What is the Rubenstein threshold for new Orioles’ payroll?

With the news that Grayson Rodriguez and Andrew Kittredge will begin the season off the field, we wonder whether Mike Elias will be out buying more pricey relief pitching in a sport with no salary cap. Luke Jones and Nestor debate the Baltimore Orioles’ pitching needs and the threshold for payroll in the world of David Rubenstein. The money and tough-talk financial realities of small-market MLB in this one…

Nestor Aparicio and Luke Jones discussed the Orioles’ pitching needs and the impact of injuries to Grayson Rodriguez and Andrew Kittredge. Rodriguez is recovering from elbow soreness, potentially facing a Tommy John surgery, and may miss the start of the season. Kittredge is out until June with a knee injury. Jones suggested the Orioles should add a reliever like David Robertson, who had a 3.03 ERA last year, to bolster the bullpen. Aparicio expressed skepticism about the new ownership’s financial commitment, questioning their willingness to spend significantly on pitching. Luke Jones and Nestor Aparicio debated the Baltimore Orioles’ pitching needs and payroll constraints. Jones suggested focusing on bullpen reinforcements due to Andrew Kittredge’s injury and the potential return of other pitchers. Aparicio highlighted the team’s financial pressures, noting the need for an $8 million reliever and the impact of increased expenses. They discussed the Orioles’ payroll, state funding, and the financial commitments of team management. Aparicio also mentioned upcoming shows and events, including a Maryland crab cake tour and discussions on Canadian themes and baseball.

Luke Jones and Nestor debate O…benstein threshold for payroll

Mon, Mar 10, 2025 8:40AM • 1:06:34

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

Orioles pitching, Grayson Rodriguez, Andrew Kittredge, bullpen, David Robertson, payroll, ownership, Rubenstein, Mike Elias, injury concerns, relief pitchers, financial commitment, revenue streams, World Series, prospects., Orioles pitching, bullpen fortification, payroll threshold, Rubenstein expenses, revenue streams, Andrew Kittredge, Chase McDermott, Kyle Bradish, Tyler Wells, Baltimore baseball, Gambling Awareness Month, Maryland crab cake tour, Rick Emmett, Kenny Lee, Ronnie Stanley contract.

SPEAKERS

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Nestor Aparicio, Luke Jones, Speaker 1

Nestor Aparicio  00:01

Welcome home. We are W, N, S, T. Am 1570 we are Towson, Baltimore’s leader of all things. Towson. This week, we’re hoping the Towson is leading the CAA. We are going to be over at the C, V, P on Friday, hopefully with a March Madness. Good news final, but we’re gonna be doing the show either way, we’re gonna be at CVP doing the crab cake tour. All of it brought to you by the Maryland lottery. I want some scratch off, some I have a few lucky magic eight balls still left to scratch off. I think I have laying around here. I do right on set, right on cue. There they are. Just scratch it. We haven’t had lucky magic anything here on the baseball side, Luke and I would be sunning ourselves right now somewhere west of Tampa, let’s say Dunedin, or clear water, someplace like that. But because of the tampering period, Luke being the responsible sports reporter that he had, the credentialed, responsible sports reporter and the foot pro football Writers Association, something, something the next couple of days that we’re not at Spring training, but we do have our passports ready to be stamped at Niagara Falls and the peach bridge, Peace Bridge, we’ll be doing opening day in Toronto two weeks from now. Luke, my God, it’s March. I’m looking out. It’s still dark out at eight o’clock in the morning. How are you? How was your baseball weekend? I know, like, I offered to take you to Florida for free and go to Disney World, see your buddies, and you’re like, you turned it down, and you love baseball, but, like, you don’t even love spring training baseball, because, like, this stuff happens with Grayson Rodriguez and then the Andrew kittridge guy. Can

Luke Jones  01:39

I say that my enthusiasm at this point, what was Grayson Rodriguez’s description? Initially feels pretty sluggish. No. I mean, first, to be clear, I love spring training baseball. It’s just I didn’t want to be glued to my phone sending out wnst Baltimore positive text alerts because the Ravens were signing this guy

Nestor Aparicio  01:59

or this guy knew that the news was going to happen on Saturday if we decided to not do the trip, right, right. Yeah, right, right. Now we could just go. Let’s just go. You know. Well

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Luke Jones  02:09

now the the more pressing issue might be, who can the Orioles add to their pitching staff at this point? But did

Nestor Aparicio  02:17

you expect to see Rodriguez on opening day in Toronto? Was that you that was your expect? No, no, you expected. I think effin was going to be the guy, okay,

Luke Jones  02:25

because of experience being the veteran guy. I mean, that’s typically how it goes. I figured F in the open in the opener, and Grayson Rodriguez in game two. But I thought, hey, that doesn’t mean that Grayson Rodriguez wouldn’t start game one in October, if everything goes to plan. Now it’s a case of, you’re hoping he’s starting games, period, right? And let’s be clear, I don’t want to sound the alarm that he’s doomed, but let’s look at the progression that we’ve seen over the last five to six days. He starts out making and having an outing where his velocities down a little bit. He says he feels sluggish. Then the following days dealing with some soreness in his triceps. And then, you know, they and let’s be clear, for anyone who’s watching or anyone who understands the human body, the tricep is here, and I’m pointing to underneath my upper arm that is connected to the elbow, right? So when you hear them start talking about the elbow, that doesn’t automatically mean that it’s the owner collateral ligament. Now, this could end up being that, ultimately, when it’s all said and done and oh, by the way, Garrett Cole second straight year for the Yankees elbow. And there’s even reports now coming out of the weekend that he’s, you know, he could be heading towards Tommy John surgery. So every team deals with this, but at the very least, we know he’s shut down for the next week to 10 days. He had a cortisone shot to try to clear up some inflammation in his elbow. You hope that that inflammation isn’t hiding a not hiding, but masking a greater issue at work here, which would be something related to the UCL, which would be a Tommy John surgery scenario. You’re hoping that the cortisone clears things up. He was dealing with a little bit of, you know, what you would consider tennis elbow, or some, you know, just some tendinitis. And you hope that he can start throwing again in a week and a half. And, yeah, he’s he’s not gonna be ready for opening day. We know that at this point in time. I mean, they’ve already confirmed that, but there’s still a best case scenario where he’s able to pitch later in April, right? And he’s okay. But we also know how these things can go, and even if it’s not a Tommy John surgery scenario, it can be a more extended absence. And what does that mean? So if you’re Mike Elias, Look, you can’t just force a trade for a number one or a number two, especially you. The timing of mid March makes things weird. On the front of one, are guys available now that might have been available six weeks ago, but teams are saying, Hey, we’re going to go into the season and see how it plays out. And two, even if you sign a pitcher like a Kyle Gibson or a Lance Lynn or someone of that nature, who’s still available, what’s their timetable for being ready. So, you know, this isn’t ideal. I don’t want to sit here and try to say that everything’s fine. I don’t want to say everything’s doomed, either. But it’s not ideal. It’s not what you wanted. I mean, Grayson Rodriguez, we’ve talked about this. You know, the moves they made with their starting rotation were more filling out the back half of the rotation. Grayson Rodriguez was someone they were counting on to give them upside and to hopefully take the next step. And instead, this is going to be the third time in four years that he’s not available for the bulk the full season. So you know, what you do in the meantime remains to be seen. I think you know. There was even a report from the athletic late Sunday night that there are lots of teams scrambling right now, the Yankees, I mean, Garrett Cole and Luis heel not going to be ready for opening day. Uh, Kirby out in Seattle, you know, really accomplished starting pitcher. He’s He’s sidelined right now. So teams deal with this, and teams look for alternatives. But what’s the reality of that? For me, I look at Andrew Kittredge and the bullpen right now knowing that Felix Bautista isn’t going to be full throttle on opening day, in the sense that you’re letting them throw multiple innings, or back to back days, or pushing him the way that you would have two years ago before the injury, and also understanding Kittredge now out until probably June at the earliest. You know, with this knee injury, I mean, they’ve said he’s going to miss a couple months at the very least. That’s kind of

