Luke Jones gives Dennis Koulatsos a long list of candidates and complications that have cause the search for the next offensive coordinator to linger longer than John Harbaugh expected.
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
ravens, lamar jackson, point, wide receiver, offensive coordinator, draft, game, talked, hire, running, complicates, bateman, lamar, philadelphia, passing, teams, week, deacon jones, terms, league
SPEAKERS
Luke Jones, Dennis Koulatsos
Dennis Koulatsos 00:02
Welcome back. My first guest as always leading off is is my favorite Deacon Jones. Yes, I got an inside tip that Luke has become a deacon in this church. Congratulations to Luke. I think that’s awesome. So you’re my favorite Deacon Jones. Long. Slide number two, for the Hall of Famer, they used to play for the Rams.
Luke Jones 00:20
You know what I would I would have to say, Dennis, you got to reverse that. I mean, Deacon Jones, one of the all time greats, but I
Dennis Koulatsos 00:26
do pretty much all time great in his field, and you know, time getting your field. So there you go. Well, I’ll
Luke Jones 00:30
say this, I would still say Deacon Jones much, much, much better in his field than I have in mind. But I appreciate the sentiment nonetheless. Dennis, how are you my friend?
Dennis Koulatsos 00:39
Well, I’m fine. But again, I digress. You’re a real geek. And though and he goes just Deacon by name. You’re a deacon indeed. And so we’ll, we’ll leave it at that. But lots to unpack this week, Luke and what it is, what is the Superbowl week should be a very fun matchup two teams that deserve to be there. I think they’re the two best teams in the NFL. And I think there’s a lot of intrigue, a lot of lots of storylines, right? No shortage of those.
Luke Jones 01:03
No question about it. We touched on it a little bit last week. And certainly it’s been talked and talked and talked out and talked about some more, but it is a fun matchup. And you have the number one seed from each conference, you have, in my mind top to bottom what looked like the best roster in the NFL throughout the season. And maybe the bills before the injuries really caught up to them and losing Vaughn Miller and a few others, but Philadelphia with the roster that they have top to bottom, but Kansas City has Patrick mahomes, who’s going to be the MVP and is the best quarterback in football. And I don’t think it’s terribly close in terms of him. And then whoever is number two, number three, number four, with no disrespect to that group, which includes Lamar Jackson when he’s fully healthy. But so so you have this matchup of what looks like a better roster, although I don’t I wouldn’t say it’s dramatically slanted towards Philadelphia in that way. I mean, you look at tight end, for example, Travis Kelce is the best tight end in football, Dallas, Goddard is really good when he’s healthy. But you look at most of the other units on either side of the ball, and you’re generally going to get Philadelphia the edge. But is it so dramatic to say then that Kansas City having the edge with no disrespect to Jalen hertz, but Patrick mahomes be in the very best. For me, it makes this a really compelling matchup than I expect a good football game. I think one of the more critical element elements is going to be Philadelphia’s ability to run the football and if Kansas City can contain that a little bit, slow it down a little bit. I mean, I think one thing that we talked about a lot about the Bengals as the year went on, was their improved ability to run the football. But what they did against buffalo, they couldn’t carry over against Kansas City in the AFC Championship game. And I think that was more one of the more understated points of the difference of that football game. It wasn’t the only thing but it certainly made a difference. So Philadelphia, it’s we’ve talked about it a lot this year, Dennis third, in some way, similar to what we talked about with the Ravens when they were at their best two or three years ago, in the sense of if you can slow down that running game doesn’t mean you’re gonna stop it. I don’t think there is any stopping a running game like that in the same way that there hasn’t been with the Ravens when they’ve been at their best. But if you can slow it down, and put a little more pressure on Jalen Hertz in that passing game, and keep them you know, get them in some more third and long type situations. That’s where you have a little more of a chance. So looking forward to the matchup. And if for no other reason, maybe that kick starts, or maybe not kickstart but finishes off this ravens offensive coordinator search as it’s pretty apparent. They’re waiting until after the Superbowl to see if they can at least talk to Eric the enemy. Maybe they want to talk to Brian Johnson, the Eagles quarterbacks coach, but we’ve just found ourselves in this holding pattern as it relates to the Ravens with offensive coordinator and certainly waiting, trying to interpret every social media post as I saw some, some fans do a go on Wednesday night with Lamar Jackson, what colors he’s wearing and holding a book tag and representing is he getting his bag is he signing? I mean, it just speaks to how I don’t want to say ridiculous because that means that implies it’s not important, but it does speak to the lengths that we’ve gone to try to interpret this whole thing where I go back to something happened, please, offensive coordinator search something related to the contract. You know, it’s been very, very quiet on the Ravens front which isn’t a bad thing to keep to be clear, but at the very least it seems like the Ravens brass is going to have their summit with Steve Bushati here in the coming days and down in Florida and not that they’re necessarily will be any news reported news to come from that but certainly that’s the big kind of Summit to lay out what the offseason plans are going to look like and in it an offseason that feels like it could go in many different directions for the Baltimore Ravens.
