo just advertising a mass and now in the games, because people are watching the games. And we talked about the Houston Astros and zero ratings and what that represents, but for the city, this is what we’ve waited for. And now this promise is here in these players and these young players, and there are so many things that could go right or wrong on the field off the field negotiation, all of that. But I can’t begin to tell you, Dave, how many people have come up to me in six weeks, and have talked about Adley rutschman contract all of a sudden, like I’m like, Oh, my God, like we’re there already? It well, we just did the Lamar Athan, we have to have it. And I’m like, can’t we just play baseball, but but these are questions people have, because of Manny Machado, because of the Angelo’s family. These are the same questions I have every single day to say, all right, these guys have never run. John Angelo’s has never run a lemonade stand with any. There’s been no business to run now. Hotdogs have to be warm parking has to be good people need to be hired. Traffic needs to go well. Public Safety. Start with that. Let’s start with that. Right. So all of these things that there was traffic last week, Dave, I was late getting to a happy hour, because Oriole traffic lead out. That’s true. That’s a success story. It really is a success story. And I really want it to go well. But it’s my job to sit on the outside and say, How’s it going? I want to know how your your your experience if you go down there, because we need you to come back. We need you to want to come back again, make a special trip up in July or August. We need you to maybe hold off on that London plan in October because that week might be important around here, right? So there’s just different considerations with the baseball team. And we’ve waited and now to your point. They’re counting on you to get money and come and sit in the seats and be a part of it. And then there’s that. How much are beers? We did have a good time do I want to go back again? Do I have a favorite player like and this is the time for that and it’s beautiful to watch Matt be in here every day to have people come up to me every day and want to talk about baseball. It’s

David Katz  15:09

your baseball guy. It’s in your name your baseball guy. And it means so much to you. It means so much to the city. We’re in Oriole town and a lot of ways we’ve become a Ravens town and I love my Ravens. But there’s something when the Orioles are clicking. It’s something there’s something magical about every day. Look, I think the Orioles can get I’m a business guy. I’m not a player development guy. I think the Orioles can get the business stuff, right? I do. I think they they will get it right. I think the they’ve been blessed with a crown jewel stadium, nestled in a part of the city that, you know, maybe has been a little more neglected over over the recent time. But they still have this incredible venue to watch a baseball game. And now I think the hiring of Mike Elias, I don’t know when that was four years ago, five years ago, and the plan he’s put in the place, you have to give ownership management credit for finding him and say and the system that they’ve put together the moves they’ve made, I will I will tell you, I had similar concerns in March, when I looked and I said okay, these guys should be able to put the bat on the ball. But our pitching is going to be woeful. You know, relief pitching should be good. But making none of these real big, splashy moves in on the starting pitching side. Really concern me and especially at the beginning of the season, the first couple of days, I was like, Man, are we going to be able to do this, we’re wasting all these bats and this youthful energy. And man, maybe it’s over performance, maybe there’s something to momentum and energy, maybe it’s something to how Adley rutschman calls a game, there’s a hell of a lot to what I think is more important than any single draft pick that these guys have done is move the strategy strategic move of putting over a number of years, the players in place with you know, a lot of left handed bats and a certain type of pitching rotation, etc, etc. And then knowing they’re going to move the wall back and up.

Nestor Aparicio  17:26

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Well, I just came clean. I went to a CEO event a month and a half ago when the season started. Like week two of the season, they gotten off to a good start. I might have been five or one or something but they were pretty good at this luncheon. And all the questions were bad Adam Fraser and they were about statin and they were just different kinds of questions. But Elias came clean about the wall. And the obvious which we talked about on the air a year and a half ago which is they couldn’t sign pitchers in the market they can and they felt like they would have trouble getting a pitcher to stay and they would have trouble having a young pitcher keep his head together. Grayson Rodriguez being Exhibit A in the early going, struggling a bit more than a bit. But if the ball was going out at 364, two or three times a game that a mistake or two leads to five runs instead of to fly outs or a sac fly that it changes everything about a young pitchers countenance it changes their success. And if God knows you bring some Scott Erickson you know, sinker ball guy that ground ball, ground ball, fine, you can have those pitchers, but then when it comes time to get paid they go pitch for the Yankees like Messina did so because because they want to get out of here. So all of that for 30 years. I knew that from though unlike Messina 9095 Right when it was his decision as the Cleveland had bigger ballpark Houston to just build a bigger but there was all these places he could have gone cleat, Cleveland, Boston wanted him he didn’t like the monster there. Like there was all of this. If you’re a pitcher and you’re gonna take 100 to a million dollars. You want to go someplace that’s that’s a better ballpark. All that being said he came clean about it and said, Yeah, of course we did it about pitching. I’m like, wanting you to say that a year and a half ago, baseball people sort of know that, you know, really?

