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As one of many Pro Football Hall of Fame voters weโ€™ll have on Baltimore Positive this month, NFL historian and author Jason Cole returns to discuss the candidacies of Marshal Yanda, Terrell Suggs and Steve Smith Sr. as well as what the Ravens need to do to make the next step from January into February. And, of course, the Chiefsโ€™ attempt at the unprecedented three in a row in New Orleans.

Nestor Aparicio and Jason Cole discuss the NFL, focusing on the Kansas City Chiefsโ€™ dominance, particularly their three consecutive Super Bowl appearances. Cole highlights the Chiefsโ€™ impressive execution and minimal mistakes, noting their statistical underperformance but game-winning strategies. They also discuss the Philadelphia Eaglesโ€™ success, crediting their balanced offense and defense. Cole praises the Eaglesโ€™ head coach Nick Sirianni for his motivational style. Additionally, they touch on the Baltimore Ravensโ€™ potential, emphasizing the need for Lamar Jackson to reduce mistakes. Finally, they address the Hall of Fame prospects of Terrell Suggs, Marshal Yanda, and Steve Smith, with Yandaโ€™s impressive resume being particularly noted.

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

Super Bowl radio row, NFL insider, Hall of Fame voters, Patrick Mahomes, Kansas City Chiefs, Lamar Jackson, Baltimore Ravens, Derek Henry, Philadelphia Eagles, Saquon Barkley, Mark Andrews, media accountability, Hall of Fame prospects, NFL coaching

SPEAKERS

Jason Cole, Nestor Aparicio

Nestor Aparicio  00:01

Welcome home. We are W, N, S, T am 1570 task Baltimore. We are Baltimore positive. We are positively doing a cup of soup or bowl all week long next week. So this week, weโ€™re actually doing some Super Bowl radio row conversations with some old friends. Youโ€™ll hear from Joe Flacco. Youโ€™re gonna hear from Jamal Lewis, a whole bunch of old writers and coaches and different folks. This guest is a defending champion around here as a long time NFL insider covering many different beats as well as the league itself. He is on the Pro Football Hall of Fame voters committee. That means many things to lots of fans. I think in reality, when I bring on these ladies and gentlemen that do this, as Iโ€™ll be doing over the next couple of weeks, to talk about Terrell Suggs and Marshall yonder, Steve Smith and everything else. These are all people that have really been covering the game a long time. So I love having Jason Cole on as our defending champion. You can find him out on the interwebs, and anytime that Stanford and Cal get together, heโ€™s usually in the middle of some sort of food fight with Amy Trask, how are you, my friend? Itโ€™s been a while weโ€™re not weโ€™re like ships in the night. We only get together on the internet once or twice a year, and I usually call you when something happens with Lamar Super Bowl week, but itโ€™s good to have you on. I still follow and the NFL, even when they throw you out, you still sort of watch, right?

Jason Cole  01:19

Everybody does. Doesnโ€™t matter whether you belong or whether you donโ€™t belong to the club. So yeah, Iโ€™m doing great. So thanks for asking.

Nestor Aparicio  01:26

Well, itโ€™s that time of the year where everybody licks their wounds, except for Patrick mahomes or Tom Brady. Right? What mahomes has done, and we would always get into this back when I met you 20 years ago. Of what does it mean? Tom Bradyโ€™s in his fourth Super Bowl in six year and eighth Super Bowl like it starts to stack up, and you start to wonder whether Lamar burrow or or Josh Allen on the AFC side, let alone Herbert or Stroud or any of the rest, are going to break through, because the Chiefs have managed to put together a pretty special elixir here, even when theyโ€™re not so good and only lose one game. So pretty good, man.

Jason Cole  02:04

Yeah, two games that lost. I mean, you gotta count the the last game of the season, even though they that was an exhibition game for them. Um, you know, itโ€™s hard to explain this is, this is such a staggering accomplishment to get three straight, in and of itself, to have a chance to win three straight and do something that no team has ever done before in the Super Bowl era, and hasnโ€™t done since the 60s with the Packers, when they win three straight titles, itโ€™s a level of concentration and a level of will that, you know, very few humans are capable of. And we know some guys like Brady do it. We seem, you know, come close, but oh my god, what Iโ€™ve watched this season, because theyโ€™re really not from a statistical standpoint, theyโ€™re not that great. Like what Baltimore did this year was far more impressive statistically, but when it comes to actually executing games and not making mistakes and doing things that get you the critical plays to get you through it. Kansas City is simply fabulous. So