Dennis Koulatsos 05:03
Yeah, look, that 2019 squad, the Ravens they couldn’t use the AJ Brown and Devonte Smith. And yeah, we would have been singing a different tune after that season, they wouldn’t have hurt their cars, they certainly would have helped their cause. But with Lamar Jackson, and you and I talked about it before we got on the air, with the quarterback situation being very much unsettled. That certainly doesn’t help in terms of recruiting a top notch coordinator, right. There’s no stability there at this point, no guarantee. No saying that. I thought about this, saying that someone really wants to work Lamar Jackson, there’s no such thing as somebody who really wants to work with organization that hasn’t hit on a wide receiver in years. There’s a lot of question more question marks than answers, Luke.
Luke Jones 05:49
Yeah. And I don’t think it prevents them from hiring a good offensive coordinator. But it certainly complicates matters, it has to because any coordinator worth his salt certainly wants to have at least a better idea of what’s going to happen with Lamar Jackson, then the rest of us outsiders are left to speculate about for the better part of the last two years. So even if the Ravens themselves and I’ve said all along, I don’t think the Ravens have known for sure, I think what they want what they say publicly is not necessarily aligned with the reality, as Eric Acosta has alluded to, on a number of occasions, as far as it taking two to tango. Now, again, it doesn’t take that long to for a deal to come together if both sides truly want to make a deal and compromise. And we’ll see what happens. I mean, certainly we’re getting, we’re getting closer and closer to that window for the franchise tag. So we’ll at least see some movement in regards to that. If there’s not a deal between now and then. But how could it not complicate the offensive coordinator search? It’s why I asked John Harbaugh the question, what the week that the season ended, and he was respectful and how he answered it. But he dismissed that perception. And I’m not even saying that that has played out. You know, it’s been a long search. But as you and I talked about, even before we began our conversation here, that there have been these extended more exhaustive searches kind of around the league. I mean, certainly the teams that are waiting to hire a head coach, haven’t hired an offensive coordinator. And teams like the Ravens have cast a very wide net. I mean, John Harbaugh said they would. And they’ve certainly followed through with that, in terms of talking to a number of people around the NFL, certainly talking to some individuals at the collegiate level, Todd Monken. Of course, Todd Monken, also experienced as an NFL offensive coordinator, so not exclusively a college guy. And, you know, even with the recent report from the athletic that the Ravens talked to Bobby Ingram, who was the OC for Wisconsin this past year, and of course, was the Ravens assistant of prior to that. So, you know, they’ve talked to a lot of people. And I think that serves two purposes. One, you certainly don’t want to leave any stone unturned in terms of trying to find the right individual. And I’ve said this to you over and over, Dennis, any of these hires, in the same way that when you’re looking to hire new people to join the staff at Coons, you know that there are many right answers, in many cases, but you want to make sure you find a right answer, it doesn’t have to be the perfect hire, but you want it to be a good hire, you want it to be the right hire, you want it to be someone who’s a fit. So I think it’s no different when you’re talking about this. A lot of the names that have been talked about whether we’re talking about mungkin, or Dave Canalis, from Seattle, or Brian Angeles, sheEO, from from Minnesota, or Eric, the enemy, or Brian Johnson, or you know, whichever name Bobby Ingram, whoever you want to throw out there, I think, you know, you’re, you’re casting a wide net, you’re talking to individuals who might have a new perspective, even if it’s someone you’re not going to hire, they might have some ideas about your offense that you might be able to then apply with whoever the new person is going to be. So from that standpoint, I’m not shocked that it’s been a longer search. You know, we talked about this a week or two ago that this was always going to shape up to be the most exhaustive search they’ve done since hiring Gary Kubiak back in 2014. Because, you know, in the higher since then they have either gone internally, or the one that wasn’t internal was Mark Strassman. And that was not a good fit. You know, that was a case where they jumped the gun, quite frankly, in terms of whether that was going to be a good fit or not. So I think that’s that’s kind of where they are right now with taking their time with this. And at this point, you might as well wait until after the Superbowl. If you feel there are a couple of individuals that might be the right hire for you. Or, if it comes comes down to one of these other names that we’ve talked about, or maybe there’s a name we haven’t talked about. Keep in mind, Gary Kubiak was not mentioned until extremely late in the process. I mean, in fact, there had been I think, four finalists or what were perceived to be the finalists that were even relayed by John Harbaugh less than a week before they ultimately hire Gary Gary Kubiak. So there are very likely names out there that still haven’t seen the light of day from a media standpoint. So from that, from there, you’re trying to be thorough, but I can’t. I just can’t help but believe and think and suspect that. Yeah, Lamar Jackson status is going to complicate things because you take him out of the equation, it doesn’t mean the ravens are the worst team in the NFL. But it certainly takes them out of that contender status until you see what’s going to happen there in terms of Do you hire? Or do you sign up or require a bridge quarter veteran quarterback? Do you draft someone with what you hoped would be a top 10 pick in April’s draft? So now there’s just so many moving parts. And it’s, it’s tough to really say, with any confidence, you know, how it’s gonna play out until you get a little bit of clarity there. And I would think, with this hire, or with this interview process, you know, the first round was via zoom via video conference, which makes sense, especially in this day and age post COVID. But the second round, then is in person. And I think, when you have that in person type talk, where not just the actual interview, but whether you have dinner, you know, whether you go down to the cafeteria, whether you have a drink, if it’s late night, or something along those lines, that’s probably where some of these candidates are like, Alright, what’s going on with Lamar? Is he going to be here, you know, what’s going to happen? And that’s where probably the Ravens aren’t revealing their cards entirely. But that’s where they probably do need to have a little more transparency and be like, Look, here’s where we are, here’s where Lamar is, here’s our confidence level with whether we can bridge the gap and, or we’re planning on most likely he’s going to play on the tag, or maybe we are going to trade them if the right deal comes along. So that’s where I think with the second interviews, and maybe that’s why to go back to your point, maybe that’s why this situation maybe has necessitated having a little bit of a longer hiring process, not just because they want to hire the right guy. But on the flip side, that so called right guy wants to know exactly what he’s getting into here. And that and that’s where, you know, that kind of goes back to what my original question was. Everything about Lamar status, that complicates everything, about this offseason from hiring free agents, who you’re going to be able to keep in terms of salary cap, because if he’s playing on the tag, or if he’s just on the tag for part of the offseason until whenever you trade them, all of those, all of those different possibilities have a very clear consequence on just about everything you do this offseason. So that’s kind of brings us back to the original question that we’ve been asking it over and over and over what’s going on with Lamar and we continue to wait for some sign of, you know, a little more clarity as far as ultimately what’s going to happen.