David Katz  19:11

Look, it was it was the untold thing. It was to me it was a story of last year, and everyone will talk about Adly. And he has been phenomenal. And I hope he is the cornerstone of this franchise for the next decade. But the wall move was sheer brilliance. It worked. And it worked because they had a strategic plan. These guys are super smart at not just evaluating talent, but evaluating talent in the in the context of the scheme. They’re running in the same way that the ravens are super smart and how they draft and develop linemen, who will pull in a different way because we don’t play this type of power football. We play this type of football and you need to have the talent to fit the scheme and I I think we’ve now seen excellence on both of these franchises in building rosters around the skill sets they had and the unique qualities they have. And it is, it’s an absolute pleasure. And by the way, you got to give Rob man for credit, I remember seeing an interview with him. And they asked him a question. And many would say that between Adam Silver, and Roger Goodell and all these guys, Manfred will not get the credit that all these other guys get for running these institutions. We could talk about all the mistakes baseball’s made, but combine some of these local moves that the Orioles have done in the broader context of the rule changes that we’ve seen this year, that have brought people back to baseball. And I never understood I mean, baseball has always been so aligned with its tradition and history and not wanting to do it. But they figured out rule changes that don’t really change a lot of those long term stats that everyone wants to compare generation to generation, but have found a way to make it more appropriate for the modern sports fan. And it’s like universal applause across across the board. So combined those chili

Nestor Aparicio  21:10

wager on it while we’re talking about that, because like wagering on baseball that mean like that is the to my eyes coming to it. Look, the shift going back. That’s normal baseball to me, right? This, you can’t pick off that sort of Little League rolls, you get two picks, and that unit gets it and so it’s changed everything about speed. It’s almost made the rotisserie gain remember when we’re Ciceri was like homerun stolen bases and whatever the hell else you came up with the bait up issue, and I’m like, How the hell do you think Willie like, Vince Coleman is as valuable as Mike Schmidt? He’s not boy steals basis he steals at home she mentally it’s 35 home runs and their bet and I’m like, what kind of game are you running here in the 80s? What kind of craps game are you running here? You’re waiting the dice. I’ll tell you this, the the part of baseball and getting all of this right for stats for this. The biggest thing baseball’s done is two hours and 30 minutes get the game over in the short attention society that I need to gain to end and I hate the runner on second base. But the game ends and if the game ends, everybody goes home happier at a better our pitchers go home happier franchises go home happier, they don’t sell beer after the seventh inning, so they don’t make that much money anyway, I don’t. I’m trying to think of all of the stuff you’re talking about. And whether it’s science or good fortune or good luck or just final negotiation for all the baseball people watching their sport, just sort of, at least in our market, a good team right now. And all of these other things conspiring at the same time. It’s, it’s made, it’s just made life better on the land, the pleasant living David Katz. That’s all I’m saying.

David Katz  23:04

It has indeed. And then you put on top of that, a team that is just supremely likable. There’s something about like aging veterans going through and having their last big win or, or kind of continuing to dominate. And that’s great when it happens with your city. But there’s something more special in those early moments. When you’re watching. Young players develop in front of your eyes achieve their dreams deliver the excitement, these homeruns celebrations and all these kind of quirky, silly little things, but these fun, these kids are doing their kids. Okay, their kids at this point. Sure.

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Nestor Aparicio  23:47

Did you feel bad about the beerbongs thing or were you okay with the boxing?

David Katz  23:51

I don’t care about the Bierbaum thing. It makes them happy. It’s fun. It’s fine. It’s great. Like, let these kids live. You’re gonna sit in the Birdman

Nestor Aparicio  23:59

the birdbath section? or No?

