When DeShaun Watson showed up at the stadium as a pre-game scratch in Cleveland, most Browns fans knew it was going to be a long day. Luke Jones and Nestor recap another Ravens road win over the hapless Browns and backup QB Dorian Thompson-Robinson, who was overwhelmed by the purple defense.
ravens, talk, week, year, game, fifth round, defense, browns, good, backup quarterback, great, cleveland, sunday, bengals, deshaun watson, ball, losing, quarterback, football team, friday
Nestor Aparicio, Luke Jones
Nestor Aparicio 00:01
Welcome back. wn S T tassel. Baltimore. Baltimore positive happy 25th anniversary to us happy fall in October to you. Happy clinch missed everybody that was celebrating last week for the the Orioles and now we sit. And we wait. We thought it might be Seattle we thought it might be Houston we knew wasn’t Minnesota but it’s gonna be the Texas Rangers in the Toronto Blue Jays this week. Allen McCallum has talked to us baseball, Rick Dempsey, Dr. senseis going back into the Wayback Machine to talks and Brooks Robinson, with Rick Vaughn and Charlie Steinberg this week and Eric Fisher among some others. This guy here was I don’t even know where to begin with you. I mean, what a week this was for you. I feel a little bad because, you know, they thrown me out. Not my fault, really. But like I can’t even help you. And like next week, they’re gonna play games and we’re gonna go on the road, the baseball team, and the football team is gonna be in London. You’re not even gonna miss practice. How about that? What do you think of that?
Luke Jones 00:59
Good timing. Right? Absolutely good timing with the Division Series coinciding with the Ravens going to London taken on the Tennessee Titans. It’s gonna be strange. Nestor. Not going to be in Pittsburgh, Sunday game two or the hlds.
Nestor Aparicio 01:12
Baseball to watch. I’ve always wanted to say that. Yeah,
Luke Jones 01:15
yeah, absolutely. And based on how the Steelers looked and how the rest of the AFC North looked, I think that it’s appropriate. At the the quarter mark, not really the quarter mark was 17 games anymore, or now but I think you look at what happened Sunday for the Ravens. You know, they go to Cleveland, I think most people were anticipating a close game. Browns defense off to a great start. Ravens offense looks great in Cincinnati, but it’s been very choppy. I think we would all admit that. The expectation even as of Saturday, multiple reports indicating Deshaun Watson, who let’s be clear, I’m not saying he’s Patrick mahomes. But he’s certainly far better, far more established. A far more confidence inspiring then Dorian Thompson Robinson, who I kept wanting to call Dorian green, or Dorial, green Beckham, the wide receiver in the draft about 10 years ago. But we wake up Sunday morning, and suddenly Deshaun Watson is not playing. And you have a Cleveland Browns team that is going with a fifth round rookie quarterback who they flat out admitted they weren’t anticipating him playing and yeah, he got some reps and you can talk about that. And he had a nice preseason, yada, yada, yada. We knew what was going to happen with this game, most likely, from the moment that Watson was rolled out. We know I
Nestor Aparicio 02:36
want to ask you about that. Because like, I don’t want to say I didn’t talk about it last week at all, because we talked so much baseball last week. It was a baseball week around here. That’s what I said to you two weeks ago, like the ravens are gonna get no oxygen. We’re going to talk about it for five minutes on Monday. We’re gonna talk about five minutes next Sunday, then they’re going to London and we’re talking about breakfast, I’m gonna be up at Hollywood Casino. It’s been the strangest period of time where I go out and walk the streets and no one. I mean, I’m wearing a baseball shirt courtesy of our friends who carry a wellness and foreign daughter picked us up on Friday. Everybody’s into sort of the orange spirit of this. But the football team I think can quietly be five and one six, and one wherever they’re gonna be at they’re gonna be in first place because these other teams in the division really stink. And the Ravens still staying. The ravens are just beaten up. I think the Ravens could be good if you bring all their players, they can be very good, but they haven’t looked really good in a month. They’ve looked good enough to be three and one.