Nestor Aparicio  03:11

part of that is spagnolo too. I mean, we talk so much about mahomes, the defense, their defense shows up in ways when other teams defenses donโ€™t show up, including the bills, being able to stop the chiefs and get the ball back. You know, just in a general sense that your defense, these teams that win championships have a level of balance and Bella checks defensive mind was always behind everything Brady ever did, including taking the air out of the football in December, which is a really good idea in the snow, yeah,

Jason Cole  03:38

especially if you want to hold on to it more. Yeah, look, it is an amazing balance. And you talk about Spags, Spags is the perfect Lieutenant. I often talk about that is you have to have a combination of head coach and coordinators that works in sync, and Spags and Andy Reid are about as perfectly synchronized as you can imagine, between offensive play caller and defensive play caller and how they run this team and how theyโ€™re trying to operate it. And you can get into a long, deep discussion about philosophy, but those guys know what they want, what each wants to do for the other, to protect, to protect each side of the ball well.

Nestor Aparicio  04:28

And then there was Eric the enemy. And you know the coaching tree of Andy Reid being this incredibly legendary thing, and all of it seated in the disappointment of, I donโ€™t know which championship game you were at back in that era. I was always on the AFC side, but they lost some games at the vet they lost, you know, they lost home NFC Championship games and Donovan McNabb and the game down in Jacksonville, and that his Manifest Destiny not fulfilled, coming in from Green Bay and being a guy who. Who was a quarterback coach. Heโ€™d never called an offense, right like as the head coach of the eagles to be now mentioned with Shula Landry, Lombardi, Belichick, weโ€™re getting into that sort of level. Paul Brown,

Jason Cole  05:14

Paul Brown, weโ€™re getting into the top five. Joe, Joe Gibbs, you know? Paul Brown. Lombardi, yes. Um, if he, if he stays another four years and he beat Sheilaโ€™s record, do you then give him the, you know, the number one spot, you know, if you care about numbers, that

Nestor Aparicio  05:32

kind of thing, he might win three championships the next four years too. If they can retool he might,

Jason Cole  05:36

I would again, I would say the level of the level of focus that you need and the pressure that goes with it. I really think that we saw a lot of that this year play out with this team and like, itโ€™s just so hard to emotionally get high enough to win these games. That is really hard. Itโ€™s just really, really hard to maintain. And I know that they went 15 and two during the regular season. They won two playoff games now, so itโ€™s been a spectacular year. But if you really watch the way they played, it has been a struggle in times this year, itโ€™s been a very serious struggle for them. I mean, their offensive line is just not, is not very good. So there are. They havenโ€™t made this easy, and I think that that just wears on people after a while. You know, theyโ€™re going to have to replace Kelsey at some point in time, and theyโ€™re going to have to do some other things. So maintaining this is not quite so easy, but you do start with the best coach and the best quarterback. And for right now. This is magnificent. It is just a really, truly thing. So worrying about whatโ€™s going to happen the next three to four years, theyโ€™re going to be good, I donโ€™t know that they can be this good that long. Got it. This is, this is really, truly something Iโ€™ve Iโ€™ve never witnessed a team be this great over a three year stretch. Well,

Nestor Aparicio  07:04

part of it is they donโ€™t make a lot of mistakes, right in the big games.

Jason Cole  07:08

They donโ€™t be, well, hey, I got a stat for you on this team. Theyโ€™re, theyโ€™re, theyโ€™re, stand to be only the second team in the Super Bowl era that was out gained on a per play basis. In other words, how far they moved the ball versus how far their opponents moved the ball, they were in the negative territory this year. Thatโ€™s only happened one time in the Super Bowl era, and that was a Patriots in 2001 which is historically not very good team. That was Tom Bradyโ€™s first championship team, right? This before we thought Tom Brady was Tom Brady, right? And that he was all that special, we found out later what he really is, but we it was all just sort of bubbling up early on, and that team was a sort of a ragtag bunch of guys were kind of put together 20 free agents right now. It was a tough game. It was a tuck rule year. It was the great upset of the RAM. So, you know, I just, I look at this, and I say, what they are doing right now is almost unheard of. And yes, it is a matter of, they donโ€™t beat themselves. They donโ€™t do little things in games that hurt themselves. You know, like yesterday, they had two mistakes, the fumble When mahomes left the ball just a little too long and Pacheco knocked it out of his hands, you know that? That was the one turnover. And then when mahomes missed on a Second and nine play, when he stepped up in the plot pocket, and I was I was really keeping track diligently, those are the only two really obvious mistakes that they had in that game that hurt them in a significant way. So yeah, they donโ€™t commit mistakes. They put a lot of pressure on their opponents to make every single play, and the bills almost did it yesterday. They played an incredible game. Jay