David Katz  24:03

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No, I’m getting one game. I’m gonna I’m gonna try to sit in as good a seat as I can possibly get my hands on. And I’ll be going with some people that I know will want to sit in some really good seats. So we’ll be sitting in the best seats we can get our hands on. But I will tell you it. It is it’s just fun. And that mlb.mlb.tv subscription that I had on for years and years and years and if turned off after Machado left and it looked like we were going to be rebuilding for five years. You know, it’s back on. We’re watching a lot of games. Although now I’m In Miami so I don’t get the benefit of starting these games at the end of my afternoon.

Nestor Aparicio  24:40

My broadcaster good Ben McDonald truly good at this. Yeah.

David Katz  24:43

Yeah. Look, every part of it. By the way, Jim Palmer was Jim Palmer is to me is still great. I still learn something about baseball. Every time I hear Jim Palmer Speak, speak about

Nestor Aparicio  24:54

this. It’s great to see him get reengaged too because he was falling asleep two years ago like everybody else. I mean, poor bike bordick I spent time with port bordick only called awful games for years and years and years board. It’s one of the best humans that I know he’s a credit to humanity. He’s a credit to the city’s a credit the baseball his credit to the organization, and certainly wasn’t bad at doing the games. You know what I mean? The games were bad. It’s hard to watch anybody in the sixth inning of 32 and 7014 in the middle of July, you know, like, that’s not that’s not a fair judgment on him. But the broadcasts are good. Ben McDonald’s good. The team is good. I don’t think the jersey thing’s good, you know. But, David, for you being the flyover in all of this game. What What are your media concerns, baseball concerns for growing this thing? Because you’re the kind of executive quite frankly, John Angelos can hire to come in and, you know, spice things up in some way with the digital side of things, because it’s what you do. It’s what you’ve always done at Fox and Yahoo, when you see it from afar. What this is the chance for all good ideas on deck, I guess, is what I’m saying. Because there’s so many things they they couldn’t do when they stunk that they couldn’t do now, like the birdbath thing, birthday thing and catching on when they’re losing 100 games, you know,

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David Katz  26:12

people are watching Major League Baseball is going to be at a major crossroads. And I don’t want to get to business focus right now. What do I need? I need to learn stuff. That’s why the demise, the quote, unquote, demise of the RS ns, the regional sports networks, you know, people don’t realize on the football side of things, they have national television deals, they’re gonna make $110 billion over the next 10 years locked and loaded, plus gambling, plus Sunday Ticket plus, plus, plus, because Brian ROLAP, Roger Goodell and the team that at the NFL are the best in the business at maximizing revenue out of the

Nestor Aparicio  26:58

NFL Draft. That’s all you have to do, which is literally, I think they ask themselves, what would Vince McMahon do? We’re doing that tonight? And they do that for four days?

David Katz  27:08

And look it? I watch and I watch every minute of it. Okay, I am sitting there

Nestor Aparicio  27:15

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when the playoffs are on in the NBA in the NHL when the Orioles are playing too, right.

David Katz  27:19

It is a year round experience. And I think there’s a lesson in this right they’ve taken the NFL, which was a seasonal and regional experience. And they have made it a year long national experience

Nestor Aparicio  27:33

worldwide. Why? What asked me do the same my wife’s lives in Germany. He was waiting to see what games are in Germany that you know, we have this London game now like up the Games in London. I’ve seen pictures.

David Katz  27:46

We What do you mean, we went out for Indian food after the game.

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Nestor Aparicio  27:50

I forgot everything that happened after that game. And I remember not being in a really good mood because

David Katz  27:54

that was the single worst game of any sport. You and

Nestor Aparicio  27:58

I spent that evening together because my wife didn’t even want to be near me. And you and I was dude. Can I apologize to you publicly for everything about that happened after that game that day? Because it was it that was a really bad day.

David Katz  28:15

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Yeah, you’re not we were together though. Man you through Leicester Square at

Nestor Aparicio  28:22

the Chinese food as I remember. That’s correct.

