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Catching a break for pain relief and trying to Move

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As our continuing education series with Wendy Bronfein of Curio Wellness moves into real life after Nestor’s wife Jenn broke her ankle two weeks ago, the cannabis conversation moved back to a gel product that has proven functional for pain relief.

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

week, pill, product, talk, gel, curio, plant, science, happened, find, wife, orioles, pain, pill bottle, night, great, little bit, traditional, day, tablets

SPEAKERS

Nestor J. Aparicio, Wendy Bronfein

Nestor J. Aparicio  00:01

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Welcome home we are wn St. am 1570, Towson Baltimore and we are we’re making it happen here in the summer heat. Orioles making their thing happened. Luke’s been out No, he’s Mills all week. Hope you’re enjoying all of our program we’ve had Rockstar stop by this week Thomas Dolby came by did the crabcake tour was to Gainesville and Mark Bryan from hooting the blowfish checked in. So we did a long chat about his love of the Orioles and our mutual love of the Orioles. We’re doing crab cakes all week long or Coco’s on Wednesday. We are we’ll be at Fleet Week down in the heart of everything and Fells Point living classrooms who I know my next guests will appreciate on land and sea and in air. It is Maryland Fleet Week. A lot of stormy out on the road all week long will be cost this next Thursday before the Orioles beat up on the Yankees. I will be there all afternoon, Jessica valus, who just redid our brand new website at Hartford design, she’ll be our guest she has her own podcast, so I’m gonna let her be on my podcasts next Thursday as well like the young kids do it. And then on the 25th will be a Pappas in Parkville Maryland lottery scratch offs, I will have the new sevens to giveaway, which I’m looking forward to as well. Not that I’m tired of Miss Pac Man, but it’s time to get on to Mrs. Pac Man. And then of course, later on, we’ll be doing other things like the oyster tour later on this summer. Beginning in September, curio wellness and foreign daughter presented our 25th anniversary documentary. They’ve been helping me share lots and lots of memories and stories and old stuff including even this week. Tom Matty, there’s a book out on Tom Matty and found this cool little picture that was a part of the documentary. But we’ve needed foreign daughter and curio wellness in my home that we skipped last week when you’re off doing some thing get smarter about how to grow this and sell this and do that and the new space and all that. But are you aware that my wife went hiking in the woods and just turned her ankle and broke it or this has been? There’s been a painful week around here. WNS t when

Wendy Bronfein  01:55

I knew about the broken ankle, I did not know how it happened. It was a high

Nestor J. Aparicio  02:01

early right after her birthday. Birthday June. She’s just celebrating birthday. She goes out. She’s got the water pack. I mean, my wife’s the sticks the whole deal, right? She goes out about two miles from where we are, you know, they’re Providence, and the gun, neck gunpowder of Loch Raven, and my phone rings at 919 She’s been gone 20 minutes and she’s screaming and crying. She’s in a ditch. So she’s talking to me and I grabbed my keys. I don’t even have my wallet. Gone. Where are you? I’m up here. Okay, I’m near the road. I think I can see the road I see a house let me try to get to the house. She’s talking to me. She’s breathing. Like I’m on the phone and I’m like I thought she’s bleeding it took her it took her a good four minutes to tell me she turned her ankle I didn’t even was wrong. I’m in the car driving and I’m like I’m being the calm when she’s had cancer twice. You know, I’m a parent. I’ve dealt with all this. She was clearly alive and going to be okay. I just had to get to her. She made her way to a clearing it got her within 30 minutes, iced X ray diagnosed cast on the foot the whole deal. And then comes the pain and then comes the oh what where? Where are we on pain management? And of course you know doctors are offering opioids in that and territories all in and you know, like and we’re like, Okay, where do we go with it? And that’s just a new one for me and you I know it’s not new for you, but it’s new for our conversation. And what would you say to my wife we just met about things you could do to at least for the summer because you can’t get missed the stones can’t get around. This is um this is where maybe you come in and we get some education today.

