They are the Elton John and Bernie Taupin of Baltimore sports media – only gathering a few times a year and making podcasts, videos, blogs and radio from two different states for two decades at WNST Baltimore Positive. Luke Jones and Nestor Aparicio convene at Kooper’s North on “A Cup Of Soup Or Bowl” to discuss the direction of 2025 Baltimore Orioles. It’s baseball season, Birdland…
Nestor Aparicio and Luke Jones discuss the 2025 Baltimore Orioles’ outlook, focusing on pitching and potential roster moves. They highlight the importance of Adley Rutschman’s health and performance, the potential of Grayson Rodriguez, and the depth in the pitching staff. They compare the Orioles’ payroll to other MLB teams, noting the financial flexibility and the need for a blockbuster trade. The conversation also touches on the importance of a balanced lineup, the impact of injuries last season, and the potential for young players like Jackson Holliday and Colton Cowser to improve. They conclude with a light-hearted discussion about the Orioles’ new uniforms.
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
Orioles pitching, Adley Rutschman, Corbin Burns, Zach Eflin, Grayson Rodriguez, bullpen depth, payroll concerns, young players, position player depth, trade possibilities, health concerns, defensive improvements, lineup balance, playoff potential, uniform changes
SPEAKERS
Speaker 1, Luke Jones, Nestor Aparicio
8
Nestor Aparicio 00:00
Welcome back. We are W, N, S, T AM, 1570 Taos in Baltimore. We’re here at Cooper’s pub north in May’s chapel. They call it Cooper’s north. We’re here in the plaza in beautiful Timonium. So brought to you by our friends at the Maryland lottery. It is a cup of soup or bowl. We have lots of bags for the Maryland Food Bank people bring canned goods up here, doing the right thing and participate and helping us out. Also. Our friends at wise markets have been involved in this. This is a little bit of a homegrown segment. Luke Jones joins us. Mean joins me. Now. It’s really hard to get him down into the city because he does 81 baseball games and he’s doing football games and out to Owings Mills. But Luke lives across the border in Pensacola, and when I said Timonium, he’s like, it’s not that far. Yeah. So 30 minutes, 33 I don’t know, but right off 83 absolutely, I was thinking on my way here, it is so rare when you and I are actually physically together. We are Bernie. Bernie. It’s so funny talking. And I was thinking about it. I was just like, when were we in a room together? Yeah, which was the end of baseball season? I mean, that was October. Listen to us. It was like, together a lot. I’m like, I mean, we zoom so often, so it feels like we spend more time together. This is the part where you really admit that you’re glad I don’t have a media production because I’d be sitting next to you, bugging you like you’re crazy. Well, you know, I hate me working next. I just bury my head in my laptop, and I hate myself when I’m next to you. That’s all because I’m funny. I’ll glib and I don’t take any of it seriously because I just, well, that was always preseason football games. I mean that that was the shtick. And be like, really, here’s my new shtick this week. Welcome back. We’re wnst today. On today’s program, we’re going to take a hard look at the impact of this year’s Pro Bowl, because this is the week we always do that. I think I said to you earlier this week, if I put a headline up that said, Luke and Nestor, break down the Pro Bowl. Would anyone click on it? No, it would be literally, let’s tear it down. Break it down so it doesn’t exist. Probably 15 Super Bowls together before, like, they started throwing me out all these years of doing this, and we did football and all that, it’s it’s baseball. By the time people hear this, there will be either a new Super Bowl champion or an old Super Bowl champion. The Orioles are trying like, this is their time now, right? Justin Tucker is gonna have his name run through the mud every day. And the Orio and the raves would get to deal with free agency. The Ravens aren’t gonna get better this off season. They’re not gonna make some splash signing of a player that you’re gonna say, well, that they’re gonna win. They better win the Super Bowl the guys they have now the Orioles, we’re still at a point where there could be a blockbuster deal for them at some point in the summer, in the spring, at a time we could see that this Japanese kids seven and two in June. Yeah, 35 right? I mean, I’m trying to think of Jackson holiday could roll into form rutsman could come back and be the guy that he better come back and be the guy that you better be nice kind of top of the list, yeah, but beside you might come up and be the guy that while he pips him a year. Now, I don’t know how this works out. It’s baseball, right, but I do know pitching is important, and I know in the end of the day, we’re gonna wind up talking about pitching and them either having enough, not having enough, or even the perception that they don’t have enough, which kind of ate them up last year after the injuries. And there was a perception that they couldn’t win in October and they couldn’t well, but
