Eric DeCosta must be listening to Nestor Aparicio and WNST Baltimore Positive. There has been an open debate for 18 months on the show about adding Derrick Henry to the Baltimore Ravens backfield. Now, as Luke Jones suggests: you got what you wanted! The deep dive here on adding King Henry in Owings Mills.
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
derrick henry, ravens, year, running, gus, point, lamar, spending, offensive line, game, terms, yards, lamar jackson, love, edwards, week, odell beckham, steelers, standpoint, win
SPEAKERS
Nestor J. Aparicio, Luke Jones
Nestor J. Aparicio 00:01
Welcome home, we are wn st am 1570 tastic, Baltimore and Baltimore positive we are going to be taking the Maryland crabcake tour out on the road. I swear weโre gonna do this in April. But we have so much crap to get to we have free agency. We have tampering they took from us we took from them, the Steelers took from us. Luke Jones joins us now. Weโre not even to like the start yet. Right? Like all the fireworks happen beginning Monday morning, and then Monday afternoon and then Tuesday morning. And then by the time like it rolls around, they actually start free agency we all sort of know everybodyโs gonna be sitting, which makes the new world more interesting from your report tutorial side. Yeah,
Luke Jones 00:42
it does. And while weโre still going to find out some stuff at the 4pm deadline, cuts around the league, potential trades. I mean, there have been some trades around the league that have been reported. They havenโt been made official. But inevitably, if we looked in recent years, youโll find some trades. So I wouldnโt be shocked if thereโs something along those lines even for the Ravens Not that Iโve heard specifically, but you have to be prepared for anything. But in terms of the free agent movement itself. The first couple of days, the first couple waves Yeah, you get to the official start Wednesday 4pm. And thereโs inevitably a few jokes about you know, youโll see a video posted of the Tumbleweed just kind of rolling down the road. Lots going on and queue up the inevitable king for a queen. Bad jokes and puns and cliches as it pertains to the Ravens. Patrick queen out Derrick Henry in and just, you know very exciting on that front. Very interesting on both fronts, quite frankly. And as I wrote it Baltimore positive.com Ravens fan itโs not happy to see someone defect to the Steelers. And I think you know from a WWE standpoint from
Nestor J. Aparicio 01:58
the US is what Tiki Barber would say. Right? Yeah, sure.
Luke Jones 02:02
Sure. And look, letโs be clear, and weโll get to Derrick Henry, because I think Ravens fans want to hear way more about that. But look, three years 41 million for Patrick queen. I think itโs clear the market wasnโt as hot for him, as many anticipated. And sometimes that happens. So I donโt think anyone seriously speaking should be grudge him for making a business decision on the heels of the Ravens gave ro Quan Smith $100 million. And they said to Patrick, queen, weโre not picking up your fifth year option. So he has every right to do that. But from a football standpoint, from a pro wrestling standpoint, Patrick, we just just completed the heel turn. And I think itโs funny because I think you go back at the history of the franchise and look, I understand rod Woodson played for both teams. But rod Woodson had the one year buffer where he was in San Francisco and letโs face it in 1998 ravens Steelers wasnโt ravens Steelers yet? I mean, not even close it took a few years of Woodson already be here
Nestor J. Aparicio 03:01
to them watching Woodson roll around with our ring, kind of you know, it
Luke Jones 03:06
was but my point is weโve never seen a player in his prime like this A prime talent like this defect from one to the other directly. So from a rivalry standpoint, and letโs face it, weโve talked about this a lot. Raven Steelers has lost a lot of steam in recent years and a big reason why, beyond Ben Roethlisberger and Terrell Suggs and Ray Lewis and Troy Polamalu and all the different names riding off into the sunset. Itโs been Lamar Jackson not being on the field for I think heโs played in three of the last nine Raven Steelers game so the rivalry suffered. Thereโs no question about that. Patrick Queen, who also doesnโt shy away from a little bit of trash talk. From an entertainment standpoint, from a journalistic standpoint, Iโm all for seeing a raven become a Steeler or vice versa. So itโs fun in that way. Everyone knew he was leaving. So from a football standpoint that was anticipated but his destination certainly raised a few eyebrows. But I think for Ravens fans were the excitement really allies is the the imminent imminent signing of Derrick Henry and you and I debated it going back to the trade deadline last year, and we debated even a couple days ago. But Eric dโacosta gets his man and the Ravens have a legitimate, serious feature back Iโll be at one whoโs 30 years old, Iโll be at one whoโs more expensive than theyโve been spending money that theyโve spent at the running back position in recent years. And weโll see how it turns out but just the sheer thought of Lamar Jackson and Derrick Henry in the same bet in the same backfield. I mean, doesnโt you know you canโt beat that in terms of excitement? Thereโs no question. All right,
Nestor J. Aparicio 04:51