Dennis Koulatsos 12:58
And the quicker they put that to bed. Look, we can all agree the better that way everybody moves forward, because although John Harbaugh correctly said, this was a very desirable job. However, it also made a turn away some of your more more desirable candidates because they may view a guy like Brian Johnson over there in Philadelphia, this, this could be viewed as career breaking job just as much as a courier making job, right? So and he’s also in the position as a young as a young guy, that he’ll get that opportunity someplace and winning a Superbowl perhaps enhances his chances of getting the position he wants no different than the cost of staying with the Ravens until he was given the opportunity to become the general manager, right. So you’re better. You’re better people after they don’t have to jump at this opportunity. They they have the luxury of time. Because like I said, this could be a career making job or career breaking job, depending what happened with the Lamar Jackson situation.
Luke Jones 13:55
Yeah, and again, I’ll go back to it is a very stable organization. It has a really good reputation around the league. So I don’t think it makes it impossible, but I think it does. It complicates things in short, if you’re an up and coming position coach like Brian Johnson, and you know, we’re just using that as an example. Yeah, but you know, it’s logical to see what the work that he’s done along with the rest of that coaching staff in Philadelphia and what Jalen hertz you know, the leap that he took from 2021 to 2022. How can you not look at that and say, Boy, that’s at least someone we want to talk to, given what he did there.
Dennis Koulatsos 14:31
Luke two with personnel. Let’s let’s look at how Harry Roseman the job he’s done. There was talking to the Jalen hertz they were on the fence about him before the season started. This was a pro year for him and again he became a much better quarterback when he when he brought AJ brown to the team. So is it the Jimmy J which is an excellent I would definitely combination of both right but he became a better quarterbacks coach when, when AJ Brown came at the scene, and we saw him double and triple clobbered coming up with those contested catches timing Time again, which would show the favorably in the box club for Jalen hertz, and the quarterbacks coach and the offensive coordinator and the head coach.
Luke Jones 15:08
No question about it. It’s all related. It’s all important, you know, we can we can try to rank. And you know, depending on the organization, depending on the team, you might get a different list in terms of ranking, the ranking of importance, you know, in the same way that in New England it was okay, was it Tom Brady and Bill Belichick? Or was it vice versa, right? Give me the
Dennis Koulatsos 15:29
horses, you and I could have Coach Phil Jackson as bowls and play the wizards or whatever they were called the bullets and maybe what I’m paying him by 27. Maybe we beat him by 23. But the point is, is the players that make the league what it is, any team not not to minimize what the coaches do, they certainly can help enhance the outcome. And also take away from it. But all things being equal. I do like the players and for the ravens, They have a decent offensive line, right? Most guys should return. They can run the ball. They have what looks to be a very solid tight end room. Wide receiver, the suspects. I would think anyone coming in, in addition to asking about Lamar Jackson, they have to ask Eric, the cost of that what’s going on with the wide receiver position now in the future and historically just have them in
Luke Jones 16:16
good. No question. No question. I mean, and that’s part of it, and you just laid it out. You just laid out a very concise assessment of where they are offensively right now, the cupboards not bare by any stretch of the imagination, but they have a massive question at quarterback not because of the player himself, but whether the player is going to be here or not. And the business side of that cannot be ignored here. And at wide receiver you have a very clear concern in terms of the amount of talent in the case of Rashad Bateman, there’s talent, but the questions of availability, and just a case of needing to be better there. So yeah, for any coordinator, again, it doesn’t disqualify the ravens, but it complicates it, it muddies the waters a little bit. And to your point, especially when you’re talking about someone who’s already in a really good spot. You know, it’s one thing to talk about, like, for example, Justin out and the Denver offensive coordinator under Hackett. I mean, that was a disastrous situation, how much of that was his fault. I mean, he didn’t call plays into the last couple games of the season, and their offense was actually a little bit better. So hey, that was a nice little nod for him. However, he’s coming from a situation where he’s not going to be back and Sean Payton’s there and so he’s, I don’t want to say desperate, but he’s not coming from a situation where he’s comfortable. Because if he was displaced, yeah, he was replaced. That looking at him compared to someone like Dave Canalis, who’s been in was in Seattle for years, you know, has been a Pete Carroll guy for a decade now. Or in the case of Brian Johnson, as we’ve used as kind of our test our case study here, so to speak. You know, he’s He’s in a great spot in Philadelphia right now. And you know, whether, whether it’s him getting a job in the next couple years, you know, moving up the chain or Phillies offensive coordinator gets a head coaching job in