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After 34 years of coaching in the NFL, when it comes to learning football we turn to old friends like former Ravens coach and 49ers head coach Mike Nolan to help us better understand the game. Time well spent here discussing defensing Lamar Jackson, the power of great ownership and the abilities of coaches to put the best players in a position to make impact.

Nestor Aparicio and former NFL coach Mike Nolan discuss the evolution of the NFL, particularly the impact of Lamar Jackson and the importance of player acquisition. Nolan emphasizes the significance of acquiring the best players and adapting schemes to their talents, citing the Baltimore Ravens’ success with Jackson as an example. He also highlights the role of ownership in selecting the right general manager and coach. Nolan, now coaching in the USFL, praises the Michigan Panthers’ success in developing players and coaches. They also touch on the upcoming Super Bowl matchup between the Kansas City Chiefs and Philadelphia Eagles, with Nolan predicting a close game.

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

charity initiative, NFL coaching, Lamar Jackson, defensive strategies, player acquisition, ownership importance, Super Bowl preview, coaching philosophy, player utilization, USFL coaching, Michigan Panthers, NFL adjustments, player development, coaching transition, football analysis

SPEAKERS

Speaker 1, Mike Nolan, Nestor Aparicio

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Nestor Aparicio  00:01

Welcome home. We are W, N, S, T. Am 1570 tassel, Baltimore. We are Baltimore positive. And this is going to be one of the great weeks of my young life. We are doing our biggest charity initiative. It’s my thing. It’s year two. It’s a cup of soup or bowl. It’s where this works is if you bring some canned goods, dry goods at any of our locations, next week, during Super Bowl week, we will give you a free cup of soup or bowl crab or cream of crab, and any of our locations. We began on Monday Acosta’s find out all that information at a Baltimore positive it’s all brought to you by friends at the Maryland lottery. I’ll have some monopoly scratch offs to give away, as well as our friends at wise markets. We’re always trying to do good deeds and feed folks. This guy has been doing good deeds for a long time. He’s now out of the club, I think, you know, like Johnson. Josh Johnson got this thing where he’s worn all these jerseys and been on all these teams. This guy’s coach in a lot of places. He now makes his home in Denver. He’s one of my all time favorite Raven former coaches and a former National Football League head coach, not an easy gig, and he looked really good in his dad’s suit. We welcome our defending champion and defensive coordinator extraordinaire, the one the only Mike Nolan back onto the program. You know, I used to do radio row every and we fly to New Orleans and wait for some hot shot like you to come by that likes me and knows me, and plops down for 20 minutes and talks about Patrick mus but I’m like, I’m just going to call all my friends this week and have them all on. And it’s so good to see you. You still look young. What are you golfing or something? What are you doing? Yeah,

Mike Nolan  01:30

don’t go that far. It’s good to see you too. But I don’t know about how good I look, but nonetheless. But Nestor, it’s great to be on with you. Great to see you again. It’s been a long time. We had a lot of good times together back in the day. It’s been a while, but anyhow, it’s nice to be on with you. Great. Well, you

Nestor Aparicio  01:44

lost the hair, but you have to smile, because you don’t have any of these pressures of tight ends dropping two point convert, or, you know, making challenges, or what happens and like, what is life? You know, after football, you’ve been involved in you’re still involved in the game. You’re still coaching, but the the vigors and what John Harbaugh and Eric DaCosta and everyone in these situations, including Zach gore and Dean Pease trying to pick up the pieces at the end of the season. You live that for a long, long time, including through the eyes of your father when you were a boy, right? Yes,

Mike Nolan  02:15

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I did. You know, it’s the NFL is a lot of fun. It was for many years. It was, I was in the NFL about 34 years. But did I tell you it takes a little bit when you when you depart it. I left in 2020 after the 2020 season. And it’s an adjustment. You know, when you do it for a long time, it’s, it’s quite the just like anybody, if they retire, whatever it is, it’s quite the adjustment. But, and there’s certain things you miss, but there’s some other things that definitely don’t miss that you know, like you said, it’s a, it’s a 12 months out of the year kind of a job, and there’s a lot of pressure by all on all these guys. And that still exists today. I do think it’s changed a little bit from from when you know, 30 years ago, what it is today. But nonetheless, it’s still, it’s still it’s still a lot of fun to watch, a lot of fun to be a part of. I’m sure, whether you’re covering a game or whether you’re involved in the game. But again, life is still good after very good as a matter of fact, yeah, I don’t

Nestor Aparicio  03:10

even know where to begin with you, because I could start with the Washington reconstruction, and certainly, let’s just start with the ravens, because that’s home base. Sometimes I wind up ending with them. We’ll get them a homes, and we’ll get to Josh Allen and all of that stuff. But for the Ravens. And you know, you have been in the league recently. You were in Dallas a couple years ago. We talked about the Dallas job and what’s going on there. And you, man, you’ve been linked to every one of these owners, every one of these general managers, so many of these coaches. You’ve coached with them, against them. You’re friendly with some, not some, like, you’ve been everywhere, man, you’re like Johnny Cash. Let’s start with Lamar and where you are in trying to beat Lamar late in your career and figure out defenses, because how much has he changed the game? And when they came in and Harbaugh was talking revolution, revolution, and now we see with another hall of fame, back the stresses that this can create to smart defensive minds like yourself.