Luke Jones 03:30
it wasn’t because of the pitching. They couldn’t hit. I mean, they pitched fine in those two games, but yeah, I mean, obviously begins with the pitching. And I mentioned Adley rutschman, that’s for me, that’s the prerequisite. He’s got to look like Adley rechtman again. The guy was for two calendar years, and then he wasn’t for three months, which I think he was hurt. I asked him point blank after the game two loss, season ending loss to Kansas City. And, you know, didn’t want to go there, but you read the tea leaves, you see when he got hit on the hand, all that. So making that assumption, because it’s all we can go off of at this point in time, you hope he bounces back. He’s healthy, better shape, whatever might have been bothering him. All that, right, so, so that’s first but, yeah, when you lose Corbin burns, when Kyle Bradish, best case scenario is back in July, let’s say might not pitch at all this year. Who knows? You certainly can’t count on that, but you’re looking at the top of the rotation. Okay? Zach Eflin, good trade line edition, or trade deadline edition, pitched, well, it’s under contract for another year. We talked about that. Feel good about him. He’s 30, wrong side of 30. I mean, he’s not old, but he’s not young and not
Nestor Aparicio 04:40
inexpensive. I mean, given that where we were the different Sure, old ownership and new ownership. But the
Speaker 1 04:45
8point is, he’s as close as a sure thing as you would get. I mean, he has a little bit of an injury history that goes back to Philadelphia, so I think it’s important to be mindful of that. But, I mean, let’s face it, I say this to you, better make 30 starts. Everyone is durable until they’re not anymore. In any sport. Well, if they’re gonna win a world, if they’re gonna compete this year, I mean, he’s got him, it’s the 28 to 33 starts, and he’s got to be hell yeah. I mean, it’s very, very don’t think you’re gonna get that out of Rodriguez. Well, that’s where you’re about to go. Well, I don’t know if you say you don’t think, but until you see it, there’s going to be some doubt, right? I mean, I don’t think there’s any reason to think that he’s just going to be hurt, but until you see, I don’t have in pencil in for 30 starts, right? I mean, well, you have a penciled in, but look, everything’s in pencil when you’re talking about pitching. I mean, let’s be, let’s call this is
Nestor Aparicio 05:29
where you start saying, who’s our sixth, seventh, eighth guy, who’s the guy we’re gonna deal with. That’s, that’s what’s
Luke Jones 05:33
interesting to me. And we talk, we’ve talked about this from a pitching depth standpoint, when you start talking about guys that you project to be number four, number five types. They’ve got a decent stable of guys like that at this point in time. I mean, even go, you know. I mean, who knows what’s gonna happen with Trevor Rogers. He’s been in their organization now to see if they can, quote, fix him. I mean, that was always the idea, to some extent when they acquired him from Miami. Kate povidge pitched well down the stretch, he’s not even in there. They’re projected starting five to begin the season, but he pitched well. So
Nestor Aparicio 06:05
interesting. You look at what they gave up for him, and it’s a placeholder in a different place where they we always say they need more pitching. They need more pitching. Well, they gave up some depth in position player, depth for guys that you know, we can sit here and talk all day about a second baseman and whether that’s the right thing to do, but if they get 40, 5060, innings at a four clip out of him, four and a half clip out of him, we evaluate that a little differently. And that’s not asking a lot. That’s asking for him to be participatory. And I saw the Danny cologne thing that that the arms have changed in this bullpen, and the arms are changing the rotation, from where all that hope was last March to where it is right now. The organization has done a transplant with pitching in order to be competitive this year, and have gone all in on these one year deals. Yeah,
8Luke Jones 06:52
no question. I mean, we’ve talked about it. I mean, go, look at their payroll. It’s middle of the pack and Major League Baseball now, which was not the case even. What is it? Where are they? 140 Yeah. I mean, it depends on which source you want to look at cots baseball contracts, which is pretty reliable. You know, across baseball, I think they’ve had them one, 150 something like that. I mean, it’s not too far off from where the it peaked in the Dan Duquette era. So which, fully acknowledging that was almost a decade ago at this point, but it speaks to they’ve spent money. Now, I’m not saying that they’ve spent it in a way that I would pitching or and they
Nestor Aparicio 07:30
