Understanding terpenes and cannabinoids

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As we continue our education series in understanding adult use cannabis and the science of the plant, Wendy Bronfein of Curio Wellness discusses the various strengths and strains of locally produced flower at Far & Dotter in Timonium.

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

bridge, strain, cannabis, plant, baltimore, potency, tunnel, point, curio, day, growing, drive, product, science, people, orioles, cost, terpenes, understand, build

SPEAKERS

Nestor J. Aparicio, Wendy Bronfein

Nestor J. Aparicio  00:01

Welcome home, we are wn S T am 1570, Towson, Baltimore and Baltimore positive at some point, I think I’m going to create a new screen grab behind me on the YouTube channel with the Key Bridge, but I think it’d make me cry today. So I’m trying to like, let it let it low. We’ve talked about a lot of stuff here since I’ve been back. I was in Florida for six days. Three days of spring training almost for two days of having the owner of the ravens and the general manager of the Ravens run for me in the middle of night, and John Harbaugh’s press conference, The Death of Peter angelos, Jackson holidays, not on the opening day, Robin, all of this stuff that’s happening. And I woke up at 550 in the morning on Tuesday, in a very loud hotel room in Lake Buena Vista, Florida, there were a lot of kids there. And I wasn’t even going to Epcot and got the text that Cambridge has been destroyed with links to European websites that were telling me that this was a headline trusted European websites. And I put the television on and the first thing I saw in my hotel room at 551 in the morning was Johnny Oh, in my hotel room in Florida at this press conference and I’m reaching to everyone I know in my space. Wendy brown fine not just our friend but also chief cannabis Officer here at wn st to educate us on all things, medicine and otherwise but really a Baltimorean she’s wearing her Orioles gear were slated for maybe a beverage at the nest or fade Lee’s prior to a game and we’re putting the crabcake tour down to families in two weeks. I’m wearing my costume T shirts, because business is going to be affected by this everywhere around and when it first off welcome in. You know, I don’t want to it’s just a somber tone for everyone you know. And if I tell the story about how my uncle Norman drove me over the bridge in 1977 gets, it gets dusty in here. And I think for everybody in Baltimore, I’ve been reached you by people all over the world asking how we’re doing.

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Wendy Bronfein  02:05

Yeah, I’ve fielded a lot of those calls and texts as well yesterday. I know I’m looking at the shirt now that I’m wearing and I put it on because I was thinking about opening debuting tomorrow, but I forgot how blatantly it says Baltimore across it. And I feel like it’s pretty meaningful. After yesterday, it’s it’s just totally surreal and unbelievable. You’re

Nestor J. Aparicio  02:29

from the northwest side of town, which makes you unique to the bridges and the tunnels. I had a girlfriend who grew up Randallstown Pikesville Owings Mills area. And she had really never been through the McHenry tunnel or the Harbour Tunnel because there’s no reason to, if you live between, let’s say, Towson and Woodlawn there’s sort of dead waters over there. Maybe I go over to cost the state the beltway get some crabs or something like that. But for people on my side of town, I mean, it was visible from my bedroom window in when I lived on Kane Street, my my teens was visible all of my childhood. It’s the first thing you’d see moving anywhere high, anywhere in my territory, and Dundalk up on fade Avenue or anywhere high. The first thing you see is the arch of the bridge. First thing, let you know your home. You know, I’ve equated it to 911. And people put me like that, you know, I understand the level of the tragedy. But I think there’s something of seeing

Wendy Bronfein  03:22

this visual rumbled. Yeah. And

Nestor J. Aparicio  03:28

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I, I flew into the airport on Tuesday evening. And I was purposely peeking out the right side. I mean, I’ve flown to the airport 1000 times I know exactly where I am. I have a Garmin GPS. And we entered from the west. So I didn’t see it. I’ve only seen it 1000 times on my timeline. But when I go so if I go to cost this tonight, and I very well may and I look out there and it’s gone. I’m gonna freak out.

Wendy Bronfein  03:55

Yeah, no, I mean, I totally understand what you’re saying it is. I had a friend who happened to be at Fort McHenry on Sunday and took a picture of the bridge, which also at that moment happened to have a large like tanker container ship passing, right basically right through the center of it. So it and then and then took a pic then her husband took a picture yesterday at seven in the morning. And it was like, you know, this sort of, you know, 15 hour difference, if you will, from one day to the next it was it was so eerie.