Mike Nolan  04:08

Well, you know, when that, when they brought that college part of the game, which has been about 20 years ago, they brought that college part of the game with the quarterback, obviously, was running they, you know, everybody was trying to convert college quarterbacks who were runners into pocket guys, and that never was much of a success. You know, Michael Vick was a guy going way back that was trying to convert him, but they still allowed him to run from time to time. Lamar is, is, is a special guy because he’s, he’s so talented at the aspect of extending plays in the pocket or just being a threat as a run. You know, one of the things that that a guy like Lamar gets, that people don’t really realize when you’re watching the game, is Lamar doesn’t see all the exotic defense that most quarterbacks see. So when he lines up a lot of times, he’s going to get a 3d or some kind of an eight man box, which is going to show coverage really fast. What’s. Makes it very easy for the quarterback to know who to throw to. And so like I said, he’s not going to see four rushers from a side very often things like that, just because, if you do it because of his legs, he’s going to he’s going to blow it apart. You’re not going to feel good about your call. So one of the things, because of the type of player he is, that a fan can at least watch now is, is, like I said, you don’t see a lot of exotic defensive calls against him keeps this game simple. It allows him to function in the passing game easier than a lot of quarterbacks, but also it allows him to use his legs at times and and the way to stop him. Obviously, I thought the best plan I’ve seen against him was a year ago. I think it was a championship game when Kansas City played for the ravens, and I thought that Steve spagno did a great job of getting them into passing situations and then doing nothing more than rushing three guys and just spying the quarterback and forcing Lamar just to stay in there and be a one dimensional quarterback. And one dimensional obviously, what I mean by that is he can’t run anymore. It’s just going to stay in the pocket. So when it comes to Lamar, he’s very special, very unique, very talented, very good, very hard to defend. Because look, you can have all the great schemes in the world, but when it gets right down to it, the better players are going to players are going to win. And, well, I should say, win the down, maybe not the game, but win the down and, and Lamar is a great example of that. He has an awful lot of wins, whether they won the game or not. He himself has a lot of wins within the game because of his talent and and it starts, really, in my opinion, with his legs, not with his arm. He’s got a good arm, but it’s not without the legs. It’s, you know, it’s not as much.

Nestor Aparicio  06:38

Mike Nolan’s here, and I learned more in five minutes talking to people like you, you said something that I don’t know, that I’ve ever heard anybody say in 33 years of doing this, winning the down, win the down. And I guess when it comes down to it, that’s the game. The game is winning the down and the Ravens. And I’ve said this, but I’ve never used it in that term. You just taught me something that I’ll probably use the rest of my life, because that’s the way it works. The way it works. That’s why we call them wise conversations. Thanks, wise markets. But winning the down is something in 18 and 19, even when they transition, when you were still in the game, you may have even played against us, like lose track of where you were in those years, and you know who you’re what. Some years you came in with guys that couldn’t play, and you were the coordinator of beans. Some years you had the best players, you know. So I mean, you went through a lot in that way, and you always know the difference as well. But when they had Mark Ingram, they were in second and one and second and two and second and three all season long, all night long, and they just beat your ass if you’re putting me in second and one and one and second and two all night long, because you’re winning first down, winning first down. And I I said winning first down a lot about them over five or six years. And that’s the thing that Derek Henry and this running attack early in the year, when they’re not in first and 25 because they do something stupid on first down or jumping off, I mean, all of the motion, most penalized team in the league, and that, in the end, is going to be the story for me, is mistakes, not necessarily penalty, but just mistakes that they made. They made too many mistakes for being as talented as they were, and that’s why they’re not playing football next week in New Orleans. But the winning, the down, my God, first down, especially. But as I’ve said, If they don’t win first down, they come back Second down, and they’ll get nine on that one, and then they’ll get themselves into third and four, and if they don’t make it, no problem, they’ll go on fourth and two or fourth or three from anywhere on the field. So they bought themselves a 25% more chance, just because they’re going to go on fourth down, if you’re playing blackjack. But the whole notion of winning a death, they only have to win one out of the four downs, and they move the chains on you right, literally. But if they