so the Derek can be saying you and I went up down the river and I have been the Lamar hater. But Iโve been the pro Derrick Henry guy, the pro They need a better running back and you have been the good six yards of carry, they can put anybody, they can put you back there, but John Riggins back there, but anybody, I donโt think they assessed it that way based on how they spent money. And again, this speaks to me covering the team for 26 years, me sitting here the last two years and not knowing exactly what theyโre thinking. But reading the tea leaves and knowing the personalities, put a lot of thought into this. They put a lot of what do we really need for Lamar? What where do we need help for Lamar, and as much as Kevin Zeitler sounded nice, it sounded pricey for them. As much as you and I are concerned about Ronnie Stanley and Morgan, Moses, and they should be to, and whoโs going to play on the offensive line? I think thereโs the here and now of hey, itโs March, if weโre going to get an established back, not Dalvin. Cook at the end, not name any of the rest of the names. I mean, pick pick any of the names that theyโve rummaged out the last three or four years, you know, I canโt even remember well, who was the tall skinny guy from the Raiders? So give me give me his name. Come on. Iโll tell you what, Latavius Murray. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, thereโs one. So Iโm gonna go through all these other sort of Melvin Gordon, right. I mean, I canโt even name them all. And then Iโm playing. So I really played well. Well enough. Derrick, Henry, to me, is different. But to some of the stat Nickโs like yourself that this is, this has been panned to some by some, why would you pan it? Why would anyone pan it? Look?
Luke Jones 06:30
I mean, I donโt think itโs been panned. I think thatโs a little strong. I mean, look, what you said about some of the some of the names you mentioned, and letโs be clear, I mean, Latavius Murray was like their fifth or sixth option that year because they already lost JK Dobbins. They had already lost Gus Edwards, theyโd already lost Justice Hill before the season even started. So So you know, some of that is they
Nestor J. Aparicio 06:51
had a one, a two and a three. What do they have right now, if they had to go play this week without Derek, what do
Luke Jones 06:56
they mean? They have an emphatic one. I mean, look, Iโve never said I disliked Derrick Henry. I love Derrick Henry. Heโs been on my fantasy team.
Nestor J. Aparicio 07:01
No, no, Iโm not saying that. Iโm not being flippant. Iโm saying they didnโt have a running back. And they didnโt want to enter the draft and enter the summer. With this being their situation. I mean, in a lot of cases, the way they move the football look, itโs just as dangerous as running around with Prashad Perriman. And whoโs gonna catch the ball? You know what I mean? Like, whoโs gonna run the ball is important here. And it was dolphins, dolphins dolphins until it wasnโt. And itโs been a band aid ever since to some degree to some degree.
Luke Jones 07:29
I mean, that band aid ranked first in the league and rushing URI goes,
Nestor J. Aparicio 07:34
here we go.
Luke Jones 07:34
I do. I want you. You want me to ask and I mean, if you guys want me to say I love it, Derrick Henry, Super Bowl.
Nestor J. Aparicio 07:41
I donโt love it.
Luke Jones 07:44
I donโt but I donโt hate it either. Let me be clear about this. Iโve yet have viewed their running game in the aggregate. Right. And with Lamar Jackson being the centripetal force, I mean, to your point, look at the motley crew of running backs that theyโve had at some points now, at other points. Letโs be clear, Gus Edwards, until last year had averaged five yards of carry every year he was healthy, and has been extremely efficient. And I think if nothing else, maybe the fact that the Ravens spent what they spent on Derrick Henry when Gus Edwards went to the chargers for two years, $6.5 million, that might have been an indictment on where they think Gus Edwards is at this point in his career, because, say what you want in terms of Gus Edwards never been a guy thatโs rushed for 2000 yards, like Derrick Henry did four years ago. But from an efficiency standpoint, from a yards per carry standpoint, from a success rate standpoint, Gus Edwards has been as efficient and productive as just about anyone in again, understanding he hasnโt had 250 Carry seasons like Derrick Henry, but heโs been extraordinarily efficient. So for the ravens to say, all right, Gus, we love you. But goodbye. And he goes out and rejoins Greg Rome, and with the chargers, and the Ravens go and spend, not quite three times as much but close to it on a running back who is of course better. Iโm not saying Gus Edwards is as good or better than Derrick Henry, Iโm talking in terms of the cost effective part of this, the idea that anytime you spend on one position, thereโs a trade off, and what are you not spending elsewhere? My, the point Iโm making is, Iโm guessing this is as much about the Ravens not thinking much of what Gus Edwards is, itโs going to be in 2024. Then, oh my gosh, we need to go get a feature back because in the aggregate, with multiple backs, even with the injuries, theyโve had yards per carry, ranking the last five years, first, first, fifth, third, third, rushing DVOA the last five years first 12, which that was the year that they lost all the running backs, and Lamar was hurt at the end of that season. Second, first rushing EPA, which is another efficiency metric first first 11th second third.