Nestor Aparicio  08:55

Coleโ€™s our guest. He is a pro football hall of fame voter and a wise old soul when it comes to things NFL, I want to get to Lamar. Weโ€™re going to get to Hall of Fame. Weโ€™re going to do all that. But I want to get on to the Eagles for a minute, because this is sort of replacing my radio row. That if we were sitting in the convention center down in New Orleans, half hung over trying to figure out which benier We were going to have, or where good, what emeralds place weโ€™re going to tonight for seafood. We would be talking about the Eagles as this. This is an amazing thing. It feels like five minutes ago with Schwartz and, you know, and that group there, and some members still sort of around half of them, but the Sirianni thing two Super Bowls now his thing with the fans, and heโ€™s kind of an outlier of a head coach in a way that we donโ€™t see him as the village genius in any way, and then saquon Barkley and the genius of signing him in the off season as well as weโ€™ll get the derrick Henryโ€™s genius in a minute as well, because weโ€™re all giving up on running backs. Iโ€™m sure. Somewhere in the last 10 years, you and I were talking about, well, running backs arenโ€™t cool anymore. Nobody gives them money. And all of a sudden, if the Eagles are gonna win the Super Bowl, you know, next week, no. Going to be a big day for saquon Barkley, and itโ€™s going to be about Kansas City not being able to stop that, right? Pretty much.

Jason Cole  10:05

I mean, say quant. I mean, aside from Derek Henry, you know, this is, you know, this is incredibly stunning year for him. I mean, 2000 yards, everything that he did this the opening play, you know, yesterday, to get them kickstarted after it looks like Washingtonโ€™s going to control the tempo of the game, then boom, like, Okay, you got your field goal. Have a good time. This is, this is how we play here, because weโ€™ve got weapons. We have serious weapons in Philadelphia. I mean, theyโ€™ve got that, that trio to the two wide receivers include, make it four guys, make it Goddard, the two receivers and take one. I mean, wow, thatโ€™s thatโ€™s an incredible group, and theyโ€™re added in a very good offensive line and a defense thatโ€™s played stunned in football. This is really a terrific team right now. I love the way they play the you know, the one downside is that Jalen Hurts is just, you know, having an okay year, and I think heโ€™s been exposed quite, quite a bit. Itโ€™s going to be a real test for for Kansas City and family. Spags is going to have his hands full trying to figure this out and really trying to put a lot of pressure on it hurts to be the one to have to make decisions to beat them. Because if you can do that, if you can put the game in Hertzโ€™s hands and not in the sake oneโ€™s hands, then you have a you have a real shot against Philadelphia.

Nestor Aparicio  11:35

Iโ€™ve known Vic Fangio a long time, going back to Billick here in five minutes with HAR ball, and they had their own wars of running the score up with his five minutes in Denver and all that. It is incredible that when the Ravens needed help, they reached to whoever the old man is, right? You know, letโ€™s bring Dean peas back. Let me bring Craig Madison back for but like these old sage defensive guys, if they still have and Spagnola is now one of them, right there is something Marvin Lewis once said to me, I think the second or third time that he was going to get fired Cincinnati and survived it, is, we donโ€™t get dumber. We really do get smarter. We get better at this, if weโ€™re good at this, everyone. And that would speak to Pete Carroll getting a gig, you know, this week in Vegas, the Vic Fangio thing, and them just planting him in. And you talking about how incredible this defense is. Is there a Hall of Famer on that defensive unit?

12:32

Um, Philly, yeah.