Luke Jones 03:30
Yeah, they’ve looked good enough to the three and one and there are a couple of plays away from being for now. And yeah, I get it backup quarterback backup quarterback the previous week, although they lost to Gardner Minshew and Indianapolis. But you just said it. I mean, this is at the at the quarter mark, roughly speaking now. You look around the rest of the division. I mean, Cleveland, if Deshaun Watson shoulder is okay. After their bye week, you can talk me into the browns, potentially being a good team. So I mean, their defense was bad in the second quarter, but it was excellent throughout the rest of the
Nestor Aparicio 04:05
team. I mean, get to 10 or 11 wins, of course, and sevens a good team these days. Right? Exactly. And
Luke Jones 04:11
I’m right. So you can convince me of that. But Let’s call a spade a spade at this point in time. The Cincinnati Bengals looks like a disaster right now. I mean, statistically, it’s awful. Joe burrow can’t move. How much of that is his lack of mobile would be? How much of that is Zach Taylor’s offense? Maybe the end figured out at this point in time you and I’ve talked at different points over the last few years, as well as the Bengals have played as as really good as they’ve been at times. I’ve stated on a few occasions that I wasn’t convinced Zach Taylor’s this amazing coach who’s their left tackle,
Nestor Aparicio 04:45
by the way? Orlando Brown. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And who would have never been a left tackle here. This organization looked at him five, six years ago and said, We don’t want him protecting the corner. We’re certainly not gonna pay $5 million a year. Like that was I mean They’ve made a lot of decisions after the Superbowl that the fans they were the white there’s they’re spending a lot of money on tickets in Cincinnati. It’s to 200 ollar get in. I mean, it’s like it was here when Ray Lewis was dancing to go to a Cincinnati Bengals game, which blows my mind. But they sort of gone in the other direction after the Superbowl in regard to where the Ravens would be if they went to the Super Bowl this year, two years from now you’d say? Well, their quarterbacks making $50 million a year. They haven’t drafted in the same way because they’re drafting they’re not getting lottery picks anymore like the Orioles they’re not get one ones anymore once you start making the playoffs, right. So for me what the Bengals they were never like a great organization. They got the quarterback and they had the lightning in the bottle two years ago. I thought it was sustainable but sustainable takes everything you’re talking about not giving Orlando brown money to be your left tackle that that’s what makes things sustainable.
Luke Jones 05:50
I’m not gonna say anything about their left tackle when the ravens are paying a guy $100 million over the past few years. You can’t stay on the field fair. Linda Brown posts up every week and I and I’ll full disclosure, I didn’t watch Cincinnati play on Sunday. I was watching the Ravens. I don’t know how he performed Orlando browns, the least of their worries. I mean, I I think they have so many other issues
Nestor Aparicio 06:09
with the offensive line was their worry all along that was Super Bowl two years ago. Sure. But
Luke Jones 06:14
I think it’s way bigger than that. fears over is not healthy in the same way that large x was unhealthy at the end of last year or the year or the year before that. So not to get you know, let’s not get too hung up on the Bengals right now. But there are a mess there. Well, who’s coming again, you and it’s not them? Right? At this point. It’s not looking good for them. There’s no question about that, especially when you look at their schedule. Now they do have their BI coming up in a couple weeks. But three of their next four opponents are against playoff teams from a year ago. So they’re certainly in a spot where this could get way worse very quickly. And maybe the theme here to talk about more so as it pertains to what we just witnessed in Cleveland on Sunday is they don’t have a backup quarterback. I mean, look, Tyler Huntley we know is not actually a Pro Bowl quarterback and that was the punch line last year and you know as a total joke that that he was named and alternate not and all that and Josh Johnson has this career journey man who has been around forever, but look at who Cincinnati’s backup quarterback look at their backup quarterback situation situation. And you can see why they’ve really had no choice but to say, well, we’re going to see if Joe burrow can play through it, and he wants to do it. And they have no shot if he’s not out there. But the problem is, they’re not having much of a shot with him out there. On the flip side, bringing it back to the Browns here for a moment and we’ll get to the Steelers because there’s plenty to talk about with them too. But the browns, they traded Joshua Dobbs in late August, a guy who by the way, despite the fact that we know the Cardinals are far from great, and they were expected to be the worst team in the NFL. He’s actually played pretty well. So you see that you look at the decision that they made to trade their veteran backup quarterback out to the desert in Arizona, because this kid, Thompson Robinson, and look, I don’t want to pick on him too much. He’s a fifth round rookie. He’s a fifth round rookie in the first month of his NFL career pertaining to the regular season. It feels
Nestor Aparicio 08:08
like they told me he was gonna play Friday night. Right literally like
Luke Jones 08:13
I don’t even know that though. Nestor. I mean, they were still I mean, national reporters were still saying as of Saturday evening to Watson was going to play
Nestor Aparicio 08:21
the pointspread thing and the gambling thing drives me out of my mind, because, of course, I mean, my pics last week, I took the browns because I’ve made my pics on Wednesday. And like, if you would have told me that kids playing quarterback, I mean, the game was almost a little bit of a joke. It was like a little bit of a push. Once you got out, he got out there and ran around. You’re like, he’s not once I got the 14 three I think the game’s over they there’s no way they’re gonna be able to push the ball down the field let’s they play defense strip Lamar. As I tweeted, when the ball hit the carpet the second time in the first quarter. I’m like, go away, they’re gonna lose this if they kick the ball around because this kid can now play
Luke Jones 08:55
no doubt, as I wrote it Baltimore positive.com. To me, it started to look like organizational malpractice that they traded Josh Dobbs and handed the backup job to this kid. By the second Cleveland drive, when he throws way behind the receiver gets knocked up in the air and Brandon Stevens makes a great play and returns it to the 10 and the Ravens are ravens are up seven nothing despite the fact their offense and done anything to that point.