Nestor J. Aparicio  04:28

Yeah, the whole thing’s been surreal for every one. Did you use the bridge much? Because I literally I think there’s a lot of people in the northwest side of town. That’s just Bill Cole came on. He was my first guest, you know, after the tragedy early in the morning on Wednesday. And, you know, he said it was always sort of like an escape route. You know, if for anybody that has a business or was going to the airport, or it was the way as a kid, I use the bridge whenever we went to Ocean City. So if you’re going across the bridge, we’re going to the beach, you know, like party time. Let’s go we didn’t and the tunnels were more for the air. For and certainly being where I lived cane street Eastern for a long time and, and even in the White Marsh, just use the McHenry tunnel because it was wider, better faster. But I I’m a little older than you even and what I remember when there was only one tunnel and Baltimore was a nightmare for everybody, anybody was going New York to Florida anywhere in the corridor, one road, two lanes drive the Harbour Tunnel, some of us will, you know, now have to now over the next five years, 10 years, however long it takes. And Baltimore was a traffic nightmare. And the Key Bridge was always like, peaceful. There weren’t a whole lot of cars on it. And for me, I’m wearing my Costas shirt even though this is a curio wellness segment when he brought finds our guests. I met my executive producer Ray Bachman, over cost this two weeks ago, and he lives in Pasadena. And he said, Yeah, man all these years, I can’t believe I’ve ever cost us more often. I love it, or I’ll come over here 10 minute drive. It’s quick. It’s quick. It’s quick. Oh my god, I’d be spooky now. Right? And because he and I’m just hoping the businesses on the peninsula that we all stick together and understand like, One Road in one road out and Dundalk now. And that’s, there’s almost a feeling about that. That’s a little weird. You know, even for a guy that literally, the neighborhood I grew up in one day, like right at East Point Mall. We were equidistant from all three passageways, you’re getting to the harbor, or the Fort McHenry, or the Key Bridge, we’re all three miles literally one way or another. It just depends on whether you wanted to get spit out on fourth Smallwood road, or whether you want to get spit out in Brooklyn, or whether you want to get spit out of the foot of the city, because you’re going downtown to Camden Yards, let’s say right? So I’ve experienced I’m old enough to experience all three ways and all the good, the bad, and the ugly, the Key Bridge was was peaceful. It was really easy way to get anywhere,

Wendy Bronfein  06:54

you know? Well, I hadn’t considered until like when they were discussing it, sort of the from the shipping perspective, the hazmat issue with the tunnels that the bridge provided. And that the without that there’s like a 3030 mile detour. And I was like, I was thinking about it yesterday. And I thought, well, we’re all over the news today. And we’re usually talked about for other things. And I thought maybe as awful as this tragedy is, there’s so much conversation around the commerce that we provide, that maybe this is this is this can help shift our narrative. And people think of us in a different way. Because how crucial our port is, the systems that come off of it, the businesses that support that, and that it sort of starts to change, kind of what people reflexively think about us when when we’re talking about

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Nestor J. Aparicio  07:46

and, you know, Bill, Bill coal being the smartest guy in the room around here from coal roofing. You know, he we were talking about, like, how it gets rebuilt. I mean, obviously, the dredging part and getting the port open, and the loss of like, all of these things that are short term issues, and Joe Biden saying, Hey, we’re gonna pay for it. We don’t know what it is. And we thought, well, could they build a tunnel? Well been the the hazmat, as you said, it has to be a bridge. So you eliminate that. Well, what about the Maglev we’re trying to build that on the East Coast and do other transit. So why don’t we build a super bridge? And maybe that really means that Dundalk will be the new West Palm Beach in one day, 20 years from now? Like, so. There’s so much. I always use this. I’ve gotten very spiritual lately with this one, Deepak Chopra, one of my spiritual gurus, who I bumped into on the street in New York, one day was weird. He mentioned pure potentiality, pure potentiality. Right. So the potential for this as an unbelievable unmitigated tragedy, disaster. Awful, right, that we build something that’s not only beautiful and pretty, and Francis Scott Key would be proud of, and something I’m gonna want to drive over and take a picture. But something that’s affected for the next 50 years, not something that was built, quite frankly, quite frankly, it was built to really help Sparrows Point, its first port fell apart anyway, because that’s why the roads empty all the time, the roads empty, because it was why it was built to like, have as many cars as our beautiful cars, but it never has because nothing ever came. And then they polluted the wall, like all of that. And we have all of these really important environmental issues, and we put so much I’ll get Martin O’Malley on here soon after all he tried to do with the bay. That’s his pride, and like making sure that we do this in a clean way for the day. But I have no doubt that we have the ability to do this better, to make it better this time around and build it for our kids kids and say, what’s the potentiality of how awesome it can be if it’s rebuilt, that would really serve the community and the port and bigger boats and like all of that and proof depths and like all of that, that’s why I said West Paul, you know, because you went up, we got to go on a cruise to Bahamas someday, you know?