the near future, he will steps right into a situation that he’s very familiar with. So you know, that that’s always part of it. I mean, you’re all Todd Monken. Okay, he’s at the collegiate level. And you might say, Oh, he probably wants to get back in the NFL. But he’s been the offensive coordinator for the two time defending national champion. So he’s getting compensated very handsomely at the college level for an offensive coordinator. So if you’re him, you’re not rushing into something unless you absolutely love the situation. So again, all of these candidates in the same way that we talked about the different scenarios for the ravens, the different outcomes for the ravens, this offseason, all these candidates are at different places, you know, the different ages, different stages of their career, might be in a really good job right now. Or maybe not, maybe they’re unemployed right now. I mean, that’s just, that’s the way it works. So it’s led to a longer search and not terribly surprising. And again, at this point, you might as well see if you can at least have a conversation with an Eric the enemy have a conversation with Brian Johnson. And they might tell you, they’re not interested in you know, after a short amount of time, and that’s fine, you know that that’s not a knock. It’s just the way it works. So, you know, ultimately, you would assume this is winding down because you do want to have your offensive coordinator in place even if there’s the uncertainty remains with the MAR. You can’t just wait wait offseason to hire an OC. So we’re gonna see that come to a resolution. But as you pointed out a few minutes ago, there are lots of teams that are still waiting to fill those roles. So and you don’t get the sense that the Ravens have really necessarily missed out on someone that they really had a great chance to hire. Typically, you have a conversation and someone decides to stay put or you know, they go somewhere else, you know, whatever it might be, doesn’t feel like the Ravens have missed out on on, you know, their top two or three guys, hypothetically whoever they might have been.
Dennis Koulatsos 20:05
And the other piece though is this look Eric to caster acknowledges he’s gotta get the wide receiver room better if they’ve signed Lamar Jackson longterm, let’s say goes through, he’s gonna be up against that salary cap of five draft picks heading into this year’s draft class not enough money on a couple of soul. What will they do? At the wide receiver position? That’s what I keep going back to the heaven needs a quarterback. Right? You gotta get a corner in there with it with a high pick, I would think wide receivers gotta be up there still. They have some holes.
Luke Jones 20:42
Yeah. And that’s what this is the nature of the beast when you’re talking about the fact that whether you sign Lamar or he plays on the tag, the days of Lamar only have costing a couple million dollars on your cap are gone. So
Dennis Koulatsos 20:56
he’s not playing on a tag. Look, I can’t see a scenario. I know he’s a different cat. I know he lived for 23 million. I can’t see him setting foot a training camp on the tag. I think I can’t see him doing it again. He didn’t want he should have done it the first time. But to be frank with you, he pretty
Luke Jones 21:13
well. Well. And you know, just just to be thorough, I mean, it wasn’t the tag is the fifth year option. But your point your point is well taken.
Dennis Koulatsos 21:20
But if you if you and I were his agents, right? I mean, when he went down to the Denver game, I held my breath. I thought my God, did he tear all three ligaments in his knee? Because I didn’t so he’d have been done at that point. Look. So yeah, for his own good if you unhei Were his agents, right? If it was colossal, and Jones, right, he wouldn’t have set foot in camp without a contract. Now, if he wanted a guaranteed contract still probably won’t show up. But all year long. But my point is, he has to he has to I just don’t see him playing on the tag. I just I just can’t see. Yeah.
Luke Jones 21:53
And to be clear, I’m not I’m not suggesting that he will or that’s what I expect. But if you know, we’re just laying out the different scenarios, it complicates things does. I mean, you’re just like you said they don’t have even if they’re cutting Coleus Campbell and
Dennis Koulatsos 22:13
right. Everybody, you
Luke Jones 22:15
said words? Well, I mean, Marcus Peters a free yet, but I’m talking about guys that are under contract. Yeah, no, no, if you’re talking about having to prepare, you know, we’ve talked about exclusive versus non exclusive, let’s say it’s the exclusive tagging. And even if you’re just using that with the idea that you’re going to entertain some trade offers, but you got to make sure you get the right offer before you trade them. Right. So so there’s still so many moving parts to this. But you’re in a position where you only have at this point, your projected cap space at the start of the new league year. And this is without resigning anyone. This is without cutting anyone at this point in time. This is the guys that are currently under contract, which excludes Lamar Jackson, they’re at about $28 million in cap space, the non exclusive tag number is it what $32 million? So you’re already over there. You’re done.
Dennis Koulatsos 23:01
So you know, they’re they’re, they’re in better shape if they tag and trade him in terms of draft capital, keep showing up and etc. Right. So they are but that’s the that’s the good problem to have. When you have a good quarterback when you have a franchise quarterback. You can’t get around that?