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Mike Nolan  08:45

got a first down after first down, no question. But you’re right. It’s the winning the down is we’re looking in a in a player’s mind. That’s where you want their mind anyway. You want it to be on the down. You don’t want them thinking way ahead as a coordinator or a play caller. You’re thinking ahead, because that’s your job. You know, you’re after you make a call, you’re kind of thinking, okay, if I’m if I’m behind the chains, here’s what I’m doing. If I’m headed the chains, here’s what I’m doing. And and then you also have to think about your players. You know, one of the real great blessings of being on a good team is you typically have really good players, and it’s fun to be a coordinator and call players when you have really good players, because you could call something bad, which I did several times, and it was like, Oh, my God, look at work. And you’re thinking, somebody pat you on the shoulder, says that was a great call. And you yourself, know, no, not really. I said, Thank goodness we had that man. I can remember that when I was at Baltimore as a defensive coordinator for many years, or for three years, anyhow, when I was there where, you know, I call something, I think I’m kind of cringing a little bit. And sure enough, Ray and Ed and and Deon, or whoever else was out there would, would make it a good play. And I think, Yeah, boy, that was, you can call anything up here that works. But as the quarter on the offensive side, getting back to Lamar, he does, he makes, he he does a, he does a great job of moving the chains. And he is a. Player that has a play caller. You can feel very comfortable if the first one was unsuccessful, I still got a chance for this next one, although it might be second and very long or even third and long to make it work, and if the defense isn’t, isn’t paying close attention to Lamar. Look, Lamar can run for it on a third and 10, when you’re back to thinking I got the perfect situation, third and 10, and Lamar will run for it. You know, as you drop everybody back to coverage and think that’s a coverage down, he’ll, he’ll, he’ll change the chains real fast for you. So he’s, he’s a, he’s a remarkable guy and a great talent, and certainly a, you know, he carries the, he carries the load for the ravens, quite a bit on offense. So

Nestor Aparicio  10:36

I’m going through your resume here because I’m trying to figure out where you were in the Lamar chain, or whether you saw him in New Orleans or Dallas at the end, or any of that stuff. But I’ll say this the first they drafted him, and we still had Flacco, and that was the year Ray went into the hall of fame. And I took five bus loads of people out to Canton, and they played when they, I think they were cheese boarding the ground. There’s before they fixed the stadium up and like all that out there in Canton, and they got that whole campus going on at the Hall of Fame there. And his first game, it’s that first crazy preseason game. They played the bears because Urlacher went in. It was a bears ravens game, completely forgettable July, you know, whatever it was, preseason game. And he ran in the linebackers, and I’m like, up on the roof with Luke in the press box, a little rickety High School press box up there, and I’m watching number eight run run into linebackers. And I’m like, no, no, no, we can’t have this. And I’m thinking, How about guys like you? I mean, Billick would come on, I think you were at ESPN for five minutes, and then I think you would come on here and said, I don’t know about my quarterback running into linebackers, I think that that was as much an issue as pocket awareness, reading defenses, being able to operate in the pro all like all of that for Lamar was just sort of like, I don’t want my quarterback seeking contact. And I’m astonished this far into it that it’s worked out as well. But I do remember Peyton Manning, at the end, turtling up, that there are protection things, and then there’s just a general protection of the league’s not real serious about protecting quarterbacks in this era that you can get away with stuff that maybe Steve Brogan couldn’t or Steve Young couldn’t get away with a generation ago.

Mike Nolan  12:15

Yeah. Well, that the NFL had to adjust when the quarterbacks became running players. If you remember, they had the thing where the quarterback, were you coming off the read option, and you couldn’t, you know they were the same Where’s, where’s the area where we can hit the quarter? In other words, when is he a runner and when is he not? Because sometimes that was the action on a play action pass. So you’d come through and you’d bury the quarterback, and that that action was not the triple option or the or the read zone read. It was simply the fact he was play action pass. So they’ve had to do some things to protect the quarterback as well. But you’re right. When you have a quarterback that runs like that, I think one of the things that I’ve noticed in the game that the quarterbacks themselves, if you remember about 1015, years ago, a quarterback sliding was not what they did. I mean, if it was only every now and then and a lot of times they’d get criticized for sliding, because it

Nestor Aparicio  13:01

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was considered not macho, right? John Elway didn’t slide. You

Speaker 1  13:05

know what I mean Exactly. People say, ah, take a hit. You know, look at him. He’s quivering. He’s going down. But no, it would be