Wendy Bronfein  10:06

Yeah. I mean, you mentioned Sparrows Point. That was one of the things I thought of yesterday was like that whole rebirth and the Tradepoint. Atlantic, and then the impact over there. But I totally agree with you, it’s like, you know, this, you hopefully there is sort of something we can make out of it. That’s so much better than the tragedy that we’re in right now. You know, I ended up in like, a little bit of like, a rabbit hole yesterday, like reading about it, like, it cost $60 million to build, and it happened between these years. And then I went to the place of like, Oh, my God, if it took four years or five years, in the 70s, how long will it take today? Because, you know, doesn’t seem like we ever get anything done quickly. And so that’s like, one of my hopes, is like, there’s a great plan. And that bridges back as soon as we can make it happen, and we don’t lose like a generation over it.

Nestor J. Aparicio  10:54

You know, it’s amazing. We talked about the baseball ownership. And Peter died this week. And I’m talking about, you know, like Peter died. And this thing has so made that back page. And I mean, it’s really made the Orioles Back Page, even though you’re wearing them, and we’re gonna get together, but you’re not gonna be back page for national anthem gets played. We’re all down there. And we’re feeling the feels right, not just the baseball, but you know, you’re my sponsor, you’re my friend like, like, there’s no one more bullish on the potentiality of the city than I am standing in front of that. And we are now faced with worldwide attention. The President is giving us money. And we’re doing this in that this is Wes more chance to shine and maybe become president one day, if he doesn’t, like this is a real opportunity for our community in a way and a gut punch way to stick together and come together in a meaningful, meaningful way.

Wendy Bronfein  11:54

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I would agree. Wendy

Nestor J. Aparicio  11:55

brown find is here. She’s carrier wellness, She’s the Chief Brand Officer there. Let’s talk some cannabis. That’s what we do around here. I did some abbiati. Last week, I gotta get Eddie on the show, I know you’re going to opening day, maybe he’s going to hit me day because he’s Pikesville guy Baltimore guy, or you’ll fan all that stuff. There. I’m a little confused as a customer. So let’s just say this. I try to do the research as as Katt Williams once said, and I try to talk to you and educate myself. But when someone comes in and don’t use, you know, maybe they were at a concert one time and smoked a joint back in the day. And they don’t know the difference between indica sativa hybrid this that. I mean, it’s a science, right. And it’s not an inexpensive product, as we talked about that you want to know what you’re doing and what you’re where you are. But part of reading the back of a tin can, and even taking the little camera and shooting the QR codes that they said we’d never use it now we use them all day. I can’t order food in Florida. But a QR code will have a menu boom, you know, I would say when I see 27% 32% 22% 19%. But you know, like indica sativa. There’s such an educational process for everything you do is one of the reasons you come on here. And I tried to learn about this stuff. But then there’s the price point of well, if I want 32 or 34, that really good stuff the curio has, because that’s really the business you’re in is trying to get the best stuff that it’s maybe easier or I don’t know the economics are going 19 or 22%. But I understand how it’s priced. And I want to give you some oxygen today to like talk about because I really don’t don’t know how and why something 16 Something’s 40 and something’s on sale. And like all the pricing. I think everybody understands the sale, though. And I’m sure people take advantage of it. Guilty.