Nestor J. Aparicio 10:00
So Eric might say, Letโs keep it that way. Letโs keep it first. Okay,
Luke Jones 10:07
fine. I mean, sure, but I but I guess my point is, youโve been able to be wildly productive spending next to nothing at the position is how much better is Derrick Henry going to make you then first in the league in rushing yards? Is my point, how much better is Derrick Henry going to make you then third in the league in yards per carry? Iโll hear it being better. But boy, thatโs a high bar. Right? I mean, if Derrick Henry rushes for four and a half yards per carry this season, which isnโt bad for him whatsoever, but youโre spending a lot more to get that production than you did in the past. So thatโs the point Iโm making and at what cost? And you just mentioned? Well, okay, the Ravens have talked about wanting to really rebuild their offensive line, thatโs not an easy thing to do. And if youโre going to spend a lot more money on a running back, and that becomes even more challenging to do. So.
Nestor J. Aparicio 10:56
Itโs about being able to draft young players, though, on the offensive line they do, even though it hasnโt been successful lately. Every year, they were losing one for a while. But to your point, they donโt have a naked play with right now other than the veteran guys that they have on the on the book ends, right. Like, and the garden thing is still very much. You donโt know think Cleveland can play. I mean, really?
Luke Jones 11:16
Yeah. Well, and letโs not overlook Tyler Linder, Obamaโs approval center. Heโs great. I mean, heโs the anchor. I mean, heโs really the anchor. Itโs not Ronnie Stanley Morgan, Moses, at this point. Itโs Tyler, Linda bomb. I mean, Wayne on the cheap. Right? They have one spot where youโre not worried whatsoever. Thereโs no question whatsoever on the offensive line. Thatโs not to say that Stanley Moses arenโt going to be back. But at the very least, thereโs
Nestor J. Aparicio 11:39
questions two years now heโs gonna be a $12 million $50 million center. So So again,
Luke Jones 11:44
look, as I just said, Iโd love Derek cannery. And Iโm looking forward to this. And I think itโs going to be fun. Do I think this makes the Ravens dramatically better. And thatโs the big key here, because youโre spending dramatically more money at the running back position relative to what you were doing? Do I think this makes them dramatically better? Iโll tell you where it matters for me. Whatโs Derrick Henry going to look like in January? Heโs 30 years old as it is. And this is where I think itโs going to be interesting for them because you have this feature back. I think itโs going to be critically important for them over the course of a 17 game season, to lighten this guyโs workload from where itโs been the last few years, with the thought in mind of wanting him to be at his absolute best come January because nothing has changed on that front. From where we were talking about this team a week ago. Or a month ago. Yeah, well, on the heels of losing in the AFC Championship Game, everything they do is judged on January at this point. So Derrick Henry could come in and rush for 1500 yards or five yards per carry. But what how does it change our fate in January thatโs thatโs ultimately going to decide how successful this move truly is. Because there is a trade off to spending more on a running back when you have needs on the offensive line. When you have needs that edge rusher when you have needs. You know, with Ronald Darby going off the Jacksonville, you need another corner to backup Marlon Humphrey who has been injured. So you know, you go down the list of all the moves they make. And look, I saw a lot of people saying this on social media that what else did you want them to spend on at this point now that you know, we canโt look at this in terms of player A for player B, right? In the same way that we can look at this and say okay, well, is a $9 million 2024 investment better? In Derrick Henry, is that better than a $15 million investment in Odell Beckham last year? You know, the there isnโt just one or one choice, right. I mean, thereโs lots of that was
Nestor J. Aparicio 13:38
gonna be my point. And itโs took part of that money. And I mean, itโs the Lamar tax. I mean, I bet Lamar is in love with this idea.