Nestor Aparicio  13:12

a thing. Like, you don’t do that in front of your teammates. They get hit. You can’t, you know? Like it was be a man, right? Like, literally, it’s the game, right? That’s right,

Mike Nolan  13:19

it is. But nowadays, you know, that’s that. So it has that encouraging. That is actually a very good thing, because the quarterbacks are going down, they’re sliding and, and I think it’s a really good

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Nestor Aparicio  13:29

and they’re still playing in January. Mike, yeah, that’s why we had compelling football this month. It’s because five of the top 10 quarterbacks weren’t unavailable, right? Oh,

Mike Nolan  13:38

yeah. Well, you’re exactly right. I said to my wife, we were talking about the game and who’s going to win this and that going to win this and that, and I I said, you know, everybody’s got a quarterback, so everybody’s got a chance in these in these two weeks. I mean, look at the Washington red scars, and look at that young guy, uh, Daniels. I mean, what a difference he has made for that football team. I mean, he’s so fun to watch. I enjoy that guy. But again, all all the teams, all the four teams this past weekend had a quarterback and actually going into the Super Bowl to be the same way. But, you know, protecting the guy is really important, and I think the NFL has done a good job of that. The players themselves have done a good job of that. So Lamar and his style of playing, he’s able to function, you know, and stay healthy all the time. What I think the biggest danger he has is when he does those forward flips going into the end zone on a touchdown on his own. I think those those, they need to back. He needs to back off a lot of those. One of these days he’s going to land on his back and think, Oh, I’m getting a little older than I used to be. Well,

Nestor Aparicio  14:30

Mike Nolan is here. He’s staying young, and he is at Denver, Colorado, living the Rocky Mountain High Life. And yeah, you were coaching in in in the USFL for a minute, right? You had good things going on there that must be interesting for you at coaching these kids at the highest level. Now, there’s Senior Bowl in college and scouting and things that you would do and watching tape of maybe lower level football in a Delaware Towson game or something like that, to recruit players. But doing this job at where you’re. Coaching players that are of a different level of trying to get to a different level that must have been interesting for you at the end, in the same way that maybe going back coaching a high school team, or I had Mike Flynn on recently, one of our compatriots, who’s coaching kids. And I think, you know, balls, ball, but I think there’s a level when you’ve seen it, the speed and the level you’ve seen it at, that it is a little different when guys are trying to make it right. Yes, it

Mike Nolan  15:21

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is. And I tell you what, it’s completely a give back situation for me. I mean, I enjoy it a lot. Everything about it is trying to help the players get back into the NFL or get in there first time, if that be the case, same thing with the coaches. Got a lot of coaches that would like to coach the NFL, so it’s a great opportunity for me to it’s a feel good all the time, because that’s all we’re really doing. Look, we’re trying to win. We play 10 games, but games, but in the process, you’re trying to develop these guys and give them an opportunity to get back in the NFL. And our our team, the Michigan Panthers, has done a very good job that we got a very good general manager, Steve Case our and he’s done a really good job of getting guys opportunities to get back in the league and things like that. So it’s an entirely different for me. It’s an entirely different what I want to say my the things that I’m trying to accomplish are not about me anymore. They really aren’t. It’s, it’s, it’s a give back and and it’s a lot of fun doing it, because we have had a lot of players get the opportunity to go back in the NFL. So that’s that’s really the biggest success, other than winning football games. We’ve been in the playoffs last two years. Haven’t won a playoff game yet, but we’ve gotten to the playoffs, and it’s just been a lot of fun working with them. But it’s a it’s a great I think it’s a great thing and a great league, and I think it’s something that’s needed for the NFL. We’re basically a farm league to the NFL, in my opinion. That’s what we are. We’re trying to that’s what we’re trying to do with our guys

Nestor Aparicio  16:41

well. And I remember first time Marvin Lewis ever had me in his office. He put this big three ring binder down on my desk with the big rings back in 1996 and it was a Pittsburgh Steelers linebacking. It was the book because he had just come from there, and he opened the book said, What do you know about football? I looked down and said, apparently, not much. So, you know, but he always in the beginning, and Jim Schwartz was his, you know, assistant in the room at the time. We would sit over brown bag lunches in that little office at the top of the steps in the old facility where I met you. I think when I met you, Marvin’s the one that introduced me to you in the comment series. I remember the minute I met you, um, and in Marvin’s office up there, he would say, you know, all this about coaching and this and that, that we’re teachers. What if this is a classroom you’re going to find the football as a classroom setting, and then you take that, what you learn out onto the field, but it is mainly classroom. It is, it is a lot of learning and perceptual learning and time where you’re not a coach, motivating or, as Rex Ryan would always say to me after you left, and he and pet took me on, we don’t coach effort around here, you know. And so that’s pretty good, Rex. So, you know, we don’t coach effort, you know, you coach, you teach, you teach, and say, This is wrong, this is right. This is the correction on the tape. This is the, you know, like all of that. So I would think at the heart when you leave the environment of we gotta win. We’ve gotta win. There’s money on the line. There’s all of that. It becomes a teaching environment for you at the end, right?