save some money on position by not signing Santa on there. Right? Sure, so. And at some point that money in position is all going to go to these kids that are going to hit arbitration fully start. I mean, it already has storm. Gunner Henderson is going to take a major move soon. Oh, sure, right. And it’s going to be substantial to add whatever your 150 becomes a 170 real quick, right? Well, but, but even the last couple years, I mean, Santander was getting raises up. Cedric Mullins, look at what he’s making, point in time. So, so they were always going to get more expensive. You know, by the way Cox hasn’t, as we speak right now, right around $160 million now, I’m hoping that’s not the the end all be all ceiling for what? David’s, 284 blue jays, 243, Red Sox, 171, and the razor, right? So, so the nationals are spending 108 this year. So it’s climbed, and it’s climbed substantially. And I’m again, I’m not patting them on the back for that. I’m just trying to speak where we are in terms of Phillies are spending 288 The Braves are 216 the twins are 149 cubs, 191 cardinals are spending, what they’re out spending the Cardinals issue, which they
Luke Jones 08:39
will Cardinals have kind of, you know, they’ve dipped, and they’ve struggled the last couple years. And, you know, I’ve, kind of, I’ve used the Cardinals as a well, that’s why I was looking for them, right? And they fluctuated, right? I mean, some years they’ve been as high as maybe eighth or ninth over the last 20 years. And some, well,
Nestor Aparicio 08:55
8the brewers are telling their fans they’re trying to win, and they gave Corbin burns away. And their payrolls 108 million, you know, and they were in the playoffs last year, so, and their fan base isn’t like mad at them for not getting they’ve they have become conditioned to be middle class and and I if that we’re all chopper lower class. We’re all trying to figure out where the Orioles want to position themselves, yeah, and I still think a lot of that’s unknown. You know, what’s going to happen with mass and what’s going to happen, in a general sense, with Major League Baseball, local TV rights. What’s going to happen with people like me, if I’m going to give them money or not? Are they going to get me back? Are they going to start getting six, 800,000 bucks a year from me or not? I don’t know if you know. So. So,
Luke Jones 09:34
I mean, these are questions that we’re not going to answer today, but we look at the state of the pitching staff. Does it have the the number one, Corbin burns, ace. No, it doesn’t going in, going into the season two years ago, Kyle Bradish wasn’t perceived to be Kyle Bradish yet, and he finished fourth and Cy Young voting that year. Can Grayson Rodriguez make that kind of jump this year? If he stays healthy? I think he’s got a chance to well, we talk
Nestor Aparicio 09:56
a lot about the 14 Orioles, and we talk about way in Shen now. Tillman pitched a little bit more like a one for a minute or two, a bunch of threes. I mean, twos and threes and fours Exactly,
Luke Jones 10:06
exactly. And that’s where I look at where they are from a rotation standpoint. Look, I’d still love to see a move made for Dylan cease or Luis Castillo or someone like that, whether it’s in the next three days, whether it’s in the next two weeks, or whether it’s in June, right? Well,
8Nestor Aparicio 10:20
this is where the intrigue I’ll bring you into that a little bit, because they signed the outfielder thinking that there might be some curse there. There’s a little bit of positioning to think like they still want to make a spot. They want to know
Luke Jones 10:33
that they obviously have the farm system, the capability of doing that, the financial flexibility they should have to do that again. I don’t think this isn’t about money. That’s about 10. You’re talking about a guy that’s in the final year of, you know, having one year of control, like Corbin burns. Think about what you gave up for. Corbin burns, you know, would you even have to give up Heston? Curse that and look, let me be clear. And you could check this out in greater length at Baltimore positive.com Ramon Laureano, who hits left handed pitching. Good, good fielder, great, one of the best throwing arms in baseball. Probably not a center fielder anymore, but certainly a guy that you could put in left or right and feel good about when you’re going up against left handed starters. You kind of look at the condition of the Orioles outfield right now. You know Tyler O’Neill was signed to essentially replace Santander. We know that crushes left handed pitching. Look at his splits against right handers the last few years. Not terrible. But also, you know, if you’re facing a really tough right hander, given that might be a day to give him a, you know, give him the night off facial Corbin burns. I mean, we we know Cedric. Cedric Mullins, as much as I credit him for rebounding from a brutal start last year, two of the last three years, he’s basically been unplayable against left handed pitching. So, you know, Colton cows are the books still out about him in terms of facing left handers. You know, I think he had a 660 ops against lefties last year. It’s not great, but better than Mullen. But I think with some of the guys like him, he’s got a lot of play. And that’s the thing you and I argued Harold Baines. He went from lefty to righty all the sure, you know, but
Nestor Aparicio 12:02
you have to, you have to give me back right?