Nestor Aparicio 09:17
The ball down the field again have to
Luke Jones 09:20
I mean, actually they
chucked it down here on the field. But it was aimless, right. I
Luke Jones 09:26
mean, you could tell and again, I don’t want to pick on him too much shame on them for putting a fifth round rookie in the spot and people will say, well, Tyler Huntleys, a former undrafted rookie But Tyler Huntley, his rookie year, RG three was still the Ravens backup quarterback at that point in time. It wasn’t until Griffin was hurt late that season. And the following year when the Ravens handed the reins you know, the backup rains Tyler Huntley, so crazy, absolutely crazy mean organizational malpractice, but it’s the Browns What do you expect? So, you look at that you saw very early Leon in that game that their offense was not going to mount much keep in mind, they’re also missing Nick Chubb who’s gone for the year lost in week two, and he had been the anchor of everything they did offensively, you know, before Deshaun Watson. So they’re hurting in that regard. But I think if you’re John Harbaugh, you’re Todd Monken. You’re Lamar Jackson and the Ravens, by the end of the first quarter, it was evident, like you said, unless we give the ball away, unless we’re turning the ball over, and they did turn it over in the second quarter. On a fumble on their first promising drive of the game, not counting the 10 yard touchdown run from Lamar after the pick. You saw them though at that point in time, they finally came alive in the second quarter, they had two very impressive touchdown drives. But other than that, after that, they played it safe the rest of the way. And they did not gain much yardage. I think they had what 47 yards total win the second half. But they didn’t need to do more than that this was one of those games where keep the clock going run the ball, even if you’re only getting two, three yards a pop, try that if Lamar is gonna throw get the ball out quickly, because the last thing you want is to get him hurt, especially when Morgan Moses leaves late in the first half. And this is one of those games where you knew from the time that it was 14 to three, like you said, you knew that there was nothing Cleveland was gonna be able to do other than you turning the ball over them taking the ball away from you to give them any realistic shot of winning this football game. So as I wrote, I don’t think this is a 28 three result against the team playing a fifth round rookie quarterback. It’s not an eye popping result that’s going to earn you the style points or the eyeball test of wow, this is a really great football team. But they did what no one else in the AFC North could do on Sunday, they won. And we already mentioned the Bengals, the browns, I thought what was interesting about this Nestor and maybe maybe the CBS guys were just talking because there was nothing to talk about in the fourth quarter. But they alluded to the fact that there could be long term concern about Watson shoulder mean, he mentioned his rotator cuff. So if this is more than a week or two thing for him, they’re done. I mean, I don’t, and their defense is good. You know, maybe, maybe the hype was a bit much going into week four, but their defense is legit, like it’s good. But at the same time, it’s not good enough to sustain, you know, to overcome what they dealt with on the opposite side of the ball, which was a rookie quarterback going up against what we already knew was a good defense. The Ravens defense didn’t have anything to prove on Sunday, they went out and did their thing. And Kyle van Noy was added to the mix and he looked good and they played they harassed this kid and they blitzed and they brought pressure from different places. And they picked him off three times and they sacked him four times. And they they shut down the run, which would have been his only chance to really feel like he could do anything against this defense then
Nestor Aparicio 12:54
losing Chubs way worse than us losing Dobbins. I mean this point.