Luke Jones 13:44
He showed me it was more tax last year though. Yeah, he wanted Odell Beckham I mean, I mean, thatโs, you know, the, you
Nestor J. Aparicio 13:50
give the kid a half a billion a quarter billion dollars like you let them do what he wants. I mean, itโs his team. Now. If he wants a running back and heโs in there saying, I donโt want to play with Gus Edwards breaking, you know, being older I, I want the king bring the king in here. Last year, we had Odell Beckham bring me to King. You know, like, I do think thereโs a point here where they sued Lamar. I mean, come on, dude. I mean, we call that a $30 million tax last year for a washed up wide receiver. Like, I donโt think Derrick Henryโs washed up. And I do think they look better getting off the bus and I agree with you 100%. I donโt think they have any intention of running him 26 times again, I donโt. But I do think I do think this if theyโre in Cleveland and week three, and theyโre up 30 to 17. Heโs going to get the ball the last eight minutes of the game like Gus did, and thatโs going to be more of his game. They want them to throw the ball, right? I mean, they really do. Yeah, and run less and not be the guy running the ball in the last eight minutes of the game because they canโt figure out any other way to do it. Or especially when they get behind by three points in wet themselves. And he runs right he runs left. Itโs itโs razzle dazzle sometimes itโs going into the phone booth and itโs work But when they get behind, itโs different. I think heโs here to make sure they donโt get behind.
Luke Jones 15:07
They werenโt behind much last year. So I mean, weโll
Nestor J. Aparicio 15:09
see. Fourth and 1/4 and one and a half from the 44. yard line.
Luke Jones 15:14
Gus Edwards was outstanding in those situations over the last five years. I mean, there, there are even statistics that kind of prove he, at times has been the absolute best short yardage back in football. So
Nestor J. Aparicio 15:26
well, he ought to help Herbert out in San Diego, right. I mean, and they paid him.
Luke Jones 15:30
And again, this is where I go back to for me, I donโt know how much of it is really oh my gosh, we need to have a dramatically better running back as much as weโre not sure what we saw from Gus Edwards in 2023. How thatโs going to translate to 2024. And we know heโs a couple of years removed from his knee injury, which was a really bad knee injury, mind you, and heโs Gus Edwards gonna be 29. So heโs not a spring chicken either. So I think a lot of this had to do with their projection on where he was at his career in his career. And Derrick Henry, look, heโs 30 years old, he has over 2000 carries in the NFL. i One of my arguments for not being inclined to do this, if it costs too much was heโs going to start declining at some point. Now, in fairness, I think people that just point to his yards per carry last year being lower, or kind of selling short how bad the Tennessee offense was terrible. Yeah, I mean, it was really wet. So when you look at his yards after contact and things of that nature, he still was among the best backs in football, but heโs already an outlier in terms of defining that right in terms of defying and fighting off father time for him to be 30 years old, for him to have as many carries under his belt, and to still be that productive. Thatโs the world is going to turn at some point. Now I am not saying itโs going to be this year. And Iโm not saying that this move wonโt work out. And like I said, I love the player. But youโre spending markedly more for this running back then youโve spent on a running back, you know, even go back. Itโs been five years since they signed Mark Mark Ingram to what three years 15 million. So even taking into account the growth of the salary cap youโre still spending more relatively speaking.