Luke Jones 12:04
8You’ve got to see what it looks like. And that’s where to me, that’s where I’m not so inclined to look at Ramon liriano and say, Oh, where they’re going to trade Heston kerstadt. I see a path because of what I just said, because you have so many guys that are kind of platoon at least questionable, that there should be a path for Heston kerstad to get legitimate at bats. And look, I’m not saying that means 600 no
Nestor Aparicio 12:25
question, you don’t love him with a glove either. You know, I don’t. I don’t think
Luke Jones 12:30
he’s as bad with the glove as like. I don’t think he’s Mark Trumbo out there. Let me put it that way. I think if you give him more opportunities out there at the major league level, keep in mind, this guy’s had very limited opportunities, and a lot of that’s been because of that’s been because of health. Unfortunately, the best stretch of time he’s had in the major leagues was right until he got beamed in the head by, you know, by the Yankees in mid July, and that derailed the rest of his season. So I think he’s someone that you obviously you signed Tyler O’Neill. I’m not saying you just let Santander go and you hand 650 plate appearances to curse dad. But I think because of how O’Neal profiles as a guy who has an injury history, a guy that you’re going to get some days off here and there, certainly because you’re going to platoon Cedric Mullins, and that opens up left field. We talk so much about Mullins not being here. He’s still here. He’s still here. And look if there’s a trade to be made for a pitcher, if they want Cedric Mullins, and that’s, well, there’s a salary issue now with him, right? I mean, it is to a point, but, but I think some of it is also, well, half the organizations don’t want to pay anybody we’ve already Yeah. I mean, you want to take on salary. You don’t want to take it off. It’s amazing. I was looking at something the other day. I mean, as bad as the Orioles have been, and as woeful as management and ownership has been for the better part of three going on four decades. I look at the I saw some factoids about the pirates. I think, I think I read, still the biggest free agent contract they’ve given to an outside free agent, I think, is $17 million like, it’s it’s insane, it’s absurd. The
Nestor Aparicio 14:02
schemes things gonna Yeah, really. I mean, test them, and it’s a shame, because
8Luke Jones 14:05
I, you know, as Raven Steelers rivalry aside, I mean, I think there’s qualities to that city that aren’t completely foreign to Baltimore, in terms of bad baseball. Well, I was talking more in terms of a fan base that would support better baseball, but, but, yeah, I think with the old they played there, you know, I go back to what you kind of said at the beginning, as much as there are questions about pitching, and I get that, you know, bullpen, I like on paper much better than it was at this time a year ago. But acknowledging Felix Batista, how quickly? How soon is he going to look like Felix Batista, or is it going to take some time? Doesn’t mean he’s going to be unusable or bad or anything like that, but is he going to be the 2023 version, pre injury version question there. But you know you’ve signed Kittredge. You have Sir Anthony Dominguez. You have Gregory Soto, who I think is an interesting wildcard. For the bullpen. The point is, I think there’s upside in that bullpen, that it can be better. What I have brought back Danny coulomb, probably, but at the same time, he’s someone who had elbow issues. Had elbow surgery in June, came back. The results were okay. Velocity was down about two and a half miles per hour on his fastball. I’m guessing the reason why they didn’t want to commit $4 million to him is not because they’re cheap. I think they really have their doubts whether he’s gonna be healthy and effective. So, you know, they pivot, they go in a different direction. Did the same thing with Jacob Webb elbow issues over there over you also
Nestor Aparicio 15:31
have to figure out the lefty thing and the lefty right thing. The game has changed in regard to how many batters you’re gonna face. And you mentioned curse that, and Colton cows are on platooning or not. I think the last thing you want to do is take a 2425 year old guy who’s been a lottery pick and and start down that pathway of being a platoon play,
Luke Jones 15:52
sure, and I think, but you want to have some balance in that regard. I mean, look at some of the toughest left handed pitching that’s in the Al east. You know, when you’re talking about one of the, you know, one of these studs, you know, you’re talking about Max freed or crochet like, think about the guys that are in this division now, is that the night that you might say, well, you know, Mullins isn’t going to play against lefties that much. I don’t think period. I think the only time he’s going to see at bats against left handed pitching, I’m guessing, is when it’s a lefty reliever in the fifth or sixth inning. You know, where you’re not going to pull them because you want his defense, but, but I think he’s you’re rarely going to see him start against lefties, but when it’s one of the toughest of the tough lefties, that might be the night to say, hey, let’s start loriano. We’re going to start O’Neill, obviously. And you know you kind of
Nestor Aparicio 16:37
8Whoa, you build your lineup to play righty lefty. We want to have the guys that hit lefties while we were in but I’m in agreement with you. You certainly don’t want to be in a position where these guys are just playing straight platoons because June and cows are sitting 180
Speaker 1 16:51
against, you know, like, then I gotta make a move exactly. And, like I said, he got better in the same way that, if you recall gunner Henderson a couple years ago, there were a lot of questions about
Nestor Aparicio 17:02