Wendy Bronfein  03:41

So I you know, you’re saying if she’s experiencing ankle pain as it as it heals and keeps going well I’m

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Nestor J. Aparicio  03:48

gonna tell you what she did you know, Can I can I give you what happened here? Yeah, move balm which we discussed. And this is before the Northern Lights went all over Canada on Wednesday night again, and I missed it. But we wound up with the gel. And I want to say that like I came in at Christmas time with Gina and your dad and we did the plan. I encourage it. One of my favorite podcasts of the Year by the way with your dad tell him I’m talking to him since that day. I don’t bother him using my phone I leave him alone. I bother your sister with funny things but I don’t bother him. It was one of my favorite shows and that day you sent me out because I had not thought about the bond but you were talking to Gina about it and you convinced me you’re like hey, try it aches and pains you do yoga this might make sense better than Bengay and adsorbing jewelry that smell bad. And I started using it and it like I get a bad back it really works. But this gel happened and I didn’t love the gel because he get it on your hands and you know what I mean? Like the bomb just became my go to we’ve talked about this but the gels a little messier and it has it has a pump on it so you can put it you know right where it needs to be. Well obviously this week we have these products and having Use the gel much because I’ve used the bomb. And when we end up getting hold on a second here, this is my other bomb that’s now you know, like so I use the bombs, right. But the gel we haven’t used and I swear to you last night, she can finally kind of touch it because it was perfect. It looks like the Northern Lights is purple, green, blue, red, you know, salty, shade swollen, you know, so you can touch it. I mean, the first week, but she started using the gel, like two days ago, I stole this off her desk, and it’s helping this your stuff work, secure your wellness, as well say that out loud is a spokesman or endorsement person, but you’ve put this stuff around my world and my wife broke her ankle, and it’s giving her some relief. And that’s nice. So thank you.

Wendy Bronfein  05:45

I know, you’re welcome. I would have said in this case gel mostly because if it was fresh and the site hurt, you know, the gel is a much like a gentler application. Whereas with the bomb partials nice is like when it’s when you’re using it, if things ache, it’s like you’re kind of massaging yourself as

Nestor J. Aparicio  06:03

good back I gotten really good at it.

Wendy Bronfein  06:06

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But if your ankle or something is broken, and the to the touch the place hurts, you know, that’s not going to be great. The other thing is the you know, with with the gel or the balm, which is transdermal, that’s where we’ve talked about, you don’t always have to put it where it hurts, you can just put it where you’re veiny. And it’ll, it’ll cut through into your bloodstream and move in your body. But you can definitely put it there as well. I’m glad to hear it’s helping that. That would have been my my recommendation relative to like, do you want to deal with the pain and you don’t want to have any sort of functionality impact, right? No psychoactivity just the relief? Well,

Nestor J. Aparicio  06:42

the psychoactivity happened when she took the cast off. And the only thing I could think of that will be better than a curio wellness product or any sort of even like hard drugs that would make our kitty cat has been watching her like roll around in this boot. And she could take the boot off now. And she was literally watching the Orioles. She was watching cold cold Irvin deal on the Hill against the other night. And the cat came up and laid right on her bad foot or tried to at least a little bit to like sue their pain. So we have all sorts of medicinal qualities around here. Wendy brown find is our chief cannabis officer. She is the Chief Brand Officer at curio wellness. And you know, I’ve written down a whole bunch of stuff here this week for us to like, have a little fun to talk about things even sleep, my wife had problems with sleep, because she did start to take sort of hard stuff the first couple of days, and it’s sort of wack, they’re all out. She didn’t have to work some nights and days were weird the first eight days, she’s back to work now. And so you know, the sleep thing is important. And I’ll get to that. But I just wanted to talk to you about like you weren’t here last week, you’re off doing stuff. And I kind of kid you, I don’t know where you are, whether you’re dealing with governmental issues, whether you’re dealing with product issues, or growing new things, or new flavors, or sense or this or that or stranger, or whether you’re often some of your other states where you do business. But I just keep thinking about the flower part of your business, and trying to grow the best stuff. Because I keep coming back to that. And I don’t know, we’ve talked a lot about that, because we talked about flower and indica, sativa and hybrid, but for what your industry is going through to have all of these new products. And it’s so sort of new. And all of you sort of find different things, including go back to the conversation with your dad about stomach issues and GI issues and different things. Where’s the science on the plant for you and how much you keep up with because I’ll be honest, I could talk to doctors and bring some nerds on or whatever. But I always say to people I know. I don’t know whether you studied horticulture in college or when you had a science mine or whatever. But whenever I talk to you, you’ve clearly as a brand and for what curio does and for the industry itself for safety and the stigma and all of that, your your science forward and all of this stuff. And I don’t talk to you enough about that.