Luke Jones 23:15
Yeah, yeah, no question. So you know that they’re gonna be in a position where they’re going to have to make a couple of at least a couple of difficult cuts. I love Coleus Campbell unless he’s taken considerably less than what he’s owed. And by the way, he still plays at a high enough level that I’m not saying he’s a one or $2 million player, but short of him making a whole lot more than that. I mean, it’s, you know, it’s gonna be really tough. You know, I like Gus Edwards. He’s your number two running back. He’s making, you know, over $4 million in base salary. JK Dobbins is off is in a contract year. So logic says you’re probably going to draft a running back at some point. I’m not saying real early, but probably early day three, let’s say, Yeah, I agree. If you’re going to do that, does it make the most sense financially to Fergus Edwards. Now he might, maybe he takes a pay cut, because, you know, he’s coming off of having missed parts of the lat, you know, the entire 2021 and then parts of part of 2022. So, now you go down the list, and there’s always some wiggle room that you might be able to figure out with some of these guys, you know, Kevin Zeitler, bigger cap number, don’t expect him to be cut. But can you work out maybe a short term extension that lowers his cap number, so, there are ways to do this, but the point is, you’re only gonna be able to create so much space, right. So short of Lamar Jackson being extended in a more conventional market way that the Ravens would like to extend him, you know, it’s not as easy to structure it if it has to be fully guaranteed, guaranteed, but you can structure it in a way that his cap number is on the lower side. And yeah, you’re still gonna have to make a couple of cuts, but you can Give yourself a decent amount of cap space. Certainly if you trade them, then you’re kind of I don’t want to say you’re entirely starting over but you kind of are in terms of presumably you’re going to draft a rookie cool, you know you’re going to draft a quarterback and
Dennis Koulatsos 25:15
could it does he pan out but that’s I think that’s a lot of fans miss is Oh, sure. They probably have about a 30% chance of of a first round draft pick. panning out you can have Yeah, you can get a you might get a Josh Allen but you also might get, you know, a baker Mayfield and that’s Zach Wilson, or Zach Wilson. There you go, or Kyle bowler going back to that. And now you’re really not just starting over you’re you’re getting way behind the eight ball with your organization.
Luke Jones 25:43
Right. Right. And obviously you can’t make decisions in you know, out of out of fear, right? I mean, everything you do has a calculated risk to it in the same way that they could pay Lamar Jackson, and the last two years could be the tip of the iceberg of injury starting to catch up with him. There’s there’s that risk. I’m not saying that that’s going to happen. But there’s always that risk. But Dennis, but there’s
Dennis Koulatsos 26:04
data to suggest that right? I mean, he you can’t get around that. And that’s, that’s the other piece when you’re representing yourself that that tends to, I would think a very personal would that be the presence of an agent? Sitting there and taking those those shots for you?
Luke Jones 26:19
Sure, no question about it. So I mean, the overall, the prevailing point here is there are lots of tentacles to this, right? There are lots of variables and possibilities and lots of combinations of things that can happen here. So, you know, but all of that, to go back to your original point about wide receiver and mentioning cornerback as well. It’s complicated by the fact that you don’t have a whole lot of cap space, or I mean, really, you have no cap space. I mean, you’re you’re when you consider you’re not certainly not gonna let Lamar Jackson just become a free agent. I mean, that’s the captain obvious statement. So at the very least, even if you’re only giving him the nonexclusive Tag, you’re already eating up all of your cap space and then some which requires you to then make some moves and restructure some guys, let a few veterans go, you know, and that’s, that’s without even making a big splash. So that’s where we come back to. It’s great to talk about DeAndre Hopkins, but what’s it going to cost in terms of trading for him, and he probably is going to want his deal redone and I wouldn’t blame him for that. So
Dennis Koulatsos 27:25
he’s also missed a lot of games the last few seasons look as well, I mean, that he has he has
Luke Jones 27:30
been getting but at the same time, beggars can’t be choosers, and I mean, this market the Ravens have talked about this though, you know, I mean, Eric Decosta can lament wide receivers being overpaid or overvalued all you want but the market is the market in the same way Yeah, someone comes to you Dennis it says that specific car on your lot expensive but the market dictates
Dennis Koulatsos 27:53
the market. Well the funny thing is when I look at that Ohio State wide receiver with a long name right I’ll learn it before the draft when he missed last year. What hamstrings no thank you give me the guy. I mean, look, Bateman, Rashad Bateman was an injury free in college, I believe, and he’s had some bad luck on the pros, but at least don’t give me a guy with an injury history in college and craft about number one for the Ravens. I think it’s a recipe for disaster.
Luke Jones 28:20
Yeah, it’s tough because we can all point to guys who had injury concerns and then they end up staying relatively healthy and then you have someone like Rashad Bateman who had never really been hurt at all. Yeah, he had the sports hernia, you know, groin issue that ultimately he got taken care of them during his first training camp. I mean, that had lingered from college. But that’s, you know, that’s not something that is chronic, or anything like that.
Dennis Koulatsos 28:45
But the point is when you have guys on the draft for oh, yeah, here to me, I just call me crazy. But I would say those things give me the guy who’d never been hurt before at least let me start with that with somebody with no injury history versus somebody that missed an entire season. Like injuries
Luke Jones 29:01
unless it’s a case of what the Ravens did with David Java. Or you look at someone like George Pickens who fell a little bit. Keenan Allen, who has been mentioned as a potential casualty. And, you know, maybe he’s someone that the Ravens could at this point explore depending on what their cap situation is. And, again, so much unknown, but like
Dennis Koulatsos 29:21
they need they need a veteran. They need a veteran and I need a rookie, yeah, rookie high in the draft and a proven veteran to supplement and then you hope that those two in addition with Bateman stay healthy for an entire season.