Wendy Bronfein  13:43

Yeah. Well, so I think, you know, what drives the price to a certain extent in this market beyond kind of what would be your standard topics, right, you’ve got your cost of goods in terms of creating the product and selling it. But this, this market has really been driven by not only the overall quality of it, but particularly the potency, so that level of THC, and that can command higher prices here because people have shown that they value that. Most people I think when they enter the marketplace, you know, you don’t have a reference point. If you if you had consumed cannabis prior to illegal markets or other means you didn’t have any lab results to know, what was the potency? What were the terpenes present, right? This is part of that nuance where you have much more clarity to what you’re using. And

Nestor J. Aparicio  14:39

that came with legality, correct. I mean, it was only universities and like federal studies in black holes and places we didn’t know about that ever after Nixon that this could ever be studied or used for medicine, right. I mean, that’s sort of the reason I’m doing it as a defiant thing is to say you’re helping People for 50 years the government wouldn’t even allow you to measure any part of this to understand its potency effective, see efficacy, any of these things. That’s truly and I’ve been in? I’ve been in your studio, truly science.

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Wendy Bronfein  15:17

Yeah. So that’s like the federal state complex because it remains scheduled one, you can’t formally research it. There’s one institution in the United States that’s allowed to have cannabis at the University of Mississippi. They are, you know, work in concert relative to the DEA and have that that ability to do so. But what

Nestor J. Aparicio  15:37

you just educated me, I didn’t know that only one place in Mississippi. Okay. Now I know, all my kids, friends, kids are going to Mississippi. I see him down there. I thought it was just for the grove and hottie tottie. And they’d love the rebels, but no, okay, I understand. Okay.

Wendy Bronfein  15:50

But but the but the sort of, for lack of a term, the joke of it all, is that what they have, they’re just not really representative of anything that you would see in a legal market in terms of the quality, the potency, the sort of healthy quality cure of the products. So whatever. And I think a lot of that research isn’t really through the lens of what we want to identify why this is useful. It’s more like, you know, connected to why it is illegal. So but, you know, in terms of what we do, we have a very large cultivation facility, it’s about 160,000 square feet, we have multiple flowering rooms, that’s the final stage of growth. Everything is in its own climate controlled zone. And the plants move through our hygienic space in throughout their growing cycle. And then once you the once the plant has fully matured, you harvest it, you dry it, you cure it, an outside lab that’s licensed by the state comes in take samples it’s tested, it’s, it pass its testing relative to the overall safety of the product, as well as gets the lab results that tells you that potency of cannabinoids and terpenes. And then you find that information on your label when you purchase it. Which is why if you walk into a dispensary and you express to the person working there, what you’re looking for in terms of how that is going to smell, taste, feel, what effects you’ll get. They’re using that information to match your request with what the strain is. So we have our flower comes under a line called exclusive. That’s our that’s our premium products. It’s about $50.08. To your point, dispensaries are always having promotions. So you know a lot of people know what the retail price is, but but shop relative to the deals that are going on at their preferred dispensary. But this is a product that is grown in this controlled environment that we maintain, that has a strong focus on it’s dry, it’s pure, there’s a manicure into the bud before it’s packaged. And so these are and I think you mentioned like why is it this potency birth is that potency in the you know, what’s it been now in the seven years that we’ve been growing, you know, the the better the, the building, we’ll call it is tuned to the growing process. And the more we sort of attenuate our style, the better we can deliver from the plant, right, we let it express itself at its best way. So there are strains we’ve had over the years that started at a lower potency, but based on our environment and how we take care of it and kind of keep it in a healthy, natural growing environment, it starts to express itself in a better way. And we ended up with with stronger test results or more biomass from it in the future. And the only other thing I would say is we have a plant sciences team that’s part of our cultivation. There’s two PhD scientists on there and a team of people who really look at the overall health of our of our cultivars, or you might call them strains. And the approaches we take to really optimize how this garden grows.