Nestor Aparicio  06:51

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unbelievable, right? Like, and again, this speaks to can they be a better team in October than they’re going to be in April or May? Because, in April and May, as I see it, I don’t say they’re not going to be a great team or whatever, with the pitching. I don’t think you’re going to be wowed by the rotation. I don’t think you can be wowed by the pitching in general earlier. You better hope Felix Batista is not throwing 103 on april 15, and his arms falling off in June too. So I mean, there’s just so many pieces of this. And I think I’m starting to get scarred. As a modern baseball fan, I keep thinking about your old man, and my old man, if they came back today, and we’d say, Yeah, baseball’s great. They fixed it. They fixed the pace of play. They screwed around with these shifts and stuff and the analytics that you love, pop it was great and all that. But like, all their arms are falling off, yeah? Like, literally, I mean, my dad didn’t think about Warwick Harrison and and Wayne garland and Jim Palmer and Mike Flanagan’s arm falling off in 1976 you know what? I mean? Like that just wasn’t the way we were built as fans. And this is, it’s pandemic for pitching in baseball, I think. And they better figure this out for the kids too. Yeah. I mean, it’s and I don’t want to get too you and I have gotten into the weeds, oh my god, we go hours, right? So I don’t, I don’t want to dwell on this kid, Grayson Rodriguez is we think he’s Jim Palmer. He might be Steve dalkowski at this

Luke Jones  08:15

Yeah, and, yeah, and you just made the example. Look, it’s not as though there weren’t pitchers who had injuries 40 or 50 or 60 years ago. I mean, go look at Jim Palmer back in the in the late 60s. I mean, he missed some substantial time, you know, when you start getting into what he did in 66 you know, and going up against Sandy Colfax in the World Series, you know. Go look at 6768 69 you know, until he was finally healthy and became Jim Palmer. So, you know, it’s not as though that didn’t exist, but it’s just becoming so frequent. It’s becoming, you know, we’ve talked about it with Tommy John. It’s frustrating on that, on that front, but that’s another discussion that you and I aren’t going to solve that in one discussion or even 10 discussions. I mean that that absolutely, you know, it’s an epidemic and it’s nothing new, but it’s not getting any better. But that’s where I look at the Orioles right now. Look, can they slot Cade Povich or Albert Suarez into the number five spot, and their rotation still be very competitive and good enough for them to stay in the hunt and win games, and even if they’re not leading the division, be right in the thick of the wild card race. Yeah, that that’s not my major concern for April and May and June, right now, October. That’s a totally different animal, right? And and it was even when Grayson Rodriguez was healthy. But what I do look at now knowing that you gave Andrew Kittredge ten million to be a mainstay in seventh, eighth and maybe even occasionally the ninth inning, you know one of those high leverage guys for you, and knowing that he’s out of the out of the equation now until probably June at the earliest. You look at the fact that, and you know me, Nestor, i. A Sir Anthony Dominguez guy. His spring numbers are brutal, like he’s given up, I think in three outings, I believe he’s given up four home runs already. I mean, this is it’s not great, and I don’t want to, I don’t want to convict him based off, based off of that, but it’s worrisome So, and I know some people, because he got off to a decent start. You know, Brian Baker was good his first he gave up three homers on Sunday. I mean, I’m not going into the season saying I’m okay with giving Brian Baker one of my roster spots. Now, if it has to end up being that way, because, you know, someone else having forbid someone else gets hurt, so be it, but I mentioned a name to you, and I’m going to mention it again, because I think one area where I’d like to see the Orioles fortify, and they can do it right now, because it’s easier to do this than to go out and acquire a number one or a number two starter right now is go at another reliever, because Kittredge was clearly someone you identified that You were going to get, that you gave 10 million. Dollars to, he was really important. So where are you replacing that? Especially if Dominguez has been iffy, Felix, Batista is going to have to be treated, I don’t want to say with kid gloves. I don’t, I don’t know that might be too over the top, but you’re clearly going to be careful with you’re not going to give him a lot of innings. Yeah, I mean, you’re not going to pitch him back. Pitch him back to back. You’re not going to let him throw two innings. And look,

Nestor Aparicio  11:25

I don’t think he’s the guy walking off the hill, you know, on opening day, two weeks for Thursday, you and I are in Toronto in the ninth inning with three two games. I mean, I don’t think he’s the guy coming in to close that game. I It all depends,

Luke Jones  11:35

but, but even if he is, and if he does, if you have another game Friday night. That’s just like that. He’s not pitching that one doesn’t feel like Dominguez either, right? So that’s my thing. David Robertson’s out there. You know, you can even look at someone like Joe Kelly, who did not have a great year last year, but still throws hard, someone who’s pitched in the postseason a lot. There are, my point is, there are options in the bolt that are are in relief that you can go out and sign someone right now. Now, David Robertson, he’s older, but go look at his numbers of Texas. He had a good year. He was very good last year. So whatever that number is, and this is where you hope that ownership and David Rubenstein are made, have made comments at face value, saying that, hey, we’re here to financially support to me, you have a need that has surfaced with your bullpen, given the Kittredge injury, given where they are with Batista right now and again, I’m not sounding the alarm. It’s just reality, with him coming back from Tommy John surgery, and considering Sir Anthony Dominguez has been shaky at best. And again, that’s I liked him in guys, you know, I I’ve included him as someone that can be a high leverage guy for you, and he was for most of the last two months, last season, when they acquired him. But when you consider the state of those individuals, you could use a David Robertson. You could use someone like that who could come in and be a real piece for you and not say, well, well, we do have Brian Baker, and he’s out of option. No, that that’s a place, you know, that’s a placeholder, you know, that that’s a hope for the best kind of scenario. Nothing against Brian Baker is he has good stuff, but he’s had three years to solidify his place in this bullpen, and he hasn’t done it. So that’s where I look at this and say, yeah, in a big picture sense, not knowing what’s going to happen with grace and Rodriguez, they absolutely are going to need to add at least one more starting pitcher at some point in time. But I’m not as enthusiastic about just saying, Okay, well, bring in Kyle Gibson, bring in Lance Lynn. And yeah, they could do that, and they may end up doing that, because they clearly know a little bit more of where they’re they are with Grayson Rodriguez and the outside world knows right now. But in terms of upside, in terms of taking the ball for game one or game two of a playoff series, it’s not Kyle Gibson or Lance Lynn at this stage of their careers. So that’s where I look at this thing and say, I think I can live with the thought of holding off on adding a starting pitcher, but to me, fortify that bullpen right now, because there are a couple options there that make sense. That you can go out, you know, you can sign David Robertson today, right? You could sign him as you and I are talking, and that’s automatically someone that you can then slot into, you know, can close a few games, you know, close a few games for you on occasion, and pitch in the seventh or eighth inning. He can kind of replace Kittredge for the time being. And then if Kittredge comes back in June, then, hey, great. You’ve got an extra high leverage guy. So I almost feel just in terms of, and it’s not that the starter thing isn’t important, because it very much is, but that’s that’s way more difficult to just snap your fingers and produce a number one or number two starter compared to if you sign a David Robertson, you can slot him somewhere into a. The back end of your bullpen and feel relatively confident in the way that you know you’re not 100% confident in anyone in terms of health and all of that. But you know, I feel with Kittredge, it’s known that he’s going to be out for quite a while. So go fortify the bullpen. Go add another legit, high leverage arm into the equation. Or, you know, you can make a trade for that guy, you know, I mean, and we’ve seen that, I mean, so, you know, that’s where you know, if you ask me to rank those two things, I’d like to see them add a reliever yesterday, at this point in time, while fully acknowledging, yes, they need another starter in a big picture sense, we were saying that before Grayson Rodriguez, so not knowing what’s going to happen with him right now. You know, again, I don’t think you just give up your entire farm system for Dylan, cease necessarily. And I don’t know if the Padres even want to trade him right now. You know, the sentiment is they want to go into the season and see what their roster and what their club looks like at this point in time. But in the meantime, there are a couple available relievers that you can go sign and not have to give up a prospect for that. I’d really like to see them take a look and try to do that. And you know, you kind of, you kind of patch the the back end of the rotation together right now. And I will say this, you know, because this is, this has taken such a negative shift in terms of their pitching. Sagano looked great on Sunday from you know, go look at the numbers. He’s striking people out and freezing people and has, you know, he hasn’t given up a run yet. You know, that’s been good. Charlie Morton’s look good. So it, it’s not a case where they need to completely full blown 100% panic. But like I said, when you look at the bullpen right now, without Kittredge and with some of the other question marks, I’d like, I’d I’d feel a lot better if, if we were sending out the wnst Baltimore positive text alert that the Orioles have signed someone like David Robertson, who, you know, isn’t the guy that he was a decade ago, but this was still quite effective for the Texas Rangers last year, and I think would be a really nice piece to slot in there. Knowing you’re not gonna have Kittredge until the summer.