Luke Jones 29:33
You’re hoping for that and then you’re hoping you know if you’re looking at someone like Devin DuVernay, maybe a different offensive coordinator can untap a little more potential. I mean, that’s what you’re looking for. I mean, the OC is gonna be huge in this. I mean, that’s why just about everyone they’ve talked to has had has a reputation for being tied to passing game success. And you saw
Dennis Koulatsos 29:54
more candidates comment about the passing game, but I thought that was pretty telling and here’s a guy who’s really been the best This area of the ball in his direction in quick run was often but even he even said, if you’re going to win this league, you got to get the passing game better.
Luke Jones 30:08
Yeah, no question about it. And as we’ve said all along, it felt like it was time to move on from Greg Roman. I totally agreed with that said, you know, with that decision at that point in time, but I will also say, by no means has it been all on Greg Roman. So that’s where Andre had to bring in some more talent. So
Dennis Koulatsos 30:26
he had some tough luck because the Ravens at least offensively are in the year. They look good. With with Bateman running all over the field and Mark throwing passes his direction, and, of course, a different startup funky, they had to adjust to my fellow scheme and vice versa. So they got they got better, particularly when it broke when Smith. Yeah, that offense would look good. The first three or four weeks.
Luke Jones 30:46
It wasn’t I’ll go back to a year ago at this time, we were talking about the fact that the ravens and this keep in mind, this was pre Marquis brown trade, they had to first round picks as their starting wide receivers. And as much as 2021 didn’t end the way that the Ravens wanted. You could also point to that and say, well, think about it. Bateman was hurt at the beginning of the year, took him some time to get acclimated, then Lamar is hurt at the end of the year, Marquis Brown was not as productive the second half of the year. And then you know, we can get into all the different reasons why that might have been the case. But the overall point was, you wanted to see what a healthy Lamar Jackson look like with a full year of Rashad Bateman and Marquis brown. Now, the Ravens traded Marquis Brown and because he wanted out and that’s fine. I mean, we talked about it, but you know, they never replaced him, and that ultimately hurt them. And then they were completely done. From a passing game standpoint, the moment that Rashad Bateman went down. So, you know, again, I’m not trying to not trying to rehash it, because we’ve beaten that to death at this point. But it does, again, speak to you need to have enough talent. And you know, Mark Andrews made the point at the Super Bowl this week, that if you’re not able to throw and throw at a high level, and that doesn’t mean throw every play, but it means when you do it, you can do it very well, which the Ravens were on their way to doing that back in 2019. And even early in the season this year, as you pointed out, you know, the first three weeks of the season, Lamar Jackson had 10 touchdown passes, but they didn’t sustain it. So that’s the point. But you need to be highly efficient with your passing game doesn’t mean you have to lead the league doesn’t mean you have to throw for 300 plus yards again. But when when it comes down to it when you have to throw the football, when you need to throw the football when you’re in a whether it’s a two minute situation, or you are down 10 points as much as as much as that narrative, I think has been overblown a little bit, you know, because most teams don’t aren’t good when when they’re playing from behind. Now, teams are better than others when they’re playing from behind, but no one wants to play from behind. But the overall point, and it’s where they can they never got there with Greg Rome, and they were as close as they were in 2019. They were backsliding from that point that you when you have to throw the football. Yeah, you need to be able to do it. Like what when you’re in that position where you need to do it. It’s got to be there for you. And the Ravens have not been in that position nearly enough. When they’ve needed to throw the football more often than not, they’ve come up short. And, you know, the blame goes across the board and including Lamar Jackson needing to be bigger in certain spots, you know, better in certain spots. But it comes back to how do they get there. Lamar is the first domino, obviously, you know that the most not even a dominant. He’s the overall you know, he he’s the show, right? I mean, in the same way that Josh Allen is in Buffalo and Patrick mahomes is in Kansas City. And Jalen hertz is in Philadelphia. But beyond that, getting an offensive coordinator that can modernize this passing attack, make it much more refined and sophisticated, while still hoping that you keep it tied to your running game. Because I don’t think anyone even those like me who’ve complained a lot about the passing game and talking about needing to be better, have never said that. I want that to mean that they just abandon what they do as a running, you know, as as a running team. I want them to be a fantastic play action and RPO team in the way that Philadelphia has been. You know, that’s what, that’s what I envisioned for the Ravens. So, but you want to have that and you want to have this coordinator be able to tie it in to the running game. You don’t want to lose that. That’s why I liked the fact that they’re taking a long look at this because one of the worst I made mention of this when they went from Gary Kubiak who went to Denver, I mean, there’s nothing nothing the Ravens did