his best player in the team in April, and then right for a minute, right? He had that. He
Luke Jones 17:06
was all you know, even the the entire body of work, he was still one of the best players on the team. When you look at his total value, now, is it as consistent as you’d like it to be? No, but when he’s at his best, he’s arguably the best player on the team. Like you said, when he’s at his worst, he still defends really well, he still can give you tools that are useful to helping win baseball games. So, but I want to go back to something you mentioned because you you talked about Jackson holiday. You made mention, you know, you talked about
8Nestor Aparicio 17:31
to sit down because I’m getting old. I got Stan slack posters here. Keep going, Oh, that’s fine, you know. But
Luke Jones 17:35
I want to go back to as much as I’ll be the first to say that this off season has been underwhelming relative to hope and optimism with a new owner and new ownership and not knowing where payroll was ultimately going to go, even if you know they’re spending more, but it hasn’t been done in a sexy way. I think we’d all agree with that, right, so, but I think what I try to remind you, or anyone I’m talking to about the Orioles is there’s still a lot to like about this roster. When you look at this core group of young position players, when you think about where gunner Henderson was two years ago at this time, and what has he done since then? Well, he won Rookie of the Year, and he was arguably MVP of the league in the first three months of last season. I mean, he’s that kind of player, you know, Adley rutschman, assuming he bounces back again, that that needs to happen, you know. But because I think that has a trickle down effect on the pitching and everything, he’s got to be right. But when you look at is their biggest question, yeah. I mean, I think, you know, and whether the starting pitching is going to look like for number four is everything. I think what’s interesting about the question for rushman is, is it a question for them internally, or were they just being weird about it, and they didn’t want to, he didn’t want to admit he had an injury. They didn’t want to admit he had an injury. But he has, you know, whether it was rehab, whether it’s a little surgery, that that that teams are just like that. Now, it’s just weird. Everyone’s so secretive, and we’re seeing, we’ve seen it in football for years. I mean, for what if the guys heard he’s hurt because they can’t do it, but I think, I think they talk themselves into it being that they don’t want to make it sound like they’re making an excuse for someone, and then they’ll get into, well, privacy and HIPAA and all that. But it’s just like, Come on, guys, this isn’t, this doesn’t have to be this way anyway, internally, if they’re confident that there was a health, some kind of physical issue that caused that, then I’m guessing they’re not worried. If it wasn’t and it was a little more of a what the heck’s going on here? Then, yeah, I think internally that has
Nestor Aparicio 19:32
to be a big question, because he’s now, would that be the issue of them signing a backup catcher? No,
Luke Jones 19:37
8no. I mean, I think that was more a case of wanting to upgrade from James McCann. I mean, I mean, as much as McCann is a gamer, I mean, didn’t really hit right? Taylor T garden, baby, defense wasn’t great defensively. So, so I think, you know, with Gary Sanchez coming in, I mean, guys, a lot of pop you know, he’s another guy that you know, again, going up against a lefty starter. Might be the day that rutsman DHS and Gary Sanchez is behind. Was
Nestor Aparicio 20:00
also the part where Russia is the worst player Major League Baseball is. He spent four months last show and, like, I don’t know. I mean, you know? I mean, I hope it’s May 28 he’s hitting the buck 30, you know? Yeah, I don’t have to be a code right around here. I mean, I felt like worst of last summer was a code red, sure.
Luke Jones 20:15
I mean, I How many times did, were we sitting there talking the morning after games where I was just saying, Look, this isn’t being talked about enough. He’s really struggled. And, you know, as reporters there, of covering the team every day, we were asking about it. But you know, it’s not like Brandon heights just gonna say, oh he stinks. Or Michael is gonna say, oh he stinks. Or, or Rutger is gonna come right out and say, Well, I’m playing I’m playing her. Like, what do you expect? Like, you know, like everyone was but
Nestor Aparicio 20:39
the last day of the season, or during the off season. I know it’s an easy enough thing to Sure, and that’s why Adley was battling a hand thing, and that’s why that’s it,
8Luke Jones 20:47
right? And that’s why we that’s why we asked about it, and that’s why I’m still waiting to see if it will come out the first week of you know when pitchers and catchers report next week, and you know we’re talking about it then. But, but getting back to the young guys, the unproven guys, the Jackson holidays, knowing what gunner did, going from his cup of coffee late in 22 to what he did in 23 to what he’s become at this point. And my question for gunner, is there even another level he might get better? Yeah, I mean that. But I mean, we’ve said that about Lamar Jackson the last five years, and he’s just continued to get better, right? So some guys are just like that, but Colton cows are at this time a year ago, we didn’t know if he was gonna make the roster, right? I mean, he had a disastrous start to his major league so did Jackson. He didn’t hit it all. Same with Jackson holiday, but Jackson
Nestor Aparicio 21:28
holidays right there, right now too. He’s another guy, if they bring him in, and he’s hitting the buck 90 in May, I don’t I mean, I don’t know why one, I think we was in over his head last year. He early. He was in the first month of the season. No question about it. Did he look better when he came back? Yeah. Did he still struggle? Sure, but it wasn’t so bad where it’s like, oh well, that was just a huge adjustment to Major League pitching. He’s 828,