Nestor J. Aparicio 17:20
I love him getting off the bus in Buffalo and an AFC Championship game maybe at the city or Cincinnati or whatever. Just having a dude I mean, like I and you and I are all gonna be on the other side. This is gonna be fun season where youโve been dedicating upon me on the Lamar thing see, sees the MVP and I never said he couldnโt be I just said he can get hurt and he shouldnโt be running into linebackers that from the beginning. So they got another guy to keep him from running in the linebackers as he gets older and more expensive. And I just sense that you think they spent too much money and I think you wisely sense that. Whoโs gonna be blocking for like, who was her left tackle? Whoโs our right tackle? Who are our guards? What you like, what what are we doing there? And, you know, and then thereโs the whole Pat Ricard and, you know, what is their running back situation? Is it just Derrick Henry, and weโre gonna, you know, come in with one in 10 hit, you know, like, thereโs gonna have to be more in their offense and the Keaton Mitchellโs not a part of this. And obviously, Gus isnโt a part of this. Dobbins wonโt be a part of this, all the names we know, this is where they do go into the draft and get somebody at 60. Or at 90, whoโs a dare I say Ray Rice, I always compare it to Ray Rice, because he was the best back they ever really drafted, who did all of those things would be a compliment, like an axillary kind of guy to go along with Derrick Henry, I think thatโs probably what they have in their mindโs eye. Well,
Luke Jones 18:51
I mean, keep my keep Mitchell still around, itโs just gonna be a question of when is he back? Right. I mean, he had suffered an ACL injury in mid December, it would be very ambitious to think heโs going to be around for September. But he could be back by October or November. Thatโs not unheard of, in terms of under a year for an ACL. But certainly week one, you know, even if things are going really well, how the Ravens have generally proceeded and you look at how they handled Gus Edwards and JK Dobbins a couple years ago, coming back from the ACL. So, look, and thatโs part of this. And thatโs where Iโll be, I want to be fair about this. Again, I donโt hate this move. Itโs looking at it through the lens of whatโs the trade off, whatโs the opportunity cost here, that youโre missing out on in terms of adding other pieces or being able to keep to Davey on clowny? Or you decided youโre not keeping Kevin Zeitler? You know, whatever it is, but in fairness, yeah, you look at their current depth chart and in terms of healthy players, itโs Justice Hill. Okay, I love Justice Hill as a third down back as a guy that can get some passes out of the backfield. But as a number one Back Of course not. So it was never a question for me. And this is where I want to be clear about this. This is never a question for me that you donโt do anything at the position. Itโs just what do you spend? How do you spend? Where are you targeting running backs? What skills are you looking for? In doing that? And thatโs where, you know, I might have gone a different route. For example, you know, Iโve given you a really simple one, Zach Moss, two years $8 million. I think you look at some of his his metrics and how he filled in for Taylor and Indianapolis. And by the way, Zack moss ran against the Ravens all the way back in week three. Yep, two years, 8 million for him. I think that has the potential to be one of the best deals that are signed in free agency now weโll see. You know, but the ravens are certainly getting someone who has a far more impressive pedigree than anyone else that was on the market. Thereโs no doubt about that. Far more productive. Heโs set to eclipse 10,000 career rushing yards this year, I think heโs like 500 yards away. And heโs coming off of a very productive season. So it checks. It checks all the boxes. Now,
Nestor J. Aparicio 20:57
it is shocking, nonetheless, I mean, to some degree, itโs, itโs a shocking development, that I mean, look, I kicked it around about this, the last two trading deadlines and you, you know, you throw throw a wet blanket on it, and they go out and get ro Quan Smith and give him a farm right, a year and a half ago, instead of getting a running back. Thatโs what they felt like they needed then. And I think they assess the market better than anybody to look at, if a teamโs gonna get rid of a player. If a team has a cap cut coming. They knew ro Quan Smith could be available long before he was and they knew that they were going to act if he was and they they made it happen, right, like behind closed doors in the middle of the season. Um, you know, they are astute. And thatโs why when they make moves like this, despite the Odell Beckham thing last year, that was, I mean, almost on the record, to pacify and to lure Lamar Jackson here, you know, things happen sort of bang, bang, that week that it happened, when we spent eight months talking about it not happening. This is more, you know, there was rumblings at the trading deadline about this. And I told you when I said, they get him, theyโre gonna win the Superbowl like, you know, nobody wants to tackle that guy in the fourth quarter on a cold day. So and they didnโt. But Eric, Eric obviously still listens to the show. I mean, I appreciate that. Doesnโt take your best advice. But the bit in all sincerity, they they put big numbers and big machines and big science and data into this. They love something about Derrick Henry, because they went out early tampering time paid him more than any of the other running. They could have had Josh shake, they can add any of these guys, they could add any of these guys that that to your point at that price, pick your running back have to have the one you want. They pick the one they want it. Well,
Luke Jones 22:38
I mean, say Quan Barkley, and you know, some of the guys you mentioned got more money than Derrick Henry, letโs be clear about that. Letโs be fair about that. And there are younger but look, a lot of this. Thatโs why I keep coming back to this. Itโs not about Derrick Henry philosophically, Iโm not in the camp of paying running backs. I mean, Iโm just not. And I think thereโs plenty of numbers over the last five years that supports that when Lamar Jackson is your quarterback that you can stick anyone back there and be really productive. is Derrick Henry a better feature back to the other guys theyโve had? Yeah, of course. I mean, heโs going to the Hall of Fame. Like Iโm not Iโm not sitting here being dismissive of him. But when youโre spending
Nestor J. Aparicio 23:16
the Hall of Fame you do, okay. Absolutely. Okay, cool.