Mike Nolan  18:10

Yeah. And it’s really refreshing, believe me, it’s a lot of fun. It lasts about four months from start to finish with training camp and all. But it is very refreshing, just because everybody, like all the guys that are there, you don’t. You don’t have to, well, as Rex kind of said, you don’t really have to coach them into working hard. Because why would you be in our league? You know, you’re not making the big bucks like the NFL guys. Why would you be in our league if you’re really not going to give it your all? And so, you know, so, like I said, it’s, it’s the guys we coach want to be there. They worked extremely hard. They’re trying. They got a goal in mind of trying to get to the NFL. Most all of them, and some of them just like playing ball, but for the most part, a lot of them would love to get that shot again, which a lot of them do, and so that’s what makes it a lot of fun. But it’s just, it’s a different it’s a different league than the NFL. And I think, personally, even with college, the way it is now, I think our League’s the best thing going. If you want to coach, our League’s the best thing going. It really is, and the and even some of the rules, I don’t know if we ever get into that, but we’ve got some rules in our league, from the officiating to things like that that, I think are, you know, if the NFL wasn’t so hard headed about doing things that weren’t their idea, they would, they would adopt a lot of things that we do because it makes the game a lot more fun to watch, in my opinion,

Nestor Aparicio  19:27

ship the football so we can figure out what the hell a first down is that would make life a lot better for the gamblers as well. Mike Nolan is here, long time, defensive coordinator, head coach, friend, good human joins us from Denver, which we appreciate. Alright, so you’re done in the NFL. You don’t I mean, nobody’s going to call you. I mean, I

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Mike Nolan  19:45

don’t have any I have no I like what I’m doing. I really do. I like I’m doing. We have 10 grandkids, so when I’m not coaching the four months they the other eight months, I get to help with the kids

Nestor Aparicio  19:56

and all of you guys. Man, Marvin, Brian, you’re all obsessed with. Grandkids, every one of you, every one of you. I know

Mike Nolan  20:02

they’re the best. I’m telling you. Like I said, we have 10 little ones. I have seven of them. We’re in 15 minutes of us. And so we get to see him on a daily basis. And it’s, it’s a real pleasure. Now, I will say I can only last about two or three hours when I’ve got energy, but after that, I gotta say, Alright, we’re done. Go back to mom and dad. I’m

Nestor Aparicio  20:21

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well, you know, I mean, for all of you who’ve done this your whole life and don’t know anything else, and I gave Marvin a hard time. He came with me, with the Raiders, with the team I knew couldn’t win. He probably, deep down, knew he couldn’t win either. And He came into town week two, we went out and had a meal, and I’m like, really and, and it’s just sort of like, this is what I do, man, I like, I don’t like golf all day, like Billy’s doing now he he didn’t want to go off, and now that’s all he wants to there has to be somewhere where you throw your energy into stuff, and grandkids are as good as anything. All right. So now you’re at a league. You don’t want to jump. Let’s talk ownership. The you mentioned Jaden Daniels, and you mentioned culture change, and you sat at the front of this in San Francisco, where you were trying to do it, and then, you know, Jim Harbaugh came in on the back end with a lot of your players and wound up going to a Super Bowl. And there’s, there’s times in space and places for everything. You’ve been so many places as well as you can on the air. Give me your perception of the changes of I mean, you know very well, I’m a real media guy. You perceive that John Harbaugh has told people that, and I’m not anymore, so therefore I’m not. I see the changes in the league and all of this, but even mark Andrew not coming to the podium lens, just things that wouldn’t have been that way 25 years ago, but also ownership and how important it is when you were the guy getting the vanilla ice cream dumped all over your desk by the creepies over in London that people can read about, but all these years later, they have managed to Dan Quinn, a guy I’m sure you respect immensely, has gone in there pretty quickly that competence can take over and things, things change. It’s all cyclical, but ownership so important. I mean, it just, it is, it was everywhere you ever were.