David Katz  28:25

I will tell you one thing. I was incredibly disappointed when I saw the schedule come out as someone who doesn’t live in Baltimore anymore. Because this is the least travel friendly schedule for a Ravens fan that they could have done I had already said they’re

Nestor Aparicio  28:42

gonna flex the games too. So even if you booked the travel to Arizona, LA or San Francisco, they can move you out of the game if they Lamar breaks his leg and week three, they will play primetime. You

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David Katz  28:52

know, I still have I still have a home in Los Angeles. I wanted to go to that charger game. As long as they didn’t have it around Thanksgiving. I was going to that charger game. When did they schedule it Thanksgiving. The other game that all my friends decided we were gonna go to is we want to go to Nashville. We wanted to experience the Nashville game the Titans ravens rivalry is still a good one. And that city would be fun. And it’s pretty central to get to. So of course that game goes and it’s going to be in London, and it happens to be in London on the weekend that I have an event and as you said God willing the Orioles might be in the postseason.

Nestor Aparicio  29:26

So why come on don’t talk like that. I just broke

David Katz  29:30

under promise and then over deliver

Nestor Aparicio  29:33

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might hold on. Got almost 20 games over 500 It’s It’s Memorial Day. They better not be any this would be an ish show. If somehow they win at four games meet stop. All right, there’s no way here’s the

David Katz  29:49

crazy thing they’re gonna have. As of now they have the second best record in baseball, and there’ll be a wildcard team.

Nestor Aparicio  29:55

Well, I don’t want to take we don’t have a top line

David Katz  29:58

start. We don’t Have, we don’t have the top top top line guy that a lot of these other teams have that can go out there and guarantee that you went

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Nestor Aparicio  30:07

October in August when when John has to throw money. And Elias has to get rid of a couple of the the gems in his collection in order to to win this year if their leverage went, but I want you to go back to football, but I’ll say this, but one thing that’s cheated from all of this is the right no pennant race. You don’t I mean, you’re either in or you’re out at this level, they’re good enough. I don’t think they’re going to be on any fence to you. If you play 600 ball, you’re going to be in the playoffs. You just are right. So they play 575 ball, they’re going to be at the like. So knowing that because they let more teams in. It does kind of there aren’t going to be big games in August. And so maybe they’re perceived as big because the Yankees or your whatever. But I but the thought that the old school pennant race thing happens, I don’t think I think that’s going to detract from it a little bit. Not a lot here, because people are going to be excited to go out there. But it’s going to be excited to be in a crowd again, that’s

David Katz  30:59

there for winning. It’s going to be about seating. At the end of the year. It’s going to be angling for where your seating and how many home games you’re getting. And Ken by the way, can we take Tampa were three games behind them. Can we take Tampa, like there’s there’s going to be stuff get baseball credit for that to expand. I’ve said and I’m totally not a traditionalist. I’ve said we ought to go to 100 game season or 120 game season. After all the status, we can have a much launch and have a much longer play off because that’s what where the money is and what people care about, and the excitement and all that stuff. But anyway, I’m looking

Nestor Aparicio  31:36

at the season and break Barry bond. Oh, that’s right. He doesn’t? Or does he have a record? I don’t know. David Katz is here. He is the postgame he is the Baltimore I’m gonna get back to football with you because you were getting your football Mojo going here on Lamar, because last time we got together, you know, it felt like the next time we got together wouldn’t be all this kumbaya y’all love and Lamar gets his money and shows up and happy. I mean, I want to ask you this, I’ll just cut cut to the chase. This is the this is the main Ken they went up, they get to win the Super Bowl with him. You can really think they’re gonna win. I mean, like you see him sign that’s great. Better to have them than not have him. Do you really think he’s going to win four huge football games in January be standing up to do that in the next three years? Because it kind of has to happen in the next three years? Because who knows? I mean, and how much money he’s making him what it’s going to make the team look like in 2627. Because we all live through that with Flacco mean, you take 20% of the capital. So are you a true believer that Lamar is going to beat Patrick mahomes and anybody else in his way?

David Katz  32:40

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Well, let me just say, I’m a realist. And to win a Super Bowl. Lightning needs to strike. The magic has to happen. Everything needs to break your way. I think we had a better team, the year that Lee Evans dropped the ball, and Billy Cundiff missed the kick. And I thought our window had closed. And yeah, maybe these guys would come back one final year. But why was so devastated at that moment? Because you know, how hard it is to get there. And the chances of getting back? How does that happen? Well, did we think Joe Flacco would channel Johnny Unitas and put together one of the great playoff streaks of all time? Do we think that Anquan Boldin would you know, make that that fourth down catch and

Nestor Aparicio  33:35

we’re dude, I always believed in Flacco, I always believed in him, he delivered he is the most hissed upon underappreciated hero in the history of ball sports. You know,