Luke Jones 12:57
Yeah, sure. Sure. I mean, especially if there’s, and I want to be clear, I’ll keep coming back to this because it’s important to note this. I’m not talking about Deshaun. Watson in terms of the guy that was the borderline top five quarterback that he was in Houston. Yeah. Deshaun. Watson has struggled. He looked good this past week. But other than that, going back to the end of last year, when he took over, he has not played well for them. However, there’s a difference between having questions about how great how good your franchise quarterback is. And what we saw on Sunday, which was not even having a capable backup quarterback. And maybe Thompson Robinson, at some point in time becomes that. And let’s be clear, Kevin Stefanski his game plan. And it was apparent with some of the stuff they were trying to run at least early on. That wasn’t catered towards a fifth round rookie. That was for Deshaun. Watson, they thought he was gonna play. You know, they said, you know, they said it during the telecast, every expectation was he was going to play. So for them to have to pivot in that spot. It really put him in an impossible position. But
Nestor Aparicio 14:01
well, he doesn’t get the benefit of the doubt for anything right from the fan base there. I mean, he’s a serial predator, let’s just let’s just call that whatever that was where whatever was going on in Houston was not something you and I are doing in our spare time. And the fans there, the guaranteed money, the expectation we have for Lamar or Cincinnati would have for Joe burrow has been to a Super Bowl. So at least there’s been a little bit of a payoff for that. The the fans there. Darrell, I say shaking it because I wouldn’t say that. But if the coach is telling the world they’re telling the gamblers he’s playing on Friday, and on Sunday morning, he’s not playing. They bring him missing what happened are you like what, like? That’s the part that was a little bit disconcerting to me in the same way that the last game I really ever had a press pass to Chad Steele left me was the one in Chicago two years ago. And in that Chicago game we we showed up Lamar practice on Friday, you report everybody reported they’re just gonna play in the Tyler hunt. He shows up. And they’re wondering why we’re even asking questions in the postgame about it. But the Cleveland fan should have questions about this. And especially if my rotator cuff I mean, that’s like, we’ll get to Felix Batista in a little bit with Tommy John and where he is in making that decision. But man wanted to $260 million quarterback if there’s a real problem, it’s a problem beyond on the field, it’s going to be a problem with the fans, the community, obviously the salary cap, I mean, if he has a real problem and misses a year, in that way, that that’s where these guarantee contracts, it’ll all come back on the world start start feeling sorry for Steve Ashati for having to pay these guys and and Poor Mr. Haslam, who has his own criminal issues. Paying these guys 15 16 million guaranteed money. You know, it kind of it brings back the chances of a Chris Davis, or one of those Oh, my God contracts, because he’s the only one. He’s the first one to do more got real money right now. But when you’re guaranteed money, and you’re the quarterback and you don’t post up on Sunday, now they got a bye week. If they if there’s a tragedy here and he has to undergo surgery. That’s just an unbelievable thing for the league, I think.
Luke Jones 16:12
Well, I mean, no did everything you just said, I mean, I still come back to you can’t have a fifth round. Rocky’s your backup quarterback. I mean, you just you’ve got to be better you. And that’s coming from the guy that believe me. You know, I’m also the guy that says don’t spend $8 million on your veteran backup quarterback either. But they had Josh Dobbs, I think on a one and a half million dollar contract or $2 million contract. And I’m not saying he’s great. I’m not saying he would have left the Browns to a victory on Sunday, but they would have would have had a hell of a lot better chance than they did going up against a Ravens defense. That looks really good. And it looks really good every week since the season started to have a fifth round rookie. I mean, boy, did they get caught up in in the preseason, which is another reminder of preseason football, fake football, as you and I I would say like we’re light hearted and how we talk about it. But people get on a Monday
Nestor Aparicio 17:05
morning when you get your ass kicked. 28 to three, you can’t say we flashed in August. Exactly,
Luke Jones 17:09