Mike Nolan  22:03

It’s important because that’s where it all starts. And I think the first I’ll say this, that the most important decision the owner is going to make is his first decision, and that is who he’s putting in charge of the football team. I think that’s the most important thing he does. Because outside of that, I don’t think he’s competent to do anything else. They’re not competent to coach. They don’t know football. They’re not competent to pick players. They don’t know players. They don’t know any of that. So if they can just do one thing, and that is pick the guy that can do those things, if nothing else, pick the guy that can, pick the guy that’s going to pick the players. Players are the most important thing as you look across the league. Nobody wins without players. They don’t. There’s not a team that has one will win, or anything that doesn’t have players. So therefore, the person that’s in charge of that is the most important one. I’ll give you a great example that’s currently just going on, and that is Detroit Lions. I mean, their general manager, Brad Holmes, I believe, is his name, has done a remarkable job. They got good players. So the next thing in line is coaches. And if you can get some good coaches to coach those players, you’ll be fine. But it starts with players. It doesn’t start with coaches. And coaches are second to the player, so the successful football teams, that’s what you see. Baltimore is probably the best example that I could give in the last 30 years or 25 years, for sure that that’s what it’s been. I mean, Baltimore has consistently done a great job with players, and we’ll continue whatever it is, they set in place with Ozzie Newsome when he did it. That’s what made them run. I think that’s the thing that Detroit kind of impresses me a little bit right now. The way they’re doing it reminds me of the Baltimore a few years back, because they immediately got in there, got a lot of good talent. They didn’t waste any draft choices when they picked up some free agents from other teams. They did a smart job. That’s, that’s, to me, the thing that the owner needs to do when he goes in. Because, other than that, the owner has no competency in owning a football team. They have not as far as what’s on the field. Now, the business part of it, that’s their deal. Do it. Jerry Jones is a great example of done a phenomenal job on the business side, but not a very good job on the football side. And that’s, and that’s the proof. Is all there, if you watch them. But once they do name somebody, whether it was, matter of fact, if I if you go back to Baltimore again, when bashati named Ozzy, because Ozzy was not a general manager until bashati named him, that gave him that job, that was, that’s what started the whole thing for Baltimore, in my opinion, and it’s the same today. So when you do it, when you when that when the owner comes in, we’re talking about owners. The first thing, if they can hire a very good general manager who knows how to pick players, or knows how to pick a personnel guy to pick players and put that staff in place, that’s the key. That’s more important than picking the coach. Look, I was a coach, and I can tell you without a doubt, in my mind, the second thing is, Coach not the first thing. The first thing is getting best players. Any coach would love to play good would love to coach good players. And like I said, Show me a coach that doesn’t have good players, that’s successful, and I’ll and I’ll change my mind, but it doesn’t exist. The coaches enter in the Hall of Fame. They had good players, and most all of them had a quarter. Back. Joe Gibbs might have been the only one that did it with three different quarterbacks winning Super Bowl, and he’s rare, but nonetheless, they were good players. So again, Owner, whoever picks the players, whether that’s the general manager or somebody he picks and then the coach, I think that’s the way you build it if it’s going to be any good.

Nestor Aparicio  25:18

Well, Mike, I would say for the Ravens here in praise of the Costa and Harbaugh and what they’ve done in recent years. And you can read my personal thoughts about all that on the other side, but the way they’ve evaluated talent. And Eric, when he was speaking to me, would always say, you know, it’s not it’s part art, part science. There’s no like vibe on whether this kid, a is going to stay healthy, whether he’s going to get better and improve, and want to be that guy, and you all go to great lengths, not you as the coaches, but these scouts bring you players and say, cut up tape on tape. Is this a kid we want the fourth round to be my wheel linebacker? Whatever it would be that you’ve done that for a lifetime, but you’ve been around people who are really good at it, like Eric or and other people, and in other organizations that they bring you players, and you’re like these just, you know, they’re just not good enough players, right? Like, to that point where is that thing that an Eric Acosta would have, or scouts would have, being a great Scout to be able to and then the organization to take Lamar on, specifically Lamar, and say, we’re going to zig while everybody else is zagging. We’re going to do everything different. We’re going to have crackdown wide receivers like, you know, Willie, whatever his name was. Then they brought him in. He caught eight balls. But man, could he block from Mark Ingram? Right? So they, they, they brought players in, an offensive lineman, that compliment what they’re doing. That is a system that in most places you ever were employed, you didn’t spend a lot of plate, a lot of time in a lot of places, 345, years, you get that chance, and it gets blown up that there’s never really a philosophy. It’s more like, let’s just get a guard. Let’s just get just get a tackle. Let’s get the best tackle, not the one for the system we’re trying to employ. Because you don’t even know what your system is. You’re just trying to keep your