Nestor Aparicio  12:35

I mean, you know Jalen

Jason Cole  12:36

Carterโ€™s in the beginning stages of what he has Hall of Fame talent, Darius slay, maybe one day. But

Nestor Aparicio  12:48

on a man by man basis, I would get, I would take roquan Smith, Marlon, Humphrey and Matt Abiko onto my team and saying, I got better play. I have better I have better anchors. I didnโ€™t see the Eagles as being this good defensively that we would say they can win the Super Bowl next week, because they can win the Super Bowl next

Jason Cole  13:04

week. Yeah, they could. I know, I look I thought that that this was the weak link for them last year. Their defense just fell apart in the second half of the season last year. So I thought they were better than this last year and underperform this year. Theyโ€™re probably over performing a little bit, but especially when you consider the loss of flet Fletcher Cox, but they have a pretty deep collection of defense alignment, you know, they you know, if you want to give Howie Roseman credit for one thing, you know, heโ€™s done some amazing things with that roster. Heโ€™s made sure that he kept the depth on their defense on both lines, and then found the weapons on the outside on offense. So heโ€™s done a really magnificent job there. And so you what you have is fan Gio has this collection of talent walking in thatโ€™s pretty sound. Itโ€™s not, maybe not what youโ€™re talking about in Baltimore with some of the stars, I get that, but they have a rotation of guys along the defensive line who work really well. A couple of

Nestor Aparicio  14:07

these franchises like San Francisco have managed to flip coaches several times and make Super Bowls where Pittsburgh, Baltimore, New England, for a long time now, theyโ€™re the ray bowl, and weโ€™ll see what they do there. But to keep that sort of stability going, the Eagles dude, they were signing Sam Bradford and giving quarterbacks money and using ones on the, you know, the kid from South North Dakota and, like theyโ€™ve done all of these really unorthodox, weird things. They gave all this money to a running back. They changed they hired a head coach at Sirianni that was not hot anything that I donโ€™t know, that a lot of owners would have said. I want that guy to be my coach, knowing what Johnny Bravo looks like. I mean, a guy went after the fans 15 weeks ago in Philly, of all places. But here we are again. That word,

Jason Cole  14:54

but that works for him, that works for him and and, yeah, they. Want to, they want a championship with, with Doug Peterson having, sort of, you know, a, you know, one, a, kind of meteoric one season and then kind of falling apart. And, you know, look, they are different. Theyโ€™re unconventional in terms of how they manage the team. I get that. But if you look at at sort of the formation of the team in terms of, you know, fundamental stuff, again, offensive line and getting weapons, you know, theyโ€™ve made it so that you can plug and play at certain spots that you normally canโ€™t plug and play at, and you can plug and play a little bit at quarterback for them, and you can plug and play at coach a little bit for them. And it works. You know, they it worked. You know, three years ago when they got to the Super Bowl with Sirianni, and they had a nice, nice group. Then they went backwards a little bit last year, and now they plugged in the right guys this year. Itโ€™s working again. But Sirianni, to me, Sirianni gives them that sense of hutzpah or gall that you kind of need to have in order for a team to really believe in itself. And this, I think it doesnโ€™t work long term, I would rather have the Andy Reid approach, which is very steady. But you canโ€™t always have that. You know, sometimes you need to have a guy who, you know is ready to flip off the vans and go to war with them, to to give your to give your locker room a little bit of energy and a little bit of hutzpah.

Nestor Aparicio  16:43

Jason Cole has chutzpah, if we could spell that with a ch,

16:47

alright? Very good, very good for a goy, very

Nestor Aparicio  16:50

trying. I daily Jewish girl, so I tried so for for Lamar and for the Ravens fans, and weโ€™ll get to mark Andrews and like all of that, and even Derek Henry, what do you say? Because I didnโ€™t talk to you last Monday, you know, and the aftermath of the bills game, but they might have had the most talent, and maybe it didnโ€™t get driven that way. They made a lot of mistakes, a lot of mistakes, lot of penalties, lot of everything, lot of MVP, lot of all of that. Itโ€™s the course. Go ahead, stay the course.