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Nestor Aparicio  17:14

If they do that, you’ll get it first on the wnst tech service. You can join that by texting, 410, 821, wnst. That’s for the old kids, 9678, text, join or w n s t. All the information’s up on the website. You can send me an email. I’m glad to send you over to get you onto the text service, because many, many folks have been on it for two decades. Um, couple directions to go here, and the totality of the pitching and how many innings they need, and bullpen versus starting, which is a lot different than it used to be, and how the game is played. October is different than March 26 or 27th or whatever, right? So I am, as I get older and as a baseball fan, I am much more mellow than screamers are on Twitter, but or X, whatever this fascist is calling it this week, that we probably shouldn’t be supporting that thing anyway. But at this point, my concern on on the pitching as I really look at it and I go through names, is, are they any better than they were when they didn’t score any runs last October, 3 and fourth, right? Like I’m looking at it and saying, they spent a lot of money, and they’ve got Sugano, and they, you know, and they, they’ve invested in, in Charlie Morton, whatever 138 innings of that they’re going to get and, you know, whatever, four and a third of, sort of, leaky fifth starter, sort of what they’re going to get right, and they’re going to be in games when the fourth inning, where they’re going to be winning four to three or losing four to three, you know, when their starters leave games, and then they’re going to come in, and it’s either going to be kerosene or a fire hose. I don’t know what it’s going to be, but it’s going to be a litany of two or three or four guys every night that are going to be coming in, the fifth, sixth, seventh, eighth, ninth inning. Nobody’s picking up two and two thirds innings of relief. There’s none of that anymore. So I just look at the amount of arms and the Sir Anthony Dominguez that they didn’t even have on the team in July of last year, guys that they fortified that the Marlins deal they did for Rogers. And you know these other guys they have, I’m with you, man, they’ve spent a lot of money, and this is where I’m going to get a little snippy with Mr. Rubenstein versus Mr. Angelo’s. You just made a 14 minute case to go give semi washed up picture. You don’t really know where the edge is, and we dealt with the Kimber last year. Good year, last year in Texas. How much money do you want to give him and get your this is on behalf of your father and my father, the nerds, get your analytics. I don’t know how many innings we’re going to get out of that picture. What the innings are going to look like, what the leverage is going to look like out of Robertson, or whomever, whomever, whomever it is, what, how much money are we talking about here? Well, I

Luke Jones  20:12

mean, he made ten million last year. Looking at it, there was a contract option that Texas turned down that I think was a 1.5 buyout. So it’s, is it 10 million like it was for Kittredge? Maybe not. I mean, Robert David Robertson’s gonna be 40, right? In fact, yeah, he’ll be 40 in April. I

Nestor Aparicio  20:35

saw your semi washed up. I’m 56 I mean, he’s not washed up. I mean he’s

Luke Jones  20:39

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not washed up. I mean, he had a three era last year. I mean, this wasn’t Craig Kimbrel last year. This was a

Nestor Aparicio  20:45

better to have him than not having been an hour talking about the salary cap and Ronnie Stanley and how it fits under the cap. It ain’t none of this. Now. It’s Mr. Moneybag. I mean, it’s a one year, one year. This is about David Rubenstein and Michael araghetti saying we’re going to take our payroll from where we won 45, 150, whatever it is, to the next level. And we’re it’s going to be a money pit. And then we’re going to need more money in July, because we’re going to onboard whatever Scherzer, whatever things out there. That’s going to be a $15 million thing with a $20 million poison pill for next to the ethylene deal. You know they’re going to be adding, never subtracting, salary. That’s the new world. And Rubenstein doesn’t even know anything about baseball. The more I talk to people, the more I realize, like your own, you’re knocking on Uncle David’s door, and he doesn’t even know anything about baseball, like, not even enough to be conversational, like he could not come on this show with you and me and talk baseball. He would embarrass himself. So he can’t. So therefore, the decision goes to him, and it’s, Hey, Papa, give me eight and a half million. For Robert, give me 11 million. Give me 4 million. Give me 12 million. We need this many million we got, you know, like wherever all that is for Katie Griggs and Mike Elias trying to explain this to an owner that runs around like he’s a baseball guy and doesn’t know much about baseball, and it’s going to his desk as to whether we’re going to be a 180 A, 150 a, 140 a, 210, wherever that’s going to be, because there’s not any sales that support this. Luke, I run a business. I run one for 33 years. Katie Grace cannot sit over there adding up leg Mason’s money and T rose money and just thinking there’s money, especially when the federal government is destroying our state right now, destroying our state right now, these fascist down in DC. So it does all run down that there’s going to be less disposable income in Baltimore to be running around for baseball games this summer at whatever the price point is going to be. So I don’t know what kind of business they’re trying to run, and I’m trying to figure all this out, because, Dude, you just did a 15 minute soliloq soliloquy on signing a washed up pitcher for a lot of money that I’ve been on the air here 34 years now, 34 spring trainings. Ain’t been a lot of years where washed up spring training pitchers for 10 million bucks have ever been discussed here in the presence of the Angelos family. So no, you’re asking for something that in football we can’t do because we have a cap in baseball we can do but there’s 10,000 empty seats in the upper deck, and beers are five bucks, and masson’s falling apart, and money bags is in on this, but he doesn’t understand baseball at all, like he just doesn’t. He just doesn’t like he takes nice selfies. He’s a nice man running around. But this is real serious money that they’re going to be adding that you as a fan, you as a reporter, you as a baseball guy expect that they should want to win, and there’s a point where, like, how many broken relief pitchers are we going to so we had that kimbre guy last year, and especially if I didn’t understand that, if I was just a billionaire, that explain, this is 9 million, that’s a lot of money. What are we doing and how he’s going to pitch? What? 48 innings? How many? What are we going to get out of here? Should

Luke Jones  24:01

pitch more than that. Uh, well, first of all, I’d say he’s not washed up. Had a three era last year. He had a 3.03 era. Two years ago, he had a 2.7 era in 2022 he’s not washed up

Nestor Aparicio  24:14

in game seven, and he’s the guy that’s jumping down on the mat like, maybe the, maybe the number’s not 10.