Nestor J. Aparicio  19:02

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Well, if this were a Grand Funk Railroad song, like some kind of wonderful, we say, Can I get a witness? i Yeah, I’m a witness. I went over and I went suits on and put the little Willy Wonka white thing on my hair and like went in. And I still have questions. I mean, you know, just the wonderment of all of it, the science of all of it. And I’ve toured beer plants I’ve toured all sorts of manufacturing facilities and shipping facilities and liquor distributor ships and all of that they don’t smell quite the way yours does and some of smell a little different, but your place and the science that’s involved there. And when someone comes into curio wellness or another dispensary to buy your product or a foreign daughter, which is your home facility just south of Timonium road on York Road, the place I go the place people pass across from the Nautilus dine rates there. So you go in and you say alright, this is 25% and it’s 40 whatever the price point is whatever and this is 32 per Then it’s the same strain. And this is 19%. And they’re selling it in or 21%. And they’re selling it in five packs of joints, right? Like whatever it is right pre rolls. So the difference in the price, you know, it is what it is. The difference in the strain is it’s blissful wizard. It’s whatever the alien OG, whatever the thing is that to say, Oh, wow, obviously the 27% of the last or the 32. Like, what’s that? For a user to say? Well, that’s only 19 or 20. But I don’t really want that. And it’s cheaper, I want to, I want to have the silver oak wine or whatever. And I think we think that, like, we compare it to crabs a lot, like, I’m gonna cost this and you should, and it doesn’t mean you have to get the big ones. You know what I mean? You can you can get them, but never got, right. So I guess that was my point is when we all get a little like 20 to 2528. How much? How much but you know, like, what would your advice be to folks about that number because it’s the biggest number on the can the percentage that you know, literally, and you sort of look at it and say, Oh, well, that’s small, medium, large, or that’s low shelf, middle shelf, top shelf, you know, we all have a delineation or that sirloin versus, you know, filet mignon, I guess we can compare it in any way. But all that being said, this does have an effect. It’s not the difference between I like my meat a little more lean, or whatever this is, there is a difference between 22 and 32%. Say? Yeah,

Wendy Bronfein  21:32

I look, I think that you could have flour that’s 22% and Florida, 32%. And it both both could be dry, cured in a wonderful way, great aroma, visually appealing, easy on the palate and the throat. Like the effects, the difference is, it’s one is stronger than the other. And typically, if the potency of the THC is higher, you’re likely going to see the other minor cannabinoids and terpenes are lifted as well, right? Because the plant is really expressing itself to a higher level. i If you’re coming in, knew that, you know the the adage, start low go slow applies. But I would say you don’t have to choose 22% If you choose 32, like, take a hit and like wait a little bit and see what it does. You know, I’ve I think for us, we we’ve tested we’ve had some strains that have tested extremely high like 36 37% before,

Nestor J. Aparicio  22:30

how high could it possibly be? Oh, that’s, that’s another question.

Wendy Bronfein  22:33

I yeah, I don’t know the answer to that. But I mean, I would agree at some point, it’s probably unnecessary. But I also like, you know, I don’t, I don’t totally understand all the THC chasing because as somebody who does enjoy smoking cannabis, I like that a lower gives you kind of more longevity as a activity, like kind of a social activity versus like coming in hot, you know, and getting fail at it. And I mean, like, alright, yeah, nobody

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Nestor J. Aparicio  23:02

wants to stand in a bar concert be on the moon, well, maybe the Pink Floyd concert. But like, in a general sense. Um, look, I like to drink. I’ve, I’ve drank too much. I think most people would have drank and drank too much. At some point. Hopefully you didn’t drive or operate machinery or do anything you’re responsible or sick, call your ex girlfriend, whatever, stupid stuff you could do. I’ve done dog wear to cost a shirt. I’ve done it all foolishly. I’m older than that. Now. And I guess that’s part of the cannabis thing for me to be even be involved in this conversation is to say, and I said this to you sort of flippantly two weeks ago, Miller and Coors, and but I never had any conversations about what it would do to you, or don’t drink too much of it. If you have the six to one, you’re gonna be driving a porcelain bus. And you’re gonna feel like awful the next day, and you’re like, Whoa, I know the feeling of all of the hangover. And that’s probably why at some point in the last decade, when my wife had cancer, and Sanjay Gupta came along, that I discovered just a better way to lighten the load lesson, you know, we’ll take the edge off whatever those hippie terms might be. And we got 420 coming up in a couple of weeks. And we’ll get all about that on our next segment, I’m sure. But I think there’s something about what’s it going to do to me? And how does it make me feel, and certainly the medicinal side of sleeping better, all of the other products that you’re deriving from this above and beyond, I just want to be a little stoned. Like, let’s start with that and then move to I want to x better or y better or Z better. That’s really where it comes in and the educational part of this, but I do think the percentages can be a little confusing, a little price centric, a little bougie in some way to say well, this will do the same as that or that’ll, you know, how do you want to do it? That there is a medicine and a science behind this that because I always wondered like they’re gonna do 42% I don’t know what the point of that is. But I also don’t know what the point of what I shot to say, this has cannabinoids that helped me and assist me. How does? How does the price point? How do I choose better? That’s all.