Jason Cole  17:26

But not everybody gets patched from homes, okay? Someday, yeah, some you donโ€™t get to have that guy whoโ€™s perfect. You have a great player. You surrounded him with the right talent, particularly Derek Henry, learn the learn a lesson that between his second year in the league, when he had Ingram going so strong, and, you know, they were surprising people a little bit, but they had that power back, and now they have a power back again, that you need to have that complimentary system of a power back with A guy whoโ€™s got the kind of quickness to create, to create problems on the edge, right? And thatโ€™s what Lamar can do with their running game. So make sure you have that you know, because you donโ€™t know how long Derek Henryโ€™s going to last, but youโ€™re going to milk Derek Henry as long as you can. Heโ€™s the perfect compliment on Lamar. Lamar has, Lamar has done an incredible job over the span of his career, becoming a much more efficient passer. Heโ€™s a better passer than I ever thought he would become. Give him all the credit in the world. Heโ€™s Heโ€™s done it, but he still makes one or two mistakes. So thatโ€™s thatโ€™s just been the story. You know, the championship game last year against Kansas City, the fumbles and the interceptions this year, one interception, one fumble, bad interception early in the game. You know, bad fumble. And you can, you know, heโ€™s not the only guy in that game whoโ€™s, whoโ€™s a villain. You know, Mark Andrews had a rough day. Okay, so thereโ€™s a lot of thereโ€™s a lot of blame to go around, but they still should have won the game despite all the mistakes that they had. They still were right there. Donโ€™t panic about this team. Donโ€™t sit there and say, Oh my God, all is lost. Weโ€™ll never get there, because it may only happen once, you know, in in lamarโ€™s career, but thatโ€™s what happens. You know that, like, thatโ€™s what happens in this league. Sometimes even great players only get one shot. But like, they have everything going the right way. Theyโ€™ve unfortunately wasted two of the greatest years in the history of any team. The last two years, you know their their yards per play differential was dominant. They have the right formula. They built the right way to win. Get yourself to a playoff, put yourself in position. They just happen to be playing at a time when Kansas City doesnโ€™t make mistakes, and so you. You know, stay the course with what youโ€™ve got. Thereโ€™s not, thereโ€™s not a lot youโ€™re going to be able to do, aside from the Chiefs having some down mirrors. I know

Nestor Aparicio  20:09

you find this hard to believe with all my positivity, but I was raised by a whole bunch of old curmudgeonly sports writers, jaded, and we just lost one of them. Phil Jackman, my favorite curmudgeon of all time few months ago, Iโ€™m going to let you be the curmudgeon if you need to be, because youโ€™re the old soul around here. You have been in as many locker rooms as I give or take, a couple I would think my years of hockey and baseball and all of that, Iโ€™ve been in exits. I wrote in my column last week, I was in the locker room when Bob Mason gave up the goal in the greatest hockey game ever played, and went over to his locker I was the first person to ask Billy Cundiff, you know, you know. And in Baltimore lore, the Armando Benitez home run, giving up the Tony Fernandez in 1997 was sort of the last chance the orals have really had to get it to go to the World Series. So Iโ€™ve been in all of these locker rooms as a 40 year journalist, 41 year journalist. Now, since I was 15 years old, the mark Andrews thing last week where they just, they dropped the ball, and then they donโ€™t come to the podium. In the old world, weโ€™d say, is he going to talk? Is he going to talk? Is he going to talk? We didnโ€™t have to ask that back in the day, like just in a general sense, if you were the goalie in hockey, if you were the pitcher in baseball, if you were the Bill Buckner and the ball went between your little whatever it was, there was an expectation that you didnโ€™t let your teammates have to do it on your behalf. Thereโ€™s that, and then thereโ€™s just the center general decorum of what it is, and that too much is given, much is expected. Theyโ€™re making $16 million as a tight end. I I took a little umbrage, and I feel bad for the guy. I mean, again, I felt bad for Billy Cundiff when I was asking him what happened on the kick, but Iโ€™m there, and what, and Lee Evans, what happened when you dropped the ball. These are all Baltimore references, of course, but they that give me where you are on all of this. And maybe you think Iโ€™m the curmudgeon. I donโ€™t

Jason Cole  21:57

know. Um, look, itโ€™s not the itโ€™s not the best look in the world. But Dwayne Starks, if you remember, did that one game in Baltimore and but Dwayne Starks at least came to the guys and said, Look, guys, I just need the day. You know, he at least said it to them, to their face. I canโ€™t talk right now. Iโ€™ve had to. I canโ€™t remember what game it was, but I remember it happened, probably the Jimmy Smith game, probably Yeah. And just he came to, he came to those guys and said, Look, guys, I canโ€™t talk today. Give me a day. And he did. He did talk the next day. Kevin Byrne