Luke Jones 21:53
20 season. I mean, think about how many, even some of the best of the best major leaguers, 20 years old, double A, right, right. I mean, even the best, even, you know, Cal Ripken, who was called up, but he was had just turned 21 I guess, when he was called up in 1981 I mean, so you think about that, not that that gives him a complete pass for just doing nothing, if he’s in the Major League lineup and not and not performing, but you do have to remember that he’s really young, and think about how some of these other guys have grown. Look what cows are did was a few years older, from his rookie year to what he did last year, second in Rookie of the Year. I
Nestor Aparicio 22:32
8don’t project it that way, and you don’t project it that way the sport projects Jackson holiday that sure this isn’t you and me. Yeah, this is everybody’s the Orioles hyping up. This off this guy’s gonna be has potentially better than Anderson, yeah, like, literally, exactly. I mean, the upside is for him to be that kind of player. I don’t think cows is gonna be better than Henderson, but westburg might be. I’m not sure he’s done, but that’s it, right? But that’s my thing here. When you look at some of these guys and how they grew from year one to year two. I mean, rushman was kind of rushman after his first month
Luke Jones 23:02
older, you know, Gunner Henderson, from 21 to age 22 to 23 I mean, look at the leaps and bounds of improvement that he’s made. Jordan Westberg, he’s kind of a league average player as a rookie, you know, he was okay, nothing to be discouraged about, but certainly wasn’t projected to be an all star, and now it’s like, okay. That was even with him getting hurt now he’s healthy and see what he looks like this year. So my point with all of this, and it’s not to say that they’re all going to become perennial all stars and that they’re going to be, you know, it’s like the Orioles or the Big Red Machine, but there’s a lot to like. And even with this lineup, even without Santander, there’s still a lot to like with this lineup. Do I have questions about the upside of the starting rotation? Absolutely, I do and that, and that’s why, to me, even if you like how the pitching is going come June and July, you got to be looking and saying, Man, is there a move to be made here? You know? Well, there
Nestor Aparicio 23:53
will be, right? He would. I mean, that would be the confidence level you would hope so. Yeah, Mike Elias walked in here right now. I gotta sweat him. I mean, I did. I think they’ve, they’ve done what they could do in the off season, short of pulling the trigger on giving a picture $200 million I mean, you either mean that’s a yes or no, and if you, if it’s no, what are you gonna do? And if you’re pitching me on what we’re gonna have established Major League pitchers, maybe they’re 41 years old, but we’re gonna buy these pictures for one year, and they’re not broken down, and they didn’t have bad years last year. And you know, it feels like there’s a reliability of kit Ridge, Eflin, clearly, Morton at 41 if they feel like they’re really going to get 134 decent innings out of him this year, then that becomes worth the money more than giving Corbin birds 230 and maybe suffering an injury or something catastrophic, and then holding out hope that there will be a deal to be made if they’re good enough, sure, sure. And if there’s a need. I mean, I the older worlds didn’t have the artillery to do that, that’s a difference, right? Sure, so. And we saw this
Speaker 1 24:57
at the trade deadline last year, even if you didn’t like ever. Move they made. And certainly I didn’t love every move that they made. They took on salary. I mean, not just EFL, I mean, like some of the other moves they made, they took on but in 2014 or 15 for them to make a max Scherzer kind of deal, they just didn’t have players. What are you gonna trade? Machado, he was in the team. I mean, they didn’t have any in Fort Dylan Bundy, what was it? You know? Well, that was the thing. In 14 they had the chance. If you recall, John Lester was being dangled. I remember and what I think it was Hunter Harvey. At the time, Bundy was, I think Bundy had already had Tommy John surgery, so he wasn’t an option. So they could have done it, and they decided to deal Eduardo Rodriguez for Andrew Miller, who pitched his butt off for the Orient. Well,
8Nestor Aparicio 25:37
there was also a point of who got money, too. Once Andrew Miller got paid. They weren’t going to pay anybody back then. So the rental thing for other than Chris Davis. What was it? Grow the arms by the bats. Now it’s grow the bats and buy the arm. And
Luke Jones 25:49
I think what’s interesting about the what, what is interesting about the pitching beyond the age of Charlie Morton and Sugano is to look at those two guys and also look at Zach Eflin, who obviously is already part of the staff, but arrived last, last August. Look at their walk rates. These are control pitchers. These are not guys that are going to issue free passes. You know, Morton still averages strikeout parading last year. Sagano, my biggest question with him, because he’s coming from pitching in Japan, which you know, generally, the biggest question him is everything. Well, no, but I just like, I think how he profiles in terms of throwing strikes. He doesn’t walk people, all of that. I like, is he gonna miss enough bats? And I don’t mean, oh, is he gonna strike a bunch? But if you don’t strike anyone out ever, it’s really difficult to pitch and be effective in this day and age of Major League Baseball like that. But and you got to play defense behind a gun. These are control minded pitchers. You know, they don’t walk many