Wendy Bronfein  25:09

I mean, I think I think when you make analogy is to like to wine and things like that it does sort of work, right? Because part of the stuff with the flower is how much of a of a connoisseur, or just somebody who is interested in sort of that visual quality. And that appeal of that flower, that’s really also part of what’s driving it, is it a is it a strain that is beloved and rare, right. And that gives it kind of an another tear up. So, you know, the exclusives that we do kind of meet a many a factor, right? They do tend to have higher potency, they are smaller batches, they’re more exotic strains, they’re going to be available in limited locations.

Nestor J. Aparicio  25:59

Well, the other part of this, you know, you could throw a 30

Wendy Bronfein  26:04

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in there, right?

Nestor J. Aparicio  26:06

I mean, it would be impossible to grow a 33% plant at home, like the only way the amount of science and the amount of care that that and that goes into making a better batch of wine a better grape, you know, a better vintage, that, that is really, really hard to do for all of you who are trying to do it, right.

Wendy Bronfein  26:30

I can’t speak to that, because I have zero perspective on doing it, like at home.

Nestor J. Aparicio  26:37

Saying that I’m saying that,

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Wendy Bronfein  26:39

right? We Yes, I think you know, we have, so the individuals have come in over the years to work and run our cultivation. You know, they sort of teas, like what they love is they get to play Mother Nature, right? So if plants need, you know, light temperature, humidity, co2, you know, if you’re outside or wherever you are, you know, it just it is what it is. But in these rooms, we can condition it to optimize, like the light, it’s the ideal light, the right amount of co2, the perfect feed, watered at the exact cadence they want. So you know, we can we can play Mother Nature and really express the plant to the best of its ability. And really, you know, kind of deliver these quality and repeatable products. I think that’s part of the biggest piece here is that if you walk in our garden, you would see that the tables of plants are completely uniform by strain, there aren’t irregularities and what’s tall, and who’s short, and who’s white, and they might change by cultivar, but a single strain, they all look identical, they’re all growing in a similar look, they’re pointing right to that that light up there which is their sun and they’re just very beautiful and healthy and that environment allows us to really deliver quality products and more than anything that product is then tested before you buy it and you know it’s safe and that no pesticides, metals, molds microbes anything remains in there it drinking

Nestor J. Aparicio  28:08

coffee learning about cannabis with Wendy brown fine here and making it all have She’s the Chief Brand Officer at curio wellness so you can find them over farmed out or you can go to foreign daughter.com You gotta carry wellness.com You can find this in front of Baltimore positive all of those good things and we began this thing with certainly Key Bridge thoughts and I want to end it with some Orioles baseball because you’re wearing your your orange shirt I got my purple shirt was happy at two weeks ago. So I’ll be wearing that for draft week you also for 20 coming up which is a big holiday. So we’ll have a little bit of fun with that next week’s Orioles and ownership and all of this stuff. This is um I there’s gonna be a lot of emotions when the national anthem is played here in Baltimore this week and for a long time that

Wendy Bronfein  28:49

oh, it’s gonna get Yeah, that was gonna get yelled extremely loud tomorrow. It’s gonna be intense. This

Nestor J. Aparicio  28:56

is exciting. So I want you to have a home run strain for us sometime soon or a pennant race something. I’ll call I’m always trying to name your plant. So did you know just just go you came up with a happy Eddie You’ve inspired me that there could be an empty nester or a home run something something so I hope to see what the ballpark thanks for all the education and and certainly the story you had about your friends with the pictures. Make sure you copy me in on that because I’d like to share that from from Fort McHenry. You got it. I’ve been looking for pictures of the key but I’ve seen so many because they’re all images of my hometown. They’re all images of the icon that I’ll never see again, which is really, really weird. So we’re in a weird spot here with the Orioles. I just got back from the NFL owners meetings. Luke is going to be joining us here to talk Memorial baseball as we get into the weekend. No April Fool’s in here at all. We’re full steam ahead. I’m Nestor we are wn st am 1570, Towson Baltimore. We never stop talking Baltimore. Positive

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