Mike Nolan  27:10

job. You know, you bring up a great point, because I think it’s one of the most important things. And majority, the majority, strong majority of player of teams, in my opinion, don’t do it. And that’s this, I can remember, when I was at Baltimore. I’ll just say it simply. And Ozzy was somebody communicated with quite a bit when I became the coordinator there. Is there about getting the very best player. First, get the best player. I can remember Ozzy bringing guys into me for film, and he’d say, look at Mike. This is a really good player. Or he’s a kid that I like. I’m interested in. He’s intriguing to me. I want you to watch the tape of him. I want you to tell me where you think he belongs. Where would he fit, you know, how can you use this guy? And it was more, how can you use this guy, rather than, does he fit your scheme? Now, that might have been said a little bit, but I think if you’re going to be any good at all in the NFL as a coach, and last, you’ve got to be a coach that knows how to utilize players, not say, I got a system and that guy fits. If there’s a mistake that I hear said over and over again, it’s he doesn’t fit our system. Look at when the Baltimore Ravens took Lamar Jackson, who did you say the quarterback was before him? Joseph Flacco, okay, what are the comparison? Do you think those two guys have anything at all in common as players, other than they play the position? None, none. So when they brought Lamar in, they were willing to say, look it, we’re going to adjust what we do, because this guy is electric and really good, and we’re going to find out what he could do, and then we’re going to do what he does, and not stick him in a pocket and make him learn how to do the West Coast offense or something else, which would have been just stupid to do. They brought him in, and they brought in an offensive coordinator that knew how to utilize his talents, and that’s that’s what they did. So they put the player and the talent before the scheme, as they call it. Look, there’s some good schemes in the NFL, but if you’re a coast that’s worth anything, you want the best player first, and then let me find out how to use them. As opposed to, hey, I need that pocket guy. You end up with a guy that’s a fat, old guy sitting in the pocket that that’s really not any good, and you just passed up on Lamar Jackson. Why? Because you said he doesn’t fit our system. Baltimore doesn’t do that. I mean, when it comes to defensive players, same way. That’s why we transitioned into the three, four way back when I first got the job, and Marvin had left and and I became a coordinator, and Rex was a D line coach, by the way,

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Nestor Aparicio  29:38

I don’t want to interrupt you, but that was incredibly controversial, and even Ray didn’t like it, right? Like, literally in the beginning, right? Yeah, it

Mike Nolan  29:45

was, it was whatever. But we did incorporate a little bit of the three four to utilize some of the peripheral players. But we had to still, what we did is we, we it was kind of the hybrid three four at the time, because we had to play some of what Ray. Just came out of plan, because it was so successful. Why junk it? You know, I’m saying so we did use it, but the little part that we had to add in now, it became one of their favorites, because it was so exciting, where guys were doing different things, and you had Ed Reed brick listen off the side and going from the line of scrimmage to cover the deep middle, things like that. We had a lot of really fun things for the players to do. But you’re right, at first, it was a it was an adjustment, because it wasn’t what they had done, and they had been very successful. So we were really doing, as you remember, we cut a lot of those players that were part of that Super Bowl team back in the day, and so we had to start over. And it was, it just wasn’t built for exactly what they had been doing. But nonetheless,

Nestor Aparicio  30:39

well, you didn’t have goose and Sam Adams in the middle. And you know what I mean? Like it was done, right? We had Kelly, Greg,

Mike Nolan  30:44

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who was, by the way, just one of the toughest people I’ve ever been around. But again, I say this a good what you what the Braves do well is they go after the best players, and they try to utilize their skills at least. That’s what I perceive as at least. That’s the way it was back in the day, it was, let’s go get the best player. You coaches figure out how to use them, and we’ll continue to have good players on our football team and continue to win. That works. If you go after somebody that fits your scheme. You know what you do, you got to be really careful now. Now you can compliment what you already do. Don’t get me wrong, but if you’ve got a I’ll say this the tight end that was at Georgia last year. That was probably one of the best players in the league this year, that played for the Raiders. I mean, look how many teams passed on that guy. He might have been one of the top two or three players in the draft, and teams consistently passed on that guy. That guy was a phenomenal I’m certain people said he didn’t. Doesn’t fit what we do. Well, if a good player doesn’t fit what you do. You need to be gone, in my opinion. I mean, it’s that. It’s that harsh. I mean, there’s not time to wait around for you to get the guy you want, because that may never happen if he never sitting there in the draft when we want him, you know, and then we gotta go pay a ton of money to get him from another team. That’s not how it works. There’s a great player going to, you know, get the Great, good players and then, you know, figure out how to use them again. That we started this whole Kyle

Nestor Aparicio  32:07

Hamilton would be the example here in Baltimore, where they got this really special kid. They had him up on the line of scrimmage, and they’re getting their ass beat in the back, because they thought they spent a lot of with Marcus Williams and Eddie Jackson on the back end. Then they moved Kyle HAMILTON To the back. He’s great at that too, and that tightened things up enough for them to win four ball games in the playoffs for five A and they won five in a row.