exactly. And that’s my whole point. So the Browns are the browns. Right. And I would even say their defense, as well as their defense played for stretches of that game. And again, we talked about the fact that really it came down to the Ravens coming alive in the second quarter offensively. That is still a team that has so much losing in its DNA, that that defense, I’m sure after the first few drives, they saw that their offense couldn’t do a darn thing. And this kid was completely overwhelmed a quarterback, unlike the ravens, whose defense held up so well, the last, you know, last year, specifically not so much the year before, but held up so well down the stretch last year, despite Lamar Jackson not being out there. And despite the offense not being able to do very much. There was a difference of the Ravens resiliency, the ravens, metal so to speak, compared to what the Browns have been, which is, you know, if things are going great, they feel good. But if things start to go sideways, here we go again, what was me that that kind of mindset that I think a losing organization is going to have. So I think it added up to terrible offense for them and a defense that, you know, despite all of its all the accolades over the first three weeks of the season, they you know, they couldn’t play a full 60 minutes. And even if they did, it still wasn’t gonna matter. Because all the Ravens needed was that first touchdown from Lamar Jackson, that was all the scoring they would need when your opponent can only manage a 53 yard field goal. And that’s
Nestor Aparicio 18:36
it. Yeah, I didn’t talk to shorts last week. But I bet third quarter, I’m saying, Man, these guys got to be getting gassed are out there a lot. They’re gonna be out there even more on the fourth quarter. I mean, that’s part of the issue with the quarterback being so bad is that it puts it on natural tax on your defense, not just psychologically you have take the ball away, you’re the only chance to win. We had that here without reading Ray Lewis for a period of time back during the bowler administration. But I would say that just the fatigue factor of having a defense out on the field that much. And knowing when your backup quarterback plays, you can’t win and your defense is gonna get the hell beaten out of you.
Luke Jones 19:12
Yeah, and I mean, I would say this, the time of possession was just about even the plays. I mean, Cleveland actually ran more offensive plays in the ravens, because the ravens, like we said, other than the second quarter, didn’t do much offensively. So but I think for me, this is a case where normally you would what you just said I would agree, but I think this was much more the mental side of it. I think the Ravens just made Cleveland well across the board and even their defense, which I do think is very talented, and we still there were concerns. I couldn’t have been the only one who exhaled a little bit when Tyler Huntley went in for Lamar Jackson knowing that Myles Garrett in the Cleveland front couldn’t tee off on the bar anymore because they you know, they did get after him some you know, there’s no question about that, especially when you’re missing your two Offensive Tackles. So this was a case of I think you saw very early on what kind of game it was going to be what your opponent could or in this case could not do offensively. And I think the Ravens adjusted accordingly and aside from one turnover, they played the kind of game that they needed to play to win. And when you say that and the final score is 28 Three, that says something about you says a lot about your opponent and how bad they were but let’s also give credit where credit’s due this was a football team that went out and won a game on on the road in the AFC north and didn’t even feel like they had to play their absolute best game to do it and that should be saying something about this team’s potential moving forward if they can finally stay healthy at some point in time.
Nestor Aparicio 20:42
Around here we say we’re on to Pittsburgh this week, but actually we’re on the I don’t know who we’re onto might be on the Tampa might be on the Texas we’re gonna find that out. There’s gonna be covered baseball and football week. We’re gonna be doing the Maryland crab cake tour next Friday. It’s my birthday the 14th is my birthday on third Friday the 13th made some movies about that. I think Friday the 13th we’re going to be drug city in Dundalk good friends with us we’ll have the Maryland lottery scratch also pick appreciation or friends that when donation 866 90 nation as well as our newest sponsor at Jiffy Lube multicarrier get in and out quick oil change and more. Learn more about that all season long. Here is our 25th anniversary I’m wearing my curio shirt, carry a wellness oath and foreign daughter over on York Road giveaway shirts. If you make a purchase $80 or more at least that was the deal on Friday and while they listen, I gotta medium Should I’ve gotten the large I don’t know. You have to wear this all month. Luke and I are gearing up to go to some godforsaken place like Florida or Texas next week. Not Canada, but the Luke did have his passport out. We’ll worry about that maybe in the ALCS who knows who’s gonna be down the far line here but it’s baseball week we’re gonna be watching baseball wall to wall this week. Get ready for the Pittsburgh Steelers. Luke can be found at Baltimore, Luke I can be found under my name namesake at LinkedIn, Facebook, Twitter, all of those social media places. We’re going to talk some more ravens football and certainly their offense. Get ready for the Pittsburgh Steelers this week. But it’s all about game one on Saturday. And Billy Joe and Stevie Nicks on Nesta we are wn st am 1570 Towson Baltimore and we never stop talking Baltimore positive