Luke Jones 23:20
I donโt think I mean, itโs got a 2000 yard season, heโs gonna eclipse 10,000 yards. Heโs shown longevity in a in. Now, that doesnโt mean itโs gonna be a first ballot guy. Right, necessarily, but I donโt
Nestor J. Aparicio 23:32
think heโs thought like that yet. I think he needs to win some games. You know what I mean? Like, listen, Walter Payton never won. Right. I mean, you know, Barry Sanders never won the end of his career. You know, Adrian Peterson never want you know, like, they didnโt win. You know what I mean? Like so, Emmitt Smith, all he did was win, right? Like in our in our faces. The Franco Harris is those guys. Derrick Henry is one of those guys like, Yeah, I mean, I do not Mr. Derrick Henry. I mean, I want to go get the oil or Jersey even though I thought it was 30. But I donโt think of him in those. I think of him in the Hall of very good right now. But I think he still has some work. And thatโs interesting that he probably thinks he still has work. And he probably, you know, Hey, dude, Iโve been in Tennessee that we havenโt had a quarterback. We got to goofer an owner, we had to put on old pajamas from Houston recently. Like heโs coming to a place that heโs taken seriously too. This is another part of the Ravens recruiting players too. And like he wants to come here. Heโs coming. Heโs already rich. You know what I mean? Heโs, heโs here to win. I mean, and I, I love that part about it. Because he runs angry. Thatโs fun. Yeah. And
Luke Jones 24:37
when I say Hall of Fame, heโs on that path is what Iโm saying. I donโt think if he quits today that heโs a lock or anything like that. I mean, I think thatโs a different discussion. So yeah, this is a great opportunity for him in that way. But at the same time, Iโll continue to go back to the passing game over the last decade. Thatโs ultimately what matters most in Anyway, passing the ball and defending the past now, Are there exceptions to the rule in certain playoff games with the elements being brutal and, and raw and things like that? Of course,
Nestor J. Aparicio 25:10
you do for their offense with the passing game, in your opinion, does he change anything? Um,
Luke Jones 25:15
he himself No, because heโs not a guy that has caught many passes out of the backfield at least last year and if you look at it, he typically hasnโt been a guy that is in pass protection a whole lot as far as like third down situations, you know, especially this past year and they you know, they had a young back in Tennessee, so he came off the field someone throw downs, but where he does help is stacking the box, you know,
Nestor J. Aparicio 25:41
things of action to me or him and Lamar, is he getting it as Lamar get shorter wants trouble for you? And if he tucks it and throws it over your head to mark Andrews and single coverage, because you got a bad matchup? Hello, you know, I mean, say flowers, you know, they they, they have fast weapons, that that would be my thought about it is I do think in the box, if youโve got to tackle Derrick Henry, you got a different situation than trying to catch Keaton Mitchell.
Luke Jones 26:10
Yeah, yeah, sure. Right. But I would also say theyโre coming from a place where they werenโt bad at those things before they were already really good at all those things and thatโs what Iโll keep coming back to the standard hereโs is gonna be very high for me Nestor. If Derrick Henry rushes for 4.3 yards per carry this year, then Iโm gonna say, Okay, weโre at the Ravens doing that in the past, you know, and thatโs
Nestor J. Aparicio 26:32
why for Odell Beckham to catch 35 passes for 15 million. We knew that going in we knew going in.