people. I mean, they’re gonna have to play defense. I mean, there’s no question. And I’m hoping they went through a period where they kicked the ball around. Last year, things got bad. They did and they didn’t for a year and a half. And it was really at when we started talking about it was really weird, especially with Gunner. I mean, who had played a really good shorts and and look, I still think that’s more weird copy than something to be concerned about or alarmed about long term. You know, I think Jackson holiday having another year under his belt at second base, there’s no reason to think he can’t be a good second baseman. And I think Jordan Westberg, you know, I guess his his faux pas against, you know, on the bobby Witt play in the playoffs aside, plays really good defense. So, you know, I think there’s still so much to like about this team. Am I going to sit? Am I sitting here and trying to, you know, trying to say they’re going to be a 105 win jug or not? No, I’m not going to Buffalo you about that. I mean, I certainly have my questions about the pitching, but I don’t think the cupboard is completely bare there. I think there’s depth, but the question is upside on the pitching side. But if you and you made the comparison, I mean, you brought it up, not me, 2014 team, they didn’t have a great rotation in terms of all this great upside, but they pitch well. Their bullpen was outstanding. That team defended really well, and you had Nelson Cruz and Adam Jones and not so much Machado that year, if you recall, because they didn’t hit the home runs in the end, but they were capable, right? And I think you know as much as yes, in a perfect world, you’d still have Corbin burns as your ace, there’s no doubt about that. But you know that is not the only path to being a really good team. And I’ll remind you that the Texas who was, who was the Dodgers ace, not right now on paper, but as their rotation was duct taped together last October. Who was the Dodgers ace? Who was the Rangers ace the year before? That is Nathan of Aldi. You know, well, for one
Nestor Aparicio 28:31
year, this year, without burns, burns would have been whatever 35 million, whatever that number is that that pretty much is the Japanese guy, Sagano and and to some degree Charlie Morton, or effluent, or whatever is to say, Do you want one Corbin burn Now, there’s another 100 50 million on the app back, and there’s other pictures you could plug in, but, but the but, you know what? How do you want to play this? And you know, part of the Corbin burns thing is, I’ll buy that. He wanted to pitch in Phoenix. I’ll buy that. Like he just didn’t want to be here and only thinks to the West Coast thing of like, if they gave him 230 if you game 250 would even be happy here with that. You’re going to outbid them if you didn’t want to be here. That’s one thing. If you didn’t believe in the contract or the money, that’s another thing. And if you felt like, well, we’re still going to spend 35 million on pitching this year. In that way, we’re just going to get two guys, you know, that don’t cost us down the line. I know you’re not tied into long term. This is buying a used car versus a new car. Dude, you know, like, literally, it is. They both get you there. They both drive. Hopefully you didn’t buy two lemons, right? We’re gonna see. But all of that being said, all of that being said, I think you look at you look at Vegas and the sports books,
Luke Jones 29:48
8win loss totals Orioles are right there, second or third in the American League. Now that might say way more about the overall state of the American League, more so than the Orioles, but you see that. You see some of these different projection systems, pakoda and all these, you know, zips and all these different projection systems that, for years hated the Orioles, I mean, even going back to the buck and Dan Duquette era, that always undersold them. And they, they tended, they would tend to exceed expectations in that way. You know, all of those analytics models and everything, still like this team. Now, is it again,
Nestor Aparicio 30:26
game one in October? You know what? I mean, that’s right? No, I have to get to get there. They don’t get to October. Really be something? Yeah, yeah. I mean, there were 89 and a half, you know, Vegas number. They are they better be they better be a playoff. That’s what I would say. And this pitching better hold up, this better have been a good idea pitching.
Luke Jones 30:44
And I mean, they just, they need to be healthier than they were last year. I mean, the injuries killed him in the second half of the season. I mean, there’s no question about that, and I’m not, I’m not excusing everything that happened, but, I mean, Let’s call a spade a spade. Losing Grayson Rodriguez hurt, and you lost Eflin for what, two weeks and Burns was just plain bad in August, right? I mean, that was still something that was just kind of weird, even in hindsight looking back at it. But you lost Jordan westburg. And, you know, even though Mateo was isn’t a middle of the order hitter, he’s still important depth for you. And they, you know, they lost him and rushman, what the heck was going on with him? I mean, you add all those things up, it’s less and less surprising in hindsight to look back and
Nestor Aparicio 31:23
empty
8Speaker 1 31:24