there. That was his dream job. That was the one head coaching job he would actually take, at least according to him at that time. I mean, who knows, but they went from him and that fantastic outside stretch and zone blocking. And you know that that Kubiak Shanahan offense that continues to Kyle Shanahan has been able to breed so much new life and principles that his dad and Kubiak used but You had that, and then you went to Marc Trestman. And that running game completely. Just Of course, that was 1000 yard, you know, 1000 plus yard rusher in 2014. Wasn’t that in 2015, that offensive line was a shell of of what it had done the previous year, because there’s secret sauce involved there. So that’s where I say, better get this, right, because you want to Yeah, you want to be more dynamic from a passing standpoint. But if you lose that magic from a running game standpoint, and look, there’s no one better than Greg Roman. And that’s not to say that, that’s me advocating that they should have kept Greg Roman, but you have to at least acknowledge it. There is no one better when it comes to a running game than Greg Roman in this day and age. So your long story short of what I’m trying to convey here, you want to find that proper balance. And that doesn’t mean
Dennis Koulatsos 35:53
you also need that capability to come back loop. We saw the revenue flow multiple Sure. 10 point the 10 point lead, right double digit lead, but we also seen teams come back when 2027 30 points, which is unheard of, but it just goes to show you that the league is evolving, it’s changing, it’s becoming more and more, in my opinion, an arena football type of league Not, not that there’s anything wrong with that, but it does lend itself to some historic comebacks. And in a league where you’re you’re down by 17 or 20 points heading into the fourth quarter, you still have a chance to pull out a victory. Yeah,
Luke Jones 36:28
it feels more more like the NBA in that way. Right. I
Dennis Koulatsos 36:30
mean, it’s okay. And I’m okay. Look, I’m fine with it. Right. But But my point is the Ravens as constructed weren’t, we knew that had gotten a hold, it would have been very difficult for them to be able to come back it just Yeah. Now by 10 points. The Ravens just seemed like an insurmountable lead down by seven points. seemed like it was a tall mountain to climb.
Luke Jones 36:46
Yeah. And I mean, Lamar Jackson had come back on a couple of occasions in 2021. We can all think back to that Indianapolis game. But yeah, in 2022. They didn’t have the horses. I mean, they just didn’t when Bateman went down. I mean, it was just, we talked about it all year, they had number three, four and five wide receivers on the field of every place. And
Dennis Koulatsos 37:04
you and I talked about it in a preseason, right? That never replaced the Hollywood Brown and that you got to have depth because you can’t just have one guy, one go to guy those positions, you need multiple, you look at the and I love what they’ve done with their tight end room, for instance, you know, they have they have some quality depth in that room. And they didn’t have the same thing at wide receiver and it’s a league, it is a passing League. Yes, you have to run the ball, right? That that’ll never go away. But you have to be able to be dynamic and explosive. And if you if you get the ball back, you’re down by six by seven or event with with 45 seconds left, you want to feel like you have a shot to move the ball down the field and be able to tie the game again.
Luke Jones 37:43
No question and I’m glad you brought up the tight end room because that is another factor as much as we’ve talked about the the OC, passing game wide receiver, obviously, Lamar. I want to see an offensive coordinator who as part of that passing game can build on what Greg Roman did in terms of the the tight end. Mark Andrews is a given here. But what did we see that was frustrating about this offense was okay, Isaiah likely was very productive when Mark Andrews wasn’t playing. Not so much whenever we talked about the idea of both of them being on the field at the same time. And look, I’m not saying that this is going to become Rob Gronkowski and Aaron Hernandez the football player not still about the field
Dennis Koulatsos 38:28
perhaps Perhaps you should oppose some game film and saw how they utilize it. How was it McDaniels utilize those guys at the same time?
Luke Jones 38:36
Yeah, we just we did not see that their success coincide it was Mark Andrews getting his which is great. Hey, you know for my money’s a second best tight end in the NFL. But it was him and then very little of likely or those games were Andrews didn’t play or you know, either was out or miss time, then we saw likely put up numbers. I’d like to see that be a little more complimentary. And that’s not to say that they’re both going to have 100 receiving yards. You know, we’re not going to say that Andrews is going to be you know, they’re gonna have 2000 yard tight ends. But can you do that because it goes back to what we said about wide receiver. Look, I agree with you. I’d like to see them get an established veteran that can kind of be you know, and maybe a best case scenario is it’s one on one a with that veteran and a healthy Rashad Bateman. And I’d like to see them draft wide receiver early day three, let’s say at latest, but that’s going to be tough to do because of the cap because of a limited number of draft picks. At the same time. You can only pick the players that are on your board, right so. So my overall point is that’s what I’m hoping for, but it might only be a veteran wide receiver and maybe you don’t get a wide receiver. You don’t draft one until the fifth round or maybe you trade.