Luke Jones 26:38
Those arenโt the only two players in the league is my point. Like, you know, like, we could keep talking about that trait, you know,
Nestor J. Aparicio 26:44
by signing star players to appease your quarterback and appease the fan base. Are you really doing it to win? Or did you do it to sort of put what put making nice poster? You know, looking good coming off the bus? I I thought Odell Beckham was was definitely that. I think the end morale, and heโs going to teach wide receivers and all that. This is weโre gonna kick your ass play. And I donโt. I like that. From Raven standpoint, I like this as a compliment to Lamar. I like it a lot. Okay,
Luke Jones 27:14
yeah. I donโt dislike it. Iโm just saying itโs an expensive way of going about it at the running back position. After years of spending nothing there that you could then spend it elsewhere. And
Nestor J. Aparicio 27:27
rookie guards
Luke Jones 27:28
the offensive line. Now. Iโm glad you brought that up, because, and itโs not so much about the rookie thing. Itโs much more, we also need to understand what kind of runner Derrick Henry is. Because heโs so big people just think about it in terms of the box being stacked and running between the tackles. And heโs really big, and heโs converting third and fourth downs. And look, he does those things. Iโm not going to sit here and say he doesnโt. But Derrick Henry, at his best is running outside zone and having linemen who can get into space and occupy blockers and give him cutback lanes. And he can go nuts. Weโve seen him do it against the Ravens in the past. I mean, he is a guy that you want to be able to get him to the outside, because heโs still really, really fast. And that even proved, was proven out last year, looking at some of the Next Gen Z guys
Nestor J. Aparicio 28:14
canโt catch him and the small guys canโt tackle him. So you know,
Luke Jones 28:19
cases I mean, thatโs how fast he is, if you can get him to that point. So with their offensive line, I think itโs and I think this is where theyโre going anyway. And Tyler Lindenbaum is a great example of this. Yeah, he can be physical. And Iโm not saying heโs not a physical player. But Tyler Linder bombs, some of his biggest highlights of last season and even going back to his rookie year, without seeing him blocking downfield seeing him move on the move, itโs going to be imperative for them if they want to maximize Derrick Henry as a runner, that they need to get more athletic on their offensive line now, easier said than done. Right? I mean, and thatโs where I think itโs interesting, even from the standpoint of talking about someone like Ben Cleveland, who I think many of us have viewed with the assumption that heโs gonna be one of their starting guards. He doesnโt really fit that profile. So even there in terms of what you want to do to optimize what Derrick Henry does as a runner, they still have some work to do on their offensive line. So I donโt hate this. I donโt love the price, though. Iโm not going to. Iโm not going to shy away from that. And people are going to say Iโm hatin on it, and I donโt like Derrick Henry, and thatโs not true. I love Derrick Henry, but
Nestor J. Aparicio 29:29
I didnโt hate Odell Beckham. I just thought it was absurd. You know what I mean? Like,
Luke Jones 29:33
I didnโt love that. Letโs be clear, though. Like, like, letโs not position this that I was in favor of that, you know, I thought it was crazy to give Odell Beckham $15 million. It was Lamar tax. I mean, but at the same time, I think a lesson that needs to be learned there, which Iโll go back to what I said a few minutes ago. Youโve got to keep Derrick Henry fresh for January, Odell Beckham remember they managed him at times. He was actually go back and look he had a really good stretch from what the second week of November through early December. He was really good for that four or five game stretch. And then what happened. He wore down and was a nonfactor late in the season. So with any move they make, whether weโre talking about Derrick Henry, whether weโre talking about any pass rushers, theyโre going to sign any offensive lineman, theyโre going to acquire anyone theyโre going to draft ever all the incumbents on this team, anyone whoโs coming back, that resigns with them, you know, like just anatomy k, for example. You know, itโs all going to be judged on what they do in January. I mean, thatโs just where they are at this point. You know it. For me, I mean, Derrick Henry, rushing for a bunch of yards in the regular season. I mean, theyโve, in the aggregate, theyโve rushed for a bunch of yards every single year sits
Nestor J. Aparicio 30:43
to help them close games. So you hope
Luke Jones 30:47
you hope and I mean, last year, they did not have to close games very often, letโs face it, I mean, they had the top point differential, and they blew teams out, especially in the second half of the season. And, but then
Nestor J. Aparicio 30:57
they got behind once, and they couldnโt get a fall in and they canโt get up against the team thatโs capable. You know what I mean? Like, those three weeks in January, to your point, are gonna define who they are. And they better get to the third week. Yeah,
Luke Jones 31:08