seats in the upper day. Nobody wants to go, but nobody thinks you can win, right? And, I mean, you know, I mean, you were the guy that was more optimistic than I was in mid, mid September. I mean, I was kind of throwing dirt on him at that point, because I just, I believe they’d hit the ball. Well, sure. I mean, I thought they’d score eight runs in one in the games. And let me be clear, I wasn’t saying I didn’t think they were gonna win the world. I wasn’t saying that to pat myself on the back. It was more so that it just trended in the wrong direction for a long time. Yeah, and it just felt like and that’s why coming back with that Corbin burns doesn’t feel warm and fuzzy. It doesn’t but you know what you hope to it ends up being warm and fuzzy. You hope these young guys learn from that. I mean, think about it. So many of these guys just excelled through the minor leagues. You know, that just burned through the minor leagues. I mean, you look at someone like gunner and Jackson holiday and all these guys, you know, a lot of these guys, this was their first real experience with failure. So how do you handle that? You know, do you kind of, you kind of turtle up and, you know, if it happens again in June, then, your tail spin again. Or do you say hey,
Nestor Aparicio 32:21
for Jackson holiday to go down and come back? I mean, for kids, sure. But though Jones is here, we’re at Cooper’s north, it’s all brought to you by our friends at the Maryland lottery. I have the lucky magic eight ball here. It’s the end of a cup of Super Bowl week. We are hanging out. I think I’m gonna wrap things up, because I’ll get together with you, and we’ll get the football and like all that other stuff, but there’s plenty on the baseball side with these other people. Get to the orange uniforms, which we still had five minutes on the Let’s go. I don’t want to say you’re gonna vomit now or later. I will say this much I like them more than the city connects at the very least. But you know me, man, I’m a purist when it comes to baseball uniforms, they’re gonna put them on, put the real throwbacks on, and wear the old logo. And it would be a throwback thing. Don’t have it be a modern version of, you know what? Spoiled this, though, right? Savannah bananas spoiled. No no. When they released their promotion, their giveaway schedule, they had a, it’s a green Rodriguez bobble head, and it was people notice, hey, he’s got orange pants. Look if they only wear it, they’re gonna wear white top and orange
Luke Jones 33:24
pants, or black, no, no, no, no, Orange. Or either, all orange are orange with the white like they have. They’ll keep that one as a right, but I think the all orange will be their alternate I’ve Chris pica has, I have to credit him for this, because he he’s verbalized this. I know when we’ve talked about this, or even probably been on the radio, my perfect alternate uniform for the Orioles would be, and putting aside, I like the orange jersey. It’s fine, you know, like, I’m fine with that.
Speaker 1 33:52
8He said for years that you should do a Sunday home game 1966 uniforms. You know, the classic script, the black, the black letters on the name plate, you know, the old cartoon bird cap. That would be a perfect, you know, kind of an off white, white, yeah, those dusty white. I mean that that would be the perfect Sunday afternoon home game alternate uniform. That would be,
Nestor Aparicio 34:18
but, but that’s too, but that’s, that’s too boring for today. Today’s something magic happens. You know, today’s day and age is, you got to make the uniforms uglier and ugly. Lucas here we’re making them, you dumb with it. Yeah, and, you know, it’s, like I said, it’s, it’s the day and age that we’re living in. These uniforms. Have to look you kids, don’t buy those orange pants. Whatever you do. I’m very much a keep the pants white or gray, you know, I’m or, you know, if you, if you’ve got your powder blue that some teams wear, otherwise, don’t mess with the pants. Don’t eat some gumbo. That sounds great. We’re Cooper’s north. I am Nestor. It is. All brought to you by the Maryland lottery, friends at wise markets also with us. I’m gonna do one more segment around here. I got Greg and I got Chris here. We’re gonna talk about Towson, the Towson torch, Towson transfers. Gonna talk a little bit about the documentary, which features Luke as well. He was younger then I’ve aged him dramatic. And I must really be looking old, because that’s all you keep today. You’re like, shaved up and stuff. You don’t. I hadn’t shaved all week. I hadn’t either when you and I don’t shave. You know, two old farts this month from from the time the Ravens into baseball season. This is what I catch my three times a year now. So I have to shave when things we get together smell nice and all that. We’re Cooper’s north. It is a cup of Super Bowl. It is part of our extended Maryland crab cake tour. We’re doing this all for the Maryland Food Bank. We have tons of bags back here. I’ve had lots of folks about it, food insecurity this week, and the charity today, we’ve had the greater Chesapeake foundation out. I’ve got all sorts of cards here. We had a blind industry. Jessica Normanton was here for bis M also we talked about the horizon day camp, which is also powered up by the Greater Chesapeake foundation. I had reads rescue on, had a beautiful young lady on today who rescue senior dogs, and it’s our E Ed, not like Andy Reid, like Ed Reed, and she told me my dog’s name was read because my husband’s Ravens fan and so, and she never heard from Glenn Eunice or the real Ed Reed. So I think the real Ed Reed, if I’m going to pressure anybody, this is perfect, older, wiser and still stealing hearts, just like Ed Reed, yeah, right. Just, just like Ed Reed, right? So I want to pressure Ed Reed into doing something nice for the reeds rescue. There’s my shout out to you. Glenn Yunis, so do something nice for the folks that reads rescue, who rescue senior dog. So very quick for all that, right? Very cool. Absolutely, I’m a senior dog. I appreciate you and Chris rescuing me around here as well as Greg. So if you hate the documentary, I’m going to have the guy on it’s his fault. I have anything to do. No pressure. If you love the documentary, it’s because I’ve lived a charmed life. I’m Nestor. We’re back from Cooper’s. I’m going to live a charmed life with some Gumbo and some extra rice back from more right after this. I’m.