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Luke Jones  24:20

I mean, maybe it’s eight, maybe it’s seven with some incentives. Maybe you give them a, you know, maybe there’s a deal to be made that it’s six and there’s a vesting option for next year. If he, if he does give you 70 innings, he’s got a contract for next year. Different

Nestor Aparicio  24:34

kind of business we’re talking about, where you’re talking about just giving away six, eight, 10 million it’s hard for them to make 10 million let me let me tell you that for you, they go out on the street with their sales packages. Just money just doesn’t fall off trees from sponsors. It’s certainly not falling off trees from Middle River fans running down there and buying $94 club seats on Tuesday nights against the twins like the revenue streams. They have are limited. These guys are billionaires. Maybe they just don’t care. But I know this. They don’t necessarily love baseball so much that they understand baseball enough for you to understand what a bullpen is and what relief pitching is in the value. That’s for Elias to say that. But this is where these neophytes come into this. They over. They paid 1,000,000,008 they’re getting all this money from the state, and they’re worried about how to make money. Make money. Make money. Make money. You’re trying. You’re a nerd like me, wanting to and like all the fans, how are we going to win? Who’s going to pitch, and how much does it cost? And can Uncle David afford it? Well, of course he can afford it. He’s a billionaire, right? So, like, but what are they going to put in? And this is where I will just stop everything on all the dreamy pie baseball stuff, and say these are cutthroat businessmen who have made billions of dollars by squeezing everything and everybody, including nursing homes, graveyards, all sorts of things to make money, and they’re now into this thing, to be heroes, and we’re at a very tender point where they can really win the World Series, like they’ve inherited a team that’s better than most of the crap we’ve seen around here the last 34 years on my watch, at least on radio. And there’s an expectation now, not only among you and every fan and everyone listening to our voices, but there’s this expectation that we’re unencumbered by the ghost of Mr. Angelos. Right? I might even get my press pass back, so that we’re unencumbered by the ghost of Peter Angelo’s everything you’re asking for that you asked for in the first 15 minutes of this to heal the bullpen and fix things. It’s gonna cost money that before Peter died a year ago, next week, we never talked about any of this. We were never good enough to talk about being one relief pitcher, 140 year old, not washed up. I’m being facetious. I’m just being tough guy here and saying, Where are you going? Because you’re asking for things this franchise is never done in a payroll way, where we’re asking to do things they’ve never done before. We all want Henderson signed westburg. We wanted to sign Richmond last week, the minute that holiday sitting 320 this year, we’re going to want to give him 400 million in extent, like there’s all of that for fans. And then there’s the reality of who’s selling the tickets. How much are the tickets? Where’s the money coming from? Where’s my press pass? Because I’m not giving them any money until I get my press pass back. I’m just not I’m already 30 grand upside down from Greg Bader for 22 years ago. So I’m not like literally, they need to make money. Figure out money. Figure out streaming all these important things. But they got guys like you saying you want to do something win a World Series, and you can’t win a World Series without a bullpen. In order to get a bullpen, it’s going to cost X millions. And then on top of that, I’ve all and I’ve been saying this for months, my big belief is they can’t win as they’re constructed right now. They cannot win the World Series with what they have, especially with kit bridge not pitching until June, like they know Rodriguez, they’re not, they’re not a World Series contender. With this pitching staff right now, they’re going to need to do something, and that’s going to cost a lot of money. I mean, not just a player or two. This is going to be an expensive proposition if they’re want to keep up with the Joneses. The Adam Jones is who’s got a business card. Now I like that, but this is, this is going to be expensive, man every time somebody gets hurt, you and I are going to run to the microphone and lock and four is going to run to Twitter and call him incompetent. And B A L is going to back up anything they do. Brett Hollander is going to be whatever they say is the greatest thing ever. Tom Davis is going to the Hall of Fame now for doing that for 30 years, like I’m just saying, we’re going to sit here and say, Are they good enough to win the World Series? How much more money is it going to take? Because that’s really what it’s going to come down to for them, that and prospects, which they have, and they’ve never had before, but they’re in a really unique position. But this is not going to be cheap.

Luke Jones  28:58

I mean, it’s not going to be but, I mean, if you can’t sign David Robertson for whatever it’s going to cost. I mean, you’re not signing, you know, he’s not signing a four year deal or anything like that. I mean, if you can’t do that, then, then there is no hole.

Nestor Aparicio  29:12

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That guy 15, that guy, 17, that guy. But if you can, but again, these aren’t long term commit. Like, if you can’t do that, like you’re the pirates,

Luke Jones  29:18

then, and you might as well go find out

Nestor Aparicio  29:21

what we might as well for 20 years, right? Like? So wait, I’m trying to pirate traffic. We are to your point, signing David Rob put money in. Putting money in, putting money in is better than I’ve got money. I got plenty of money. I got plenty of money for investors. I got plenty of money. But I’m looking my point

Luke Jones  29:36

here is signing David Robertson is not the same thing as what you’re going to have to do with Gunner Henderson and what you’re gonna have to, you know, so or, or even what you’re gonna have to do at the trade deadline to go get an ace, right? I mean, and look, it’s not even necessarily about money. You could go out there and you could acquire Sandy alcantara for from the from Miami, who looks fantastic this spring, coming off, you know, coming off of, you know, being. For the removed from Tommy John. And, I mean, he might be the guy it’s, you know, it sounds like the Marlins probably are a little more apt to wait to the trade deadline. The Orioles have the prospects to go get him. And he signed through, I think, next season, and there’s a club option for 27 go, look at the numbers. He’s not going to be making crazy money. You know, I think it was a five year, $56, million deal he signed a few years back. But the prospect capital that you’re gonna gonna have to give up there so which

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Nestor Aparicio  30:28

they have for the first time, which we talk out loud about them making deals in a way that Mr. Rubenstein doesn’t know this, Mike, why is probably I wanna go. Should know this that we never been able to speak about the team in real terms. After a terrible weekend for injuries, they lost their number two starter, they lost their number one bullpen guy, right by money, right like literally, but Batista, all things aside and he, I mean, there’s so many question marks about this going in that is exciting, but it’s also exciting that they have prospects and they have money now, what are they going to do with it? What are they are they going to turn that into something in October that can win a championship, other than thinking you’re going to win 11 to 10 every

Luke Jones  31:09

night? Well, and look, their offense is going to be really important to and that’s where we go back to last October, they had Corbin burns, and he pitched like an Acer pitch in a game one of a series, and they lost because they didn’t score any runs, right? So, so that’s obviously hits. That’s a big part of this. And it’s funny that we’ve gotten this deep into the conversation we haven’t yet mentioned. I mean, Gunner Henderson may not be ready for opening day. That’s tomorrow. Let’s talk about that, right, right? And, and again, that’s not sounding if he has to miss the first week of the season, that’s not the end of the world. It’s way better that he does that and he’s right, rather than force shoehorn him into the opening day lineup, and he’s dealing with an intercostal issue all year long, but, but that’s where I looked at this thing. And I say, look, I delivering another starting pitcher that’s really going to move the needle, and isn’t just another guy that’s comparable to what they have at the back of the rotation now, meaning, you know, a Kyle Gibson or a Lance Lynn. I mean, they’re not guys that you’re signing that to say, Oh, he’s going to start game one for us or Game Two for us. You know that those are guys that are filling out the back end of the rotation. And look, it may come to There may come a time where they need that. But what I’m talking about here in terms of addressing the upside question that they had, even with Grayson Rodriguez, and now, not knowing, you know, is Grayson Rodriguez going to be out until mid April, or is it going to be out all year? I We don’t know, right? I mean, we don’t know. It’s some some circumstances here where I don’t think they know for sure right now, they’re hoping the cortisone does the trick, right? So if it doesn’t that long term question as far as a number two or a number two starter, I can’t sit here and say that they can solve that very easily right now. But what you can solve is fortifying your bullpen, because there are some options that you can sign right now if you if ownership and your organization can’t handle adding that on a short term commitment, then, yeah, I have grave concerns about the long term health of the franchise and ownerships willingness. And to go back to one thing that you mentioned about David Rubenstein, look, if he doesn’t know a whole lot about baseball, but he trusts his baseball people, and he understands to if what Mike Elias and sigmai Dell and their brain trust suggests, and he’s supportive of that, then he doesn’t know, need to know about baseball. I’d rather have that scenario than someone who thinks he knows baseball, and he starts to meddle and overrule his baseball people, which we saw that happen on a number of occasions with but