yeah. But at the same time, if youโre behind, youโre, youโre not running the ball when youโre behind, and people will right now are blowing the gasket, thinking about the fact that they werenโt behind by that much against Kansas City. You know, some of that was panicking, and not being just not being very good. And Lamar not being very good. Right. I mean, you know, is Derrick Henry, the difference in beating the Kansas City Chiefs? Well, now you also have a diminished defense and your offensive line has question marks. And what about wide receiver, you know, is not Bateman going to take a step forward? So they still have other questions, you know, so, you know, is this the last piece for them to become a championship team? You know, theyโve got other work to do. And thatโs my point here, in terms of giving Derrick Henry, what amounts to a one year $9 million contract, and then weโll see in terms of 2025, that absolutely helps the run again, thatโs thatโs the no brainer statement. But whatโs the trade off? You know, whatโs the opportunity cost here? How much better is your running game going to be? Because again, thatโs a very high bar, you know, they were first last year, thereโs no, thereโs nothing higher than first. Right? So, you know, so thatโs where you kind of get
Nestor J. Aparicio 32:20
into as Eric saying, Iโd like to stay there. Okay. Okay. Okay. But
Luke Jones 32:24
Iโll still say that while the barge accident, being healthy is still the most pertinent, you know, factor in that being true, because theyโve proven that they can run the ball with just about anyone that running back as long as Lamar is out there and healthy. So, you know, weโll see. And again, Iโll say this much, putting aside the cap, putting aside the salary and all the questions there. I mean, you have Lamar Jackson, the greatest, greatest rushing quarterback in NFL history. And Derrick Henry, whoโs the best running back in the NFL over the last seven years, and itโs not even close. I mean, thatโs, thatโs really fun and exciting. Team. Yeah, I mean, itโs fun and exciting. Now, can you ride that to the Super Bowl, youโre still gonna have to throw the football, I mean, Iโm not not gonna sit here and say, Youโre gonna turn the clock back. I mean, 2019. And even when they tried to do it a couple years ago, they turned back the clock, or attempted to anyway, and Greg, Romans last year. And we kind of saw how it turned out before, you know, even before Lamar got hurt. So you start to throw the football. And like I said, Derrick, Henry, with putting defenders in the box and play action and things of that nature. Yeah, absolutely going to help help immensely on that front. But theyโve also already been really good. Doing those kinds of things is my point. So it just comes down to, for me, how much better is he going to make you relative to the fact that you are spending considerably more on a running back than you have in years. And again, Iโll continue to look at it in the aggregate, because ultimately, itโs not about having a name at running back, you know, itโs about how productive youโre going to be. And theyโve been very productive even without a higher price running back, like Derrick Henry in recent years. So thatโs a high bar is my point. I mean, if youโre telling me itโs worth, heโs worth it, then Derrick Henry should be rushing for five plus yards of carry next year and their, their running game should be 2019. Like, which is kind of historic, but you know, weโll see how it plays out. So and weโll see if he fights off Father Time another year, heโs done a heck of a job doing that, at this point. I mean, I think back to what was it 2021 When he had his foot injury and miss time and there are a lot of people at that point who figured, okay, this is the end for Derrick Henry, weโre gonna see him really start falling off a cliff. Theyโve run him into the ground, you know, 300 plus carries a year all this and bounce back and was really still really, really good the last couple years, so, you know, weโll see if he can do it again. The ravens are certainly confident and betting on him doing it again. Iโm not gonna say he canโt, but at the same time, this move ultimately will be judged in Jan. You worry. So I think itโs going to be important for them to, yes, get production out of him and win games, because you have to get to January. But itโs, I think itโs gonna be of the utmost importance for them to keep what will be at that point, running back getting ready to turn 31. And another 200 Plus carries under his belt for an outstanding career to make sure that heโs at his best then because thatโs how theyโre all being judged at this point. No one cares about Pro Bowls and MVPs and regular season statistics, and even the regular season win loss record or even the division title. You need to get there. You canโt go seven and 10 and miss the playoffs, of course, but theyโre all being judged on what happens in January at this point. I mean, and last year, just reiterate, you know, reiterated that big time so if Derrick Henry can be at his best Come then, and help them win game. So you know, if itโs 2024 degrees and snowing or raining or muddy or whatever the conditions, then itโll be well worth it. Itโll easily be worth it. But again, itโs a high bar because theyโve already had an outstanding running game no matter how anyone wants to complain about whoโs been running the ball at given times. This
Nestor J. Aparicio 36:12
is a tough one for the Nestor hates the caster and the Ravens, because Iโve been nothing but a brilliant in regard to them signing Derek cambrie I look jumps can be found out and Owings Mills. He can be found on the interwebs he will be found in Sarasota next week as well. And then in Florida for the NFL owners meetings fall over. They were doing a Baltimore positive. Got some fun stuff happening for our 25th anniversary in conjunction with opening day. A couple of weeks from now weโre talking a lot of baseball. Weโre gonna get a lot of football free agency in here this week. Lukeโs got you covered on the WNS T tech service for anything that still happens at some point theyโre out of money, right look, I am Nestor we are wn sta and 1570, Towson Baltimore. keep you abreast of all things football and baseball in Baltimore positive