Wendy Bronfein  08:55

Oh, yeah. So well, the science that kind of goes into the formulation and product creation, same level of attention goes in on the plant the cultivation side, right? Because that’s, that’s sort of the, you know, active ingredient in everything, right? There’s that commercial like, you know, the best cheese comes from the best cows, right? So we sort of think about that in terms of our products and our plants, right our plants are are the oil that make any of our products so we need to start with great material. So everything we do in the cultivation facility is based off of data and kind of optimizing the grow and the science that we have at play. We actually have two PhD plant scientists who lead the applied science part of our business. They have dedicated r&d space. They’re constantly looking at ways to improve the yields of our grow, to best understand and protect the genetics that we hold. And then They maintain our tissue culture lab, which is, you can almost think of it like the way you would freeze in them, you know, if you were going to do like IVF, and you were to have an embryo that you create, and you you check that it’s healthy, and then you freeze it. Well, here we’re taking very small cuttings from from a plant almost picture like the size of like a clover or blade of grass. And we’re suspending that in a test tube. And we can bring back that cultivar, just from that one piece of plant material that we’re holding, which is a much more much more efficient way than having a lot of mothers that we have to keep alive. But also it keeps the genetics much healthier than having large scale plants just being preserved for growth at any point in the year. I

Nestor J. Aparicio  10:47

guess the science part of it is where you’re taking it and where the industry is going to need to go. And so Joe Biden schedule one and all the things that have gone on with it, but proving efficacy. And even, you know, I think of myself as an essay T guy hanging out with the English people, but I don’t use the word efficacy all that often. And it’s something that I heard you using early on in our relationship, but testing this stuff and saying that as an example and I’ll promote another one of your products here. So I got the empty bag because it’s had it had a product in it before. And literally a couple five nights ago my wife’s three nights in a lot of pain. She was a soldier about it the first day my wife had cancer twice 155 nights in the hospital almost died the whole deal to bone marrow transplant just awful things happen to my wife, but like she’s she’s great with pain management just in a general sense. But about day three or four she was wacky from the the real drug she had to go to the CVS and get behind the counter. It’s amazing how inexpensive they can make that stuff when you have insurance for 78 cents per prescription and then you know I don’t know what it was or whatever but so I came home this was in the bag the whole I don’t even know what was in it right because I had the bag and I bought it for her because she’s she’s a person that needs better sleep at night right in her 50s had cancer twice as a hard job as the stare to screen has had a lot of issues like getting a full good night’s sleep for way more important than me. You know I’m bouncing off the walls after three or four hours I’m I sleep less than life as I get older. So I pop this open for her to I don’t even know what they can’t I didn’t even know how to hold the canister so unique looking little product and what these are tell everybody about because this is pulse release technology. So what do you know me while the idiot Dundalk guy in me the non horticulturist was trying to explain this to her. And you know what I do now? I’m like, I got Wendy on the show this week. Carrie Wallace, I’m gonna have her explain it and then I’m gonna make my wife watch it. How about that? How does this right? So

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Wendy Bronfein  12:51

okay, so let me back it up with that because you’re very timely because our quarterly scientific board meeting is tomorrow. But so one of the members of our scientific board is a seasoned pharmacologist and has developed several traditional drugs, prescription drugs. One of them that he holds the patent on is Adderall XR. So he is an expert in pulse and extended release formulations and a pill. So rather than taking something and it hitting immediately, and then you know, that’s your surge and it falls off having the pill set up so that it can sustain effects, or it can kind of pulse the effects at you at different junctures. So the good night tablet when we trialed it with patients was built using that system. So the idea here is that because in our in our interviews with patients understand issues with sleep, falling asleep and staying asleep are sort of part of the equation and so that I

Nestor J. Aparicio  13:56

wake up to pee anyway, though, right. So I wake up middle of the night IP. Do I go back to sleep quicker because of this?

Wendy Bronfein  14:01

Yeah. So like that in the study and the study that we did, people who had like interruptions like that, like getting up to the bathroom or whatever. They rather than that being an inciting event where it’s like, well, I paid it three and then I never went back to bed. It was I didn’t I did it. I didn’t remember that I did it or like you did it. But you went back to bed. So what happens is, is you’re you’re meant to take the pill. It’s just a pill you swallow 30 minutes before bed and it has an immediate release. That’s the fall asleep. Three hours later. It has a second release. That’s the stay asleep. So now the pill is 15 milligrams total between two cannabinoids THC and CBN it’s scored in the middle so you can actually break it in half and start with a lower dose if you prefer. You will still get the same pulse system in each half.