Nestor Aparicio  33:40

I think when it’s millions of dollars and it’s billionaires, and they get together with Katie Griggs, who knows a little bit about baseball and payrolls in Seattle and operating this kind of market. And the early reports on her, she’s got a lot more going on than Sashi Brown does, just from the inside. But I would say this on Katie Griggs, she gets together with Mike Elias and Rubenstein. They all get in the meeting, and they have their meeting, and they have their first kumbaya ever, right? They don’t they? None of them know each other. They don’t really trust each other, but they’re trying to figure this out. This is all the new thing for them, for all of them, right? And they’re dealing with money bags. There’s an ego guy, and he’s going to have a bobble head this year, because the owner needs a bobble head, right? So nonetheless, this is where, this is what they’re dealing with there now is the payroll. How much 151 6170, we can go to? 180 where’s the elasticity? Where’s the next four or five years on the EB, Edda, and like all of the money that they’re going to talk about and say, what are our expectations of revenues and expenditures. That’s a basic business. And when you start saying, Well, you know, my guy went down, and it’s going to cost 10 million to, you know, to replace him, and we’re already sort of on the hook for 15 to 20 million overage. We’ve already spent more than we thought. Because when. Came to us last July, when we bought the team. We thought the payroll would, you know, make a step from 60 million to 110 this year? Well, we’re already at 135 and you want to add more. And hey, Katie, how are sales going? Oh, I don’t know. TJ Brightman and Greg Bader ran this joint, and the upper deck was empty last year and, like, I don’t know, where’s revenue? Oh, massing. Oh, there ain’t no more mass in. Oh, well, how’s revenue do? Oh, how much are we gonna lose this?

Luke Jones  35:34

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You know, if that’s the thing, they should just go home then, because then there is no hope, right? I mean, you know, their payroll is at $160 million go look at their payroll commitment for next year. It’s next to nothing. Now, granted, it’s a lot of players that are pre arbitration or arbitration players, but the point is, and I know you’re you’re presenting the case, and you’re presenting what they do have to talk about, that’s reality from a business and financial standpoint. But you know, if, if adding an $8 million player on March 12 is that prohibitive to where they are as a franchise, then, boy, I don’t have much optimism for the future. I mean, I just don’t. So that’s where

Nestor Aparicio  36:14

being said, how many franchises in baseball readily add $8 million relief pitchers in March, nobody else, because nobody else has added him, right? So like, from that perspective of how many teams are just throwing $8 million around in this economy? How many teams can do that financially, knowing that

Luke Jones  36:34

everything they all can,

Nestor Aparicio  36:38

every one of them has a financial situation, given debt, given media, given just baseball’s teetering a little bit on whether it’s going to make another step up in a revenue realm. You know, I don’t know where their next their next basis of revenue isn’t going to Apple and Amazon and getting money falling off a tree the way the NFL is, because I had Jim Williams on doing 45 minutes of this with me two weeks ago. I would encourage anyone to go listen to that piece. He knows a whole lot more than me. And that’s where I learned honestly, and it’s probably where you learn to go into people who know more about this, but this mass and mass and the Sinclair buddies over here in Hunt Valley, who’ve taken a dozen franchises and the San Diego’s and the Cincinnati’s and the these teams don’t know where they’re going. They don’t know where their revenue is coming from. It’s going to get passed to the fans on streaming. And I don’t know how that’s going to go down, and I don’t know how many fans there are and how and where the financial wherewithal is. When the fans are saying, charge us less and we’ll come more, right? And they’re like, Okay, we’ll give you $5 beers. Come on out. I don’t know how that equates to more than 9000 people being out there three weeks from now on the third game of the year, because that’s just kind of the way it’s been. And I don’t know that that’s going to change. And I don’t know where that revenue is coming from. And that’s why, when you start adding $9 million this, and $14 million that, and Mullins is up for arbitration, and here we go with Gunner. And you know, are we going to sign this guy? Are we going to sign that guy? I don’t know where the elasticity is for their payroll in regard to whether money bags is going to be a 50 million over capped guy every year and just put a lot of money in because he’s 74, years old and really wants to have some fun, or whether he’s gonna get his the thing that made him a billionaire, which is the glasses that go like this, and he’s gonna look at the at the line items, and say, this is out of hand. This is a crazy business because, dude, it’s crazy business. He paid 1,000,000,008 for something that’s not that’s mystery, smoke and dust, and he’s gone after his rich buddies to try to get investment. Nobody’s real quick to come in and be a 1% partner with Mr. Rubenstein and get $50 million to own box seats, essentially to go chase $8 million relief pitches. Crazy business. Luke, I mean, it’s a crazy business. That’s what I’m saying right here, right now. Is that, how much is enough? How much is going to be too much, and how much is going to be we gave Sir Anthony 8 million. Let him go pitch for a while. We’ll figure it out.

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Luke Jones  39:11

Yeah. I mean, I when you put it that way, you make me feel like there’s no hope for the future. I mean real, honestly. I mean it really, really does

Nestor Aparicio  39:19

the hope is the hope because he’s already starts giving him money. The hope is they need people to start giving them money at some point. Because I’m telling you, their revenue streams are drying up in regard to regional sports networks, and then just waking up with $60 million of local media revenue to go fund. $60 million is barely going to buy gun or Henderson four years from now, like it’s gonna buy one player. And I’m telling you, in this market, they need more people like me to come give them money so they can do all of this. Because I’m with you. They need to sign Rob they need to sign a relief picture. I mean,

Luke Jones  39:56

I just, I don’t know, like I. And I’m deferring to your your more business savvy than I am. I mean, if an $8 million contract is that prohibitive, then when

Nestor Aparicio  40:07

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you’ve already got a mill 150 million out, I understand the big problem, like, what did we talk but we also have to remember rigs. And Michael, I said, what did we talk about last year when we go into ownership? Right? What was it? 181, 7190,

Luke Jones  40:20

but they have nothing committed beyond this year. Go, seriously. Go, you go, look at their what their 2026 payroll commitment is now it’s, it’s nothing like that. Say to