Nestor Aparicio  22:33

came out on behalf of Ray Lewis after the Peyton Manning game in oh six at the vision game that was in Baltimore, lost to the Colts, Ray was sobbing in the trainers room, and Kevin Byrne came out and said, Look, Ray, you know, Rayโ€™s accountable, just not in the next 20 minutes, itโ€™s not going to happen, right? You know, itโ€™s not happening tonight. Iโ€™ll get Iโ€™ll get him out, you know. But, like, there was that sort of thing that had thatโ€™s 20 years ago, man. I mean, times have changed. But

Jason Cole  22:56

thatโ€™s Look, it doesnโ€™t, it doesnโ€™t happen very often. And athletes are more out there than theyโ€™ve ever been because of social media. I donโ€™t know that Andrews is one of those guys, but, you know, theyโ€™re theyโ€™re exposed and theyโ€™re talked about more than they ever have been. So I donโ€™t worry about as much as I used to, but I would like it if guys would, you know, at least say, like, not take four days. What did it take him four days before, and

Nestor Aparicio  23:26

it was an Instagram. It wasnโ€™t, um, you know, it wasnโ€™t mana

Jason Cole  23:30

culpa. It wasnโ€™t. It wasnโ€™t, hey, look, guys, you know, I owe you 10. I owe you 10 or 15 minutes to answer the questions, right?

Speaker 1  23:39

But, you know, like, that would be nice. That would be nice. PR

Nestor Aparicio  23:44

director. Two PR directors reached me, both of them, you know, Iโ€™m not going to out them, but they reached me. They read my piece, whatever. Several head coaches in the league read my piece, and because I sent it and said, Where are you on this? Am I wrong? And none of them were like, Youโ€™re wrong. They were more along the lines and the PR people thinking, and, you know, one of these coaches was an old PR guy as well, said he only making it worse on himself. And Iโ€™m thinking, Well, youโ€™ve never really met the model media, because there is no, there are no attack dogs in ballroom, or even though Chad Steele thinks Iโ€™m one of them somehow. But like this, if this happened in New York or Philadelphia, Chicago, it would really be a diff Denver, really be difficult. Yeah,

Jason Cole  24:26

but Aaron Rogers, Aaron Rogers happened in New York, and he wasnโ€™t really called on the carpet and a lot of the things that he did either. So we donโ€™t live in we donโ€™t really live in that time, because guys can kind of pick and choose where they want to go with the media right now and still get their message out. So I donโ€™t like it. Iโ€™m a little bit more forgiving of it because of the age that we live in. We just live in this time. But yeah, I think that the guys are doing themselves more of a disservice than otherwise. Itโ€™s sort of like at the end of the Notre Dame, the National Championship game between notre. Name in Ohio State, where after the game, some of the Notre Dame guys are swearing at reporters who are asking questions. Because those guys have never been in that environment, right? Theyโ€™ve never had reporters in the locker room ask them questions in a tough moment. Because the way that college works is they bring them all to the podium and they have their time to cool off. And, you know, they everything is very packaged and prepared so that they are, you know, told how they should react. Itโ€™s not raw. And what we want in this environment is, we want the raw reaction. We want to know how people really truly feel. But sometimes how guys really truly feel is that theyโ€™re so discomfort they canโ€™t talk. And I get that like, what, what is Mark Andrews just saw the ball go through his hands. You know, a ball that he should have caught. And you know he knows what was on the line there. He knows all the work that went into it. I know how he feels now. Iโ€™m disappointed that you didnโ€™t talk directly to me as a reporter, if Iโ€™m one of those guys, there used

Nestor Aparicio  26:06

to be a professionalism that was implied, that is no longer implied, including, and Iโ€™m going to bring this up, the owner doesnโ€™t come out anymore. The owner hasnโ€™t come out since he got pissed off about Ray Rice getting outed when they had no integrity and lied. And had her lie, had everybody lie about what happened in a glass elevator has disappeared. So like there is no accountability in that way, from the top down to say, owner took $600 million of civic money to build to throw out you and everybody else out of the press box and put them up in the Little Kevin Byrne little press box in the corner now. And so there is the accountability of all of it has gone away. Jay, I mean, it really has

Jason Cole  26:45

well, because, I mean, media is not as powerful as it used to be. Itโ€™s too itโ€™s too segmented off. And, you know, there arenโ€™t newspapers the way that we used to be in these people who can sway public opinion that you have to, you have to pay attention to. Thatโ€™s just the thatโ€™s the reality of life, right? Like, thatโ€™s just the power of the media is much more disparate. Well, the