David Katz  33:49

I mean, fourth and 29. You know, I was at that

Nestor Aparicio  33:53

book on it, dude, I got you, man. So, look

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David Katz  33:57

at all of those. So do I think I think Lamar absolutely can do it? I think he can. I think so many things need to happen. And I think the sport is different. What Lamar allows you and this offseason has been a very different one, because we seem to have loaded up on offense in a big way and kind of shifted the balance of our span, despite the row Quan signing, which I love. But we’ve kind of put more into the offensive side, but I thought it was a very interesting strategy. That was very different than everyone else. Lamar could move the chains single handedly, he had a unique skill set. Patrick mahomes Everyone else needs people around him. Yes, they make people around them better, but they need people around him to make plays in a way that Lamar was single handedly able to put up 25 and a half points a game and move the chains and get enough first downs to keep us interesting in which case you’d say If your defense is good enough now, to keep people under 25 and a half points a game, you’re going to win a lot of football games, and you’re going to be in the playoffs and in the playoffs, anything can happen. So I didn’t mind that strategy. And we’ll see how the Ravens do and what I think has been a very untraditional offseason for Baltimore not just signing le marteau a big deal. But it will be J I don’t know. Ze flowers like clap one draft

Nestor Aparicio  35:27

mungkin let’s not forget the whole different philosophy.

David Katz  35:30

Monken is the biggest is the biggest thing because John’s not calling plays after play after play. It’s the guy sitting there up in the booth or on the sideline, wherever he’s going to do it. And I’m super excited to see what this guy can do. I think he’s the most important offseason move the Ravens have made. So how does he call a game? And does he get the guys in the flow. And to me, it’s all about unpredictability, we just became too predictable. We just kind of we would pack it in and you know, Lamar is either going, you know, off tackle right or off tackle left, but we pack it in defense in and you’re trying to get inches here and put the nose of the football there. And we saw how that worked. When you know Huntley tried to go over the pile on a weird call, like spreading it out. And taking advantage of all the width of the field and giving people space and then signing players or drafting players who are theoretically good in space with flowers and do Vernay and honestly, like there’s a lot of chess pieces here and can monk and put a plan together that makes it work. And let’s not forget who we really are like, we’re gonna throw more like, um, you know, I’m hearing Lamar say we’re gonna throw more, we might, we might throw more, five times a game more, which is a lot, you know, statistically, but they’re going to be running the football, okay, they’re going to be running it because we’ve got great running back. And we should have a pretty good line if everyone’s healthy. So I think the Ravens identity is going to still be hitch in the mouth. But we’ve got some players that I think you know, what’s the difference between a run and a screen passed as a flowers, or a sweep, or some of these things like they’re all variations of still the same theme for Baltimore. And I’m not an X’s and O’s expert. But I watch I watch a lot of football. And I think that Baltimore has been very good at maintaining its identity over the years. And I think that we’re going to continue to do it and what I love, you know, hardball is there’s a lot of consistency there. But hardball gives him credit. He he’s evolved as a coach, I think he’s evolved as his football philosophy, like even going down the Lamar Road, which saved his job, arguably, and seeing that it was working, and then doubling down and tripling down on it. And the use of analytics, even though will criticize him on fourth downs and all that stuff. He’s evolved as a football man from where he was when he came in and hired his dad’s, you know, offspring and kept them around too long. And the cam Cameron’s and all these guys, and he’s become his own man and he’s become has kind of created his own philosophy. And I think he represents the city incredibly well as in his role, as you know, the presidential figure that he is. So I think we’ve got a system I think Eric is more aggressive than Ozzy Let’s see if he ultimately has the magic of Ozzy not yet but he’s been willing to make moves like bringing row Quan in and you know, Earl Thomas in the past which worked for a little bit and didn’t work and others but look, I like the aggressiveness of the franchise. And I like our I like where we’re headed. And so I’m sorry for rambling here. We have as much of a chance as almost anyone other than Kansas City that I think has the chance just because they’ve got the best coach in football and the best quarterback in football and a scheme that works and players that they can plug and play that work. We’ll see what happens with the bangles when they got to pay Joe and they can’t pay everyone