Nestor Aparicio  40:33

me that they’ve got $40 million worth of elasticity to go make their pitching better, because they’re hitting is pretty good if gunners Okay, right? Like they that, that we’re going to be talking about not their pitching the rest of the season, Luke, we’re going to be talking about their money and their level of commitment to give up prospects, which is money in the future, cheap, cheap labor in the future, right? You know, we’re going to be talking about their philosophy, because, and I’m not being a dick, they’ve not had a philosophy. They had a creep owner, and it’s creepy, weird. Goes back longer than that. We’re squeezing, squeezing, squeezing, squeezing everything and taking tons of money out of the team. John Angelos was siphoning money out of this team at the end with a $58 million payroll and boohoo and Chris Davis’s money and signing nothing so they they had the wherewithal to spend more money. He took all that money with him and then sold the thing for a billionaire walk off Grand Slam. As I’ve said many, many times. Now, Mr. Moneybags is out for a huge amount of debt at 1,000,000,008 looking for partners to get into this thing since the minute he got into it. That’s why he did all those television hits last year. And, you know, he likes to say he’s loaded, loaded, loaded, rich in this, and number five in that, and just got thrown out of the like. It shouldn’t matter. You’re right, as a guy on a farm in Pennsylvania loves baseball, and a guy from Dundalk who’s living on half a farm in Towson who loves baseball, it shouldn’t matter to us. He should just be a billionaire. I’ve sat here for 34 years and they pinched every penny, every paper clip, mismanaged everything forever. I’m giving Katie Griggs and Mike Elias and Don Kovacs and Mark fine and David Rubenstein the benefit of the doubt that things are different here. If things are different here, to your point, you’re making all the right points. You got no money committed next year. You got a team good enough to win this year. Go get some pitching dude. Go get like, everything we talked about. I let you ramble the first 15 minutes. Go do all of that, because that’s how you’re going to win. We’re not going to win with no offense to Kate povidge, I don’t think he’s going to be the number two starter. That’s going to be like taking Grayson’s innings here and running with the 2.8 era over 32 starts. So I watched a lot of baseball. None of that would make any sense to Mr. Rubenstein, by the way, right. It would make sense to Katie Griggs. It would make sense to Mike Elias, but when you have to go in and say, last summer, Mr. Rubenstein, I told you 160 would be plenty of money. And now 160 is 195 and he turns to Katie and Don and says, Have we sold any more? Where’s the revenue? How we doing? You know, no masting. And you we just got here. It’s new. It’s all new. Um, you know budgets are being caught, and Trump not only threw you out of the Kennedy Center, but he’s kind of crippled 5.3% of the federal workforce, which 5.3% of our state’s Federal workforce here in the corridor. And these are baseball they’re all, you know, kind of people that would maybe come to a baseball game that they don’t have jobs, so the gas is cheap, so low is about serving eggs. They don’t serve omelets at the games. So, I mean, there is a geopolitical thing going on here. There’s a rich guy who’s got a team he wants to impress everybody. But there’s also a they have budget meetings over there, and I don’t think they looked at this and said, We’re going to take payroll from what was it last year in the 60s? Where was it last

Luke Jones  44:03

year? It was no, no, no. It’s way, way higher than that. It last year. Let me pull it up. It was not opening day. Opening Day payroll last year was at 92.9

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Nestor Aparicio  44:18

and it’s going to be a buck 58 this year. What were we right now? Yeah,

Luke Jones  44:22

it was, according to Cox, at 160 so. And keep in mind, that was a million dollars. In mind that was, that was her opening day payroll they took on payroll at the trade deadline.

Nestor Aparicio  44:33

Well, this would tell you how much money John was siphoning out of the team. Whatever the mass in revenue was, it’s less whatever Mr. Rubenstein had to pay, and he had to pay the bill, dude. I mean, the learners just didn’t walk away from $300 million they just did, and Major League Baseball funded them 15 years ago again. I mean, there’s so many, and these weren’t $8 million relief pitching deals. These are hundreds of millions of dollars. That went back and forth that Rubenstein paid quietly when that press release was released last Monday. That press release did not say what the terms were. The terms are, Mr. Mr. Money Bags reached in and paid money to learn or to make it end. That’s how that worked. That didn’t work. The other way. Didn’t say it didn’t Yeah, yeah. I mean, that’s how it worked. I’ll find out, because I find out everything and I’ll report it when I know I’ll be the only one reporting it when I know there’s only so much money. Luke, I don’t mean to be a dick, and I don’t mean to be a down. I mean, when you start losing pitches number one relievers, and we’re just gonna, like, pop up and give real money. They that’s not real money though. Nestor $8 million is it? If that it’s real money once you’ve got to 160 Well, once you went from 90 to 161 7181, 92, high, I don’t know. I on a one year commitment, though, like rightfully questioning what their threshold is. That’s all I’m doing in this. That’s fine.

Luke Jones  45:59

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I’m just saying you, you presenting that makes me have way less optimism about the future of this franchise. Then, I mean, if I mean this, if this is the best they can do, then, then they are the pirates. They’re better than the pirates, because the pirates, I think the big, biggest deal they’ve given out is, what 17? I just think there’s

Nestor Aparicio  46:19

a limit here, Luke. I mean, unless he’s in San Diego, who, just like, I understand

Luke Jones  46:25

you’re saying there’s a limit, I agree with that. But I just, I don’t think an $8 million contract to a reliever is the best example of saying that. You know, I’m not saying, you know, if David Robertson was six years younger and wanted a three or four year deal, then that’s a way different discussion, right? But you know, if you can’t, you know, it’s the old adage, there’s no such thing as a bad one year contract. Well, if that’s the case here, then, boy, I’m not optimistic for the future. Then, so, you know, and you know, that’s where I go back to keep in mind, like Andrew Kittredge, they signed as a pivot because they were going to give Jeff Hoffman a three year deal. I think the reported, you know, they’ve never confirmed this, but the reporting that was out there, I think, was somewhere in the neighborhood of three years, 40 to a reliever who was better than Andrew Kittredge. But the point is that right there should lend one to believe that there is some more meat on the bone here, that they can spend more in in 2025 understanding, yeah, everything you said is right. I’m not disagreeing with your sentiments in terms of, what is the ceiling, not for 2025 but for 26 what’s the five year plan? What? Where does TV fit into this? Where does revenue created by the fact that they’re going to have $600 million to renovate Oriole Park at Camden Yards? There is a lot of projecting that it has to go on here in terms of revenue. You’re 1,000% spot on there. Well, I

Nestor Aparicio  47:59

think the number one thing they could do is go, go play in a World Series, and get the city and win the city. And that’s where you winning the city over. If that’s about $8 million right, spend 1,000,000,008

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Luke Jones  48:07

then you have no who no hope I hear you. But yeah. So we lived in in

Nestor Aparicio  48:12

Eastern Europe, in the blockade here the last 30 years with the Angelos family, where nothing ever made any sense. Like, not, you know what I mean, like, they let you in, they didn’t let me, and they’d never make that. Nothing they did ever made any sense, except it was always about how much money, if you followed the money with the Angelos people.

Luke Jones  48:32

I mean, it was in the early, in the early years. It wasn’t but that was 30 years ago, dude, you were young man, I know, but I’m just saying that went away quickly. When it went away in the mid 2000s and then they had mass in which

Nestor Aparicio  48:43

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made that go away when mister Angelo started losing money based on his stupidity, when he started giving money to and Albert bell and then trying to rescind contracts and suing him, and like all the nonsense that he did, but all that went away when mister Angelos had to go into his own pockets in 2001 and two and Three, when the 10 year club seat don’t read the Peter principles, but 2001 two and three, Mister Angelos was reaching into his own pocket to sign David Segui Jeff co nine, Sydney ponson, because the revenue had dried up, Madison hadn’t come the national. This national saved his ass. The Nationals saved he would have been gone for Major League Baseball had the Nationals not come in, because there wouldn’t have been enough revenue, and they he would have sued himself out of baseball at that point. He would have been Al Davis at that point. But it didn’t happen. They had to squeak. They tried to put that team in San Juan. They would have loved to put that team in Vegas, but the gambling thing like there was a million things that could happen, but DC baseball changed everything about Baltimore baseball, and now we’re trying to figure out how that’s going to be different, right? Like, it’s been 21 years I’ve been talking about that, and now we’re trying to figure out how it’s going to be different, and this thing’s going to have to stand on its own. And you. I don’t want to say I’m skeptical. I got a lot of sound very skeptical. I got a lot well, I have a lot of questions it’s fair, about how a small market team that is bruised and battered everyone in the community for 30 years that doesn’t have Forbes 500 companies here to just fork over money for sponsorships. This isn’t, you know, Silicon Valley. It’s not and it’s not Washington, DC. And Washington, DC always had the federal government, the federal government, the federal government, Northrop Grumman, north and that I that benefited when Larry King and will will, you know, they were all up here being a part of this in the 90s with Cal Ripken and all, all that happened 9697 in that range. Dude, that’s 30 years ago, man. By the way, here’s two franchises to stop