Nestor Aparicio  27:05

power of your media is to vote for Hall of Fame, right? So we talk about these moments is that, you know, Hall of Fame players come to the podium when they when they win, or when they lose, and my point to the mark. Andrews thing is, if you had won, youโ€™d have been at the podium. And thatโ€™s that should be a drop the mic that

Jason Cole  27:23

I get what youโ€™re saying. Iโ€™m not and Iโ€™m not disagreeing with it, but I also recognize that in this era of media, there isnโ€™t the kind of leverage to force people to do that. And even in the old era of media, there were moments in time when guys were just like they were, you know, they were too over the edge that they could not respond. And again, Dwayne Starks is one of them. Ray Lewis, that you bring up, these moments have happened in the past. Letโ€™s not pretend that itโ€™s never happened.

Nestor Aparicio  27:51

I had McAllister run out the back doors. I mean, you know, in a regular season, guys

Jason Cole  27:55

on the line, you know what? I mean, guys do it, and then what they should do, if theyโ€™re if theyโ€™re right, is they should show up and they should face the music. And Andrews hasnโ€™t done that, and itโ€™s really more to his detriment than it is to ours. As you, as you pointed out, I agree

Nestor Aparicio  28:12

with that. Jason Coleโ€™s your last thing Hall of Fame. Suggs, yonda, Steve Smith, on the Baltimore side, 49 voters used to all get in a room drink coffee and yell at each other. Still do that sort of in a zoom environment. You know, I think on our end, Iโ€™ve been asked to rate them and think where I would put them. I thought subs would be the first of the three to get in because of positionally and where it is and all that, I have been told, No, no, no, the guard will be easier to get in, certainly, than the wide receiver. Youโ€™re the guy in the room, so you tell me,

Jason Cole  28:44

Well, I did my survey of this where I started 419, former players, current, some current players whoโ€™ve been around a while, but you know, former players, coaches, executives, or some combination thereof. Suggs was, I think, finished fifth in that ballot. I canโ€™t remember. I donโ€™t have right from it. He finished top five. So Suggs has the defensive numbers that are sort of, you know, weโ€™ll get him in. Smith has a reputation. He finished very close behind Reggie Wayne and a little further down behind Tory Holt in that survey in terms of what pecking order you would put those three guys in. So I think Smith will get in eventually. Itโ€™s going to take a couple of years, and I think youโ€™re going to have to get hold. Youโ€™re going to have to get Wayne into the hall fan, because theyโ€™ve

Nestor Aparicio  29:34

been waiting longer. I would have put him in ahead of either one of them. No,

Jason Cole  29:37

not yet. So letโ€™s not get off topic. Here

Nestor Aparicio  29:41

was in and now is out right of the 15? Yeah,

Jason Cole  29:44

well, no, I donโ€™t think Heinz has ever been in the 15, but Heinz is a really interesting case, and a lot of people have a lot of respect for him, but he hasnโ€™t made the 15. And the last one, yonda, when I looked at these 15 guys. Eyes, the guy with the best resume is yonder of all the 15 players you want to talk about, peak level of performance, continuous, all pros, Pro Bowls, all the things that you know really differentiate you as an offensive lineman. Heโ€™s the best offensive lineman you might have the best res. Heโ€™s the best offensive lineman in this group. Thatโ€™s number one. Number two, he might be the the best resume of all 15 guys, and that includes Luke Kiley, Eli Manning, Vin Thierry, you know, go on down the line, right? He is as as one other voter said, you know, if thereโ€™s a John Hannah in this group. And this is a private discussion I was having at one point. If thereโ€™s John Hannah in this group, itโ€™s, itโ€™s, itโ€™s, you know, yanda, okay, so, and is going to get in, you know, at some point. I donโ€™t want to reveal the results of of what weโ€™ve done or what we havenโ€™t done at this point in time, but I do believe that, you know, Ian is going to get in at some point in time, whether itโ€™s this year or whether itโ€™s in the future. So I think all three of them have great cases. I donโ€™t know what order theyโ€™re going to go in. Exactly. My guess would be that sons would go in first, because he has the compelling sac numbers. But that could change very easily. Jason

Nestor Aparicio  31:23

Cole is here. He doesnโ€™t change his mind too easily. Heโ€™s been covered in National Football League for a long, long time. Miss you. Wish we get together. I donโ€™t have Iโ€™m done. Iโ€™m done with everything. I was going to ask you, you know why the Giants couldnโ€™t win with saquon Barkley, but Iโ€™ll say that for the off season. Howโ€™s life good? You go into the game next week. Whatโ€™s happening here? You still