Nestor Aparicio  39:24

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we talk about the Orioles right and i David we’ve been rarely David Katz is here He’s been our guest many many times cats man dude just go find a man on Twitter longtime executive and Baltimore on I’ve had a lot of people Cincinnati on you live in LA i Dude I have a picture you and me at the Super Bowl is the last Super Bowl will ever go to you and I have a picture together of the media section where all the cannabis was wafting in the upper deck of La SoFi stadium to the second half in the press box. There wasn’t a press box. It was kind of open air. You and I were there and you saw those Bengals fans come in and ain’t never had nothing right like Bengals fans like ever And now they’ve got this gold standard, right? You know, after years of Marvin trying to build it up in Carson Palmer and otro, cinco and they, they had a lot of smoke but not a lot of fire. That the question of competence to John angelos, who five minutes ago was in war with his brother in law lawyers always they’re at war with the National still with met, like they’re good at certain things. The Bengals have been good at making money and saving money that family, they’ve never really figured out how to run it. The Reds have always sort of run that town even when the red stunk for a generation. And Pete Rose can’t get in the Hall of Fame, but he can still get in any bar he wants in Cincinnati. The Bengals This is a real, that was a indictment, but it’s a moment of truth for the Brown family. And like it, it’s a moment of truth for the Angelo’s family that they didn’t they didn’t pass the Manny Machado test. They didn’t pass the buck show author test. They didn’t pass the Chris Davis test. They didn’t pass any of those tests, the Brady Anderson nepotism that they didn’t pass any of those tests. The Bengals have made a Super Bowl have a super duper player, and everybody’s waiting on them to pay him so that they can be a real franchise for the next 10 years. But Dave, I don’t know if you’ve been to Cincinnati lately. Those white jerseys. It is a sensation, the Bengals have been a sensation in Cincinnati over 18 months in the way that the Ravens were here after Superbowl 35 were their pop up tents and everybody’s buying purple. That’s Cincinnati right now, Baltimore could be that again, right? But the Bengals we have no confidence. To your point. It’s sort of like it’s like the Chargers signing Herbert, maybe they’ll sign him and move the franchise to London. I mean, that’s possible, right? But But signing these players, I don’t know why we ever doubted they would sign Lamar, when in the end, in the end, they had no choice and he had no choice. I mean, that’s really the way business went down is neither one of them had any choice. And the Ravens had no belly to string this out for five more months. And I guess he got enough money. I mean, he got what he wanted, right. He got everything he wanted.

David Katz  42:11

The deal worked for for both sides. At the end of the day, it may have been a marriage of convenience, but I think the economics are worth it. On both sides. By the way, quick aside, because on the left last time I was on, we talked about Lamar and and I gave him a lot of credit. You had his own mannerisms. People don’t may may not like the way he presents himself in certain ways, certain fashions and everything. But the guy and his mom delivered for his family. So at the end of the day, he may not have gotten everything you wanted. No one does in a negotiation. But Lamar got paid he did it without an agent. I felt

Nestor Aparicio  42:48

like he won the negotiation in my in my mind. He dug in and he got his bag he didn’t get a little bit of the bag he got I don’t see overcome it didn’t mean they all get what they get. But he’s won one playoff game lately. You stop you stop. He wants me. He’s not a sure thing. He hasn’t been on the field in three years after Thanksgiving. So that’s why I am I be called a racist lately. Imagine that right? Like, I mean, it’s crazy. How because I just, I don’t see every sign that he’s gonna win the Superbowl pounding, pounding the ground, the frustration level, he shows professionally, all of that. decisions he makes off the field. You know, having the kid in Pennsylvania get under his skin. When he didn’t even get it. I mean, just, I’m not convinced Lamar Jackson is going to win the Super Bowl. That being said, I’ll be at the parade if he wins, right? Like, I mean, good for him. But if you you’re asking me if I bet my money on it, I don’t think I would I really don’t. Based on what I’ve seen the body of work. I don’t 2019 MPP 2024. It’s a different cast, all of that being in and it’s a way, way different responsibility. It’s not that the responsibilities of the owners. What about the cats making 50 million a year? Alright, there’s some responsibility there too. And I, I’m not convinced these when he left the show me he could show me. He’s been doubted his whole career. And he’s shown a lot of guys like me that he can get his 180 $5 million for sure.