Luke Jones  50:45

you for one second there. And I agree, if you make it great, you’ll still get some of those people to come, because you can compete with the Nationals if you’re great. And there’s

Nestor Aparicio  50:55

plenty of angels fans that go to Dodgers games now, or became Dodgers fans because they just have been,

Luke Jones  51:01

you know, and that’s what, and that’s part of building something you can, you absolutely can get people to come from DC. If you’re a great product and you’re better than what DC is now, it’s not what it was 30 years ago, to your point where there was no competition whatsoever. But we’ve talked about this with the ravens and the commanders, right? We’ve talked about how many people in what would be would have been considered Redskins territory, way back when became Ravens fans, because the Ravens were great and that team was a pathetic loser, with the terrible owner for two decades, two and a quarter century. So

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Nestor Aparicio  51:38

on the baseball side of that. We don’t feel it on our side, wearing orange here, but it’s identical. But other than cheerleaders, you know, being floozing around like, agree, the Orioles ownership here was every bit as terrible as Daniel Snyder

Luke Jones  51:53

agreed. I’m not, I’m not disagreeing with that. But the

Nestor Aparicio  51:56

point is, there’s the potential to build and, yeah, you got to spend some money to become great, and that doesn’t doesn’t mean you have to be the man. Here’s the first test. It’s March something. And they’ve they’re at a two starter, they’re out of one reliever, and they didn’t have enough pitching to start with, and they spent a lot of money on remnant pitching, literally remnant dark pitching. And we’re still back to Kincaid povidge and Albert Suarez. Give us 170 innings this year, because Grayson’s not,

Luke Jones  52:28

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yeah, and that’s what, but this, this is why I said that’s not as easy to solve today as I feel the bullpen is. And that’s why I said there are a couple guys out there, established Guys, guys who, who, you know, in the case of Robertson, was really good last year. Joe Kelly has a lot of postseason experience. Go get them. Go get one of them. And then that replaces Kittredge for the time being. And then, in a big picture sense, once kittridge, who should come back? It’s a knee, you know, he got his knee fixed. And it’s not like this catastrophic injury, you know, then your bullpen is even better off. And then, you know, inevitably, if someone else goes down at some point in time, because that’s the nature of the beast with pitchers, then you’re in a better position. So this is where I say to

Nestor Aparicio  53:13

Mr. Rubenstein, there ain’t no salary cap. Sure, sure. And we don’t have these arguments with Steve Bucha, right? We don’t have these arguments, even on the edge of NFL free agency next day and a half, we watch play. Watch Bart Scott watch, just watch all these guys run out the side door. Yeah, baseball different. It’s a completely different conversation. It is. And that 100 $60 million payroll, which is markedly higher than, dramatically higher than it had been the last couple years. And look, they had nowhere to go but up, because they had probably dramatically higher than what Mr. Elias told Mr. Rubenstein a year ago this week, when he bought the team. Like, how do you think we’re gonna you know, where is the trajectory? I bet Elias did not with one singing any $200 million payrolls in 2025 I bet he wasn’t.

Luke Jones  54:00

But you know what, at the same time, and Corbin burns even did an interview recently and confirmed this, like the Orioles were absolutely in on Corbin burns. Now we can certainly criticize him and say, okay, they didn’t get across the finish line. Trying is one thing, doing is another. But I also don’t think Mike Elias is the type to just waste time, right? He might be meticulous. He might be too conservative at times, but I don’t think he’s someone who’s just going to waste time just to make it look like you tried to sign Corbin burns. So if we work under that, under that acknowledgement, then there’s evidence that suggests there should be some meat on the bone here too. If you need to sign David Robertson, or you’re gonna still go out and get a number one or number two starter at some time. I

Nestor Aparicio  54:44

think Charlie Morton got that money, and I think Sagano, they got that money. They they got the money that would have been if, if Burns was getting 31 million a year, neither one of those guys would have been here. They certainly

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Luke Jones  54:55

both wouldn’t have been there that, you know, if neat. Neither. I don’t know. I mean, I don’t

Nestor Aparicio  55:01

know. I don’t know. How you know. Again, this is when you don’t know these people, and you’re trying to explain it to the fans as best you can in an adult kind of way. If I sat and just had a basic conversation with them and say, How do you think about this? You know, how are you going to think about this? And if they made themselves available, Mr. Rubenstein’s doing a CEO event that I was banned from when Sashi brown brown spoke there a few weeks ago or a few months ago, that I would go in, like, legitimate questions, not press box, sits down with like, Come on, dude, you know, say what you’re going to say, and then I’m going to hold you accountable to that, because that’s my job, that that’s what I do. That’s what I’ve done here professionally since I was 15 years old, is I ask you what you’re doing, and then I come on the radio every day of my life, all of my life, like The Truman Show, and talk about your words, and then the deeds and the actions that follow. I don’t know where any of that is. I have no level of trust with the new ownership yet, right? So I’ve tried, I’ve I am, I am, I am, what I am. Here I am, and I’d like to know the answers to some of this, so you and I aren’t arguing about it. So when people will get in the car and listen to it or find us on the internet, there’s some semblance of this. Is our commitment to the fans, stand up and do everything that the creepy guys didn’t do for 30 years, which is stand up front face. Be honest. Show me the plan. Tell me how to buy in. I’ve got an orange closet here ready for you. But these are the moments of truth, Luke, when they start losing players and saying, How in are they? Where are they, and are they going to be playing baseball late October here, because at the end of the day, all the rest is Bucha, are you going to win the World Series here? Yes or no, that’s really the question here. No. You know, like, no one can say that, no one can answer that, but that’s what we’re playing for here. But that’s not playing for making money. We’re not playing for getting the bigger better deal. We’re not playing for flipping the team for three point 9,000,000,004 years from now, when it feels nice, and the economy comes back, and Trump doesn’t lead us into World War Three like Rubens, not 74 years old. I’d really like to sit with him and get a real eye to eye on what the plan is here, because I keep reading all of this, I don’t believe any of it. It’s all staged to me. I mean, it is. I mean, like all of these interviews are staged that they weren’t staged. I’d have one by now, and I’d have I’d say, What do you know about this? What do you think about that? Where are we going to go with that, if they’re not willing to do that for the fan base, for you as a real media member or me as a dude standing out here trying to figure it out, so we could better explain it. It will be explained much like Eric. The cost is draft. You know intentions on draft night, and it will be explained when they do or do not commit eight or ten million to another pitcher, when they do or do not sign gunner Henderson down the line or Adley, you know, whoever it’s going to be. We’re going to see how this thing blossoms out. But I’d least like to know their vision for it, and I don’t know it. They’ve been in here a year. They’ve owned the team a year now. They got bobbleheads, they got commercials. They’re out smart CE CEO clubbing and all that. I really don’t know what the plan is. I really don’t you know. Like, I