Dennis Koulatsos 39:56
Greg keen Jared and Dante Dima should be there in a fifth and sixth sure I got it those guys. And also if they do sign up Lamar Jackson, you have to figure what that 22nd Pick the it screams to trade back if they have a willing trade partner. Right. So hopefully we can pick up at second round pick. They gave up for roquan. Smith. Yeah,
Luke Jones 40:16
I mean, it always depends who’s there, right. I mean, if the right cornerback is there, that’s your replacement for Marcus Peters, you know, and then you don’t have to put quite as much on Brandon Stevens to step into a starting role and great, you know, so, but you never know, right? I mean, there’s always I, even though the Ravens have never said this, and I don’t know this, I will still go back to on draft night, when the Ravens knew that they were going to draft or trade Marquis Brown, I suspect whether it was with the 14th Pick, because at that point, no one thought Kyle Hamilton was going to still be there, or whether it was with their 25th Pick that they were planning on in their mind. Their assumption was they were going to draft one of the wide receivers, you know, up, whichever one it was Garrett, you know, whoever felled them at 14, let’s say but you know that that run of Garrett Wilson, Drake, London, etc. It happened before then. So that was their calculated risk, I suppose. And it didn’t work out in the same way that it often doesn’t work out in the draft, because you don’t know. Because there are 3031, other GMs who aren’t going to view players in the same way that you do so. So it’s, you never really know how it’s going to play out. But to go back to just finish my thought about the new OSI, you don’t know if you’re going to have that optimal wide receiver room as much as they need to upgrade it. And I think they’ll upgrade it or they’ll attempt to upgrade it, they have to you don’t know if you’re going to get the two optimal types that we’re talking about where is established that and an earlier than later drafting, that doesn’t mean first round, but you get the point, you get the point I’m trying to make, but that might not come together. So that’s where it’s like, okay, Isaiah likely flashed ability to be a little more of a factor as a receiver, can you do that and have him be more of a factor, even when Mark Andrews is also on the field, if you can do that, and he gives you a little more of a slot option, or maybe he plays a little on the outside here and there that can mitigate some of your concern at wide receiver then. So, you know, again, it’s it’s spitballing at this point, and that’s what the ravens are going to be doing at their summit with Steve Bashaud. I mean, they’re, they’re scrimmaging every scenario at this point. And clearly they have a much better grasp on where they are with the lar, whether they’ve made some progress on the deal or whether whether they know right now, they’re probably going to trade on. I mean, whatever, whatever the reality is, you know, they they have a better idea than we do right now. So that will factor into every other decision they make. But this is the time where they’re laying all that out. Because before too long, we’re gonna be talking about pro days and workouts, and they’re gonna be focused on the draft. And oh, yeah, we’re a little little over a month away from the start of free agency. And, like we said, Ravens have a lot of tough calls to make as it pertains to their salary cap and wanting to be in a position where you can at least make a couple of modest moves here and there, you know, so it’s gonna be fascinating to see how this plays out. But in the meantime, it’s left left us a lot to talk about with not very much happening in the process just kind of been in this holding pattern here waiting to see them, make their OSI higher and waiting to see what’s going to happen with the more at least at the start of the tag window and a couple of weeks. If there is not a deal between now and then, which you never know. I said a few months ago, I was done predicting this. And I just I really don’t know what’s going to happen there. I don’t know. I don’t know if a lot of people in that building have a good idea because I think I’m guessing Eric Acosta and a couple other high ranking officials and Lamar and his close, you know, his closest inner circle. I don’t think anyone else has an idea beyond that. I think it’s a lot of educated guessing and conjecture going on with media and certainly with fan base. You know, the fan bases have numerous teams that are thinking they could be in the potential Lamar Jackson sweepstakes.
Dennis Koulatsos 44:13
Well, next week, you’re gonna we’ll review the Super Bowl, we’ll talk about the 3430 and I’ll talk to you about an Andrew Brant that tweet about the general managers and the how I thought it pertains to Eric the Casa so we’ll tease that out. But with that said, Luke, please tell our listeners where they can find your Baltimore positive wn S T, your wonderful blog and everything else that you do on social media.
Luke Jones 44:33
Absolutely. I encourage everyone to follow us on Twitter at wn S T can follow me personally at Baltimore, Luke, I’ll be on the scene and Owings Mills, whenever the Ravens hire an offensive coordinator, whenever they have some signings or things of that nature, maybe a Lamar Jackson press conference at some point or maybe not, you know, I again, who knows but check out my blog at Baltimore positive.com sponsored by coons for to Baltimore. I latest 12 ravens thoughts? Have some Spring Training preview content coming with the Orioles pitchers and catchers report next week. First workouts in Sarasota next week. So definitely still plenty of football but a little more baseball added to the mix as spring training right around the corner. You want to be on the wn St. Baltimore positive tech service sponsored by Coons, Florida Baltimore, if there is a significant ravens roster move if it is a Lamar Jackson contract signing if it is a Lamar Jackson trade, any significant local sports news sent directly to your mobile device via the wn St. Baltimore positive tech service sponsored by coons for to Baltimore. And of course, anything throughout the week on AM 15 Seven eat with Nestor, any ravens offseason press conferences, Orioles content from spring training, check out all of that at Baltimore positive.com.
Dennis Koulatsos 45:46
All right, my friend, enjoy the rest of your week. Enjoy the Super Bowl and I’m sure we’ll have a lot to talk about one week from today.
Luke Jones 45:53
No doubt kick back enjoy our last football game not counting the USFL and all that which I’m just not into. But last NFL game of the season should be a good one. And at this point at this time next week, Dennis perhaps we will be talking about a new ravens offensive coordinator. Now it feels like that decisions coming to a head in the days after the Super Bowl. So time to make a decision and move forward and see who that individual is going to be
Dennis Koulatsos 46:19
great stuff as always Luke, I really appreciate you. Thanks, Dennis. I
Luke Jones 46:22
appreciate your talk next week. All right, my friend.
Dennis Koulatsos 46:24
There we go. It was a great loop challenge here on 1570 Am wn est we’ll take a quick break and come back right after this.