Jason Cole  31:42

good. Iโ€™m good. Iโ€™m not going the game. Thatโ€™s fine, because Iโ€™d rather just sit at home and watch the game and have a Super Bowl party. So Iโ€™m fine that way. You know, Iโ€™ve done 35 of them, so Iโ€™m good. Iโ€™m good. Where I am. I work hard at the Super Bowl, at the Iโ€™m sorry, work hard at the Hall of Fame stuff. Do work at the 3013 and do a lot of freelance stuff. So Iโ€™m Iโ€™m in great shape right now.

Nestor Aparicio  32:10

I always love visiting with you, man, I run, so Iโ€™m getting thinner and thinner on people that that are old schoolers like you, that can come on here and give me the kind of depth that that I like to talk about with football. So I appreciate it. Youโ€™re always a great guest, and I hope weโ€™re in the same room eating something good sometime soon, because it feels like I miss all, all of you guys my, you know, the sports writing guys that I knew for 25 years, we got to figure out reason to get together. Thatโ€™s not a funeral. You know

Jason Cole  32:35

what? I mean? Yeah, that would be, that would be nice funeral. So not, not a good reason to get together. But no, I gotta say, You know what Iโ€™ve watched with the Ravens. Last two years, thereโ€™s been some really magnificent football that just has not ended the right way for them. So I when I say stay the course, and to people who are probably really, really frustrated with that team. I really mean it. You guys, you got to stay the course with what theyโ€™re doing. And, you know, people, Iโ€™m sure there are people who are crazy out there who want to dump Lamar or dump Harbor, do all these things and make, you know, generating changes all over the place. I think that Steve Bucha, even though heโ€™s maybe not showing up the way, he needs to show up and putting his face out there in public, you know, I know heโ€™s a kind of a private guy, but he should show up every once in a while, if, even if heโ€™s not doing that, heโ€™s doing the right thing by staying the course and creating that sort of Pittsburgh culture of respect for the head coach. Thatโ€™s thatโ€™s really important to running any organization. I think consistency of approach and making the coach an authority figure is really, really important for them, even if it seems like itโ€™s not working the way you want it to work. I did

Nestor Aparicio  33:57

a half an hour. You wouldnโ€™t even talk about the Washington Program, 38 miles away, where they are really recruiting, and theyโ€™ve got a kid, you know, there is this thing happening in my community now where the Ravens havenโ€™t had to try hard for a quarter of a century because the Orioles have stunk. Now the Orioles have transplanted. Obviously, the Washington football team is trans.

Jason Cole  34:15

Orioles are fun, man. The Orioles women organs. Now they gotta get a they gotta be a little bold and, you know, make a trade for Dylan cease or somebody like that, and make it work. But thatโ€™s, thatโ€™s a really fun organization, so itโ€™s good. Itโ€™s a good time in Baltimore and for Washington. So if you want to, you know, count the beltway total, the fact that Dan Snyder is no longer in the NFL, number one is a great thing. Number two, you have a you have a whole breath of fresh air between management, the head coach and the quarterback. I mean, thatโ€™s really a special thing that we watched in Washington. So itโ€™s back to a good time in the beltway for for football and for all sports.

Nestor Aparicio  34:58

Dan Quinn makes it. Possible for me to hate them anymore. So, I mean, I almost like found myself cheering for them in some way. Theyโ€™re theyโ€™re my NFC team. Um, never an Eagles fan around here, though, you know that this was a tough one.

Jason Cole  35:11

Thereโ€™s only so far you can go. Thereโ€™s only so far you can go with peace and love, and it doesnโ€™t go as far as Philly.

Nestor Aparicio  35:18

Well, I was a season ticket holder up there for six years during the buddy Ryan and the rich kotite era, the Randall Cunningham era, the the Baldinger era of so I sat up in Section 721, row one. Youโ€™ll find this hard to believe all the ticket stops. We were in the family section at the vet. He is Jason Cole. Iโ€™ll be telling some old stories around here. Weโ€™re W, N, S T, A of 15, 70,000 Baltimore. We never stop talking Super Bowl and a couple of Super Bowl for our charity. Next week, weโ€™re Baltimore positive. Stay with us.

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