Luke Jones  58:12

mean, I guess, and I’ve heard you say this multiple times, and I understand where you’re coming from, but I don’t know what you expect them to say publicly. What team out there says we’re going to have x payroll this year. We’re going to have x payroll, y payroll. Next year we’re going to have z payroll. If

Speaker 1  58:30

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you’re going to say, I’m a wealthy guy and payroll is no issue, which he’s kind of said a couple of times, then it’s just cash and carry we just go get the proof. It’s going to be in the pudding, but, but no one, but no one, goes out there and says specific, explicitly, states what their payroll is going to be. You’d be negotiating against yourself for players then. So I don’t expect that look. I like transparency as much as anyone. But I think the reality is there is unknown to this. So that being said, that doesn’t mean you can’t spend any money. And again, I’ll call bull hockey on not being able to add $8 million on a one year commitment for any team being able to do that any

Nestor Aparicio  59:09

how many of those are you? But talking about the next four months, though, how many more $8 million am I going to go to Mr. Rubenstein for? I mean,

Luke Jones  59:18

there’s, yeah, there’s not that many, but not that many teams spend money in season, because you generally, you’re not going to have that many free agents that are available. I mean, even when you make a trade in season, generally speaking, you’re swapping some payroll that will offset some of the cost, right? I mean, it’s, you know, unless it’s just a pure salary dump, which, you know, Zach Eflin wasn’t a pure salary dump, but you know, they took on

Nestor Aparicio  59:44

Mr. Rubenstein. I’ll say this, if you’re listening, they’ve taken on money, I mean, and that’s my point to you, is I’m in years saying, If I’m Mr. Rubenstein, dude, I’ve already given up. We’ve gone from where, from 90 to 160, like, oh. Hold on here. Maybe we should, maybe we should try to play with what we have, especially if I didn’t understand baseball. You know what I mean? Like $8 million for a relief pitcher. How many innings? You know what like like? I wonder what that conversation looked like last April, what it looked like in August, after Heflin came on, what it looks like in December, when Katie Griggs is on boarded, what it looks like in March, when Don Kovacs has been here three months and has called around and said, how much more money are you going to give me? And everybody said, None. You didn’t want to play. I’m going to play off game in 12 years here, like we’ll see at the ballpark, but I ain’t giving you any more money and and like, so I don’t know where their revenue is coming from the offset this, because I still think they’re a business, Luke, I don’t, I don’t think in terms of little boy, we’re going to deal baseball cards here, that 8 million bucks to a team that’s already added 60 million in the off season. I just think there is a point where all of these teams maybe not in the early going, because Mr. Rubenstein is in the honeymoon period where all of these teams just maybe he is just wildly at the at the club, making it rain. I don’t know. I mean, I if that’s the case, good, we will have a better chance to win. Because it’s going to take that. It’s not going to take me being sensible. It’s going to take them being like, Let’s go all in. We got to win the World Series. If we do that, the team will be worth 4 billion, and next year we’ll increase pay, you know, we’ll increase attendance by 14% and they’ll have all of those metrics that they like so much, but all of that’s predicated on them being really good, because they can’t just be okay, okay, we’ll do it here. I mean, they won’t get anybody’s attention if they’re okay. Doesn’t do it most places. Yeah. I mean, it might for a year or two when you’ve been really, really, really bad. But yeah, that’s that’s pitching okay in the American League East. It’s okay.

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Luke Jones  1:01:53

Yeah, sure, I’m not. I don’t disagree with that. I guess for me, you know to the point that you just made. I guess my hope is, if you truly are in an all in scenario that your threshold is higher than $160 million then that’s my point. So for me, then the thought is, okay, your mike Elias talked with ownership and said, All right, we’re kind of thinking, you know, our vision for 2025 payroll is $160 million but what about a rainy day fund? This would be tapping into rainy day where you say, All right, it’s already raining and it’s March, sure, but that’s, that’s my point. That was my point. And my point is, this is where you let it play out with Grayson Rodriguez. You look at Cade povidge, you look at Albert Suarez, you have, you know, Trevor Rogers will be back at some point. Chase McDermott will be back like you have Kyle Bradish and Tyler wells, maybe in July and August and September. So you don’t necessarily, you’re not necessarily in a position where you must acquire your number one starter on March 15. But what is cheaper and easier to do than that is to fortify your bullpen right now, because you do know that Andrew Kittredge is gone until June, so that’s

Nestor Aparicio  1:03:08

no matter just they are, they’re going to need another $8 million reliever on we’re over the 17

Luke Jones  1:03:14

for something. Yeah, and that’s my that’s my point. And look, everything you said is I’m not pushing back on you, presenting that I would push back on man, if they really are at their limit already, then forget about they’re not gonna be able to sign resign

Nestor Aparicio  1:03:30

anyway. I’m just saying their expenses sure are going to grow much more fast than their revenue streams are. And I’m sure they knew that going in. I just know sometimes you go in and you buy a house and you find out that it’s got termites and and, you know, like, the billion eight was the billion eight, and now there’s the 400 million coming from the state, and we’re going to do this and that, and then the massing deal, and, like, how much that cost Mr. Rubenstein, and then the pay. I’m just he’s into it. He’s into a beach house here, and they’re in there painting it, and they’re telling him about things that are going to need to be done. And we’ll see whether he does or not. Enough of this. I should be in Florida sunning myself right now laughing at you about Ronnie Stanley signing a three or $60 million contract. Uh, Luke is Baltimore. Luke. He’s Luke Jones, I’m giving him a hard time here today, because I’m the guy wearing the the green colored glasses and looking over the spreadsheets here the Orioles right now and just trying to figure out what they are. And because I want them Sure. I want them to win 10 World Series. I want baseball to matter again. I want them to be nice, you know. I want to come back to the ballpark and be into it. I’ve told everyone that, you know, everyone in their management that. So here I am. We’re going to be in Toronto, and I’m going to have my Canadian hat on. I had Rick Emmett on. I’m inviting all good Canadians on. I’m trying to find some hockey players around here, Gene Uber ACOs, Canadian, but from the Sioux right across. Border, the Upper Peninsula. So I’m gonna have gene Uber ACO come in and we’re gonna talk about Canada. I might even sing, Oh Canada. And if Kenny Lee comes on, I’m gonna sing something. He’s got a baseball book coming out. But Rick Emmett, I told Rick Emmett this without insulting him, but like, if I can’t get Kenny, I got you. So Rick Emmett from triumphs on this week talking about his new book, 10 Telecaster tales, and we did a lot of baseball, because Emmett baseball guy, so we really did a little rock and jock. I may be reaching to some of my rock and jock buddies. John Palumbo from practice crack the sky was here this week as well. Friday, we’re going to be at CVP Charles village pub in Towson. We’re going to be doing the show Maryland crab cake tour. All of it brought to you by the Maryland lottery. I’ll have the lucky magic eight ball scratch offs to give away, hopefully towson’s in Go Tigers, if you’re hearing this on Wednesday and somehow they got eliminated, my god, please know if they didn’t come join us on Friday and join for the madness on Sunday of bracketology, it is March Madness. And I must say, for my lottery friends, it is Gambling Awareness Month. John Martin has joined us this month. He gave me a pop quiz on the show this week to try to embarrass me, try to give me the wrong answers for the pop quiz. But I got five out of six of them right, and I think the one I kind of half got right, so at least I’m not an idiot. But be Be careful. Gamble responsibly. We do. We talk about gambling and baseball and football and basketball and all that stuff. One 800 gamblers available for you if you or anyone has a problem. He is Luke. I am Nestor. Plenty of football ahead. Ronnie, Stanley, what are we going to do next? Oh, it’s draft and opening day. We’re Baltimore positive. Stay with us.