Mike Nolan  32:26

Yeah, but again, that’s that’s what it’s about. I’m telling you. It’s about players. It’s about getting the best players. It’s not about recruiting guys to escape again. Right now, the Ravens can do some of that, getting guys to fit in what they got, because they’ve got a lot of really good players that they haven’t passed on and put them together and created a hell of an offense. Even on the defensive side, they’ve got very good talent. They do an excellent job with the players they always have. It’s it’s utilizing what they do, not not the other way around. That’s a mistake that many teams make. Big mistake.

Nestor Aparicio  32:57

Got the best guest in the city this week. I didn’t have to get on a plane and get out of New Orleans, although I would like some benis and some emeralds, but I will plan that at another time, maybe Jazz Fest. This guy and I have gotten together in various places. He is still kind enough to join me and bring his wise wisdom into what we do. Mike Nolan, longtime defense coordinator and head coach in the National Football League, and now sunning himself in Denver for the winter. And you know, I hope at some point we get together in the same place at the same time, and certainly steak dinner Denver before a show at Red Rock sounds like a great way to spend at some point. Hey, now I’m always thinking, Mike, you know this, um, thanks for your time, and always, and for all of you old folks who spend time with me, now that I’m becoming an old folk and talking football, we still love the game, right? Like, this is a great Super Bowl. These are two great teams. I mean, I know your affinity for Andy, Reid, spagnolo all the way around. What’s going on this is, this is a great football game we have coming up next week, right? Oh, it’s

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Mike Nolan  33:52

excellent. I think it’s, I think it’s really good. It’s gonna be exciting to watch. It’s gonna be a close game too. It’ll be like you said, Andy and Spags are kind of the the I personally think they’re the two best coaches from from a head coach, coordinator aspect. I mean, they

Nestor Aparicio  34:06

don’t hope in there too. Let’s hope be the best special teams coordinator. Who’s that? Dave tob, put him. Put him in there too. But

Mike Nolan  34:12

again, they’ve got a great staff. They’ve got very good players. Got probably not one of the best quarterbacks, if not the best in the league. They just got a lot of really good things going. But I love the way they’re coached. I love the way they work. They’re a very professional organization. Everything about that club is really, you know, and Andy’s the head of the whole thing. It’s fun to watch, and I do. I enjoy watching Steve Spagna as well. I think Steve does an outstanding job. Game plans very well every week, gives his guys a chance to win the game, uses his players really well. It’s going to be a lot of fun. Now, Philly, on the other side, is a very tough, physical football team. Now they, they bring it there. It’ll be interesting to see. And they, obviously, they’ve got good coaches as well. Vic does a nice job on defense overall. I give the advantage to Kansas City, but it’s going to be a really good game. I just think, because of the quarterbacks, because of the coaching and the. Game, the best two teams are there. You know, I would love to sing Detroit. Obviously, we’re the Michigan Panthers, and so I love our home team in the in the lions, but look, they missed their opportunity. You know, I was, as everybody that fan was disappointed when they lost the Redskins. But that’s the way it goes. So as it stands right now, I think the best two teams are clearly in the Super Bowl. And it should be a great game, really, should it? It’ll be. It’ll be a good game.

Nestor Aparicio  35:24

Yeah, for your people in Detroit, it’s tough to overcome the injuries. It really, I mean, it sounds, excuse me, and I can make that, and Campbell can’t, and they can’t, but it’s very unfortunate to the year when they had talent enough to win much like here, they had talent enough to win here, and didn’t catch the ball in the end. Mike Nolan is out, and then remember, let him get back to doing whatever He’s 10 grandkids, I’m sure you’re busy out there. Take him up on the ski slips way up. Billy does up in Park City. Everybody. I’m going to be out doing a cup of Super Bowl during Super Bowl week. We have so many guests this week. The aforementioned Joseph Vincent Flacco of Super Bowl MVP fame will be joining us here this week as well. Jamal Lewis, we have some other friends coming on. There’s a big festival going on down at the stadium that Verizon is doing on Super Bowl Game Day. I think my wife and I might be heading down to that, because it might be some fun. My wife’s a long time Verizon employees. Well, so big thanks to Verizon for supporting that here in the city and get folks downtown on Super Bowl Sunday, even if it’s not a purple party. Hi, I’m Nestor. We are W, N, S, T, A, M, 1570 Towson, Baltimore, and we never stopped talking Baltimore positive.

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