David Katz  44:25

Yeah. I think he’s, I think he’s a very grounded kid. And I think he Have you ever been in a tense negotiation? You’ve been an entrepreneur for a long time. I’ve been in corporate America for way too long. There are times when your deal is up, and you’re negotiating. And it’s easy to say you got to remain calm and you got this. In my case, I all I got to do is go in the office, take out my computer, type one computer, send out emails, make some phone calls, try to close some deals. I’m not doing win that in front of millions of fans. So he had this thing hanging over his head for two years. And he was expected to go out and these high pressure moments with media asking and fans asking and

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Nestor Aparicio  45:13

media, some some other, the guy who asked the tough questions got thrown out. I just want to make that really, really clear. And the press conferences and I’ll Sinatra Let the record show it because I was asking after he runs 21 times, whether that’s a good idea or not like I was the one guy who was willing to do that, you know,

David Katz  45:32

he lives on social media. You live on social media, that vitriol and the heat is so strong. So to ask you, I

Nestor Aparicio  45:41

am not a hater. I’m a realist novel quarterback who runs into linebackers professionally for the ability for that to be sustainable over the long haul. It has not been it just hasn’t been yet. It hasn’t been for any franchise in the history of franchises. It’s why he hit the market and nobody wanted to sink into under million dollars over the next three years to make him there guy like I don’t know what else there is to say I’ve talked to enough professionals that would say I don’t want my quarterback seeking contract like that. That seems to be a fundamental proposition that is lost upon some people in the Ravens community that just think well, they signed him he’s gonna He’s gonna win the Superbowl. I stand here and say he’s won one playoff game. Now that beat Cudi sure that they need to do a lot around him. Yes. And they have all that being said, that’s a diminishing aspect of his productivity in the coming years because ze flowers will have to be a superstar. Maybe he is and and that will have to happen quickly like it did for Andrews. Right. They’re going to need not only Humphrey to stay safe ro Quan Smith to stay safe Ronnie Stanley to wherever he is on his 30 year body. The word Jonathan’s Pinky Winky toe took him out of the game early, right. Like, they are pieces here that we’re all thinking. These are our 1215 $18 million football players. They all need to your point, be upright, functioning, Pivotal key, make big plays all that they need to do that clay is Campbell, you know what I mean? So I hear you. I’m just trying to examine this fairly based on what I’ve seen. I’m not anti Lamar, I roofer Lamar, he’s the most exciting player in the game. He has unlimited capable, I’ll give you all of that. Is he going to play 21 games and be upright and throw the ball 3035 40 times a game? And do it at the level that mahomes Does it or Allen or tick any of the guys that he’s going to have to be?

David Katz  47:51

8

The answer is no. He won’t. He won’t do it at that level. I don’t think that’s his game. But can he do it at a level that’s good enough to win playoff games and look, he he has proven an ability in clutch moments to have some incredible moments. And he hasn’t failed? Outside of some very bad two point conversions, which candidly, I’ll put on scheme. Like you go to the line. And it’s like, it’s so clear. What he’s going to do is it’s going to go one way and we need more creativity, we need more

Nestor Aparicio  48:31

care about that thing. And I’ve talked about this in season and I haven’t bothered with it in months. And I mean, let’s be honest, dude, the kid hasn’t played a meaningful game in three years, because he doesn’t play in November and December. So like, you could say, like, I sold through the pick the cost in the Giants game that was you know, like, I’ve seen him make bad plays. I’ve seen him walk on skates in Cincinnati and Cleveland and save the franchise and win games right? In October. Okay. I mean, it’s like the Wii. Nobody’s given the Orioles, the World Series in May, right? Because he ain’t seen him done it yet. Right. So for me with Lamar, the amazing thing is the inefficiency in the redzone. When that is your matchup your matchup is in short distance, nobody should ever be able to stop him because he’s got to step on everybody, theoretically, and that hasn’t in 18. And 19 was a hell of a theory. And 20 We had a plague and he didn’t take a shot. And next thing he and he’s not playing games in Pittsburgh, we’re playing on Wednesday morning. And like all of this happened. That’s him too. By the way, that’s, that’s adult that these are real things that happened. And the last two years I’ve seen not as much that leads me to believe that they’re going to win a Super Bowl that I should bet my money on and that he’s going to be upright and that he can do all of these things that we’re projecting him to do that we’ve paid him to do. We haven’t really seen him do. Maybe since 2019 other good news is you got better players this year, right? upright, and they would have been better two years ago if all the running backs they get hurt like and Ronnie Stanley’s need him blow out again in Las Vegas. And like, I, I give John and Eric all the credit in the world. And the last conversations those men ever had with me and probably will ever have with me, after long, long conversations that that they were so disappointed this time last year at the at the outcome, but at the injuries and all the injuries they had in that year. And that can’t be I mean, as we sit here right now, they are a playoff team there, you’re gonna win 11 or 12 games out here, all of that if Lamar is healthy if they run the ball, I’m an optimist about that. I would bet on that. I would bet on that right now. I don’t know that I’m betting on Lamar Jackson to win four games in January, February being