Nestor J. Aparicio  14:56

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I haven’t even looked at the oh my god they just came flying out there’s a little there. cotton in the top, I mean this literally,

Wendy Bronfein  15:01

yeah, blue pill first little

Nestor J. Aparicio  15:05

blue pill I was gonna say let’s look not too familiar with. But it’s funny because it comes into similar canister is, as pre rolls do. But I didn’t even know what kind of pill was going to come out until like this like surprise, like show and tell on the show on the air here. So, um, you know, your family was in the pharmaceutical business forever and ever, and your dad has talked to me about that and dispensing things that look like pills. But when I come into the store, it’s no wrapper like this in a container like this. I didn’t know what I was expecting to find, to be really honest with you. But it shouldn’t shock anyone and I saw something this week, you know, stuff pops up on reels if you’re on social media. And I picked that in some way. And it had nothing to do with cannabis. I think it might have even been like Neil deGrasse Tyson kind of scientific kind of thing about like, the cavemen had a headache, and they chewed on tree bark. And that turned into aspirin. And like, that’s kind of how all this kind of started. The thing with cannabis in the stigma has been such a, you know, over 100 years, with, you know, here, specifically all over the world. But starting in America, it’s an amazing thing that all of this is sort of readily available and safe and not, not having lots of I talked about booze all the time, I drank a little bit too much wine last weekend, that morning, just a little bit of the hay. And I’m like, oh, man, that doesn’t happen here. And I, you know, I think you’re onto something with science, I think this plant thing is going to work out when he’s what I’m getting at? Well,

Wendy Bronfein  16:37

you know, so most drugs do come from plants, right? So that that goes back to our whole call cultivation piece in the sense that like, the hygienic environment that we grow those plants in, is through that lens, right, we’re going to use them to make something that people either going to inhale, or the oil from, it’s going to be ingested in some way. And so you know, we want this to be a very kind of clean and high quality product, the one that you have there just to kind of comment on the sizing. So for on the adult use side of Maryland’s program, you are limited by both the potency in a single piece, as well as the full package. Now we would argue that those tablets that are medicinal form should not be sort of through the same lens as quote and edible, they’re not that kind of product. But nonetheless, that’s how they’re seen. So the original package of that came in potentially one of two ways either in a 15 count or a 30 count. And that puts the total amount of THC in a traditional pill bottle too high for an adult use consumer. So when we when we learned just ahead of adult use that the existing product was not going to be eligible for purchase we quickly pivoted by saying you know what we can put 10 of these inside of one of those tubes like we use like people use for pre rolls and and get be able to get it to market quickly. So yeah, it’s not the traditional packaging for tablets but it what’s allows us to get a compliant adult use product out there ideally just didn’t

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Nestor J. Aparicio  18:13

look like a bottle that Advil or any of those kinds of things look like yeah, that’s all on

Wendy Bronfein  18:18

the medical side. If you bought like a month supply like a 30 count supply, it would be in a traditional like push downturn pill bottle.

Nestor J. Aparicio  18:26

Whatever I find this year she’s got a scoot. I’ll get her back on next week. I think happy Yeti is going to be coming on next week. So I’m going to be you know going down and Montgomery PG County down to the you know we got the Phillies coming in here this week get all sorts of sort of poor so I’m going to have a little bit of fun because I had some combatant commanders fan on this week. And I thought the only science I was gonna get this week was Thomas Dolby and it turns out when he brought find blinding me she blinded me with the science of all things foreign daughter and curio wellness you can find them afar daughter isn’t ammonium please be of legal age. Please be open minded enough to understand the science and the education that we’re trying to present here around town and I’m gonna give you a chance to talk about Gunnar Henderson all the great pitching this week but this time next week there’s me beating up on the Yankees well plenty more to talk about Have a great week when he thanks for the education appreciate it. What did Brian find joining us here she is the Chief Brand Officer for all things, curio wellness, I still have these. This isn’t the product THCV we talked about this two weeks ago, citrus honey product and I’ve been checking out as well, clarity. I’m gonna do some writing later on in the summer to be interesting. So I’ll be on to that. I am Nestor. We are wn st am 1570, Towson Baltimore. And we never stop talking Baltimore positive good stuff.

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