David Katz  50:52

the odds are the odds are that we will not win a Super Bowl in the next five years. That is just math. Ah, the odds are we will not?

Nestor Aparicio  51:02

Will so so you’re saying I just made a pronouncement on the air that can make me a genius just by being sort of lucky and Right. Right. Like because you are right. I mean, the chances of anybody winning it’s like the Astros for people in Buffalo.

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David Katz  51:17

Yeah, I mean, that’s exactly. That’s exactly right. But do we have a chance? Will we be in the conversation? Will we make the playoffs? Will we maybe have a home game? We’ll we will be I think the odds are are pretty good. That we will be with a real chance in mid January to do something. So and then it’s all about can the magic strike? Does the ball bounce your way? Do you get the PI call? Do you get the this do you get that? Like there is so much that has to happen for this? It is? It’s a miracle when it does. And you and I were at the miracle at Mile High. Let’s not forget

Nestor Aparicio  52:02

we have pictures together there. Okay, why have you on the show? We’re looking like real friends in real life. We like we like hanging out not just on Zoom. We live in.

David Katz  52:12

We’re gonna do our own crab cake tour when I’m in in town next week.

Nestor Aparicio  52:16

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We’ll take you out for scrap pick David Katz is here. We will be doing the Maryland crab cake tour next week we’re gonna be chance Bob in hell Thor. It’s all brought to you by our friends at the Maryland lottery will be ripped up that John’s not gonna be happy with me. Neither is Ross and I got the ticket a little. But we had winners the other day as well. We were up at the local and fallston highly recommend that you get up there get that chicken Sandow up there. Hang out with the with Lou and the folks up there had a great time at fancy Clancy on learning his life story. And we talked about beer and baseball and travel with fancy Clancy my friend Jay LMB also joined us from Safe Harbor travel. Che was the witness to the nasty naked run back when the first miracle happened, which was the team ever showing up here. So I talked about that at length that I did profess that I would run through the streets in my underwear from Hooters the balls, if we ever got a team we did get a team. I didn’t run naked because I was gonna get arrested. I did run in my tighty whities. There’s a lot of video evidence of that che lamb i think i His poor child. Poor Shawn. At that time who’s now like a grown man around the Maryland PR department. David can be found at the postgame he can be found at cats man do I can be found anywhere. There’s a good crabcake and if there’s a guy on Wednesday that looks like David that sit down at the ballpark for the afternoon game. It is David Katz. So hey man, enjoy the ballpark enjoy the holiday. I will see you at some point this week for some crabs. It’s been great catching up with you and this conversation might not have happened if the Orioles weren’t, you know what I mean? I’m reaching the like people that I don’t normally reach to in May in June because the Orioles are good and it’s awesome. Isn’t it cool?

David Katz  53:57

I can be your main guy can be your gym guy too. Well, I was a baseball let’s talk media. There’s a lot to talk about in media. We’ll do this all the time, Lester.

Nestor Aparicio  54:06

It would have been all ravens in May and June and July. Like it’s been for Wani three out of the 27 summers since they got here. So I am my name. My last name is Aparicio. I have a closet full of orange just waiting to be dusted off. Like all of you out there. Head back to the ballpark this week. Good fun around here. Big thanks to our friends and window nation for sponsoring the Marilyn crabcake tours. Well I have the floppy hat out 866 90 nation if it’s still may, you had about five minutes to take advantage of the buy to get through free deal and five years 0% financing better deal and they gave me last summer so take advantage of it before summer gets here. The weather’s good. The beer is cold. The baseball has been outstanding. Yeah, we are wn sta 1572 Baltimore. We never stop talking. Baltimore positive